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Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition

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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#881 » by zaymon » Tue Sep 14, 2021 8:46 pm

OrlMagic05 wrote:
magicman112 wrote:Aaron Gordon gets paid

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I know Denver most likely will match any offer thrown at MPJ, but they are going to have to get creative in order to keep him. With AG's signing they have 126Mil committed without resigning MPJ next summer. Jokic becomes a free agent the following year. I say we thrown a max contract out to MPJ and see if Denver matches.

If we or someone else throws a max contract at MPJ they will have about 137 million dollars committed to 5 players in 2023.


MPJ is not that good creating for himself, he is awful creating for others and he is bad, low iq defender. Max seems like a huge overpay for one way third option. His back is also a big risk.
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#882 » by OrlMagic05 » Tue Sep 14, 2021 8:56 pm

zaymon wrote:
OrlMagic05 wrote:
magicman112 wrote:Aaron Gordon gets paid

Read on Twitter
?s=19


I know Denver most likely will match any offer thrown at MPJ, but they are going to have to get creative in order to keep him. With AG's signing they have 126Mil committed without resigning MPJ next summer. Jokic becomes a free agent the following year. I say we thrown a max contract out to MPJ and see if Denver matches.

If we or someone else throws a max contract at MPJ they will have about 137 million dollars committed to 5 players in 2023.


MPJ is not that good creating for himself, he is awful creating for others and he is bad, low iq defender. Max seems like a huge overpay for one way third option. His back is also a big risk.


Huge over pay for a guy that avg 19ppg in his second season with an extremely high efficiency? TS% of 66% I would take him over any of our players not names Suggs.
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#883 » by basketballRob » Tue Sep 14, 2021 9:08 pm

OrlMagic05 wrote:
zaymon wrote:
OrlMagic05 wrote:
I know Denver most likely will match any offer thrown at MPJ, but they are going to have to get creative in order to keep him. With AG's signing they have 126Mil committed without resigning MPJ next summer. Jokic becomes a free agent the following year. I say we thrown a max contract out to MPJ and see if Denver matches.

If we or someone else throws a max contract at MPJ they will have about 137 million dollars committed to 5 players in 2023.


MPJ is not that good creating for himself, he is awful creating for others and he is bad, low iq defender. Max seems like a huge overpay for one way third option. His back is also a big risk.


Huge over pay for a guy that avg 19ppg in his second season with an extremely high efficiency? TS% of 66% I would take him over any of our players not names Suggs.
I heard he was one of like 8 players to average 19 ppg, at that efficiency, at his age. Like 5 of them are hall of famers, and the others likely will be. So it cracks me up when people say MPJ isn't worth it. He's probably a future hall of fame player. Lol

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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#884 » by jonbob17 » Tue Sep 14, 2021 9:21 pm

zaymon wrote:
OrlMagic05 wrote:
magicman112 wrote:Aaron Gordon gets paid

Read on Twitter
?s=19


I know Denver most likely will match any offer thrown at MPJ, but they are going to have to get creative in order to keep him. With AG's signing they have 126Mil committed without resigning MPJ next summer. Jokic becomes a free agent the following year. I say we thrown a max contract out to MPJ and see if Denver matches.

If we or someone else throws a max contract at MPJ they will have about 137 million dollars committed to 5 players in 2023.


MPJ is not that good creating for himself, he is awful creating for others and he is bad, low iq defender. Max seems like a huge overpay for one way third option. His back is also a big risk.


MPJ is a very good pull up shooter. He doesn't pass the ball, but he looked a lot better on defense last year than he did in the bubble.

I'd be surprised if MPJ doesn't score 23+ ppg next year with Murray out. He's getting a max extension (25% of cap). He should be a nice fit next to Jokic for years to come.
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#885 » by sChOlaRlY_Magi » Wed Sep 15, 2021 12:29 am

I still say that if we can get MPJ + the assets we already received for AG, that is a BIG WIN!

I think at minimum we should throw a near max offer. Whatever the Nugs can't match, and telling MPJ that he can be our lead scorer should get it done imo.
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#886 » by basketballRob » Wed Sep 15, 2021 1:09 am

sChOlaRlY_Magi wrote:I still say that if we can get MPJ + the assets we already received for AG, that is a BIG WIN!

I think at minimum we should throw a near max offer. Whatever the Nugs can't match, and telling MPJ that he can be our lead scorer should get it done imo.
I'm sure Weltman told Bartelstein when we signed Moore, that we'll give MPJ a max or near max contract.

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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#887 » by OrlMagic05 » Wed Sep 15, 2021 1:25 am

sChOlaRlY_Magi wrote:I still say that if we can get MPJ + the assets we already received for AG, that is a BIG WIN!

I think at minimum we should throw a near max offer. Whatever the Nugs can't match, and telling MPJ that he can be our lead scorer should get it done imo.


I’d throw a max contract to MPJ right now. The guy gets buckets which is what this team has needed so desperately.
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#888 » by sChOlaRlY_Magi » Wed Sep 15, 2021 1:42 am

One thing I'll say from experience (and hopefully it invokes the contributions of SpineDoc) is that the more you work on the muscles around the spine, the healthier one feels, because the muscles are there to support the spine and keep it from being displaced.

Iirc, McGrady had some back problems, but I'd take him any day over the vast majority of current NBA players.

So if MPJ is at his best physically for the contract we'd have to throw, it is absolutely worth it imo.

And I said that, just from the eye test of MPJ.

Add onto that, that he is apparently 2nd to Wilt Chamberlain in efficiency, and I say "Throw all of that Amway cash at him!"

Seriously, though... Add him to this Squad, and now between opening up scoring for EVERYONE with a high efficiency player, and the defensive prowess of our current players. I believe we are looking at an ECF team if we have a healthy Isaac and a motivated Bamba.

What would you have other people pay to make Orlando relevant again?... Outside of Flori-duh jokes...

Being someone that was born in Orlando, I'd really like some relevance at someone others expense.

Tired of the Florida Man jokes, when we have been the pipeline for NFL, NBL and NBA players for 2 decades or more...
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#889 » by sChOlaRlY_Magi » Wed Sep 15, 2021 1:49 am

Also, and I am relying on solely 2k experience, but unselfish ball movement, makes the worst teams better than many others. I think we would really have a chance with Suggs, Markelle, and MCW as our 3rd stringer.
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#890 » by pepe1991 » Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:00 am

Porter is blind when it comes to passing to his teammates and has some of worst tunnel visions when it comes to concept of team basketball since probably Kelly Oubre and Sexton.

Not just back, almost all of his pro-athletes sport family were forced to early retirment with same knee problems.

He is another player who looks decent playing behind some of most elite passer nba has ever seen ( Mikal in CP3, Porter in Jokic).

Guy played 116 out of possible 224 games. Hardly even playing every second game.
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#891 » by OrlMagic05 » Wed Sep 15, 2021 1:04 pm

pepe1991 wrote:Porter is blind when it comes to passing to his teammates and has some of worst tunnel visions when it comes to concept of team basketball since probably Kelly Oubre and Sexton.

Not just back, almost all of his pro-athletes sport family were forced to early retirment with same knee problems.

He is another player who looks decent playing behind some of most elite passer nba has ever seen ( Mikal in CP3, Porter in Jokic).

Guy played 116 out of possible 224 games. Hardly even playing every second game.


Yes, because Oubre and Sexton have played with the same efficiency of MPJ... I dont care if a player has tunnel vision when he has a TS% of 66% shot 45% from 3 on 6 attempts and shot 54% from the field.. So did you not like Kobe? He had pretty bad tunnel vision as well...
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#892 » by jonbob17 » Wed Sep 15, 2021 3:05 pm

pepe1991 wrote:Porter is blind when it comes to passing to his teammates and has some of worst tunnel visions when it comes to concept of team basketball since probably Kelly Oubre and Sexton.

Not just back, almost all of his pro-athletes sport family were forced to early retirment with same knee problems.

He is another player who looks decent playing behind some of most elite passer nba has ever seen ( Mikal in CP3, Porter in Jokic).

Guy played 116 out of possible 224 games. Hardly even playing every second game.



In 2020 MPJ played 55 of 73 games and in 2021 played in 61 of 72 games. He missed 10 games due to COVID. He had back surgery for a known injury (before draft) prior to his rookie season.

So last year when you throw out his COVID absence, he missed one game the front end of a back to back late in the season.

Your take on his MPJ's health is like saying Okeke has only been available for less than every third game during his career, completely ignoring the fact that he was "red-shirted" his rookie season, which was part of the draft calculus, much like Porter.
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#893 » by pepe1991 » Wed Sep 15, 2021 4:00 pm

jonbob17 wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:Porter is blind when it comes to passing to his teammates and has some of worst tunnel visions when it comes to concept of team basketball since probably Kelly Oubre and Sexton.

Not just back, almost all of his pro-athletes sport family were forced to early retirment with same knee problems.

He is another player who looks decent playing behind some of most elite passer nba has ever seen ( Mikal in CP3, Porter in Jokic).

Guy played 116 out of possible 224 games. Hardly even playing every second game.



In 2020 MPJ played 55 of 73 games and in 2021 played in 61 of 72 games. He missed 10 games due to COVID. He had back surgery for a known injury (before draft) prior to his rookie season.

So last year when you throw out his COVID absence, he missed one game the front end of a back to back late in the season.

Your take on his MPJ's health is like saying Okeke has only been available for less than every third game during his career, completely ignoring the fact that he was "red-shirted" his rookie season, which was part of the draft calculus, much like Porter.


Missed whole college and rookie season but doesn't fit your narrative so you won't mention it?
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#894 » by jonbob17 » Wed Sep 15, 2021 5:09 pm

pepe1991 wrote:
jonbob17 wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:Porter is blind when it comes to passing to his teammates and has some of worst tunnel visions when it comes to concept of team basketball since probably Kelly Oubre and Sexton.

Not just back, almost all of his pro-athletes sport family were forced to early retirment with same knee problems.

He is another player who looks decent playing behind some of most elite passer nba has ever seen ( Mikal in CP3, Porter in Jokic).

Guy played 116 out of possible 224 games. Hardly even playing every second game.



In 2020 MPJ played 55 of 73 games and in 2021 played in 61 of 72 games. He missed 10 games due to COVID. He had back surgery for a known injury (before draft) prior to his rookie season.

So last year when you throw out his COVID absence, he missed one game the front end of a back to back late in the season.

Your take on his MPJ's health is like saying Okeke has only been available for less than every third game during his career, completely ignoring the fact that he was "red-shirted" his rookie season, which was part of the draft calculus, much like Porter.


Missed whole college and rookie season but doesn't fit your narrative so you won't mention it?


I said he had back surgery before his rookie season, less than a month after the draft. Denver knew what they were getting into, and is of course why he was available to them at pick 14, and why he didn't go top 3.

He missed zero games due to injury last year.

His rookie year, 2019-20, he had left knee sprain to begin the season, and an ankle injury, looks like he may have missed about 13 games to injury.

So he has missed 13 games in 2 years to injury, not quite as bad a one out every 2 games. Now he is an injury risk, as it has run in his family like you mentioned, but since he has started playing in the NBA, MPJ has mostly been on the court.
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#895 » by basketballRob » Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:16 pm

Michael Jordan missed his second season I believe. Blake Griffin was red shirted. Embiid missed his first couple seasons. All probably hall of fame players.
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#896 » by p0peye » Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:17 pm

I watched a decent share of Nuggets games past season and from what I can tell, MPJ's ceiling is Rashard Lewis if he improves his defense and his health holds up playing small ball PF.

I didn't want to pay Rashard that max contract back in 2007 when he didn't have injury history MPJ (and his relatives in Porter family) have and I sure wouldn't want to throw one at MPJ now.

Then again, max contract is likely what will take for some team to pry MPJ away from Nuggets - I just don't think it is wise to do that. He is excellent shooter who thrives playing with passers and slashers, not to mention the gravity Jokic has, but comparisons with Kobe or other superstars people seem to be making based on efficiency stats that favor good spot up shooters are silly.

MPJ in vacuum will not improve people around him, he is not a ball handler, playmaker nor a good passer even. If a team takes a ball out of Jokic's hands or denies passing angles while playing him with single coverage further from the paint, MPJ was ineffective. His defensive stance leaves him vulnerable to penetration on perimeter, so if opposing team roster permits a PF is a position where he can not only be hidden, but provide some rebounding and weak side shot blocking as well.
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#897 » by pepe1991 » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:56 am

jonbob17 wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:
jonbob17 wrote:

In 2020 MPJ played 55 of 73 games and in 2021 played in 61 of 72 games. He missed 10 games due to COVID. He had back surgery for a known injury (before draft) prior to his rookie season.

So last year when you throw out his COVID absence, he missed one game the front end of a back to back late in the season.

Your take on his MPJ's health is like saying Okeke has only been available for less than every third game during his career, completely ignoring the fact that he was "red-shirted" his rookie season, which was part of the draft calculus, much like Porter.


Missed whole college and rookie season but doesn't fit your narrative so you won't mention it?


I said he had back surgery before his rookie season, less than a month after the draft. Denver knew what they were getting into, and is of course why he was available to them at pick 14, and why he didn't go top 3.

He missed zero games due to injury last year.

His rookie year, 2019-20, he had left knee sprain to begin the season, and an ankle injury, looks like he may have missed about 13 games to injury.

So he has missed 13 games in 2 years to injury, not quite as bad a one out every 2 games. Now he is an injury risk, as it has run in his family like you mentioned, but since he has started playing in the NBA, MPJ has mostly been on the court.


His brother torn ACL twice. From projected first round pick in 2018 to playing 11 games in G league and 2 nba games since- And one ACL tear in process.

Michael's eldest sister, Bri Porter, suffered a total of 5 ACL tears in her high school and collegiate career.- forced for medical retirment.

Michael's other sister, Cierra, similarly sustained a lingering knee injury that forced her early retirement from collegiate basketball. Forced into medical retirment.

Nobody with common sense can't argue that MP jr does not have high risk of injuries when whole his damn family was forced to retired due injuries.


As for Michael, himself,he had back surgery as teen. He missed basically whole college year, whole rookie nba season and was forced on heavy min restrictions in 2019-20. He only played 16,4 mpg over 55 games. during whole year,he only played 903 min.
When you put things in perspective, he only had 1 "normal" healthy season in last 4 years.

Btw Michael Porer max would cost you $134,4M , average salary of $33,4M a year. It would be collosal mistake to tie player with poor trackrecord with injuries,who isn't ballhandler, isn't great defender and makes nobody around him better - highest payed player.
Especially because some future Suggs- whoever- Porter- Isaac-whoever lineup still has clear "second round exit" ceiling due lack of star power. That roster is ugly similar to Pacers current roster. Where they have bunch of solid players but not megastar to tie together everything.
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#898 » by jonbob17 » Thu Sep 16, 2021 2:48 pm

pepe1991 wrote:
Especially because some future Suggs- whoever- Porter- Isaac-whoever lineup still has clear "second round exit" ceiling due lack of star power. That roster is ugly similar to Pacers current roster. Where they have bunch of solid players but not megastar to tie together everything.


Wow...we are six months into our rebuild and you already have our players' and team's peak, years down the road, figured out. Someone get Alex Martins on the phone. Tell him to blow up the blow up, and hire this man.
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#899 » by pepe1991 » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:46 pm

jonbob17 wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:
Especially because some future Suggs- whoever- Porter- Isaac-whoever lineup still has clear "second round exit" ceiling due lack of star power. That roster is ugly similar to Pacers current roster. Where they have bunch of solid players but not megastar to tie together everything.


Wow...we are six months into our rebuild and you already have our players' and team's peak, years down the road, figured out. Someone get Alex Martins on the phone. Tell him to blow up the blow up, and hire this man.


Without superstar wing you can't compete. Everybody knows that i assume.
Keep your sarcasm at home.
Porter, Isaac are not transending wing talents, those teams simply would never be match to Giannis, Tatum, Durant likes of the world. Harsh reality.

As for Suggs as best player, Lillard is apsolute best case and he can' t lead team pass second round.
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Re: Around the NBA- 2020/2021 Edition 

Post#900 » by Sammyzc+1 » Thu Sep 16, 2021 9:19 pm

pepe1991 wrote:
jonbob17 wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:
Especially because some future Suggs- whoever- Porter- Isaac-whoever lineup still has clear "second round exit" ceiling due lack of star power. That roster is ugly similar to Pacers current roster. Where they have bunch of solid players but not megastar to tie together everything.


Wow...we are six months into our rebuild and you already have our players' and team's peak, years down the road, figured out. Someone get Alex Martins on the phone. Tell him to blow up the blow up, and hire this man.


Without superstar wing you can't compete. Everybody knows that i assume.
Keep your sarcasm at home.
Porter, Isaac are not transending wing talents, those teams simply would never be match to Giannis, Tatum, Durant likes of the world. Harsh reality.

As for Suggs as best player, Lillard is apsolute best case and he can' t lead team pass second round.
Sorry, but in fairness to Jonbob17, you seem to write off people who are very young and do have some talent as kids without a future. Truth is, none of us "know" exactly how any player 23 or under is going to develop. I would venture that most on this board are willing to see how the youth develops, or maybe doesnt. But being cautiously optimistic is a fun place to be. And negative nellies with have a hard time curbing that

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