Al-Farouq Aminu signs 3yr/$29m deal

[SOUL]

I feel like the FO has a better grip on where Fultz is than what they are letting on. I would hope so at least. Going into a season with just DJ/MCW is not a smart idea if you have NO idea about Fultz. I think they're just trying to settle expectations and not let the media run wild, hence the moves.

[basketballRob]

Rodney Hood - $16 mill/2 years
Jeremy Lamb - $31 mill/3 years
Demarre Carroll - $13 mill/2 years
George Hill - $29 mill/3 years
Reggie Bullock - $21 mill/2 years
Tomas Satoransky - $30 mill/3 years
Wayne Ellington - $16 mill/2 years
Seth Curry - $32 mill/4 years

Any one of these players probably would have been better use of the MLE than Al-Farouq Aminu

This reminds me of our last rebuild where we didn't want to sign anyone that could potentially be better than our young core players. If they want to get Fultz on the court ASAP, they probably don't want a decent guard standing in his way.

I know our young players should compete, and I'm not saying I agree with the plan. Just that it feels familiar.

I'm worried Fultz is mentally fragile and signing a PG might upset him. I don't know if the media response to Hammond's comments last week upset him but he's not at the Magic facility working out, he's back in California.

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[basketballRob]

Aminu might score a little more for the Magic. His usage was only 13.7 with Portland last year

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[IllMagic04]

1. Aminu wasn't the fix for the theoretical hole of back up PF. You don't spend $30 mill/3 years to occupy Jarrell Martin's role as a 10th man. It's a waste of an MLE. Especially when the Magic switch their best players between the 3/4/5 anyway. It wasn't necessary.

2. Besides Ross, we have no shot creation. We start a perennial back up point guard. We back him up with a guy who was essentially out of the league before we picked him up and a guy who can't/won't shoot. They didn't have to bring MCW back. He was not under contract. Frazier hasn't proven anything and is now hurt with a knee injury.

Pleeeeeeeese stop mentioning Fultz. Just pretend he doesn't exist until you see him hold a basketball.

Stop whining. The reason Fultz is mentioned, even against everyones better judgement, is because the roster is being constructed as if Fultz does exist. Aminu fits a roster in which Fultz does exist. Look below and you see a deep well balanced team with scoring from the backcourt. Management is obviously taking a chance on a Fultz return, doesn't mean it will work, but if they feel it is worth the chance, then I can get behind that because the upside is so high and the roster is nicely constructed other than that glaring hole at PG.

PG Fultz ?? DJ 18 MCW 0
SG TRoss 24 Fournier 24 Frazier 0
SF AG 32 TRoss 6 Iwundu 10
PF Isaac 30 Aminu 18 Okeke 0
C Vuch 32 Aminu 6 Bamba 10

This isn't whining. This is an actual assessment of a team with a lopsided roster that has been lopsided for the last 4 seasons, with a suggestion that this team is putting faith in a 21 year old kid who forgot how to shoot, may or may not have TOS, may or may not have crippling anxiety, and hasn't played basketball in 9 months.

1. There's no suggestion or evidence that the front office is preparing for him to play. Absolutely none. There's still no timetable for his return. There's no video evidence of him playing basketball. The POBO himself can't even address that he's performing the most fundamental aspect of basketball in shooting a basketball. They went an entire season with DJ Augustin, Jerian Grant, Isaiah Briscoe, and MCW manning their point guard rotation. And kudos to them for still managing 42 wins with that atrocity of a backcourt. I think we give this front office too much benefit of the doubt that they see some grand plan where Fultz is going to

2. Even if they were building this team around Fultz, who believes that this is a good strategy? To put all your backcourt scoring and playmaking hopes into essentially a rookie guard who forgot how to shoot and still hasn't been able to prove he's playing basketball despite 9 months of rehab. If that's really the plan, then there's a fair reason for skepticism and criticism.

Listen, I pray for Markelle every night just like everyone else here. But we really need to temper any expectations of seeing him play well, let alone just play. There's no evidence to have this much faith in Fultz and I don't believe building a roster for Fultz to just slide in and save us is the best strategy.

This is so on the money.

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[Knightro]

At the end of the day, Aminu is a lot better than Iwundu. So provided Gordon can handle SF full time, which I think he can, the Magic will be better with...

SG: Fournier, Ross
SF: Gordon, Ross and Aminu
PF: Isaac, Aminu

Than...

SG: Fournier, Ross
SF: Gordon, Ross and Iwundu
PF: Isaac, Gordon

[ezzzp]

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[zaymon]

DJ and Fournier are better defenders than Isaac and Gordon? WTF am I reading in here?

Its not my opinion, its defensive rating which everyone here likes to highlight. To be a legit playoff team you need to be a top 10 defensive rating team everyone says it even Clifford. Truth is our guards had the BEST defensive rating in the nba last year and our forwards were toward the bottom. Its no secret Clifford thinks Fournier is a terrific defender. Ross is athletic 6'7 body at guard spot. Briscoe/ MCW were also credited with great defense. Its not always on ball defense and blocks. Positioning, help defense is gaining momentum in the nba and i have no problem believing that Fournier, Ross, MCW are better in that aspect than Isaac, Gordon. Who killed us in the Raptors series exactly ?

[SOUL]

DJ and Fournier are better defenders than Isaac and Gordon? WTF am I reading in here?

Its not my opinion, its defensive rating which everyone here likes to highlight. To be a legit playoff team you need to be a top 10 defensive rating team everyone says it even Clifford. Truth is our guards had the BEST defensive rating in the nba last year and our forwards were toward the bottom. Its no secret Clifford thinks Fournier is a terrific defender. Ross is athletic 6'7 body at guard spot. Briscoe/ MCW were also credited with great defense. Its not always on ball defense and blocks. Positioning, help defense is gaining momentum in the nba and i have no problem believing that Fournier, Ross, MCW are better in that aspect than Isaac, Gordon. Who killed us in the Raptors series exactly ?

You're reading DRTG incorrectly. The higher it is, it means it's the estimated points allowed. DJ and Fournier are higher because they allow more points which means they're near the bottom, not the top. Watching any game this season we knew our guards were the weak link on defense. We had to hide DJ in the series because of it.

DPIPM has Isaac and Gordon both as positive defenders and Augustin and Fournier as negative overall.



DRTG = lower is better, and then the D-On/Off also show Fournier and DJ in the negative while the forwards + Vuc was positive.

[SOUL]

Some more data too, overall DPIPM has Fournier and Augustin -0.4 and -0.8 respectively and Isaac and Gordon +1.3 and +1.1.

[zaymon]

DJ and Fournier are better defenders than Isaac and Gordon? WTF am I reading in here?

Its not my opinion, its defensive rating which everyone here likes to highlight. To be a legit playoff team you need to be a top 10 defensive rating team everyone says it even Clifford. Truth is our guards had the BEST defensive rating in the nba last year and our forwards were toward the bottom. Its no secret Clifford thinks Fournier is a terrific defender. Ross is athletic 6'7 body at guard spot. Briscoe/ MCW were also credited with great defense. Its not always on ball defense and blocks. Positioning, help defense is gaining momentum in the nba and i have no problem believing that Fournier, Ross, MCW are better in that aspect than Isaac, Gordon. Who killed us in the Raptors series exactly ?

You're reading DRTG incorrectly. The higher it is, it means it's the estimated points allowed. DJ and Fournier are higher because they allow more points which means they're near the bottom, not the top. Watching any game this season we knew our guards were the weak link on defense. We had to hide DJ in the series because of it.

DPIPM has Isaac and Gordon both as positive defenders and Augustin and Fournier as negative overall.



DRTG = lower is better, and then the D-On/Off also show Fournier and DJ in the negative while the forwards + Vuc was positive.

Soul pls...... Via nba stats our guards had 24,6 defensive rating which was the LOWEST in the nba.

[SOUL]

Soul pls...... Via nba stats our guards had 24,6 defensive rating which was the LOWEST in the nba.

Show me how and where you're getting these stats, like the link. 24.6 makes no sense as an independent stat. What is 24.6 representing?

These are verified websites basketball-reference and bball-index, hell, I just checked NBA Defensive Real Plus-Minus on ESPN.com and Augustin and Fournier again, are negative, while Isaac and Gordon are positive. There cannot be two different sources of advanced stats showing WILDLY different opinions like "Fournier and DJ were the best defensive guards of the league" versus them being negative impact everywhere else. Same with that happening AND our forwards being "the worst in the league". It's simply not true.



This is strictly for the playoffs. Again, Fournier the worst in the playoffs on defense and surprisingly on offense too. AG struggled more than usual guarding Kawhi but made him work for tough shots, DJ was bad, Isaac was positive on defense despite everyone saying he was getting killed by Siakam. Dude kept ending games with 20 points while being guarded by Isaac truly on like 20% of the possessions.

[SOUL]

No offense, I can stomach people wildly wrong with opinions (I am myself sometimes) but not with stats that make no sense or our flat out wrong. I trust my eyes and if maybe I think I'm being deceived I will check a lot of advanced stats to see if it's corroborating with what I'm seeing, and there is ZERO way in hell and DJ and Fournier were good defenders this year, let alone tops in the league. Again, you're probably reading it backwards... like our strength was very clearly front court defense.

[OrlChamps2030]

[Bensational]

Soul pls...... Via nba stats our guards had 24,6 defensive rating which was the LOWEST in the nba.

Show me how and where you're getting these stats, like the link. 24.6 makes no sense as an independent stat. What is 24.6 representing?

These are verified websites basketball-reference and bball-index, hell, I just checked NBA Defensive Real Plus-Minus on ESPN.com and Augustin and Fournier again, are negative, while Isaac and Gordon are positive. There cannot be two different sources of advanced stats showing WILDLY different opinions like "Fournier and DJ were the best defensive guards of the league" versus them being negative impact everywhere else. Same with that happening AND our forwards being "the worst in the league". It's simply not true.



This is strictly for the playoffs. Again, Fournier the worst in the playoffs on defense and surprisingly on offense too. AG struggled more than usual guarding Kawhi but made him work for tough shots, DJ was bad, Isaac was positive on defense despite everyone saying he was getting killed by Siakam. Dude kept ending games with 20 points while being guarded by Isaac truly on like 20% of the possessions.

Here's the link to the NBA's official stats. DJ and Fournier both in the lower half for the team. Gordon the highest starter. Isaac in the middle (not significantly greater than DJ or Fournier, to be honest).

I'm not sure where the number 24,6 zaymon references has come from.

[SOUL]

Yep and I'm not even a fan of those stats, Looking at it, I think they are more lineup based because of the calculations -- MCW being easily the best offensive rating on the team (even with small results, you're not getting the HIGHEST RATED OFFENSE with 33/15/74 shooting splits), Ross being worse than Iwundu, Vuc only being a few higher than Isaac/Fournier who sucked this year offensively, Isaac being below DJ defensively... but even that one still shows Fournier as not good as a defender. All of those make sense if they're weighted on strictly lineups rather than individual play.

[pepe1991]

Per nba.com best defenders by def rating ( lower is better)
was Isaiah Briscoe with 100,9

Worst Magic defender was Mo Bamba with def rating of 109

In theory worst were Frazier and Jefferson but they both played >70 min so i did not count them, just like Coupain was best, but mostly because he played 16 min.


def rating among rotation players:

Evan Fournier at 108
DJ augustin at 107
Isaac at 107
Ross at 106
Gordon 106
Vuc 106

You have to understand that it's rare to have amazing def rating while in mean time your teammate plays as much as you, with you,and has terrible def rating. def rating is measured against whole team.

[SOUL]

Per nba.com best defenders by def rating ( lower is better)
was Isaiah Briscoe with 100,9

Worst Magic defender was Mo Bamba with def rating of 109

In theory worst were Frazier and Jefferson but they both played >70 min so i did not count them, just like Coupain was best, but mostly because he played 16 min.


def rating among rotation players:

Evan Fournier at 108
DJ augustin at 107
Isaac at 107
Ross at 106
Gordon 106
Vuc 106

You have to understand that it's rare to have amazing def rating while in mean time your teammate plays as much as you, with you,and has terrible def rating. def rating is measured against whole team.

Yeah those are always pretty close which is why I was looking heavily into individual advanced stats.. but even looking at it simply in those terms, there is no way those stats can turn Fournier/DJ into one of the best defensive duos in the league.

[zaymon]

No offense, I can stomach people wildly wrong with opinions (I am myself sometimes) but not with stats that make no sense or our flat out wrong. I trust my eyes and if maybe I think I'm being deceived I will check a lot of advanced stats to see if it's corroborating with what I'm seeing, and there is ZERO way in hell and DJ and Fournier were good defenders this year, let alone tops in the league. Again, you're probably reading it backwards... like our strength was very clearly front court defense.

I was looking at nba stats, team defense, and advanced search guards. I am not arguing they are some elite individual defenders, but numbers say they are elite team defenders.

https://stats.nba.com/teams/defense/?sort=DEF_RATING&dir=-1&Season=2018-19&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&PlayerPosition=G

[pepe1991]

iMO team defense is way to go now. And team defense comes down to having as little mental errors as possible. It has been a case for lot of years now. Spurs menaged to have great defense with over a hill Duncan, fat Diaw, slowed down Parker, over a hill Ginobili and only Danny and Leonard were really good individual defenders.

I think lot of great athletes are poor defenders because they grow up knowing they are quick enough to gamble on blocks and steals and can still recover. In nba that's simply not case. If you reached for a ball against guard, he is gone and you failed a team.

That's why i don't value 1 on 1 defense all that much. Every single good player, with teammate with BBIQ over 15 will avoid bad matchup by forcing pick&roll action or screen "criss-cross" to force switch.


For example, for Kawhi vs Orlando Isaac was bad matchup. He shot like 1-15 against him or something like that. Yet, Kawhi simply forced team to not be guarded by him and finished series with 28 ppg on 55,6% FG, and 54% for 3 ( over 63% TS).

[Bensational]

No offense, I can stomach people wildly wrong with opinions (I am myself sometimes) but not with stats that make no sense or our flat out wrong. I trust my eyes and if maybe I think I'm being deceived I will check a lot of advanced stats to see if it's corroborating with what I'm seeing, and there is ZERO way in hell and DJ and Fournier were good defenders this year, let alone tops in the league. Again, you're probably reading it backwards... like our strength was very clearly front court defense.

I was looking at nba stats, team defense, and advanced search guards. I am not arguing they are some elite individual defenders, but numbers say they are elite team defenders.

https://stats.nba.com/teams/defense/?sort=DEF_RATING&dir=-1&Season=2018-19&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&PlayerPosition=G

Wow, I've never seen that feature before. Interesting. But that's also for the guards collectively - including our really strong defensive bench unit.

Here are the Drtg numbers for 2-man lineups. I think it's a bit cleaner, and a more direct way to assess which players attributed what to Drtg numbers.

DJ + Fournier = 107.0
DJ + Ross = 104.6
MCW + Fournier = 105.3
MCW + Ross = 103.2
IB + Fournier = 109.8
IB + Ross = 99.9

Fournier really looks like the weakest link there, by those numbers. Shock number of them all: DJ + MCW = 77.0 (on 17 mins).

For comparison, AG + JI = 106.6.

AG + DJ = 106.9
AG + MCW = 96.7
AG + IB = 103.5
AG + Fournier = 107.1
AG + Ross = 103.9

JI + DJ = 107.6
JI + MCW = 109.6
JI + IB = 96.0
JI + Fournier = 109.2
JI + Ross = 104.0

Fournier and DJ seem like the inferior defensive pair in any matchup. But, AG + JI's numbers combined aren't flashy either, to be completely fair. They both have some crazy high defensive numbers with certain other matchups, but they're about average for the starters to be fair.