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Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2

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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1081 » by Magic Mops » Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:17 am

Interesting options for the second round pick









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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1082 » by ogmagicfan » Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:32 am

RookieStar wrote:
basketballRob wrote:Giddey is younger and better than Kuminga.

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Thats ummm a surprising hot take.


If Kuminga pans out he can be the best player in the draft. Can’t envision any scenario where that’s the case for Giddey.

Kuminga is not an Aaron Gordon. He’s more skilled, and frankly looks more fluid. Reducing him to athleticism isn’t doing him justice.
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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1083 » by basketballRob » Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:35 am

Bensational wrote:
RookieStar wrote:
basketballRob wrote:Giddey is younger and better than Kuminga.

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Thats ummm a surprising hot take.


How? Giddey’s skill level as a passer and facilitator is unquestionably better than Kuminga’s, Kuminga a significantly better scorer from inside, and they’re both poor shooters from distance right now.

A surprising hot take is setting Doncic as the bar for success for Giddey.
Kuminga is better athletically. Giddey is a little better at almost everything else, rebounding, shooting, and passing.

When I saw Giddey was actually a few days younger than Kuminga, I didn't really see any reason why Kuminga was so much more highly touted. It'll probably depend on which player works harder to improve.

As far as Giddey, I think I saw he was 1st in assists and 5th in rebounds, in the NBL. That's pretty dominating for the youngest player in the draft.





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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1084 » by basketballRob » Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:47 am

ogmagicfan wrote:
RookieStar wrote:
basketballRob wrote:Giddey is younger and better than Kuminga.

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Thats ummm a surprising hot take.


If Kuminga pans out he can be the best player in the draft. Can’t envision any scenario where that’s the case for Giddey.

Kuminga is not an Aaron Gordon. He’s more skilled, and frankly looks more fluid. Reducing him to athleticism isn’t doing him justice.
Giddey has been the best player at every level he's played on so far. Kuminga has all the tools, but hasn't done that.


https://australia.basketball/blog/2020/01/15/josh-giddey-named-mvp-as-the-nba-global-academy-triumphs-at-the-2020-torneo-junio-ciutat-de-lhospitalet/

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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1085 » by RookieStar » Fri Jun 11, 2021 12:39 pm

Bensational wrote:
RookieStar wrote:
Bensational wrote:
Athleticism does nothing for you without skill. Highly skilled and lesser athletic players can do just fine. I’m not worried about defense from whatever position Giddey plays because we have Isaac, Bamba, Okeke and RJ to cover that.

Weren’t you asking for skilled and unathletic euro guys just last week? Giddey and Sengun are the two closest to that and you’re not a fan of either, lol.


First off.. its unathletic EURO. Giddey is from down under.LOL

Second i dont like the two but in terms of player.. I rank Barnes ahead of Sengun. Both non shooters, both big wing size but one is more athletic and better physical measurements for bball. Both have different skillset although both are for leading the team. However, even though I rank Barnes the player ahead, if we are forced to choose one of them with the CHI pick, illnpick Giddy.

P.S. isnt Sengun supposed to be athletic? Posters who like him are hyping up his blocks and all due to his athleticism.


Ummm, Giddey is white and all white Aussies are of European descent. We didn’t create a different race when we colonised this country, lol.

I can understand people preferring Barnes over Giddey for his defense, but they’ll be sacrificing a much higher level of playmaking by doing so.

Sengun is athletic enough, but his skill profile is the closest to Jokic out of anyone in this draft.

As far as playoffs go, points win games and defense is very much a matchup thing. I’m surprised you care about defense so much now, you didn’t seem to have a problem with Vuc being a complete sieve. And like I said, we’ve already got a solid amount of good defenders, what we don’t have are players who can create plays of any high degree.


Oh trust me, offense all the way for me. But even though ill.be the first to admit that Vuc as the last line of defense leaves a lot to be desired, man to man he can hold his own against the big guys not named Embiid taking him one-on-one. Its when the permieter opponents gets through his man and we have to depend on Vuc that ill say he sucks at defending it.

Lol what I meant by Euro as probably their style of play because if you just say white, then i can say that overweight dude from loyola is more jokic than Sengun and Giddy.

But yes, as to elite playmakers for me we lacke them and the nearest one we have to that is Fultz. Thats why Cade and Suggs is who im hoping for.
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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1086 » by tiderulz » Fri Jun 11, 2021 12:49 pm

Bensational wrote:
RookieStar wrote:
Bensational wrote:
How? Giddey’s skill level as a passer and facilitator is unquestionably better than Kuminga’s, Kuminga a significantly better scorer from inside, and they’re both poor shooters from distance right now.

A surprising hot take is setting Doncic as the bar for success for Giddey.


Defense? Atheleticism?

TBH i dont like the two even for our CHI pick but I havr to admit they dont play the same.


Athleticism does nothing for you without skill. Highly skilled and lesser athletic players can do just fine. I’m not worried about defense from whatever position Giddey plays because we have Isaac, Bamba, Okeke and RJ to cover that.

Weren’t you asking for skilled and unathletic euro guys just last week? Giddey and Sengun are the two closest to that and you’re not a fan of either, lol.

Doug McDermott, Adam Morrison. 2 skilled, less athletic players. those are comparisons that worry me.
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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1087 » by Bensational » Fri Jun 11, 2021 1:48 pm

tiderulz wrote:
Bensational wrote:
RookieStar wrote:
Defense? Atheleticism?

TBH i dont like the two even for our CHI pick but I havr to admit they dont play the same.


Athleticism does nothing for you without skill. Highly skilled and lesser athletic players can do just fine. I’m not worried about defense from whatever position Giddey plays because we have Isaac, Bamba, Okeke and RJ to cover that.

Weren’t you asking for skilled and unathletic euro guys just last week? Giddey and Sengun are the two closest to that and you’re not a fan of either, lol.

Doug McDermott, Adam Morrison. 2 skilled, less athletic players. those are comparisons that worry me.


They should worry you - because they’re terrible comparisons. Neither has comparable skills to Giddey.

I’d say Satoransky is probably the floor/bust limit on Giddey. But I also wouldn’t give him a ceiling much higher than Lonzo with a better half court game, maybe a shorter Hedo. So not a star per se but a great glue guy.
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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1088 » by tiderulz » Fri Jun 11, 2021 1:59 pm

Bensational wrote:
tiderulz wrote:
Bensational wrote:
Athleticism does nothing for you without skill. Highly skilled and lesser athletic players can do just fine. I’m not worried about defense from whatever position Giddey plays because we have Isaac, Bamba, Okeke and RJ to cover that.

Weren’t you asking for skilled and unathletic euro guys just last week? Giddey and Sengun are the two closest to that and you’re not a fan of either, lol.

Doug McDermott, Adam Morrison. 2 skilled, less athletic players. those are comparisons that worry me.


They should worry you - because they’re terrible comparisons. Neither has comparable skills to Giddey.

I’d say Satoransky is probably the floor/bust limit on Giddey. But I also wouldn’t give him a ceiling much higher than Lonzo with a better half court game, maybe a shorter Hedo. So not a star per se but a great glue guy.

i dont view someone "like" Satoransky even close to worth the #8 pick. Satoransky looks like a typical bench guy. We still need stars. give me a player with a high ceiling, even if his floor is lower
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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1089 » by Skybox » Fri Jun 11, 2021 2:37 pm

Watching more footage and I'm warming to the idea of Mobley (assuming Cunningham gone)...He slides right in at PF, Isaac returns to SF, I still like Bamba over Carter at C (for his floor spreading potential)...Mobley looks like he could be a big scorer, inside and out, and that's over 21' of shot blocking, switching, passing lane mayhem on your front line. Mobley looks to me like Isaac defensively but with much more polished offensive skills. Perhaps Mobley or Isaac ultimately becomes our Center but Isaac's mobility and defensive agility means he CAN play SF. The PF "conflict" with AG had a lot more to do with neither being scorers or floor spreaders more than either one's inability to be labeled a SF. Intriguing picture and aligns with WeHam's apparent priority of positional length. We still have backcourt players with scoring potential and another high pick...I'd be good with Mobley, Giddey, and Ayayi in this draft.

As far as Giddey, I'd love to KNOW he'll be able to shoot but...nothing beats proven BBIQ and length as building blocks. It's a big swing but why couldn't he be more like Lamelo than Morrison (who resembles him in no way skill-wise). I'm surprised the Lamelo comparisons aren't standard...same size, same vision, same apparent weaknesses. Ayayi has that great Gonzaga pedigree and toughness, is big and can shoot.

Bamba/Carter
Mobley/Okeke/Wagner
TRoss/Giddey
Harris/Hampton/Ayayi
Fultz/Anthony/MCW plenty of interesting combos and position battles. Harris is ultimately trade bait as a solid vet/expiring.
Carter might also be moved to avoid extending both he and Bamba. Bamba gets the nod for floor-
spreading and rim protection potential. I'd keep both if fiscally realistic. Cunningham still #1 option.
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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1090 » by Magic Mops » Fri Jun 11, 2021 2:47 pm

Skybox wrote:Watching more footage and I'm warming to the idea of Mobley (assuming Cunningham gone)...He slides right in at PF, Isaac returns to SF, I still like Bamba over Carter at C (for his floor spreading potential)...Mobley looks like he could be a big scorer, inside and out, and that's over 21' of shot blocking, switching, passing lane mayhem on your front line. Mobley looks to me like Isaac defensively but with much more polished offensive skills. Perhaps Mobley or Isaac ultimately becomes our Center but Isaac's mobility and defensive agility means he CAN play SF. The PF "conflict" with AG had a lot more to do with neither being scorers or floor spreaders more than either one's inability to be labeled a SF. Intriguing picture and aligns with WeHam's apparent priority of positional length. We still have backcourt players with scoring potential and another high pick...I'd be good with Mobley, Giddey, and Ayayi in this draft.

As far as Giddey, I'd love to KNOW he'll be able to shoot but...nothing beats proven BBIQ and length as building blocks. It's a big swing but why couldn't he be more like Lamelo than Morrison (who resembles him in no way skill-wise). I'm surprised the Lamelo comparisons aren't standard...same size, same vision, same apparent weaknesses. Ayayi has that great Gonzaga pedigree and toughness, is big and can shoot.

Bamba/Carter
Mobley/Okeke/Wagner
TRoss/Giddey
Harris/Hampton/Ayayi
Fultz/Anthony/MCW plenty of interesting combos and position battles. Harris is ultimately trade bait as a solid vet/expiring.
Carter might also be moved to avoid extending both he and Bamba. Bamba gets the nod for floor-
spreading and rim protection potential. I'd keep both if fiscally realistic. Cunningham still #1 option.

I like this a lot Sir
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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1091 » by Blue_and_Whte » Fri Jun 11, 2021 2:53 pm

RookieStar wrote:
basketballRob wrote:Giddey is younger and better than Kuminga.

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Thats ummm a surprising hot take.

That’s an awful hot take. Kuminga is 18 and widely considered a top 5 pick.
Kuminga: Oct 6
Giddey: Oct 10
Both are 18, Giddey is 4 days younger... What in the actual eff
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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1092 » by jezzerinho » Fri Jun 11, 2021 3:12 pm

Mobley wouldn't be exciting but i can see the rationale. I think Ayayi will be a very solid pro, could even be a quality starter with time. Giddey tho I'm very wary of. Just not on board the bandwagon.
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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1093 » by Bensational » Fri Jun 11, 2021 3:15 pm

tiderulz wrote:
Bensational wrote:
tiderulz wrote:Doug McDermott, Adam Morrison. 2 skilled, less athletic players. those are comparisons that worry me.


They should worry you - because they’re terrible comparisons. Neither has comparable skills to Giddey.

I’d say Satoransky is probably the floor/bust limit on Giddey. But I also wouldn’t give him a ceiling much higher than Lonzo with a better half court game, maybe a shorter Hedo. So not a star per se but a great glue guy.

i dont view someone "like" Satoransky even close to worth the #8 pick. Satoransky looks like a typical bench guy. We still need stars. give me a player with a high ceiling, even if his floor is lower


That’s why I said Sato is his floor/bust limit, not his ceiling. Is Lonzo not a high enough ceiling? Who do you have in the 8 range with a higher ceiling?

For me, it’s Dosunmu, Giddey, Sengun with Mann quickly rising. They’re all very different but I like them all pretty evenly for what they offer.
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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1094 » by MagicMatic » Fri Jun 11, 2021 3:16 pm

Skybox wrote:Perhaps Mobley or Isaac ultimately becomes our Center but Isaac's mobility and defensive agility means he CAN play SF. The PF "conflict" with AG had a lot more to do with neither being scorers or floor spreaders more than either one's inability to be labeled a SF. Intriguing picture and aligns with WeHam's apparent priority of positional length. We still have backcourt players with scoring potential and another high pick...I'd be good with Mobley, Giddey, and Ayayi in this draft.


That was one conflict of AG/Isaac pairing not working. The other major issue is that you can’t roll out 4/5 guys onto an nba floor without the ability to shoot the basketball OR create any semblance of offense for others.

Tell me how a lineup of Isaac/AG/Vuc is drastically different than any combination of Okeke/Isaac/Mobley/Carter. Not convincing that it would be in the slightest.

I can’t say for sure that the guard prospects Orlando has acquired can fill that void. Terrance Ross can’t be the only guy on the roster to do it 50% of the time.

The sad part is that you’re probably correct in WeHams line of thinking. Unfortunately, that’s not how games are won in 2021.
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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1095 » by tiderulz » Fri Jun 11, 2021 3:34 pm

Bensational wrote:
tiderulz wrote:
Bensational wrote:
They should worry you - because they’re terrible comparisons. Neither has comparable skills to Giddey.

I’d say Satoransky is probably the floor/bust limit on Giddey. But I also wouldn’t give him a ceiling much higher than Lonzo with a better half court game, maybe a shorter Hedo. So not a star per se but a great glue guy.

i dont view someone "like" Satoransky even close to worth the #8 pick. Satoransky looks like a typical bench guy. We still need stars. give me a player with a high ceiling, even if his floor is lower


That’s why I said Sato is his floor/bust limit, not his ceiling. Is Lonzo not a high enough ceiling? Who do you have in the 8 range with a higher ceiling?

For me, it’s Dosunmu, Giddey, Sengun with Mann quickly rising. They’re all very different but I like them all pretty evenly for what they offer.

i guess it depends on who we draft with our first pick. I dont know why, i just get feelings similar to Exum, where I just dont believe he will translate over to the NBA. I believe he is better skilled than Exum, but also believe he has much less athleticism which will hurt him a lot.
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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1096 » by TDJacksonville » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:21 pm

MagicMatic wrote:
Skybox wrote:Perhaps Mobley or Isaac ultimately becomes our Center but Isaac's mobility and defensive agility means he CAN play SF. The PF "conflict" with AG had a lot more to do with neither being scorers or floor spreaders more than either one's inability to be labeled a SF. Intriguing picture and aligns with WeHam's apparent priority of positional length. We still have backcourt players with scoring potential and another high pick...I'd be good with Mobley, Giddey, and Ayayi in this draft.


That was one conflict of AG/Isaac pairing not working. The other major issue is that you can’t roll out 4/5 guys onto an nba floor without the ability to shoot the basketball OR create any semblance of offense for others.

Tell me how a lineup of Isaac/AG/Vuc is drastically different than any combination of Okeke/Isaac/Mobley/Carter. Not convincing that it would be in the slightest.

I can’t say for sure that the guard prospects Orlando has acquired can fill that void. Terrance Ross can’t be the only guy on the roster to do it 50% of the time.

The sad part is that you’re probably correct in WeHams line of thinking. Unfortunately, that’s not how games are won in 2021.

That Issac extension looks worse every day. Can't shoot. Can't stay healthy. Would love to see us move Issac for a lengthy shooting SF. Maybe something like Issac for Michael Porter Jr.
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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1097 » by Knightro » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:38 pm

I am a Giddey fan. There's are scenarios where I'd be comfortable taking him with the Bulls pick.

In terms of pure point guard skills - tempo, passing and court vision - he's as advanced as you'll see for an 18 year old kid. Stick that skill on a 6'8" 200 pound frame and my intrigue goes up even more.

The question marks are real though. He's not athletic and he can't really shoot too well.

Can he beat anyone off the dribble? Can he finish? Can he guard anyone? Will he make enough perimeter shots?

The passing/vision/shot creation skills are extremely real and a legitimate high end building block.
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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1098 » by Skybox » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:40 pm

MagicMatic wrote:
Skybox wrote:Perhaps Mobley or Isaac ultimately becomes our Center but Isaac's mobility and defensive agility means he CAN play SF. The PF "conflict" with AG had a lot more to do with neither being scorers or floor spreaders more than either one's inability to be labeled a SF. Intriguing picture and aligns with WeHam's apparent priority of positional length. We still have backcourt players with scoring potential and another high pick...I'd be good with Mobley, Giddey, and Ayayi in this draft.


That was one conflict of AG/Isaac pairing not working. The other major issue is that you can’t roll out 4/5 guys onto an nba floor without the ability to shoot the basketball OR create any semblance of offense for others.

Tell me how a lineup of Isaac/AG/Vuc is drastically different than any combination of Okeke/Isaac/Mobley/Carter. Not convincing that it would be in the slightest.

I can’t say for sure that the guard prospects Orlando has acquired can fill that void. Terrance Ross can’t be the only guy on the roster to do it 50% of the time.

The sad part is that you’re probably correct in WeHams line of thinking. Unfortunately, that’s not how games are won in 2021.


The ONLY legit complaint against Vuc was his defense. Mobley plays D and moves like Isaac but (potentially scores and rolls like Vuc)...entirely different picture. I'd prefer a Alpha creator at SF like Cunningham and, maybe, someday that player appears or develops but for this draft and our existing personnel, I draft the bpa and try to utilize my personnel in the best combos possible. I don't take a lesser player like Barnes because I'm dead set on getting a "playmaking SF" while I have the worst roster in the NBA who are still, fortunately, largely undeveloped. You wanted to blow it all up, they did a good job, draft the bpa.
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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1099 » by basketballRob » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:58 pm

tiderulz wrote:
Bensational wrote:
RookieStar wrote:
Defense? Atheleticism?

TBH i dont like the two even for our CHI pick but I havr to admit they dont play the same.


Athleticism does nothing for you without skill. Highly skilled and lesser athletic players can do just fine. I’m not worried about defense from whatever position Giddey plays because we have Isaac, Bamba, Okeke and RJ to cover that.

Weren’t you asking for skilled and unathletic euro guys just last week? Giddey and Sengun are the two closest to that and you’re not a fan of either, lol.

Doug McDermott, Adam Morrison. 2 skilled, less athletic players. those are comparisons that worry me.
Ben McLemore is pretty scary also.

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Re: Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2 

Post#1100 » by basketballRob » Fri Jun 11, 2021 6:01 pm

Blue_and_Whte wrote:
RookieStar wrote:
basketballRob wrote:Giddey is younger and better than Kuminga.

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Thats ummm a surprising hot take.

That’s an awful hot take. Kuminga is 18 and widely considered a top 5 pick.
Kuminga: Oct 6
Giddey: Oct 10
Both are 18, Giddey is 4 days younger... What in the actual eff
The point is Giddey is better right now, and you can't say, well Kuminga is younger.

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