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Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team"

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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#761 » by pepe1991 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 6:56 pm

OrlMagic05 wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:oh look, Mitchell just signed contract that will shut down chance for Jazz to build contending roster.
:lol:

Man, is it time to remove salary cap? It only hinders small market teams as Warriors and Lakers are fine burning $600 000 000 000 in luxury.


You can't be mad at Mitchell or the Jazz. You have to pay your superstar or he will find someone else that will lol


Do you need to pay him $195 000 000 over 5 years and kill your whole cap space for player that will, like any star, be disgrunted and angry at you because you can't sign "help" but main reason why you can't sign help is because 40% of salary cap is tied to him? :lol:

John Wall angry at Wizards why they thought of trading him after he signed supermax, eat 45% of cap space and didn't suit up for them for 2 years is most 2020 NBA thing ever.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#762 » by jonbob17 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 6:56 pm

Skybox wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:oh look, Mitchell just signed contract that will shut down chance for Jazz to build contending roster.
:lol:

Man, is it time to remove salary cap? It only hinders small market teams as Warriors and Lakers are fine burning $600 000 000 000 in luxury.


with Gobert coming for Supermax close behind...they'll end up trading him for pieces. Then, at the end of his deal, he'll go to the Lakers for $3m


Gobert ain't getting supermax kind of coin. Not even close.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#763 » by Dub_Sax » Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:10 pm

Given how the nba likes to control the sports news cycle, I believe there are some trades that are in the works, but we're not there yet. It's still free agency time. Once this is over, there will be another period where the nba will dominate the news cycle with trades. One of which hopefully will include Westbrook to the Magic for players not named Vooch.

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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#764 » by OrlMagic05 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:23 pm

pepe1991 wrote:
OrlMagic05 wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:oh look, Mitchell just signed contract that will shut down chance for Jazz to build contending roster.
:lol:

Man, is it time to remove salary cap? It only hinders small market teams as Warriors and Lakers are fine burning $600 000 000 000 in luxury.


You can't be mad at Mitchell or the Jazz. You have to pay your superstar or he will find someone else that will lol


Do you need to pay him $195 000 000 over 5 years and kill your whole cap space for player that will, like any star, be disgrunted and angry at you because you can't sign "help" but main reason why you can't sign help is because 40% of salary cap is tied to him? :lol:

John Wall angry at Wizards why they thought of trading him after he signed supermax, eat 45% of cap space and didn't suit up for them for 2 years is most 2020 NBA thing ever.


Its the price owners have to pay. You sound a little like the orlando sentinel when the contract we originally offered Shaq was "too much" Not saying Mitchell is remotely close to Shaq, but you have to pay your star players or youre going to suck. Teams like the warriors were extremely lucky that Curry was injured his first few years which is why he didnt get the max and they also have great management that structured contracts correctly. If Isaac wouldnt have got injured i'm sure the magic would have offered something close to that which I believe is worth it (pre injury).
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#765 » by Nyce_1 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:24 pm

Dub_Sax wrote:Given how the nba likes to control the sports news cycle, I believe there are some trades that are in the works, but we're not there yet. It's still free agency time. Once this is over, there will be another period where the nba will dominate the news cycle with trades. One of which hopefully will include Westbrook to the Magic for players not named Vooch.

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You're crazy. Camp starts in 10 days. Teams aren't holding back trades just to control media interest. Teams want to get their players and families settled asap.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#766 » by Dub_Sax » Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:34 pm

Nyce_1 wrote:
Dub_Sax wrote:Given how the nba likes to control the sports news cycle, I believe there are some trades that are in the works, but we're not there yet. It's still free agency time. Once this is over, there will be another period where the nba will dominate the news cycle with trades. One of which hopefully will include Westbrook to the Magic for players not named Vooch.

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You're crazy. Camp starts in 10 days. Teams aren't holding back trades just to control media interest. Teams want to get their players and families settled asap.


If you think trades get done with respect to players and families having time to get settled, you're crazy.

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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: 

Post#767 » by Ducklett » Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:36 pm

Dub_Sax wrote:
Nyce_1 wrote:
Dub_Sax wrote:Given how the nba likes to control the sports news cycle, I believe there are some trades that are in the works, but we're not there yet. It's still free agency time. Once this is over, there will be another period where the nba will dominate the news cycle with trades. One of which hopefully will include Westbrook to the Magic for players not named Vooch.

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You're crazy. Camp starts in 10 days. Teams aren't holding back trades just to control media interest. Teams want to get their players and families settled asap.


If you think trades get done with respect to players and families having time to get settled, you're crazy.

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Trades are made to be player friendly all of the time. They want that good rep with agents/players when they go into signing players...
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#768 » by Howard Mass » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:08 pm

Some teams like Atlanta and Charlotte have definitely gotten better.

I do think Orlando is going to face some questions no later than The Trading Deadline and probably before.

Decisions need to be made here on the direction of this team and one way or another, this is likely going to happen.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#769 » by jonbob17 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:30 pm

Howard Mass wrote:Some teams like Atlanta and Charlotte have definitely gotten better.

I do think Orlando is going to face some questions no later than The Trading Deadline and probably before.

Decisions need to be made here on the direction of this team and one way or another, this is likely going to happen.


Seems to me like the decisions were made, no matter how much some, and especially me, disagree with them. Maybe they trade Fournier at the deadline, but they need his expiring money to pay the young guys anyways.
The direction is to move forward and compete with the personnel we have (and value).
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#770 » by Nyce_1 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:53 pm

Dub_Sax wrote:
Nyce_1 wrote:
Dub_Sax wrote:Given how the nba likes to control the sports news cycle, I believe there are some trades that are in the works, but we're not there yet. It's still free agency time. Once this is over, there will be another period where the nba will dominate the news cycle with trades. One of which hopefully will include Westbrook to the Magic for players not named Vooch.

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You're crazy. Camp starts in 10 days. Teams aren't holding back trades just to control media interest. Teams want to get their players and families settled asap.


If you think trades get done with respect to players and families having time to get settled, you're crazy.

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Smart guy, of course they don't. But, in an unprecedented time, teams are trying to make transactions fast so players can quickly get to the new team, settle, and be ready for camp and they can get their families moved so they don't have to worry about those stresses.

Definitely not "hey, let's make teams wait on trades so we could control the news cycle".
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#771 » by Howard Mass » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:22 pm

jonbob17 wrote:
Howard Mass wrote:Some teams like Atlanta and Charlotte have definitely gotten better.

I do think Orlando is going to face some questions no later than The Trading Deadline and probably before.

Decisions need to be made here on the direction of this team and one way or another, this is likely going to happen.


Seems to me like the decisions were made, no matter how much some, and especially me, disagree with them. Maybe they trade Fournier at the deadline, but they need his expiring money to pay the young guys anyways.
The direction is to move forward and compete with the personnel we have (and value).


More are to come as this team is stuck now.

The first will likely be to move Fournier.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#772 » by Gomagic44 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:23 pm

We haven't had a real direction in 10 years. The plan failed. So we hired a new GM. We still rely on the last guys starters. It's the same thing over and over again. High character athletes that cant shoot. The goal is to win a championship. This ain't it!

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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#773 » by Dub_Sax » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:35 pm

Nyce_1 wrote:
Dub_Sax wrote:
Nyce_1 wrote:You're crazy. Camp starts in 10 days. Teams aren't holding back trades just to control media interest. Teams want to get their players and families settled asap.


If you think trades get done with respect to players and families having time to get settled, you're crazy.

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Smart guy, of course they don't. But, in an unprecedented time, teams are trying to make transactions fast so players can quickly get to the new team, settle, and be ready for camp and they can get their families moved so they don't have to worry about those stresses.

Definitely not "hey, let's make teams wait on trades so we could control the news cycle".
Think about it, no FA has signed a contract yet. Teams still have to evaluate their rosters post free agency. At that point they will have a better idea of if they need to make additional changes to their roster..

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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#774 » by pepe1991 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:43 pm

Gordon, Vuc and Evan are entering their 7th season together.

You can't even make that crap up...

The lack of desire to do anything, to move anybody, to even choose direction from this front office is one of most annoying things about Orlando Magic in last 2 decades. Sure there were some crappy times, there was whole 2013 sh** fest, there was Payton and Hezonja era, there was post Dwight depression but at least we all somewhat understood direction. it was Orlando Magic, post Howard- rebuilding saga.

What execlly is Orlando now? We are not contender, that's a given. We are not building team, no cap flexibility, we are going nowhere. And we are not rebuilding team, we are not even lottery team for crying out loud nor we want rookies. We just flushed 2 second round picks for nothing and refused to re-sign previous second round picks.

There is great article on OPP how directionless and flat out depressing Orlando Magic offseason has been so far

https://www.orlandopinstripedpost.com/2020/11/22/21589345/orlando-magic-wes-iwundu-james-ennis-gary-clark-2020-nba-free-agency

if anybody bothers, enjoy

hell, there is juicy part that sums everything so well

Decision makers in Orlando’s front office likely feel that they need clarity regarding these numbers before they can make definitive decisions about the roster pieces around their two young hopefuls. But herein lies the problem: pushing major decisions further down the line is degrading the value of any players they may eventually decide to move on from, as well as limiting the team’s ability to put together a plan for the pieces they’ll need two or even three years down the line. The Magic are a team that projects to have neither juicy draft picks nor significant cap space in the next few years, while the odds of internal improvement are growing slimmer. It’s not a great combination!

There are some genuine ‘rock and hard place’ dynamics at play here for Orlando. The team hasn’t found the sort of transformational talent needed to ensure genuine competitiveness, and now there are bills coming due that promise to lock up the team’s ability to add to any core as they move into the next phase. In this instance it doesn’t seem that the decision making processes have helped; there’s a real feeling of things being more reactive than proactive, which makes getting ahead at any point incredibly difficult.

The problem this offseason — like it has been at similar flash points in the recent past — is that the Magic have appeared indecisive. Only the most optimistic of souls would believe that the ceiling of the team as currently constructed hasn’t largely been known for the better part of twenty-four months now. But in exercising patience and adopting a protracted ‘wait and see’ period of evaluation, the front office have now pushed their decision-making timeline almost to its end — and breaking — point. The veterans are aging. The youth are about to get paid. The options available are dwindling as Orlando are backed further and further into the corner.

The Magic are stuck in the morass that is the NBA’s middle ground. The opening salvo in this offseason, again, did little to suggest the team is ready to move on from their current mediocrity and navigate the difficult years ahead in successful fashion. More than anything I would love to be proven wrong, but there’s an evident sense of familiarity that isn’t comforting in its presence. Fingers crossed the future will prove more favorable.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#775 » by basketballRob » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:52 pm

Not sure who Gerald White is?




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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#776 » by Airgordon00 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:27 pm

I have a feeling we will be hearing about a Isaac extension pretty soon with all these extensions getting done. I’m really curious to see what the #s will be for Isaac.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: 

Post#777 » by RookieStar » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:30 pm

basketballRob wrote:Not sure who Gerald White is?




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Well at least he is honest about being in the G League.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#778 » by dsg2021 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:35 pm

I would rather let vets walk away and force teams to pony up cap space than trade them for #24 and trash. It's a tactic that would pay off in trade talks 3 years later (there's a bite with the bark), when ORL has a real path and the trades really count.

I think many of the pessimists will be surprised at how willing WeHam, Lloyd and FO will be to let salary shed off. There will even be "young" players who walk away instead of WeHam extending them or matching them. Even if there is fluster and smoke that they'll match.

One thing the WeHam FO has been able to do really well is smart cap space use. And already hitting big-time on a #6 pick too. The salary cap sheet in future years are not going to be nearly as clogged as they think. You just extend JI for as long and as much of an injury discount as you can, and build from there.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#779 » by tiderulz » Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:36 pm

dsg2021 wrote:I would rather let vets walk away and force teams to pony up cap space than trade them for #24 and trash. It's a tactic that would pay off in trade talks 3 years later (there's a bite with the bark), when ORL has a real path and the trades really count.

I think many of the pessimists will be surprised at how willing WeHam, Lloyd and FO will be to let salary shed off. There will even be "young" players who walk away instead of WeHam extending them or matching them. Even if there is fluster and smoke that they'll match.

One thing the WeHam FO has been able to do really well is smart cap space use. And already hitting big-time on a #6 pick too. The salary cap sheet in future years are not going to be nearly as clogged as they think. You just extend JI for as long and as much of an injury discount as you can, and build from there.

it also could backfire with free agents who see how Orlando deals with their vets. and what hitting big time #6 pick are you referring to? the JI raft pick reminds me of the AG pick. its not that it was so great, its that it was good compared to the players picked after that ended up not being good. And they flopped the #6 pick the very next year,
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team" 

Post#780 » by Optimus_Steel » Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:47 pm

dsg2021 wrote:I would rather let vets walk away and force teams to pony up cap space than trade them for #24 and trash. It's a tactic that would pay off in trade talks 3 years later (there's a bite with the bark), when ORL has a real path and the trades really count.

I think many of the pessimists will be surprised at how willing WeHam, Lloyd and FO will be to let salary shed off. There will even be "young" players who walk away instead of WeHam extending them or matching them. Even if there is fluster and smoke that they'll match.

One thing the WeHam FO has been able to do really well is smart cap space use. And already hitting big-time on a #6 pick too. The salary cap sheet in future years are not going to be nearly as clogged as they think. You just extend JI for as long and as much of an injury discount as you can, and build from there.
I'll give them that, they are not crippling future cap with contracts and not trading for contracts.
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