Magic apply to have Timofey Mozgov Removed From Cap

Post #1 » by **Howard Mass** » Fri Oct 25, 2019 7:34 pm

The Magic have applied to have Timofey Mozgov removed from their books.

The fact that he signed with a Russian team and has been waived could hurt in this effort but glad they are at least giving this a shot.

Mozgov has yet to be play for his team in Russia.

If they get him removed, the $5.6 million a year on the books the next three years would off the books and give The Magic some flexibility.

My take is they are doing this now while they explore their options for the 14 spot that they have to fill.

Let's hope this happens and Mozi comes off the books.

MoMM · Post #2 » by **MoMM** » Fri Oct 25, 2019 7:40 pm

NBA didn't accept Wizards asking for Wall's injury exception, will they accept Moz? Not very likely, IMO, but maybe next season or so.

How did it work for Chris Bosh? Does anyone remember?

Post #3 » by **UCF** » Fri Oct 25, 2019 7:43 pm

Doesn’t hurt to try I guess. I don’t expect the league to do us any favors.

jezzerinho · Post #4 » by **jezzerinho** » Fri Oct 25, 2019 7:44 pm

Doesn't hurt to try. Low chance of success, on the face of it, but none of us are NBA legal advisors or capologists

Popsicle1228 · Post #5 » by **Popsicle1228** » Fri Oct 25, 2019 7:57 pm

I was shocked when the NBA denied the Magic’s request for an injury exception to be applied to Grant Hill’s contract. That was a 7 year max deal which was a complete albatross to the team, and the NBA still said no. I am hopeful, but won’t be shocked if the NBA denies the Mozgov request.

MagicFan101 · Post #6 » by **MagicFan101** » Fri Oct 25, 2019 8:12 pm

My readings on the Wall decision mostly say that, despite what the owner says, Wall has made enough progress in rehab to leave hope of a return this season.

Mozgov was tagged with a career ending injury. At first glance this would be very different from Wall and give us a shot. But is that really what happened? Or was he an overpaid stiff with an injury just bad enough to give us an excuse to cut him? ... I’m guessing the later and hence we will NOT get the exception.

ezzzp · Post #7 » by **ezzzp** » Fri Oct 25, 2019 9:45 pm

He's not on Khimki's roster or listed in the Euroleague's player list

https://www.euroleague.net/competition/teams/showteam?clubcode=KHI&seasoncode=E2019

https://www.euroleague.net/competition/players?letter=M

NavalAviator94 · Post #8 » by **NavalAviator94** » Fri Oct 25, 2019 9:54 pm

His last game in the NBA was April 11th, 2018. He's certainly satisfied any time requirements.

Raider_MXD · Post #9 » by **Raider_MXD** » Fri Oct 25, 2019 11:36 pm

Why should it matter if a player who has been bought out gets injured?

MagicFan101 · Post #10 » by **MagicFan101** » Fri Oct 25, 2019 11:44 pm

NavalAviator94 wrote:His last game in the NBA was April 11th, 2018. He's certainly satisfied any time requirements.

I’m not sure time is the key factor here. I think it’s more a matter of why he hasn’t played since then.

Is it because he sucks and no one wants to play him? Or was he really THAT badly injured?

One implies a team **** up in giving him that deal and / or trading for it and should still be held accountable. Another implies a bad situation happened and something should be done to ease the transition.

You want to make sure teams can’t avoid the cap in this fashion when they whiff on a player.

MoMM · Post #11 » by **MoMM** » Fri Oct 25, 2019 11:45 pm

NavalAviator94 wrote:His last game in the NBA was April 11th, 2018. He's certainly satisfied any time requirements.

It's just one season if you think, so it's not a lot of time.

PrimeThyme · Post #12 » by **PrimeThyme** » Fri Oct 25, 2019 11:45 pm

Our cap guys here could probably help with this, but I feel like this could be pretty significant if it gets approved. Zack lowe mentioned on his podcast today that if Evan has a good season he could be a prime candidate to opt-out and get a payday in a weaker free agency class. If Mosgov, Fournier, and DJ comes off the books next year would we be in position to go after a Derozan/Gallanari/Vanvleet/Bogdanovic? It looks like we may have 16 mill or so in cap space if they did so probably not likely.

ezzzp · Post #13 » by **ezzzp** » Sat Oct 26, 2019 12:55 am

Raider_MXD wrote:Why should it matter if a player who has been bought out gets injured?

He didn't get bought out. The Magic used the Stretch Provision to waive him.

The Magic can apply to have his stretched salary removed from the team’s cap. They had to wait one year from the date of his last played game to apply.

The determination of whether a player has suffered a career- ending injury is made by a physician selected by NBA and NBPA. It has to be determined that the player has an injury or illness that prevents him from playing skilled professional basketball at an NBA level for the duration of his career.

ezzzp · Post #14 » by **ezzzp** » Sat Oct 26, 2019 1:02 am

MagicFan101 wrote:
NavalAviator94 wrote:His last game in the NBA was April 11th, 2018. He's certainly satisfied any time requirements.

I’m not sure time is the key factor here. I think it’s more a matter of why he hasn’t played since then.

Is it because he sucks and no one wants to play him? Or was he really THAT badly injured?

One implies a team **** up in giving him that deal and / or trading for it and should still be held accountable. Another implies a bad situation happened and something should be done to ease the transition.

You want to make sure teams can’t avoid the cap in this fashion when they whiff on a player.

Yea, its a factor. The Magic had to wait a year from the date of Mozgov's last game played to apply for this injury benefit: NBA Collective Bargaining Agreement Page 189

In regards to his injury, this is from August 2, 2019 Eurohooop.net

Timofey Mozgov missed the 2018-19 NBA season due to knee trauma and after his return to Europe and Khimki Moscow revealed that his injury might not have been treated the best way possible:

“There is some progress in my knee injury recovery, although not as speedy as it should be since it is an old-time trauma. I don’t want to make wrongful accusations in regard to American doctors, but their treatment of my injury was not quite correct. It seems to me at the moment that they have been treating me based on a wrong diagnosis. Nothing terrible has happened, but the injury has aggravated as the time went by”, Mozgov told TASS.

The 33-year-old also confirmed that he won’t be joining the national team’s training camp: “I will not be joining the national team for the training session as I am unable to fully recover physically. However, I have enough time, or even more, before the start of the season. Nobody is hurrying me for the time being since Khimki needs to see me healthy playing for the club.”

The season has started and Mozgov is not on Khimki's roster or on Euro League's player list:

https://www.euroleague.net/competition/teams/showteam?clubcode=KHI&seasoncode=E2019

https://www.euroleague.net/competition/players?letter=M

ezzzp · Post #15 » by **ezzzp** » Sat Oct 26, 2019 1:42 am

PrimeThyme wrote:Our cap guys here could probably help with this, but I feel like this could be pretty significant if it gets approved. Zack lowe mentioned on his podcast today that if Evan has a good season he could be a prime candidate to opt-out and get a payday in a weaker free agency class. If Mosgov, Fournier, and DJ comes off the books next year would we be in position to go after a Derozan/Gallanari/Vanvleet/Bogdanovic? It looks like we may have 16 mill or so in cap space if they did so probably not likely.

The Magic won't have cap space, with or without Fournier.

Even if they trade away their 2020 1st + renounce all their free agents (MCW, Fournier, Frazier, Iwundu and DJ); they would still be $4.6m over the salary cap.

Zach Lowe didn't take into account that there are very few teams with any cap space at all...and that was before the China incident.

According to Keith Smith's (pre-China) 20-21 cap projections: only Atlanta, Cleveland, Memphis, and NYK have max room...Phoenix has $16m, Portland has $17m and Charlotte has $24m.

I really don't think Fournier opts out. Not only is there very little money (before the China repercussions take effect), but none of the teams that do have money are attractive situations for him, nor is he a need for them.

As I've said to you in the past, its all about trades for the Magic...asset retention is vital + keeping good competitive context to keep player values up is a must.

fendilim · Post #16 » by **fendilim** » Sat Oct 26, 2019 6:41 am

If we apply this on him, are we still required to pay the last years of his contract? Will his salary be immediately removed from our current total salary?

drsd · Post #17 » by **drsd** » Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:48 am

fendilim wrote:If we apply this on him, are we still required to pay the last years of his contract? Will his salary be immediately removed from our current total salary?

Mozgov gets paid.

Orlando is looking for cap-relief, not trying to get out of an iron-clad contract.

Orlando will pay him $5.6M this year, next year, and the year after (2021/22).

..

drsd · Post #18 » by **drsd** » Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:03 am

ezzzp wrote:
Timofey Mozgov missed the 2018-19 NBA season due to knee trauma and after his return to Europe and Khimki Moscow revealed that his injury might not have been treated the best way possible:

“There is some progress in my knee injury recovery, although not as speedy as it should be since it is an old-time trauma. I don’t want to make wrongful accusations in regard to American doctors, but their treatment of my injury was not quite correct. It seems to me at the moment that they have been treating me based on a wrong diagnosis. Nothing terrible has happened, but the injury has aggravated as the time went by”, Mozgov told TASS.

The 33-year-old also confirmed that he won’t be joining the national team’s training camp: “I will not be joining the national team for the training session as I am unable to fully recover physically. However, I have enough time, or even more, before the start of the season. Nobody is hurrying me for the time being since Khimki needs to see me healthy playing for the club.”

The season has started and Mozgov is not on Khimki's roster or on Euro League's player list

More on this:

An NBA Fitness to Play panel will rule on Mozgov’s health. The Collective Bargaining Agreement requires players to cooperate, including by “appearing at the reasonably scheduled place and time for examination by the jointly-selected physician.”

The NBA must also determine Mozgov’s career-ending injury “became known or reasonably should have become known while with Orlando. After his last game, Mozgov got traded from the Nets to the Hornets to the Magic in the 2018 offseason. Corroborating evidence for Orlando: Though he didn’t play, Mozgov was available for a 2018 Magic preseason game.

Yahoo LINK

I think the there are at least three reasons above why Orlando might be declined. The death-blow has to be that last sentence. Let me fix it. Corroborating evidence AGAINST Orlando: Mozgov was available for a 2018 Magic preseason game.

...

ezzzp · Post #19 » by **ezzzp** » Sat Oct 26, 2019 9:18 am

drsd wrote:More on this:
An NBA Fitness to Play panel will rule on Mozgov’s health. The Collective Bargaining Agreement requires players to cooperate, including by “appearing at the reasonably scheduled place and time for examination by the jointly-selected physician.”

The NBA must also determine Mozgov’s career-ending injury “became known or reasonably should have become known while with Orlando. After his last game, Mozgov got traded from the Nets to the Hornets to the Magic in the 2018 offseason. Corroborating evidence for Orlando: Though he didn’t play, Mozgov was available for a 2018 Magic preseason game.

I think the there are at least three reasons above why Orlando might be declined. The death-blow has to be that last sentence. Let me fix it. Corroborating evidence AGAINST Orlando: Mozgov was available for a 2018 Magic preseason game.
...

Mozgov blaming US physicians for the treatment of his knee issues doesn't mean he is on bad terms with the Magic FO and will refuse to cooperate. In fact, the only reason he was even able to sign with Khimki was because the Magic stretched his contract - that benefited him tremendously. The Magic let him out of a situation were he was never going to play to one where he was able to return home and sign a new contract with his original team AND still get every penny of his NBA $.

I think you are misunderstanding the "corroborating evidence." The author got it correct. The injury has to be determined to have become known while Mozgov was in Orlando. That he was officially listed as available (aka active) for one 2018-19 Pre-Season game with the Magic is official evidence that he was healthy and active for at least one preseason game with the Magic. That means the injury occurred or was first diagnosed after already being listed as active with Orlando. Hence its corroborating evidence FOR Orlando.

nymets1 · Post #20 » by **nymets1** » Sat Oct 26, 2019 4:39 pm

MoMM wrote:NBA didn't accept Wizards asking for Wall's injury exception, will they accept Moz? Not very likely, IMO, but maybe next season or so.

How did it work for Chris Bosh? Does anyone remember?

John Wall didn't get signed by an overseas team. He's fully committed to the NBA unlike Mozgov. Those are 2 totally different cases.