Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 III: It's B-ball Time !!!

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[PrimeThyme]

The reg season hasnt even started yet and everyone has already turned on all the young guys. Even for RealGM standards that has to be a record

Take 3 of the best scorers off any team and see what they look like (especially this roster). Isaac is still a raw developing offensive player and is not ready to be in a featured role in an offense.

When people wanted to see AG take a jump this year, they didn't want to see him turn into a jump shooter. These last two games reminded me of the 2017/2018 season when our team was decimated by injuries and AG played in lineups with zero spacing and turned into a jump shooter out of necessity. Similar to the 2016/2017 season as well.

A lineup of DJ/MCW/AG/Isaac/Bamba just flat out doesn't provide enough spacing in the modern NBA. That's why we've seen the last two nights teams pack the lane and make everyone shoot jumpers. This team has to have Vuc/Ross in order to look like a functioning NBA offense. Thats not because either is all NBA caliber players, its because of how our roster is constructed. You can't blame the fact that we lack shooting/playmaking/creation in any form on Isaac/AG. Put either on a team that has it and see how good they look.

AG taking a jump will come in the form of him doing what he did last year just at a higher level. Locking down defensively, playmaking, and finding more of his offense around the basket instead of outside of the paint. People can choose to cut bait on him like they've been trying to do off and on for 4 years now but I still have faith he can play a crucial role in this teams success.

[Def Swami]

Why would PHX ever entertain trading Devin Booker? It makes no sense.

[ezzzp]

You can't blame the fact that we lack shooting/playmaking/creation in any form on Isaac/AG. Put either on a team that has it and see how good they look.

I don't know if people realize it, but last year the Magic were a very good passing team. They were a top 5 team in AST% and top 3 in Potential Assists.

They had numerous players that can create for themselves (and others) at decent to good levels:



The biggest issue that kept the Magic's offense from a better efficiency and having a higher ranked offense was primarily shot selection and not getting to the line.

The Magic were a pretty good 3PT shooting team, ranked 11th in the NBA in 3P%...and that was with Fournier shooting terrible. They were also right in the middle of the pack at-the-rim in both volume and FG%.

They just took way too many mid range shots (4th most mid range shots in NBA). A lot of that volume by guys who were shooting them at a very low efficiency. The worst was Aaron Gordon who took 175 of them at a horrific 33%. Ross, Fournier and Vucevic shot more volume, but at least had a solid FG% - but they definitely need to be looking for a higher value shot instead of settling for quick mid rangers which happened way too often.

[MagicMatic]

Why would PHX ever entertain trading Devin Booker? It makes no sense.

It was just an idea. PHX would likely not entertain the idea at all. The original post was about who AG would return to balance the roster.

[pepe1991]

Please don't criticize Vuc or Evan, even though they played like the shouldn't even be in the league during the preseason.

By the way Mo's leg has been hurting. Do you admire him for playing through it?

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

With so many injuries in 2 years, maybe Mo should retire?

You are the NBA definition of cancer FFS

How cute

[GelbeWand09]

Please don't criticize Vuc or Evan, even though they played like the shouldn't even be in the league during the preseason.

By the way Mo's leg has been hurting. Do you admire him for playing through it?

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

With so many injuries in 2 years, maybe Mo should retire?

Is Mo out again? First I’m hearing of this.


Sent from my iPad using RealGM mobile app

No Clifford mentioned Mo was hurting after the 2nd game already, but he could play. So he seems a bit handicapped, but nothing big.

[basketballRob]

Please don't criticize Vuc or Evan, even though they played like the shouldn't even be in the league during the preseason.

By the way Mo's leg has been hurting. Do you admire him for playing through it?

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

With so many injuries in 2 years, maybe Mo should retire?

Is Mo out again? First I’m hearing of this.


Sent from my iPad using RealGM mobile app

He's having soreness in the same leg that he had a fracture in last year. He's been playing through it.

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

[pepe1991]

With so many injuries in 2 years, maybe Mo should retire?

Is Mo out again? First I’m hearing of this.


Sent from my iPad using RealGM mobile app

He's having soreness in the same leg that he had a fracture in last year. He has been playing through it.

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

No he does not, just a fact that team shut down Vučević for 2 games for "injury " that he described as " nothing serious at all, It’s more precautionary " tells you everything to know about health of other players.
Same thing is with Ross and Fournier, who both sit out games for minor issues.

Stop making things up just to pile up excuses.

[basketballRob]

Is Mo out again? First I’m hearing of this.


Sent from my iPad using RealGM mobile app

He's having soreness in the same leg that he had a fracture in last year. He has been playing through it.

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

No he does not, just a fact that team shut down Vučević for 2 games for "injury " that he described as " nothing serious at all, It’s more precautionary " tells you everything to know about health of other players.
Same thing is with Ross and Fournier, who both sit out games for minor issues.

Stop making things up just to pile up excuses.

Prior to the Boston game I definitely heard that Mo had soreness in that leg and they were keeping a close eye on it.

[MagicStarwipe]

Came from Clifford's mouth that he is having some soreness in the spot he had surgery. Must be nothing too serious though because he's still playing, albeit on a minutes restriction.

[rcklsscognition]

<insert my overreaction to Mo's soreness here>

[MagicFan101]

Golden State was projected to miss the playoffs this year by ESPN early this morning. With basically no depth at either Forward spot beyond Green, they still seem like a good trade partner.

Does anyone believe Fultz + Russell could be the Lilliard + CJ of the East?

AG + Bamba for Russell -- (DJ can be used instead of Bamba or in combination if they want cap space)

Orlando rides out with Vuc + Birch at C and Isaac steps up as our future at Forward

Guard: Fultz, DJ(?)
Guard: Russell, Ross
Forward: Aminu, Iwandu
Forward: Isaac, Jefferson, ... eventually Chuma
Center: Vuc, Birch

... we need a taker for Fournier soon.

[yoyojw17]

The reg season hasnt even started yet and everyone has already turned on all the young guys. Even for RealGM standards that has to be a record

Take 3 of the best scorers off any team and see what they look like (especially this roster). Isaac is still a raw developing offensive player and is not ready to be in a featured role in an offense.

When people wanted to see AG take a jump this year, they didn't want to see him turn into a jump shooter. These last two games reminded me of the 2017/2018 season when our team was decimated by injuries and AG played in lineups with zero spacing and turned into a jump shooter out of necessity. Similar to the 2016/2017 season as well.

A lineup of DJ/MCW/AG/Isaac/Bamba just flat out doesn't provide enough spacing in the modern NBA. That's why we've seen the last two nights teams pack the lane and make everyone shoot jumpers. This team has to have Vuc/Ross in order to look like a functioning NBA offense. Thats not because either is all NBA caliber players, its because of how our roster is constructed. You can't blame the fact that we lack shooting/playmaking/creation in any form on Isaac/AG. Put either on a team that has it and see how good they look.

AG taking a jump will come in the form of him doing what he did last year just at a higher level. Locking down defensively, playmaking, and finding more of his offense around the basket instead of outside of the paint. People can choose to cut bait on him like they've been trying to do off and on for 4 years now but I still have faith he can play a crucial role in this teams success.

You beat me to this comment. hahahah

and go figure when our team plays another team and does well when they are missing one player (3rd option even).... "No .... that wasn't a great win... Minnesota was missing Andrew Wiggins"

or also... every other team will get a pass for their losses as they deal with injuries, sitting players, experimenting with lineups or play style... "It's just preseason"... but we do the exact same thing..."This team is garbage ... here goes another year"

It's as though people are guarding themselves from disappointment by being #EXTRA. haha

[PrimeThyme]

Golden State was projected to miss the playoffs this year by ESPN early this morning. With basically no depth at either Forward spot beyond Green, they still seem like a good trade partner.

Does anyone believe Fultz + Russell could be the Lilliard + CJ of the East?

AG + Bamba for Russell -- (DJ can be used instead of Bamba or in combination if they want cap space)

Orlando rides out with Vuc + Birch at C and Isaac steps up as our future at Forward

Guard: Fultz, DJ(?)
Guard: Russell, Ross
Forward: Aminu, Iwandu
Forward: Isaac, Jefferson, ... eventually Chuma
Center: Vuc, Birch

... we need a taker for Fournier soon.

No I don’t. Especially considering the fact Fultz isn’t even attempting 3’s. By the way his attempts have looked up to this point, I can’t really blame him either.

That lineup you suggested most likely wouldn’t make the playoffs even in the east. Every single player in that lineup are below average 3pt shooters. As good as Russell was last year he still only shot 36% from 3. He’s 35% for his career. Vuc shot it better last year but is only a 33% shooter from 3 for his career. We will see if he can sustain the 36% from 3 this season. Both players were in contract seasons.

Isaac and Aminu are below average 3pt shooters at this stage as well. Same with Iwundu and Birch. Jefferson isn’t even a rotational NBA player.

If you are going to commit to Fultz as a starter I think you’re going to have to surround him with shooters. If you had a 40% or better 3pt shooter at the 2 spot and an above average shooter at the 3 to pair next to Isaac/Vuc I think you could make it work. But our roster is not presently constructed that way and I don’t see any deals outside of Beal which probably would require Isaac and AG considering the market that will be out there for him.

[j-ragg]

Golden State was projected to miss the playoffs this year by ESPN early this morning. With basically no depth at either Forward spot beyond Green, they still seem like a good trade partner.

Does anyone believe Fultz + Russell could be the Lilliard + CJ of the East?

AG + Bamba for Russell -- (DJ can be used instead of Bamba or in combination if they want cap space)

Orlando rides out with Vuc + Birch at C and Isaac steps up as our future at Forward

Guard: Fultz, DJ(?)
Guard: Russell, Ross
Forward: Aminu, Iwandu
Forward: Isaac, Jefferson, ... eventually Chuma
Center: Vuc, Birch

... we need a taker for Fournier soon.

No I don’t. Especially considering the fact Fultz isn’t even attempting 3’s. By the way his attempts have looked up to this point, I can’t really blame him either.

That lineup you suggested most likely wouldn’t make the playoffs even in the east. Every single player in that lineup are below average 3pt shooters. As good as Russell was last year he still only shot 36% from 3. He’s 35% for his career. Vuc shot it better last year but is only a 33% shooter from 3 for his career. We will see if he can sustain the 36% from 3 this season. Both players were in contract seasons.

Isaac and Aminu are below average 3pt shooters at this stage as well. Same with Iwundu and Birch. Jefferson isn’t even a rotational NBA player.

If you are going to commit to Fultz as a starter I think you’re going to have to surround him with shooters. If you had a 40% or better 3pt shooter at the 2 spot and an above average shooter at the 3 to pair next to Isaac/Vuc I think you could make it work. But our roster is not presently constructed that way and I don’t see any deals outside of Beal which probably would require Isaac and AG considering the market that will be out there for him.

Might be the worst team ever in terms of drawing fouls.

[MagicFan101]

Golden State was projected to miss the playoffs this year by ESPN early this morning. With basically no depth at either Forward spot beyond Green, they still seem like a good trade partner.

Does anyone believe Fultz + Russell could be the Lilliard + CJ of the East?

AG + Bamba for Russell -- (DJ can be used instead of Bamba or in combination if they want cap space)

Orlando rides out with Vuc + Birch at C and Isaac steps up as our future at Forward

Guard: Fultz, DJ(?)
Guard: Russell, Ross
Forward: Aminu, Iwandu
Forward: Isaac, Jefferson, ... eventually Chuma
Center: Vuc, Birch

... we need a taker for Fournier soon.

No I don’t. Especially considering the fact Fultz isn’t even attempting 3’s. By the way his attempts have looked up to this point, I can’t really blame him either.

That lineup you suggested most likely wouldn’t make the playoffs even in the east. Every single player in that lineup are below average 3pt shooters. As good as Russell was last year he still only shot 36% from 3. He’s 35% for his career. Vuc shot it better last year but is only a 33% shooter from 3 for his career. We will see if he can sustain the 36% from 3 this season. Both players were in contract seasons.

Isaac and Aminu are below average 3pt shooters at this stage as well. Same with Iwundu and Birch. Jefferson isn’t even a rotational NBA player.

If you are going to commit to Fultz as a starter I think you’re going to have to surround him with shooters. If you had a 40% or better 3pt shooter at the 2 spot and an above average shooter at the 3 to pair next to Isaac/Vuc I think you could make it work. But our roster is not presently constructed that way and I don’t see any deals outside of Beal which probably would require Isaac and AG considering the market that will be out there for him.

Might be the worst team ever in terms of drawing fouls.

Good observation. Enough time has passed that Russell probably is what he is here, but I see how easily Fultz gets to the rim and can't avoid seeing a bright future in drawing fouls. He just shies away from that contact at this moment ... which is a bit understandable.

[GelbeWand09]

My problem with Russell is, i don't believe he makes us better.

Russell is bad or mediocre in most skills we desperately need. Penetration & getting to the Freethrowline. Even his 3P shot is mediocre (before last season, even bad).
So far, he is much more a high volume / low efficiency scorer. And i didn't even mentioned his ''defense''.

If we trade Gordon, i want at least a guard who can penetrate & gets to the line. Of last years Nets, i take the contracts of LeVert & Dinwiddie before Russell any day.

[jezzerinho]

Beal is the guy to get, but Wash doesn't want to go full reset.