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Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory

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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1801 » by pepe1991 » Tue Oct 13, 2020 10:23 am

I just see no reason to keep adding this half baked players that are full or semi busts or unrealized potential who's ceiling is "role player on average team if everything goes right" any more. Bamba, Fultz, Gordon and now Smith? How many is too many?
You look at this contending teams and without somebody with superstar potential, mostly at wing, it's simply complete waste of time to keep adding this mediocrities that outside age have no positive attribute to attached to their names. Or are already overpayed ( Gordon) or close to free agency ( Fultz, Smith, Bamba) where you will end up paying them just to not lose them. It's lose- lose situation.

Player today has to be either:
a) star that requires s*** loud of attention
b) uber elite role player at skill he covers ( shooter, slasher, scorer, defender ...)

And no, shot blocking isn't "required skill", good defense doesn't end with block, most blocks end up being retained possession by attacking team and inbound on a side.

This team is becomming "rebahilation center for draft busts, come, recover value, go somwhere else to contribute" team :lol:
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1802 » by KillMonger » Tue Oct 13, 2020 10:28 am

MoMM wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:So on front page : Magic expressing interest in Dennis Smith Jr

"The Orlando Magic have expressed interest in trading for Dennis Smith Jr.

The New York Knicks acquired Smith as part of the 2019 Kristaps Porzingis trade.

The Magic own the No. 15 overall draft selection."

So we can assume that DJ won't be back and they will try to get DSJr for peanuts?

if we can get him for peanuts....why not
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1803 » by Skybox » Tue Oct 13, 2020 11:46 am

Tarheel wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:So on front page : Magic expressing interest in Dennis Smith Jr

"The Orlando Magic have expressed interest in trading for Dennis Smith Jr.

The New York Knicks acquired Smith as part of the 2019 Kristaps Porzingis trade.

The Magic own the No. 15 overall draft selection."


A lot of stories have come out about Knicks trades the last couple of days - sounds like a GM leaking to generate interest or push the price up to me.

I see no world in which this FO trades a FRP for a player currently backing up a player they let go for a SRP, unless it's part of a bigger deal for the Knicks pick.

That being said, if the deal is a SRP and salary (eg Birch) to take a flyer on DSJ? Sure.


This also on the heels of Knicks brass saying impressed they were with DSJ off-season commitment and improvement. They’re looking to build his value but I can’t imagine it’ll work with his frp salary on top...perhaps we get him and #8 for something (AG)?
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1804 » by j-ragg » Tue Oct 13, 2020 1:42 pm

If we are gonna target a DJ replacement, should go after a guy like Monte Morris if the price isn’t too high.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1805 » by Rainwater » Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:26 pm

pepe1991 wrote:So on front page : Magic expressing interest in Dennis Smith Jr

"The Orlando Magic have expressed interest in trading for Dennis Smith Jr.

The New York Knicks acquired Smith as part of the 2019 Kristaps Porzingis trade.

The Magic own the No. 15 overall draft selection."


Lol, this shows how much faith they have in Fultz.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1806 » by Rainwater » Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:31 pm

Skybox wrote:
Tarheel wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:So on front page : Magic expressing interest in Dennis Smith Jr

"The Orlando Magic have expressed interest in trading for Dennis Smith Jr.

The New York Knicks acquired Smith as part of the 2019 Kristaps Porzingis trade.

The Magic own the No. 15 overall draft selection."


A lot of stories have come out about Knicks trades the last couple of days - sounds like a GM leaking to generate interest or push the price up to me.

I see no world in which this FO trades a FRP for a player currently backing up a player they let go for a SRP, unless it's part of a bigger deal for the Knicks pick.

That being said, if the deal is a SRP and salary (eg Birch) to take a flyer on DSJ? Sure.


This also on the heels of Knicks brass saying impressed they were with DSJ off-season commitment and improvement. They’re looking to build his value but I can’t imagine it’ll work with his frp salary on top...perhaps we get him and #8 for something (AG)?


I would agree with this if NY didn't already have a million PFs, lol.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1807 » by drsd » Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:06 pm

For me Smith would be replacing Augustin as a bench PG that can play emergency starter minutes. That's all fine. But if the Magic go with the #15 for Smith, that meeds to be part of a packeting were both teams have more assets involved.

Say #15 and Aminu for Smith and Reggie Bullock.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1808 » by MagicMatic » Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:24 pm

I’d like to hope that anything involving DSjr involves moving up in the draft.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1809 » by MartinsIzAfraud » Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:35 pm

I could see this being a solid rumor. Seems like the Magic FO has done a lot of work on Haliburton, maybe they're also looking at Okoro? Only issues is what would we give back to NY as Smith's salary is only 5ishM.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1810 » by MagicMatic » Tue Oct 13, 2020 4:11 pm

The only thing I hate about the Smith rumors is that it again means filling minutes up that would otherwise be available to a rookie.

Fultz/Smith/MCW really leaves no room for a lot of players in that 8-15 range (yes we should resign MCW). Even with keeping 15 it puts a lot of prospects on the back burner. I could see it now with people complaining all season about Smith getting solid backup minutes over whoever we draft.

This is why we aren’t the Heat. Instead of developing players from the draft, and giving them opportunity, we fill the roster with redemption projects and vets for some self imposed playoffs or bust precedent.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1811 » by Skybox » Tue Oct 13, 2020 4:24 pm

Conversely, maybe we're absorbing DSJ (and adding something of value-hopefully, not 15) just to get the 8th pick.

I like AG for DSJ and the 8th pick

Bamba for DSJ and the pick

TRoss for DSJ and the pick

Some of these may be more fair than others but DSJ is a negative value (not Wiggins-level, but still). The first is probably most realistic balance as AG has "wow" factor and PR weight.

I don't value 8 THAT much more than 15 (less than other drafts). Moving up is good but the value of that move is not close to AG. I would LOVE to take two swings in this year's first round. I also wouldn't put any weight on Isaac's injury preventing an AG trade, we weaken one position to strengthen another. Okeke, Aminu, Clark can hold it down for Isaac if a good return for AG is out there. Okeke may be taking AG's spot ultimately anyway....I like AG and he'll flourish in the right spot, but now's the time, IMO.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1812 » by MartinsIzAfraud » Tue Oct 13, 2020 4:27 pm

MagicMatic wrote:The only thing I hate about the Smith rumors is that it again means filling minutes up that would otherwise be available to a rookie.

Fultz/Smith/MCW really leaves no room for a lot of players in that 8-15 range (yes we should resign MCW). Even with keeping 15 it puts a lot of prospects on the back burner. I could see it now with people complaining all season about Smith getting solid backup minutes over whoever we draft.

This is why we aren’t the Heat. Instead of developing players from the draft, and giving them opportunity, we fill the roster with redemption projects and vets for some self imposed playoffs or bust precedent.


Smith would be taking backup PG duties IMO. DJ wouldn't be resigned and MCW might get a small 2 year deal?

You've got Iwundu, Clark and Ennis minutes to somewhat divy up between Aminu/Okeke and draft pick.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1813 » by Magic#1 » Tue Oct 13, 2020 4:40 pm

I still like DSJ and having a coach like Clifford could help him figure stuff out The problem is that our likely two main point guards both would shoot under 30 percent from three and still have a lot of uncertainty around their health and stability. I'd still be interested for the right price, but can we please invest in some guys who can shoot? I'd probably rather stay at 15 and go for a guy like Terry.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1814 » by Creativetran » Tue Oct 13, 2020 5:55 pm

j-ragg wrote:If we are gonna target a DJ replacement, should go after a guy like Monte Morris if the price isn’t too high.

Monte would be awesome but no way is he gonna be cheap after his play this year
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1815 » by MagicMatic » Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:12 pm

MartinsIzAfraud wrote:
MagicMatic wrote:The only thing I hate about the Smith rumors is that it again means filling minutes up that would otherwise be available to a rookie.

Fultz/Smith/MCW really leaves no room for a lot of players in that 8-15 range (yes we should resign MCW). Even with keeping 15 it puts a lot of prospects on the back burner. I could see it now with people complaining all season about Smith getting solid backup minutes over whoever we draft.

This is why we aren’t the Heat. Instead of developing players from the draft, and giving them opportunity, we fill the roster with redemption projects and vets for some self imposed playoffs or bust precedent.


Smith would be taking backup PG duties IMO. DJ wouldn't be resigned and MCW might get a small 2 year deal?

You've got Iwundu, Clark and Ennis minutes to somewhat divy up between Aminu/Okeke and draft pick.


Yeah, I just don’t see any wings in this draft at those picks that can fill those minutes. It’s a guard heavy draft for the most part. Maybe Vassell or Nesmith make the most sense at that point.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1816 » by Bensational » Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:51 pm

MagicMatic wrote:The only thing I hate about the Smith rumors is that it again means filling minutes up that would otherwise be available to a rookie.

Fultz/Smith/MCW really leaves no room for a lot of players in that 8-15 range (yes we should resign MCW). Even with keeping 15 it puts a lot of prospects on the back burner. I could see it now with people complaining all season about Smith getting solid backup minutes over whoever we draft.

This is why we aren’t the Heat. Instead of developing players from the draft, and giving them opportunity, we fill the roster with redemption projects and vets for some self imposed playoffs or bust precedent.


Smith is still only 22, but now he knows the league, he's had time to learn the NBA PG role more, he's been humbled, and if he puts in the work to elevate himself he still has good potential. I think he's a fantastic buy-low option, personally.

We could still take on a rookie guard to let them duke it out with DSJr & Fultz. Both guys will be coming into their RFA years, so it might pay to have some more depth. If the rookie outplays them, they'll get the minutes. Though, chances are it means they start looking to draft bigger wings instead, like Nesmith, Vassell, Green, Bey, Bane, etc, and less likely the likes of Maxey/Lewis/Terry/etc.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1817 » by MagicMatic » Tue Oct 13, 2020 9:01 pm

Bensational wrote:
MagicMatic wrote:The only thing I hate about the Smith rumors is that it again means filling minutes up that would otherwise be available to a rookie.

Fultz/Smith/MCW really leaves no room for a lot of players in that 8-15 range (yes we should resign MCW). Even with keeping 15 it puts a lot of prospects on the back burner. I could see it now with people complaining all season about Smith getting solid backup minutes over whoever we draft.

This is why we aren’t the Heat. Instead of developing players from the draft, and giving them opportunity, we fill the roster with redemption projects and vets for some self imposed playoffs or bust precedent.


Smith is still only 22, but now he knows the league, he's had time to learn the NBA PG role more, he's been humbled, and if he puts in the work to elevate himself he still has good potential. I think he's a fantastic buy-low option, personally.

We could still take on a rookie guard to let them duke it out with DSJr & Fultz. Both guys will be coming into their RFA years, so it might pay to have some more depth. If the rookie outplays them, they'll get the minutes. Though, chances are it means they start looking to draft bigger wings instead, like Nesmith, Vassell, Green, Bey, Bane, etc, and less likely the likes of Maxey/Lewis/Terry/etc.


Yeah, the proposed acquisition seems like it’s going to push the FO into targeting a bigger wing prospect. Who knows, maybe the deal has larger implications (Deni or Hayes at #8). Doubtful but possible. If Orlando isn’t planning on moving up with these trades, I think only Green, Bey, and Bane are left at 15.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1818 » by drsd » Tue Oct 13, 2020 9:07 pm

Bensational wrote:Smith is still only 22,.


If Smith can develop a consistent 36%+ three-ball, he will carve out a 10-year NBA career as an eventual starter. Otherwise, he will be a Carter-Williams type as a best-case.

..
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1819 » by drsd » Tue Oct 13, 2020 9:09 pm

MagicMatic wrote: (yes we should resign MCW)..


We fans are not talking about this enough.

My thoughts: Carter-Williams has earned himself more than a one-year LLE deal. I would think 2.6 and 2.8 over two years would be a good deal for Orlando. but of course that comes with the full cap hit of 5.3M that would not come from a one-year deal.


..
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#1820 » by KillMonger » Tue Oct 13, 2020 10:24 pm

Smith could be our trey burke, price has to be right though
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