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Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory

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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#881 » by NotACat » Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:41 pm

drsd wrote:
SOUL wrote:
drsd wrote:
It is a 7:30PM game EST.

Question: any updates to the Gordon, Isaac, and Iwundu DtD injuries? Also Kurucs and Crawford have declared DtD injuries? Any updates there?


2:30 PM EST actually!


I meant GMT (i.e. it is a 7:30PM game for us here in the UK).


..

that seems like a great time than you would normally watch it
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#882 » by Knightro » Fri Jul 31, 2020 1:09 pm

NotACat wrote:
Knightro wrote:
NotACat wrote:On the other hand, he has expressed his frustration and wants to be on a winning team. Him joining a team like ours that's still young and has been to the playoffs the last 2 years could be the kind of team he's looking to join and go all out.

https://heavy.com/sports/2020/07/zach-lavine-chicago-bulls/


Guys say stuff all the time.

I'm sure he would prefer winning over losing, but would he be comfortable getting his usage reduced dramatically at the same time?

Fair point


I didn't mean for that to be condescending or anything either.

I'm positive LaVine would rather play for a winning team than a losing one. Losing wears guys out big time. It's not fun.

What I'm skeptical about is if LaVine would be willing to alter his game to the point where he could contribute to winning basketball.

Is he willing to start to fight over screens and not get lazy away from the play defensively just watching the ball v. staying connected to his man? Is he willing to reign in his shot selection? Is he willing to take fewer shots period?

There are a lot of things that go into playing winning basketball that LaVine has never really showed much interest in doing.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#883 » by NotACat » Fri Jul 31, 2020 1:55 pm

Knightro wrote:
NotACat wrote:
Knightro wrote:
Guys say stuff all the time.

I'm sure he would prefer winning over losing, but would he be comfortable getting his usage reduced dramatically at the same time?

Fair point


I didn't mean for that to be condescending or anything either.

I'm positive LaVine would rather play for a winning team than a losing one. Losing wears guys out big time. It's not fun.

What I'm skeptical about is if LaVine would be willing to alter his game to the point where he could contribute to winning basketball.

Is he willing to start to fight over screens and not get lazy away from the play defensively just watching the ball v. staying connected to his man? Is he willing to reign in his shot selection? Is he willing to take fewer shots period?

There are a lot of things that go into playing winning basketball that LaVine has never really showed much interest in doing.

I didn't think you had a condescending tone, I genuinely think you bring up a good point. Doing the little things consistently is going to be necessary for Lavine if he's going to elevate a team to the next level and his numbers are going to go down. Its definitely a valid question
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#884 » by basketballRob » Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:18 pm

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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#885 » by OrlChamps2030 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:26 pm

basketballRob wrote:I like Heild better because he's more of a role player. I don't think we need to bring in some high usage guys with below average defense.

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Man this team may as well be called the Orlando Role Players. Not sure why you want another one :lol:

I like both guys but I give the edge to LaVine bc I think he’s more dynamic offensively and younger
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#886 » by The Effect » Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:28 pm

basketballRob wrote:I like Heild better because he's more of a role player. I don't think we need to bring in some high usage guys with below average defense.

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lol im the complete opposite, i think thats exactly what we need

We need that go-to, alpha scorer more than anything. This team has nothing BUT role players. offensively, JI is a role player, Evan (hopefully wont be here but if he is) is a role player, Gordon is best as a role player, Vuc is somewhat forced to be the GUY, but hes best as a role player, Chuma is likely a role player (based on his college tape), Fultz is the closest thing to a go-to player and right now he still needs to develop into that role
Not saying Lavine is at the same level, but what this team needs is our new TMac, we need that guy that we can hand the ball to and ask them to go get us 40 on a random night.
I like Buddy, but to me, like you said, hes a role player. Thats literally the last thing this team needs right now
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#887 » by jezzerinho » Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:30 pm

I am fully on board for a greedy, offensive shot creator. Not so greedy he breaks open the entire offense, but someone who is a warrior.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#888 » by pepe1991 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:43 pm

jezzerinho wrote:I am fully on board for a greedy, offensive shot creator. Not so greedy he breaks open the entire offense, but someone who is a warrior.


His efficiency by TS% would make him second best Magic scorer behind Evan and his current 60% TS.
So in other words, his shots have better return value than shots of 18 out of 19 Magic players that took single shot this year.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#889 » by MoMM » Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:18 pm

thelead wrote:
MoMM wrote:
thelead wrote:
We're not getting LaVine for trash. AG will likely need to be included. That or young players like Bamba and Chuma.

So Bamba is not trash? :)


With 5.5pts, 5rbs,1.3blks, 36% from 3 and a 17.78 PER in 12.2 mpg while being in his 2nd year? No

Yeah... it seems that our coach really trusts him after this 1st game.

After leading by 30, he inserts Bamba and we almost see the lead gone in 4 minutes after a 16-0 run. Bamba -12 in 4 minutes. What a player, what a player!
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#890 » by j-ragg » Sat Aug 1, 2020 2:15 pm

MoMM wrote:
thelead wrote:
MoMM wrote:So Bamba is not trash? :)


With 5.5pts, 5rbs,1.3blks, 36% from 3 and a 17.78 PER in 12.2 mpg while being in his 2nd year? No

Yeah... it seems that our coach really trusts him after this 1st game.

After leading by 30, he inserts Bamba and we almost see the lead gone in 4 minutes after a 16-0 run. Bamba -12 in 4 minutes. What a player, what a player!

Doesn't everyone usually come in and dominate after sitting for 40+ minutes?
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#891 » by dsg2021 » Sat Aug 1, 2020 2:45 pm

I would kill for something like DJ, Aminu, top 15 protected pick for LaVine and Porter Jr., but the salary only matches up with LaVine.
Porter is probably too pricy now.
Maybe make it a top 22 protected pick conditional to two unprotected 2nd's, plus DJ and Aminu, and trust in Okeke, LaVine, #17~ pick as the reinforcements. But LaVine brings a lot of things we lack, like driving and aggression. I know he's got flaws on the court, but at a two year commitment and for such a low offer..
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#892 » by jonbob17 » Sat Aug 1, 2020 2:52 pm

DJ is a free agent, so that's not going to happen. AG + 16th pick for Lavine is probably pretty fair, may need a third party involved, I am not sure how AG fits on Chicago.
I am not a big fan of Lavine, but I wouldn't mind seeing how that turned out in Orlando.

Maybe Derrick Jones Jr could be worked in to a 3-way and it could be the dunk contest trade
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#893 » by basketballRob » Sat Aug 1, 2020 3:13 pm

I'd rather just get star role players to put around Isaac and Fultz. No thanks on Lavine, he's a really high usage guy with little defense. Even Chicago fans aren't big fans of him. He'd just kill team chemistry.

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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#894 » by MartinsIzAfraud » Sat Aug 1, 2020 3:14 pm

MoMM wrote:
thelead wrote:
MoMM wrote:So Bamba is not trash? :)


With 5.5pts, 5rbs,1.3blks, 36% from 3 and a 17.78 PER in 12.2 mpg while being in his 2nd year? No

Yeah... it seems that our coach really trusts him after this 1st game.

After leading by 30, he inserts Bamba and we almost see the lead gone in 4 minutes after a 16-0 run. Bamba -12 in 4 minutes. What a player, what a player!

He also got to play with YMCA level dudes. Has to be frustrating as hell for him unless he’s not trying in practice either. Dudes honestly looking more like a bust each game.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#895 » by MartinsIzAfraud » Sat Aug 1, 2020 3:15 pm

basketballRob wrote:I'd rather just get star role players to put around Isaac and Fultz. No thanks on Lavine, he's a really high usage guy with little defense. Even Chicago fans aren't big fans of him. He'd just kill team chemistry.

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Star role players is that a thing?
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#896 » by basketballRob » Sat Aug 1, 2020 3:59 pm

MartinsIzAfraud wrote:
basketballRob wrote:I'd rather just get star role players to put around Isaac and Fultz. No thanks on Lavine, he's a really high usage guy with little defense. Even Chicago fans aren't big fans of him. He'd just kill team chemistry.

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Star role players is that a thing?
I should coin it. I think TRoss is a star role player. He's not going to hold the ball and probe the defense like MJ, he's either going to pass, drive, or shoot.

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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#897 » by j-ragg » Sat Aug 1, 2020 4:03 pm

basketballRob wrote: No thanks on Lavine, he's a really high usage guy with little defense.

I think you could argue we need someone who's high usage (that's worth his usage).

Our need for a scorer breaks down like this for me:
a) someone who can get to the line
b) someone who can shoot off the dribble
c) someone who can make a play for others

Lavine isn't my top choice for trade targets. But he does check my personal boxes of what we need, and he's somewhat available which is rare for a go-to guy.

I don't think Fultz/Isaac will ever be the stars with the ball in their hands though, they need someone to play off of imo. I'd be happy to be wrong.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#898 » by Knightro » Sat Aug 1, 2020 5:08 pm

Here's a crazy stat.

In the last two years, Zach LaVine has thirty 30 point games and nine 40 point games.

In that same period the entire Magic team combined has twenty 30 point games and zero 40 point games.

I have major reservations around LaVine's ability/willingness to play winning basketball, but he unequivocally provides a level of scoring punch that the Magic simply do not possess right now.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#899 » by zaymon » Sat Aug 1, 2020 5:29 pm

Knightro wrote:Here's a crazy stat.

In the last two years, Zach LaVine has thirty 30 point games and nine 40 point games.

In that same period the entire Magic team combined has twenty 30 point games and zero 40 point games.

I have major reservations around LaVine's ability/willingness to play winning basketball, but he unequivocally provides a level of scoring punch that the Magic simply do not possess right now.

He did it on over 30 % usage. I.dont know what kind of efficient offense you can build around him. Not close to passer and decision maker to give him 30 % usage, and on the other hand below average shooting spot ups to play him off ball. He is a trap desperate teams fall into
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory 

Post#900 » by Magic_Johnny12 » Sat Aug 1, 2020 5:46 pm

If we gave the same usage to Fournier do you think he could put up Lavine numbers? Is there any statistics that can illustrate that?
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