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Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0

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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#981 » by drsd » Mon Nov 15, 2021 8:30 am

MagicFan101 wrote:Are you sure you’re interpreting those stats correctly?

Check out the player projections and see what these same stats have to say about the future. Specifically, check out the Market Value for some of these guys going forward.

I suppose it depends what we care about and focus our attention on. Both can be true at once. Yes, today Cole has been our “best player” out of our necessity to find points. Still, as many have pointed out his style of play is unlikely to translate to winning basketball and the advanced stats project as much.


"Market Value": my take - almost every player on this roster has no value. There are either youth or injury concerns (or both) on every player not named Ross, Harris, or Carter-Williams. And where is the "value" in those three right now?


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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#982 » by drsd » Mon Nov 15, 2021 10:30 am

pepe: we both seem to agree that this is a poorly constructed roster that has no hope of winning 30 games.

I see some light in that (five of the young-guns should develop NBA competence, and Orlando, FL has intrinsic attractions for free agency - including available cap space (with the likes of higher pay given lower taxes, warmer weather and excellent facilities and infrastructure.

My question to you: where lies your hope and positivity? That is, where are the areas you are excited about and paths you see to future success? That it less clear to me.

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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#983 » by pepe1991 » Mon Nov 15, 2021 11:10 am

drsd wrote:pepe: we both seem to agree that this is a poorly constructed roster that has no hope of winning 30 games.

I see some light in that (five of the young-guns should develop NBA competence, and Orlando, FL has intrinsic attractions for free agency - including available cap space (with the likes of higher pay given lower taxes, warmer weather and excellent facilities and infrastructure.

My question to you: where lies your hope and positivity? That is, where are the areas you are excited about and paths you see to future success? That it less clear to me.

..


I really liked fact we drafted Suggs. Maybe i overvalued him...I really thought he will be better than this ( albet only 11 games sample).
There were some areas where Gonzaga didn't use him ( more of traditional offense , more pick&roll) and i thought it's just because Kispert and Timma are guys who are better college players so they defer offense to them.

But it doesn't seem to be the case, i had no clue his ballhandling is this bad. (even reports were mentioning issues with handles, but it was always more like side note question mark than actual red flag ).


I like F. Wagner. He is waay better than anybody sold him. His shooting will go up and down but he is good. Defense is very good. Passing is underrated. I really like him!
I think Wendell has been Magic best all around player. I hope somebody can convice him to view himself as Center.
IF he can shoot for season 34-36% for 3 on 200-ish sample i will be thrilled.

I actually like improvment in shooting from Cole. I just think we rely too heavily on him and he isn't projected nba starter imo.

Before season started i had high hopes about RJ Hampton. But he struggles. He should be playing along side playmaker, not being forced into PG role he has no business playing. We involve him into 2 possession a game as picK&roll handler and guy shoots 26,7% from those situations. If we focus on him being cutter and wide open shot-taker, he'll be fine.
Prediction day after Vuc, Gordon, Evan departure - most fans who are celebrating birth of new rebuild will be crying how rebuild is painful before 2022-23 season ends.
Date of writeup: March 26th, 2021.
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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#984 » by drsd » Mon Nov 15, 2021 11:50 am

Glass half full thought of the day:

Orlando is starting to get healthier and projects to have more and more players returning.

....

Glass half empty thought of the day:

In that: moving forward the Magic has the NBA's hardest schedule over these next 69 games. :(



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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#985 » by MagicFan101 » Mon Nov 15, 2021 2:32 pm

drsd wrote:
MagicFan101 wrote:Are you sure you’re interpreting those stats correctly?

Check out the player projections and see what these same stats have to say about the future. Specifically, check out the Market Value for some of these guys going forward.

I suppose it depends what we care about and focus our attention on. Both can be true at once. Yes, today Cole has been our “best player” out of our necessity to find points. Still, as many have pointed out his style of play is unlikely to translate to winning basketball and the advanced stats project as much.


"Market Value": my take - almost every player on this roster has no value. There are either youth or injury concerns (or both) on every player not named Ross, Harris, or Carter-Williams. And where is the "value" in those three right now?


..


So you believe in the advanced stats when they support your narrative and throw them out the window when they don’t?

Sounds logical.
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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#986 » by 89Magicfan » Mon Nov 15, 2021 3:18 pm

pepe1991 wrote:
drsd wrote:pepe: we both seem to agree that this is a poorly constructed roster that has no hope of winning 30 games.

I see some light in that (five of the young-guns should develop NBA competence, and Orlando, FL has intrinsic attractions for free agency - including available cap space (with the likes of higher pay given lower taxes, warmer weather and excellent facilities and infrastructure.

My question to you: where lies your hope and positivity? That is, where are the areas you are excited about and paths you see to future success? That it less clear to me.

..


I really liked fact we drafted Suggs. Maybe i overvalued him...I really thought he will be better than this ( albet only 11 games sample).
There were some areas where Gonzaga didn't use him ( more of traditional offense , more pick&roll) and i thought it's just because Kispert and Timma are guys who are better college players so they defer offense to them.

But it doesn't seem to be the case, i had no clue his ballhandling is this bad. (even reports were mentioning issues with handles, but it was always more like side note question mark than actual red flag ).


I like F. Wagner. He is waay better than anybody sold him. His shooting will go up and down but he is good. Defense is very good. Passing is underrated. I really like him!
I think Wendell has been Magic best all around player. I hope somebody can convice him to view himself as Center.
IF he can shoot for season 34-36% for 3 on 200-ish sample i will be thrilled.

I actually like improvment in shooting from Cole. I just think we rely too heavily on him and he isn't projected nba starter imo.

Before season started i had high hopes about RJ Hampton. But he struggles. He should be playing along side playmaker, not being forced into PG role he has no business playing. We involve him into 2 possession a game as picK&roll handler and guy shoots 26,7% from those situations. If we focus on him being cutter and wide open shot-taker, he'll be fine.



He has the most common issue when it comes to handles. A lot of tall pg’s have that issue. He dribbles too high in traffic. He has the ability to break down defenses, he just dribbles it too high.
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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#987 » by drsd » Mon Nov 15, 2021 6:30 pm

MagicFan101 wrote:So you believe in the advanced stats when they support your narrative and throw them out the window when they don’t?

Sounds logical.


Anthony is even by the eye-test Orlando's best player so far. I really not sure that we are disagreeing on that. Will Anthony be the Magic's player of the year? I hope not as it means this team is a lot, lot worse than we all expected.


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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#988 » by drsd » Mon Nov 15, 2021 6:33 pm

Memory lane:

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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#989 » by MagicFan101 » Mon Nov 15, 2021 7:12 pm

drsd wrote:
MagicFan101 wrote:So you believe in the advanced stats when they support your narrative and throw them out the window when they don’t?

Sounds logical.


Anthony is even by the eye-test Orlando's best player so far. I really not sure that we are disagreeing on that. Will Anthony be the Magic's player of the year? I hope not as it means this team is a lot, lot worse than we all expected.


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Mo Bamba was arguably our best player in a few of the first games early on. Did anyone believe “Mo Bamba was the best player on the Orlando Magic”? I didn’t think so. These are NBA players. Nearly every player has it in them to ball out for a few games. Cole has an electric personality so when he does it we get chants of MVP! and even what should be more educated fans here projecting a future star. **smh**

Cole is a very flawed player.

I applaud him for stepping up in this time where we have little other option.

Still, I repeat. Cole is a very flawed player.

He is not ever going to be a star and is unlikely to even be a starter for a contender.

Enough said.
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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#990 » by drsd » Tue Nov 16, 2021 12:47 pm

Orlando is 29th in TO differential
Orlando is 29th in personal foul differential
Orlando is 29th in rebounding rate

The Magic is not setting themselves up for FG opportunities. Add to that:
Orlando is 28th in FG% differential

Making shots less frequently and coupling that to taking less shots to begin with, is it a miracle the Magic has 3 wins?


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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#991 » by Magic_Kingdom » Tue Nov 16, 2021 12:54 pm

Unfortunately I don't think anyone on our roster has much value right now, with the exception of WCJ and Franz. Chuma and R.J. have been disappointing. The biggest jump is supposed to be between your rookie year and your second year, and they both look like they've regressed at this point. Who knows what Suggs will become, but he's not Trae or Luka or any of those players that show out their rookie year so you know they are a future star.

If I'm the Magic I trade Mo for anything right now. If they aren't going to re-sign him then just get him off the roster and build around the pieces they want to keep. I think as the losses pile up and Mo's interest wanes his value will only go down, so right now is the time to get peak return. Having said that, I don't think there will be a long line of suitors. WCJ improved his game over the summer. Bamba is just doing the same things with more minutes.
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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#992 » by JBSouthpaw » Wed Nov 17, 2021 12:05 am

Magic_Kingdom wrote:Unfortunately I don't think anyone on our roster has much value right now, with the exception of WCJ and Franz. Chuma and R.J. have been disappointing. The biggest jump is supposed to be between your rookie year and your second year, and they both look like they've regressed at this point. Who knows what Suggs will become, but he's not Trae or Luka or any of those players that show out their rookie year so you know they are a future star.

If I'm the Magic I trade Mo for anything right now. If they aren't going to re-sign him then just get him off the roster and build around the pieces they want to keep. I think as the losses pile up and Mo's interest wanes his value will only go down, so right now is the time to get peak return. Having said that, I don't think there will be a long line of suitors. WCJ improved his game over the summer. Bamba is just doing the same things with more minutes.


RJ hasn't been disappointing, shooting 43% from three, has had some good def too. just started slow. his lack of min is crazy
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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#993 » by KillMonger » Wed Nov 17, 2021 7:46 am

Read on Twitter


On magic reddit it turns out what we're all thinking is true, gary harris is one of the worst players in the league right now....using those same metrics, out of 319 qualifying players he ranks.....319....how is he getting minutes over RJ?
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FREE FREED MO BAMBA......INVEST IN AMC/SHIB ....... FREE FREED MO BAMBA......INVEST IN AMC/SHIB
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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#994 » by drsd » Wed Nov 17, 2021 11:17 am

KillMonger wrote:
Read on Twitter


On magic reddit it turns out what we're all thinking is true, gary harris is one of the worst players in the league right now....using those same metrics, out of 319 qualifying players he ranks.....319....how is he getting minutes over RJ?


By RAPTOR (sort by Magic and lower the minutes line), Ross is even worse than Harris. Hampton is 6th for Orlando, above Okeke, by the way.

Anthony continues to be the best RAPTOR offensive player and Suggs the best RAPTOR defensive player for the Magic.

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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#995 » by Bergmaniac » Wed Nov 17, 2021 1:27 pm

KillMonger wrote:On magic reddit it turns out what we're all thinking is true, gary harris is one of the worst players in the league right now....using those same metrics, out of 319 qualifying players he ranks.....319....how is he getting minutes over RJ?

He is our tank commander.
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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#996 » by drsd » Thu Nov 18, 2021 10:44 am

Bergmaniac wrote:
KillMonger wrote:On magic reddit it turns out what we're all thinking is true, gary harris is one of the worst players in the league right now....using those same metrics, out of 319 qualifying players he ranks.....319....how is he getting minutes over RJ?

He is our tank commander.



Harris is actually playing worse than Bacon: Harris 21/22 vs Bacon 20/21

Talk about "finding your role".



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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#997 » by Blue_and_Whte » Thu Nov 18, 2021 11:20 am

Harris is trash. Idk wtf happened to that dude.
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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#998 » by YosemiteSam » Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:12 am

This is well deserved

Read on Twitter
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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#999 » by Passout » Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:06 am

YosemiteSam wrote:This is well deserved

Read on Twitter


Going to be a sad day when he retires.
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Re: Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0 

Post#1000 » by drsd » Fri Nov 19, 2021 9:32 am

What I love about Steel is that, whereas he is always the smartest and most knowledgeable person in the room, he never thrusts that out in his personality nor his broadcasts. His knowledge is always explored in a humble way.

AND: I love Turner as his color-man, given that Turner "says things" that generate some super-knowledgeable insight from Steel. Turner is a perfect set-up color-man in that regard.

Yes Steel for the Vest here, and Turner for a strong Cummerbund.

It's Marchitelli for the mittens, for me. Hill just annoys the heck out of me.

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