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Well, 11 games passed by, and results are all over the board. Hot start against mostly terrible teams, injuries, and rude awakening of mediocrity.

Looking some numbers, with finally some measurable data to look at, things are flat out bad for "young guns" preachers, ones who just want to hand team to young playres and watch them turn into new Harden, Durant, Lebron.



Image shows how poorly each and every single young player is actually doing.
Vuc is basically doing his best Jokić- MVP performance, but nobody can save this team from missing playoffs. Well... Maybe they actually can make playoffs if you look who else is fighting to miss it. Most teams on East are flat out terrible to medicore. I won't be suprised if only 5 to 6 Eastern conference teams even ends up with positive record.

What are your guys thoughts ?

What would you like to do next? Tank, soft tank? Full tank? Rebuild? Or just patch things up with veteran PG and keep grinding?


I'm leaning toward hard rebulid as i'm losing any hope there is any path toward being even watchable until 2022/2023.
I just don't see any player to build future around, and tanking sounds like only logical direction.

BPM is a pretty flawed stat, to be honest. How did Vucevic end up so far ahead of everyone and with an MVP level current value in a supposedly largely plus minus based stat when he has a significantly negative on/off rating (-9.1)? It's not like he's averaging 35/18 or something absurd like that.

Bergmaniac wrote:BPM is a pretty flawed stat, to be honest. How did Vucevic end up so far ahead of everyone and with an MVP level current value in a supposedly largely plus minus based stat when he has a significantly negative on/off rating (-9.1)?

Hole team has negative net rating.
Magic plus minus differential is -4,2.

Net rating is still too wild to use for 11 games because of lobsided Ws and Ls didn't evan up yet

Learnt that we have a very good team but we are cursed, too many injuries

This is the NBA Wasteland. Beat the bad teams and make it close to good teams for 2.5 quarters then fall apart. This team is who they have been for 7 + years. It needs to be blown up properly.

Bergmaniac wrote:BPM is a pretty flawed stat, to be honest. How did Vucevic end up so far ahead of everyone and with an MVP level current value in a supposedly largely plus minus based stat when he has a significantly negative on/off rating (-9.1)? It's not like he's averaging 35/18 or something absurd like that.

Yeah. BPM is fairly useless. It’s only real value is in that it allows you to compare modern players to players from previous eras because it is composed only from the rudimentary stats that have been collected for ages. Even then, it doesn’t really tell you much of anything. Unfortunately, people use it because all of the more useful stuff doesn’t get rolled out until much later in the year.

We learned that the difference between being 6-2 and 0-8 is markelle fultz

we learned we are same flawled chucker team we ve been for a decade plus basketball gods hate us
and I dont blame them

We learned that some fans are overreacting based on 11 game sample size with 3/4 of rotation being injured or rookies. Little more injuries and we will end up with good lottery pick, young core and good veterans. Some people need instant gratification, but it rarely works.

We learned that some ( ok maybe a lot) of Magic fans were expecting a star in the 15th pick.

zaymon wrote:We learned that some fans are overreacting based on 11 game sample size with 3/4 of rotation being injured or rookies. Little more injuries and we will end up with good lottery pick, young core and good veterans. Some people need instant gratification, but it rarely works.

expected this. It's been 5 **** years my dude and we have one of the most timid FO's in the NBA who can't draft worth ****. We have 4 years of sample size and we're nothing more than a 1st round exit team whose cap screwed for years.

Personally, I feel that it confirmed the Magic are an average team. By average, I mean that they'll hover around .500 and maybe make a 7 or 8 seed in the Eastern Conference. The Fultz injury makes me think it might be a little hard to even do that, though.

Fultz was massive mistake.

The Effect wrote:We learned that the difference between being 6-2 and 0-8 is markelle fultz

the difference between 6'2 and 0-8 is strength of schedule and healthy bodies. Not just one guy who wasn't even playing well when he got injured.

MartinsIzAfraud wrote:

zaymon wrote:We learned that some fans are overreacting based on 11 game sample size with 3/4 of rotation being injured or rookies. Little more injuries and we will end up with good lottery pick, young core and good veterans. Some people need instant gratification, but it rarely works.

expected this. It's been 5 **** years my dude and we have one of the most timid FO's in the NBA who can't draft worth ****. We have 4 years of sample size and we're nothing more than a 1st round exit team whose cap screwed for years.

I try to be consistent with my aproach i dont change my opinion with every win or loss. I dont agree with drafting. Isaac is a game changer and I like both Chuma and Cole. We need to be patient. Those injuries suck for young guys development but could push us into top 5 of the draft even without trades.

No new revelations. We are still no closer to being a contender than we were when Henny first got started in 2012.

I still think unless trades are made we are around the 8th to 9th best team in the East. Clifford gets this team prepared and hustling and we are going to beat the bad teams and pick up wins here and there against teams on a back-to-back or with players out due to health and safety protocol.
Vucevic has improved his game. He looks like KAT with out the blocks.

Even with an improved Vuc, it feels like our future ceiling has gotten significantly lower. JI is still our only projectable young player and he has huge injury question marks.
Okeke looked really slow.
Fultz shot hype was just hype, really disappointed in Clifford putting that out there.
Anthony, I am not giving up on him, but man he has got a lot of fleas. The same fleas people pointed out before the draft.
I still think we have no idea on Bamba's future. You could tell me he is a future DPOY or we don't offer him another contract, and I have no idea which is closer to the truth. Actually maybe the latter is more probable, but the point he has a very wide range of outcomes.

Really feels like this FO miscalculated and brought us out of the rebuild too early. Clifford is the right coach for a team with one more very good player.

I still hope we can find one player who can contribute quickly from the next draft, I just don't think we we will pick high enough, and even if we get top eight or so pick that player might be too young to add significant value to the peak years of Vuc.

Fournier and AG have to go almost immediately to re-invest in the future. I am not even sure if that is enough. It seems like we have to get really lucky in this year's draft and have JI come back 100% with no future issues, which might even require more luck.

Same as last season. Vuc, Gordon, Ross (and Evan when playing) are good enough to beat up on bad teams and make our record seem more competitive than it is. We have one prospect who can get in the court and another in the coach's doghouse.

And it's boring AF basketball

For starters, as long as we don’t have that one superstar to build around, we’ll never be in contention. Do I think we possibly have one on this roster? No I don’t.

I do like Fultz and JI, they should be building blocks going forward. Which is pretty sad with their injury history. But again, I like them.

We need to put ourselves in a position to give us the best shot at an elite talent. To me, that should either be through the draft or by trade for young (diamond in the rough) talent.

For example I’d really look into opportunities like trading with GS. I’d take on Wiggins for Wiseman and or the wolves pick. GS could use Fournier, Ross and Vuc. Maybe even Gordon.

I’m a fan of Vuc but I think we should really consider selling high now because he’ll be 34-35 before we can have this thing rolling.

I believe there’s options and we need a shake up. We’re going nowhere.

Vuc looks like an all star. Trade some people (hell and Vuc is someone wants to pay us nicely) and look forward to a great pick in a great draft and hope to god we find a superstar.