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2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18)

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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#381 » by JBSouthpaw » Mon Apr 5, 2021 2:20 pm

bigdogdylan5 wrote:I think if Cliff wants to coach this team he has to find a way to walk the line of holding them accountable and not being too harsh. I get it no moral victories but damn he doesn’t have to be that harsh. You need to find the middle ground between of Cliff and Skiles and the bull JV was doing. I fully expect to see this lineup for the rest of the season so everyone needs to prepare themselves. Cliff has no patience for the youth judging by these press conferences.

MCW/Anthony
Harris/Ross/Ennis/Hampton (lucky if 10 mins a game)
Bacon/Ennis/Porter
Okeke/Porter/Birch
Carter/Birch/Bamba


-No way Hampton is buried on the bench, he's played too well
-Harris coming off injury won't be starting right away IMO,
- Ennis is no where able to play SG
-When both healthy Ennis has started at SF over Bacon.

No patience for youth?? Cole and Okeke were both getting minutes at the beginning of the year with all healthy.

IMO what is most likely:
MCW/Hampton
Bacon/Harris/Cole
Ennis/Ross
Okeke/Birch
Carter/Mo

I'd like to see:
RJ/MCW
Harris/Cole/Bacon
Ennis/Otto
Okeke/Birch
WCJ/MO
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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#382 » by Bakomagic » Mon Apr 5, 2021 3:54 pm

JBSouthpaw wrote:
bigdogdylan5 wrote:I think if Cliff wants to coach this team he has to find a way to walk the line of holding them accountable and not being too harsh. I get it no moral victories but damn he doesn’t have to be that harsh. You need to find the middle ground between of Cliff and Skiles and the bull JV was doing. I fully expect to see this lineup for the rest of the season so everyone needs to prepare themselves. Cliff has no patience for the youth judging by these press conferences.

MCW/Anthony
Harris/Ross/Ennis/Hampton (lucky if 10 mins a game)
Bacon/Ennis/Porter
Okeke/Porter/Birch
Carter/Birch/Bamba


-No way Hampton is buried on the bench, he's played too well
-Harris coming off injury won't be starting right away IMO,
- Ennis is no where able to play SG
-When both healthy Ennis has started at SF over Bacon.

No patience for youth?? Cole and Okeke were both getting minutes at the beginning of the year with all healthy.

IMO what is most likely:
MCW/Hampton
Bacon/Harris/Cole
Ennis/Ross
Okeke/Birch
Carter/Mo

I'd like to see:
RJ/MCW
Harris/Cole/Bacon
Ennis/Otto
Okeke/Birch
WCJ/MO


You think Cole is going to be relegated to 3rd string shooting guard ?

He was starting when we still had Vuc, Fournier and AG and still had some nice scoring and assist games.

Ad soon as he returns he will challenge Okeke/Ross as our best offensive weapon.
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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#383 » by Popsicle1228 » Mon Apr 5, 2021 3:57 pm

ChosenSavior wrote:This is a better fit for Gordon. He can be spoon fed buckets all day and not be asked to create his own shot which he is incapable of doing. They are definitely going to need AG to play like that every game because the better teams in the West are definitely going to attack Murray and MPJ in that lineup. Both of them are very suspect on the defense end. Also Jokic will need to man the **** up. Dwight was basically bullying him in the series against the Lakers and completely took him out of rhythm.

As for us, I feel confident in saying that I really like the trade we did with Denver. We actually got more for Gordon than I'd imagined. I stopped liking Gordon honestly after our first playoff series against the Raptors.


What was it that you saw or heard that made you stop liking Gordon in that series? Just curious to get your perspective.
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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#384 » by basketballRob » Mon Apr 5, 2021 4:00 pm

thelead wrote:
PrimeThyme wrote:I’d personally prefer to keep Clifford on board too. Ive been higher on him than most over the last few years && think he could play a critical role in WCJ’s development.

The only thing that gives me pause with Cliff is his handling of young guards. A somewhat turnover prone guard like RJ could find his way out of the rotation at any moment once we get some guys back && that’s just not going to be an option. He has to play.

Overall though, I actually think Clifford gets a really unfair rep when it comes to his development of young guys. He’s shown the willingness to give the young players who could actually play and that have talent on this team big minutes and pretty defined roles (Isaac, Chuma, Cole). Bamba just isn’t any good and isn’t capable of playing big minutes in the NBA.

I think Clifford will stay on. Harris/Ross will still be under contract next year, Isaac will be coming back, && I imagine we will have some cap space to play with too. We will be more competitive than people think, similarly to how we’ve been since trading everyone at the deadline.

Clifford squeezes everything out of a roster.


I'm not the biggest Clifford fan but watching the bulls makes me really appreciate him
The one thing I worry about is Cliff can push for wins and jeopardize the health of players. This season we've been playing a compressed schedule and perhaps Cliff should've used the bench more early on.

They have plenty of proof now, that playing players tired, causes soft tissue injuries.

Like the Fultz injury, for several games before the one he got injured, he couldn't buy a 10' shot. He normally makes that, and that was a sign he was tired.

Instead of looking at the season like a marathon, every game was a 40 yard dash.

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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#385 » by ChosenSavior » Mon Apr 5, 2021 4:07 pm

Popsicle1228 wrote:
ChosenSavior wrote:This is a better fit for Gordon. He can be spoon fed buckets all day and not be asked to create his own shot which he is incapable of doing. They are definitely going to need AG to play like that every game because the better teams in the West are definitely going to attack Murray and MPJ in that lineup. Both of them are very suspect on the defense end. Also Jokic will need to man the **** up. Dwight was basically bullying him in the series against the Lakers and completely took him out of rhythm.

As for us, I feel confident in saying that I really like the trade we did with Denver. We actually got more for Gordon than I'd imagined. I stopped liking Gordon honestly after our first playoff series against the Raptors.


What was it that you saw or heard that made you stop liking Gordon in that series? Just curious to get your perspective.


For me, I just did not like the fit with him and Isaac long term and that his offensive game plateaued to me when watching him in that series. His limitations were on full display once Toronto honed in on shutting down Augustin and Vuc. While he does make splash defensive plays due to his athleticism, he still is inconsistent on that end of the floor.

He is a much better fit for the Nuggets who have superior offensive players that can draw attention away from him allowing him to cut to the basket and use his athleticism which is his greatest attribute.
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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#386 » by JBSouthpaw » Mon Apr 5, 2021 4:09 pm

Bakomagic wrote:
JBSouthpaw wrote:
bigdogdylan5 wrote:I think if Cliff wants to coach this team he has to find a way to walk the line of holding them accountable and not being too harsh. I get it no moral victories but damn he doesn’t have to be that harsh. You need to find the middle ground between of Cliff and Skiles and the bull JV was doing. I fully expect to see this lineup for the rest of the season so everyone needs to prepare themselves. Cliff has no patience for the youth judging by these press conferences.

MCW/Anthony
Harris/Ross/Ennis/Hampton (lucky if 10 mins a game)
Bacon/Ennis/Porter
Okeke/Porter/Birch
Carter/Birch/Bamba


-No way Hampton is buried on the bench, he's played too well
-Harris coming off injury won't be starting right away IMO,
- Ennis is no where able to play SG
-When both healthy Ennis has started at SF over Bacon.

No patience for youth?? Cole and Okeke were both getting minutes at the beginning of the year with all healthy.

IMO what is most likely:
MCW/Hampton
Bacon/Harris/Cole
Ennis/Ross
Okeke/Birch
Carter/Mo

I'd like to see:
RJ/MCW
Harris/Cole/Bacon
Ennis/Otto
Okeke/Birch
WCJ/MO


You think Cole is going to be relegated to 3rd string shooting guard ?

He was starting when we still had Vuc, Fournier and AG and still had some nice scoring and assist games.

Ad soon as he returns he will challenge Okeke/Ross as our best offensive weapon.


I think he'll be there to start. He's been out for 2 months.
I have no idea of what their plan is for Harris. Do they think he'll be with us next year??
What I think will happen, vs. what I want is different.
I'd want Cole to be the 1st guard off the bench for either Hampton at PG or Harris at SG.
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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#387 » by Knightro » Mon Apr 5, 2021 4:20 pm

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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#388 » by Howard Mass » Mon Apr 5, 2021 6:34 pm

drsd wrote:
Howard Mass wrote:Great effort tonight by the very short handed Magic. In the end, they ran out of gas to a very good team who will contend for the Western Conference Title. It was an exciting game most of the way and really about as much as you could have hoped for under the circumstances.

Now, The Magic get a few days off to get healthy and beat this damn flu bug. Cole Anthony will be back soon and hopefully Gary Harris too.


Gordon has not lost a game since being a Nugget.


..


He has not.

I'm happy for him.
R.I.P. Dharam Raghubir (A.K.A. Magnumt)

:beer:
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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#389 » by DiplomaticMagic » Mon Apr 5, 2021 8:02 pm

I might be on the train hoping Cliff quits
https://youtu.be/ODJ0hKHonJg

I dont know how mad you can be at the players with how they fought, after playing b2b games with 8 players with 2 of the 8 sick, and another 2 with hamstring/ankle injures playing in high altitude and be super pissed about it

And the fact he brings up JJ Redick as someone who did it when he came in the league is such bs. JJ rode the bench for almost 4 years before he played.

Holding guys accountable is one thing but to air it out like that is just a bad look
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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#390 » by RookieStar » Mon Apr 5, 2021 8:20 pm

zuppafly wrote:I'm on the other side: I think Cliff is showing how to be the best rebuild coach we could have.
He is playing the young guys and he is making them accountable during the losses. We can argue that it's expected to loose these games, but it's up to the coaching staff to develop the players and make sure they become able to win and not make the mistakes we are doing.
Experience is worth zero if the players are not on their toes every single game. We will lose a lot of games, we will lose a lot of close games due to mistakes from young guys, I want to have a coach that is pissed because of these mistakes and pushes the young core to grow and learn to win games, not just fill the stat sheet.


I agree.If CLiff is the coach that can instill the proper learning for these rooks then Im all for it. We will have a lot of losing games no question about that. I want a coach that will teach them that just because w elost a game doesn't mean you can be nonchalant about losing your man, dribbling your foot, late to your assignments and etc. Lose because the other teams can't miss, the other teams are bigger and pushed you around, other teams have more calls etc etc
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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#391 » by JBSouthpaw » Mon Apr 5, 2021 8:52 pm

I'm going to duck after I write this, but I've been really impressed with Cliff's coaching the last 4-5 games.
He has gotten the most out of Okeke, Carter, Hampton and to a degree Mo.
This whole team is playing hard.
When Cole gets back, I'm interested in seeing him handle Cole and RJ.
At the beginning of the season, Cole was playing the 2 guard spot, then had to move into more of a lead guard. What happens now?
I've liked what I've seen with Hampton as the lead ball handler.
Now mix in Harris too.
Let's see what Cliff comes up with...
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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#392 » by RookieStar » Mon Apr 5, 2021 10:43 pm

JBSouthpaw wrote:I'm going to duck after I write this, but I've been really impressed with Cliff's coaching the last 4-5 games.
He has gotten the most out of Okeke, Carter, Hampton and to a degree Mo.
This whole team is playing hard.
When Cole gets back, I'm interested in seeing him handle Cole and RJ.
At the beginning of the season, Cole was playing the 2 guard spot, then had to move into more of a lead guard. What happens now?
I've liked what I've seen with Hampton as the lead ball handler.
Now mix in Harris too.
Let's see what Cliff comes up with...


Naaah don't be. If Cliff is the coach that can build you solid fundamentals, make you play the right way AND makes you play 100% even on a tanking season, that is the coach you need especially for a team like ours where we have 3 rookies and a potential ADDITIONAL 3 more rookies after this draft.

I mean sure its a head-scratcher with his man-love for Bacon and Birch.. but it is what it is...
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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#393 » by Ducklett » Mon Apr 5, 2021 11:32 pm

Cliff's postgame presser calling out his 8 guys, 2 of which played sick, was kinda gross.
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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#394 » by basketballRob » Tue Apr 6, 2021 12:09 am

Ducklett wrote:Cliff's postgame presser calling out his 8 guys, 2 of which played sick, was kinda gross.
Not sure why he has to tell the media everytime a player makes a mistake.

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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#395 » by drsd » Tue Apr 6, 2021 8:24 am

Ducklett wrote:Cliff's postgame presser calling out his 8 guys, 2 of which played sick, was kinda gross.


And Ross is on a bum ankle!

..
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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#396 » by magicman112 » Tue Apr 6, 2021 2:57 pm



What I really like is the effort for the whole game. No quit in these young guys they fought the whole time which hasn't always been the case with some of the other players we've had past few years. Still super early, but so far looks like we got a nice talented young core in the making if they can keep improving.
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Re: 2020-2021 Regular Season Game 50: Orlando Magic (17-32) at Denver Nuggets (30-18) 

Post#397 » by Nyce_1 » Wed Apr 7, 2021 10:41 pm

RookieStar wrote:
JBSouthpaw wrote:I'm going to duck after I write this, but I've been really impressed with Cliff's coaching the last 4-5 games.
He has gotten the most out of Okeke, Carter, Hampton and to a degree Mo.
This whole team is playing hard.
When Cole gets back, I'm interested in seeing him handle Cole and RJ.
At the beginning of the season, Cole was playing the 2 guard spot, then had to move into more of a lead guard. What happens now?
I've liked what I've seen with Hampton as the lead ball handler.
Now mix in Harris too.
Let's see what Cliff comes up with...


Naaah don't be. If Cliff is the coach that can build you solid fundamentals, make you play the right way AND makes you play 100% even on a tanking season, that is the coach you need especially for a team like ours where we have 3 rookies and a potential ADDITIONAL 3 more rookies after this draft.

I mean sure its a head-scratcher with his man-love for Bacon and Birch.. but it is what it is...
Cliff is the right coach for now. What may do him in is his lack of offensive creativity. I think sometimes, you have to think outside the box and do some unorthodox things to get ahead.
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