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Real change or contract flash?

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Real change or contract flash? 

Post#1 » by magickingdom » Sun Jul 28, 2019 12:58 pm

With nothing to talk about, how about this.
We have seen the projected over/under for next year. We know what others think. But we all know most of them never watched the Magic. We all know there has to be growth with our young players, etc, etc.
But the question is: was the last 30 games, with the about 30/10 record, a real representation of what this team can do or just a contract year flash in the pan?
Did they finally start learning to play the way Clifford wanted them to play and this year they will build on it and only get better or are we all getting excited for nothing and there will be more of the same?
Because it would seem, if they just started getting it and those last 20 wins were examples of the future. Then this year should be pretty fun for Magic fans and they will surprise a lot of other teams. And finally, just maybe, the basketball world will give them some recognition?
What say you?
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#2 » by j-ragg » Sun Jul 28, 2019 1:03 pm

Tough to say. You could argue we made the playoffs for three reasons. Health, schedule down the stretch, and career years from guys under Cliff. I'd guess we're probably around the same spot, but could easily see 35 wins as well.
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#3 » by fendilim » Sun Jul 28, 2019 1:39 pm

Tough to say, but having the foundation from last year is something we should consider when talking about us trending up.
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#4 » by OrlandO » Sun Jul 28, 2019 3:02 pm

We are a better team now than the one we started with last season.
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#5 » by MagicStarwipe » Sun Jul 28, 2019 3:18 pm

It comes down to 5 questions.

1. Will we remain healthy?
2. Will the players continue to buy in to what Cliff is preaching?
3. Will the contract year studs continue their play from last season?
4. Will the youngsters improve and add to their games?
5. When teams start figuring us out and taking us more seriously, will we raise our level or will we fold?

Could go either way but I'm optimistic about the season.
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#6 » by drsd » Sun Jul 28, 2019 4:12 pm

MagicStarwipe wrote:It comes down to 5 questions.

1. Will we remain healthy?
2. Will the players continue to buy in to what Cliff is preaching?
3. Will the contract year studs continue their play from last season?
4. Will the youngsters improve and add to their games?
5. When teams start figuring us out and taking us more seriously, will we raise our lever or will we fold?

Could go either way but I'm optimistic about the season.


If the answer is 80% to each of the above, the Magic win 45+ games. If the Magic max out ability, this will be a low 50-win team. Only major injuries to TWO starters makes this team fail to reach expectations.

Continuity has value in and of itself.


..
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#7 » by GameOver25 » Mon Jul 29, 2019 12:51 am

MagicStarwipe wrote:It comes down to 5 questions.

1. Will we remain healthy?
2. Will the players continue to buy in to what Cliff is preaching?
3. Will the contract year studs continue their play from last season?
4. Will the youngsters improve and add to their games?
5. When teams start figuring us out and taking us more seriously, will we raise our lever or will we fold?

Could go either way but I'm optimistic about the season.


:lol: We typically fold like a bad poker hand.
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#8 » by The Real Dalic » Mon Jul 29, 2019 1:12 am

Us and the Pistons are the two biggest question marks of last years playoff teams. Either one of us could rise or fall.
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#9 » by AdamTheGreek » Mon Jul 29, 2019 2:21 am

While some people are doubting the 22-9 finish, it needs to be pointed out that we don't have Grant or J-Simms weighing us down like they did early last season. Continuity will only help us. It's just all about health, but that's where our improved depth (Aminu, Bamba, Fultz) could potentially buffer us if we see injuries occur.
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#10 » by p0peye » Mon Jul 29, 2019 9:27 pm

We've been pretty healthy last season *knock on wood*.
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#11 » by NothingButMagic » Thu Aug 1, 2019 11:35 pm

AdamTheGreek wrote:While some people are doubting the 22-9 finish, it needs to be pointed out that we don't have Grant or J-Simms weighing us down like they did early last season. Continuity will only help us. It's just all about health, but that's where our improved depth (Aminu, Bamba, Fultz) could potentially buffer us if we see injuries occur.


This is actually the main factor that makes me think we will play more like we did at the end of last year. The second unit was so bad last year until we cleared out Grant and Simmons.
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#12 » by Knightro » Fri Aug 2, 2019 10:43 pm

AdamTheGreek wrote:While some people are doubting the 22-9 finish, it needs to be pointed out that we don't have Grant or J-Simms weighing us down like they did early last season. Continuity will only help us. It's just all about health, but that's where our improved depth (Aminu, Bamba, Fultz) could potentially buffer us if we see injuries occur.


While Grant and Simmons are gone, the team really took off when Briscoe/Iwundu/Birch were all inserted into the rotation.

As it stands right now, none of those guys appear to be in the rotation.

Now it's certainly possible that MCW or Fultz/Aminu/Bamba can be even better, but the rotation isn't going to be the exact same as it was down the stretch.
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#13 » by EAS Law » Sat Aug 3, 2019 3:26 pm

Contract years have historically been years where players play their absolute best, however, I don’t necessarily believe that anything radically changes about that player afterward.

I think of Vuc or TRoss and I find it hard to believe that the ball is less likely to go in the hoop now that TRoss got his contract, or that Vuc will all of a sudden stop executing his post game. Effort is probably heightened in a contract year, but I think those guys will still give us what they can do. They are competitors.

I think the real X factor will be development from Isaac, finding ways to involve AG in the offense more and have him produce more, and then any development from Mo. those three guys will determine whether we take another step forward, or if teams will be able to play us exactly like they would have last season.

Oh and Fultz. That could be a big deal.
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#14 » by MagicStarwipe » Sat Aug 3, 2019 3:51 pm

EAS Law wrote:Contract years have historically been years where players play their absolute best, however, I don’t necessarily believe that anything radically changes about that player afterward.

I think of Vuc or TRoss and I find it hard to believe that the ball is less likely to go in the hoop now that TRoss got his contract, or that Vuc will all of a sudden stop executing his post game. Effort is probably heightened in a contract year, but I think those guys will still give us what they can do. They are competitors.

I think the real X factor will be development from Isaac, finding ways to involve AG in the offense more and have him produce more, and then any development from Mo. those three guys will determine whether we take another step forward, or if teams will be able to play us exactly like they would have last season.

Oh and Fultz. That could be a big deal.


I'm looking to see what Vuc does on D this season. I was very happy with his effort on that end for the most part last season. He needs to keep that up.
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#15 » by AdamTheGreek » Fri Aug 9, 2019 11:32 am

Knightro wrote:
AdamTheGreek wrote:While some people are doubting the 22-9 finish, it needs to be pointed out that we don't have Grant or J-Simms weighing us down like they did early last season. Continuity will only help us. It's just all about health, but that's where our improved depth (Aminu, Bamba, Fultz) could potentially buffer us if we see injuries occur.


While Grant and Simmons are gone, the team really took off when Briscoe/Iwundu/Birch were all inserted into the rotation.

As it stands right now, none of those guys appear to be in the rotation.

Now it's certainly possible that MCW or Fultz/Aminu/Bamba can be even better, but the rotation isn't going to be the exact same as it was down the stretch.


Well look though, MCW was at least on par or better overall than Briscoe (yes I know Briscoe is a better shooter).

If Birch and Iwundu lose minutes, that’s because we’ll have upgraded our productivity at those minutes. Clifford isn’t going to hand people minutes that didn’t earn them. Also, injuries will probably factor in more next season.
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#16 » by Knightro » Fri Aug 9, 2019 2:05 pm

AdamTheGreek wrote:If Birch and Iwundu lose minutes, that’s because we’ll have upgraded our productivity at those minutes. Clifford isn’t going to hand people minutes that didn’t earn them. Also, injuries will probably factor in more next season.


Couple things...

1. I do think Aminu is clearly a better basketball player than Iwundu, but that isn't a direct swap out either. Iwundu played almost exclusively at backup SF last year. Doesn't seem like Aminu is going to slot into those SF minutes. More likely, Aminu actually takes backup PF minutes away from *Gordon*, who will take away Iwundu's minutes at SF. Clearly the Magic are pretty confident AG can handle it, but there's still a level of unknown on how effective Gordon will be playing most of his minutes at SF instead of 60/40 in favor of PF.

2. I'm not at all convinced that Clifford is going to play Birch over Bamba. I like his potential, but let's be clear, from a statistical impact perspective Mo Bamba was one of the absolute worst players in the NBA last season. The Magic got absolutely destroyed every time he took the floor. That said... Clifford showed ZERO inclination to bench him in favor of Birch last year until Mo broke his leg. Ideally Mo just comes in and plays his tail off and this doesn't matter, but I'm very curious if Clifford opts to stick with Mo if he struggles as badly as he did last year.
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Re: Real change or contract flash? 

Post#17 » by AdamTheGreek » Fri Aug 9, 2019 4:36 pm

I think Bamba physically couldn’t handle it last season. That shouldn’t be as large of a problem now. Clifford and the staff giving Mo coaching/scouting assignments those final 4-5 months hopefully opened Mo’s mind to what Vooch and Khem do and that Mo adopts some of their good habits on both ends.
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