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Magic sign F/C Moritz Wagner to a 2-Year Contract (Robbins)

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Re: Magic sign F/C Moritz Wagner to a 2-Year Contract (Robbins) 

Post#141 » by pepe1991 » Thu Aug 26, 2021 10:02 am

drsd wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:Mo hasn't been good anywhere tho. He arived in nba in 2018-19, and here we are, three years later, and he is already making less than vets minimum and is only kept in nba due fact his brother is lottery pick.
He might be better suited for Euro style basketball.


How do you define "good"?

Wagner is one of the better perennial 3rd stringers of the NBA. I would rather he is in Magic pin-stripes over Bacon, for example.
A larger argument could be Ennis, but the cost lines still favour M-Wagner, as Ennis is either going to want another 3M contract or he will go to the Lakers on the LLE to chase a ring. (That said, M-Wagner would also be a good Lakers fit in my opinion).

..



Good equals playable on non tanker.
He is not that.
Being third stringer means you are not active rotation member, by definition you are not playable for longer streaches.

Was Robert Sacre or Jason Smith good? They were depth bench guys who's PT ment team is either:
Ruined by injuries or seeking to lose every game.

If Wagner gets 45 games and +15 mpg it means you are rock bottom
Prediction day after Vuc, Gordon, Evan departure - most fans who are celebrating birth of new rebuild will be crying how rebuild is painful before 2022-23 season ends.
Date of writeup: March 26th, 2021.
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Re: Magic sign F/C Moritz Wagner to a 2-Year Contract (Robbins) 

Post#142 » by basketballRob » Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:20 am

pepe1991 wrote:
zaymon wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:Mo Wagner for Boston had some epic numbers.
9 games played, TS 37%, BPM -11,5

He is what he is. Challenged nba big who isn't mobile to cover PFs and lacks talent to play full time center.

He was fine at college because college allowed him to camp inside paint on defense and he could shoot a little bit.

In nba he does not have nba range and every other aspect of his game is exposed.

And his existence and suckingness in nba does not give me too much confidence about Franz, i'll just have healthy amount of reservation what role Franz can actually play in nba. But i think there are huge aspects of Franz game from college, that simply won't translate in nba, such are passing or any ballhandling.


Boston was a mess last year, they dont have any real passers so most of bigs will look bad there. Wagner played 61 minutes there so i dont think sample size big enough to draw conclusions.
In Washington Mo played 1210 minutes and had TS 60%+.
If Moe Wagner shoots the 3 like he did with us (and its likely becouse he has 81,7 ft% in his carrier) he will be good backup for years. Bertans got 16M a year (which was insane), worse shooting but better overall version for minimum doesnt sounds that bad.


Mo hasn't been good anywhere tho. He arived in nba in 2018-19, and here we are, three years later, and he is already making less than vets minimum and is only kept in nba due fact his brother is lottery pick.
He might be better suited for Euro style basketball.
Boston was playing him in a Daniel Theis role, and he's not that type of player.

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Re: Magic sign F/C Moritz Wagner to a 2-Year Contract (Robbins) 

Post#143 » by zaymon » Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:28 am

pepe1991 wrote:
zaymon wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:Mo Wagner for Boston had some epic numbers.
9 games played, TS 37%, BPM -11,5

He is what he is. Challenged nba big who isn't mobile to cover PFs and lacks talent to play full time center.

He was fine at college because college allowed him to camp inside paint on defense and he could shoot a little bit.

In nba he does not have nba range and every other aspect of his game is exposed.

And his existence and suckingness in nba does not give me too much confidence about Franz, i'll just have healthy amount of reservation what role Franz can actually play in nba. But i think there are huge aspects of Franz game from college, that simply won't translate in nba, such are passing or any ballhandling.


Boston was a mess last year, they dont have any real passers so most of bigs will look bad there. Wagner played 61 minutes there so i dont think sample size big enough to draw conclusions.
In Washington Mo played 1210 minutes and had TS 60%+.
If Moe Wagner shoots the 3 like he did with us (and its likely becouse he has 81,7 ft% in his carrier) he will be good backup for years. Bertans got 16M a year (which was insane), worse shooting but better overall version for minimum doesnt sounds that bad.


Mo hasn't been good anywhere tho. He arived in nba in 2018-19, and here we are, three years later, and he is already making less than vets minimum and is only kept in nba due fact his brother is lottery pick.
He might be better suited for Euro style basketball.


He is still young and on a minimum contract. He has some edge to him, those type often develop above expectations. Everyone thought Cameron Payne carrier is over and now he plays important role on a contender. I dont think he is a starter, but i like his fire, he seems to be in that Markannen, Frank Kaminsky, Bertans type. If he shoots he has value.
Goodbye Vucevic, welcome lotttery picks !!!
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Re: Magic sign F/C Moritz Wagner to a 2-Year Contract (Robbins) 

Post#144 » by Knightro » Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:38 pm

Moe Wagner has been in the league for three years and has played in nearly two seasons worth of games.

He has not been a good player in any respect up until this point. It's kind of silly to expect anything out of him moving forward when there's been very little evidence he's anything but bottom of the roster filler.

If he helps Franz's transition to life in the NBA go smoother, then I'm all for him being here, but he's just a body on the end of the bench.
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Re: Magic sign F/C Moritz Wagner to a 2-Year Contract (Robbins) 

Post#145 » by drsd » Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:15 pm

MoMM wrote:
drsd wrote:
RookieStar wrote:If Birch can, Mo can as well...


For me M-Wagner is a proven NBA-calibre of player. He is a 10-13 man on essentially any NBA roster, and that places him at about the 300th best basketball player in the world.

..

So all of the best players play in the NBA? No one in Europe?


Well, I never said that, and the proviso "about" was part of my sentence.

I would say that 5% of FIBA players would be capable of NBA capacity. And very few of this players would be top-100 players. So, the best 20 FIBA players are about M-Wagner's ability. Perhaps placing Wagner at the 320th best player in the world - or the 350th. In that kind of range.

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Re: Magic sign F/C Moritz Wagner to a 2-Year Contract (Robbins) 

Post#146 » by drsd » Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:22 pm

pepe1991 wrote:
drsd wrote:How do you define "good"?

Wagner is one of the better perennial 3rd stringers of the NBA. I would rather he is in Magic pin-stripes over Bacon, for example.
A larger argument could be Ennis, but the cost lines still favour M-Wagner, as Ennis is either going to want another 3M contract or he will go to the Lakers on the LLE to chase a ring. (That said, M-Wagner would also be a good Lakers fit in my opinion).

..



Good equals playable on non tanker.
He is not that.
Being third stringer means you are not active rotation member, by definition you are not playable for longer streaches.



That places a player like Donta Hall as "not good". I can agree with that.

As every team in the league will carry 14 players, and play a 9 or 10 man rotation, that means there are 4-to-5 "not good" players on all teams.


Was Robert Sacre or Jason Smith good?


I have never heard of Sacre, so I looked up his stats. He is worse than M-Wagner. And, Smith is exactly M-Wagner's upside. Eleven year career with a 6/1/3 stat-line. Here's a stat for you: he made a fridge 37M over his career.

I enjoyed his Magic year, and kind of expected him to be resigned. But the Wiz offered him a MLE multi-year deal, and there is no way the Magic would have never gone for that.



If Wagner gets 45 games and +15 mpg it means you are rock bottom


If M-Wagner gets 45 games for the Magic this year, it means that there were loads of injuries. Here's hoping that does not come to pass.




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