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2021-2022 Regular Season Game 16: Orlando Magic (4-11) at Brooklyn Nets (11-5) - 11/19/21 - 7:30pm ET

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Re: 2021-2022 Regular Season Game 16: Orlando Magic (4-11) at Brooklyn Nets (11-5) - 11/19/21 - 7:30pm ET 

Post#381 » by Mauro Pedrosa » Sat Nov 20, 2021 5:08 pm

Something that has always bugged me about basketball strategy is why basically everyone shuts down and plays so tentative in the end of the 4th quarter. Even the awesome Curry Warriors did that against the Cavs.

If your strength is pace and space just keep doing that for the entire game. Who cares if it leads to more turnovers?

In our case, Harden, Griffin and Aldridge are slow veterans who were getting run off the court in the first half. We should have just kept our foot on the gas.

Also didn’t like Bamba being moved away from the basket. He was blocking shots left and right
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Re: 2021-2022 Regular Season Game 16: Orlando Magic (4-11) at Brooklyn Nets (11-5) - 11/19/21 - 7:30pm ET 

Post#382 » by pepe1991 » Sat Nov 20, 2021 5:12 pm

Harden is elite player, one of best basketball players in the world, period.

This is same Harden who 5 months ago had 34 points triple double in elimination game vs Celtics. If they had healthy Harden, even without Kyrie , Nets would probably won whole thing.

James Harden has won 65.3 percent of the time in his career.... You don't achive that as top 2 option without being mega elite.

I don't like flopping, and i find him annoying more often than not, but guy makes every offense better and every team contender. There was period of time where he was considered "underachiver" by not being able to beat Warriors 4 allstars mega-team ... with him, Chris Paul and... Ariza? :lol:
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Re: 2021-2022 Regular Season Game 16: Orlando Magic (4-11) at Brooklyn Nets (11-5) - 11/19/21 - 7:30pm ET 

Post#383 » by Mc-o » Sat Nov 20, 2021 6:59 pm

Mauro Pedrosa wrote:Something that has always bugged me about basketball strategy is why basically everyone shuts down and plays so tentative in the end of the 4th quarter. Even the awesome Curry Warriors did that against the Cavs.

If your strength is pace and space just keep doing that for the entire game. Who cares if it leads to more turnovers?

In our case, Harden, Griffin and Aldridge are slow veterans who were getting run off the court in the first half. We should have just kept our foot on the gas.

Also didn’t like Bamba being moved away from the basket. He was blocking shots left and right

I think your underestimating the effect of defenses and pressure at end of games .
As for bamba being away from basket has to do with the strategy of the nets forcing bamba to switch
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Re: 2021-2022 Regular Season Game 16: Orlando Magic (4-11) at Brooklyn Nets (11-5) - 11/19/21 - 7:30pm ET 

Post#384 » by Skybox » Sat Nov 20, 2021 7:14 pm

Mc-o wrote:
The Real Dalic wrote:
Statlanta wrote:I'd say Harden is an elite player. I mean he dropped a 60 point triple double against a better Magic squad a few years ago. This version of Harden though is washed and needs those calls more than ever.

Players can get hot at any moment. Especially when they control the ball for literally every possession.

Ross had a 50 point game.
AG had a 40 point game.
Corey Brewer had a 50 point game.
Brandon Jennings had a 50 point game.

Any player can get hot at any moment and have an elite game.

Sorry, but I don't believe Harden was ever elite. I believe what we are seeing now, and what we saw on the Thunder is the true James Harden.

People keep saying he's "washed" but refuse to notice the difference in officiating this season. It's really strange that he starts struggling when there are rule changes and that he always looks "elite" on nights he gets calls like tonight. Strange coincidence.

He's only 32. The reason he hasn't been great this season, is that he just isn't that great. He has one elite skill, flopping. That has fooled everyone for years.

Trae Young was following the same mold as Harden, but he's figuring it out and playing much better while Harden has been left behind.

Hardens game isn’t fun to watch but cmon you sound like a hater , last night he destroyed the magic .


I was thinking "clown"...more than hater. Most fantasy analysis of an indisputably dominant player I have ever read.
TRoss scored 50 once - Harden AVERAGED 30+ three times, and 29 a couple more times. :crazy: You don't have to enjoy Harden's game (I don't) but it's beyond absurd to question his being elite level...especially after watching him absolutely have his way with our team. He puts the ball in the bucket. Again and again and again. He benefitted greatly from the rules over the past few years...if that's gaming the system, then he's the only smart player in the league...the guy's absolutely a stud even if he doesn't look or feel like it to you...he didn't look to me like he was "left behind" last night. :nonono: I'm sorry our team gave up a twenty point lead to a team missing most of their roster because we couldn't stop one guy possession after possession.
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Re: 2021-2022 Regular Season Game 16: Orlando Magic (4-11) at Brooklyn Nets (11-5) - 11/19/21 - 7:30pm ET 

Post#385 » by Last Guardian » Sat Nov 20, 2021 7:15 pm

I think Harden is an elite playmaker for sure, and a very crafty ball handler. I do think he’s overrated as a scorer. I hate most of the shots he takes and it’s not like he’s really good at at making those shots either.
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Re: 2021-2022 Regular Season Game 16: Orlando Magic (4-11) at Brooklyn Nets (11-5) - 11/19/21 - 7:30pm ET 

Post#386 » by The Real Dalic » Sat Nov 20, 2021 7:16 pm

Mc-o wrote:
The Real Dalic wrote:
Statlanta wrote:I'd say Harden is an elite player. I mean he dropped a 60 point triple double against a better Magic squad a few years ago. This version of Harden though is washed and needs those calls more than ever.

Players can get hot at any moment. Especially when they control the ball for literally every possession.

Ross had a 50 point game.
AG had a 40 point game.
Corey Brewer had a 50 point game.
Brandon Jennings had a 50 point game.

Any player can get hot at any moment and have an elite game.

Sorry, but I don't believe Harden was ever elite. I believe what we are seeing now, and what we saw on the Thunder is the true James Harden.

People keep saying he's "washed" but refuse to notice the difference in officiating this season. It's really strange that he starts struggling when there are rule changes and that he always looks "elite" on nights he gets calls like tonight. Strange coincidence.

He's only 32. The reason he hasn't been great this season, is that he just isn't that great. He has one elite skill, flopping. That has fooled everyone for years.

Trae Young was following the same mold as Harden, but he's figuring it out and playing much better while Harden has been left behind.

Hardens game isn’t fun to watch but cmon you sound like a hater , last night he destroyed the magic . His passing, handle and scoring make him almost unstoppable . Say what you want but magic players were fouling him, having said that the refs swallowed their whistle against the magic and missed some big calls like that goaltending

I am a hater. Was I not obvious about that? I thought I was. Sorry, I don't give credit to people that would get destroyed if refs didn't bail them out. Kevin Durant is an elite talent with or without refs. Same with LeBron, Giannis, Luka, etc.

He didn't destroy the Magic, the refs sure did a good job of that though. The more people overlook and allow the way the refs officiate certain players differently, the more they'll continue to do it.

I'm not sure how it doesn't annoy anyone else that rookies "have to earn their calls" or that role players aren't expected to get a certain call just because they're not a star. It makes no sense. A foul is a foul is a foul. Period.
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Re: 2021-2022 Regular Season Game 16: Orlando Magic (4-11) at Brooklyn Nets (11-5) - 11/19/21 - 7:30pm ET 

Post#387 » by The Real Dalic » Sat Nov 20, 2021 7:19 pm

Bergmaniac wrote:
The Real Dalic wrote:Sorry, but I don't believe Harden was ever elite. I believe what we are seeing now, and what we saw on the Thunder is the true James Harden.

People keep saying he's "washed" but refuse to notice the difference in officiating this season. It's really strange that he starts struggling when there are rule changes and that he always looks "elite" on nights he gets calls like tonight. Strange coincidence.

He's only 32. The reason he hasn't been great this season, is that he just isn't that great. He has one elite skill, flopping. That has fooled everyone for years.

Trae Young was following the same mold as Harden, but he's figuring it out and playing much better while Harden has been left behind.

Harden was struggling early mostly because he was coming back from injury and was physically nowhere near 100%. The new rules played some role, but their impact was exaggerated. He gradually got in better shape, got more used to the new rules and he's shot 63 FTs in his last 5 games. His free throw drawing rate (foul shots per field goal attempts) is already higher than last season and close to his career average. Despite his slow start and fitness issues he's up to 21.2 PPG on 60.5 TS% and 8.8 assists, if a player can do that while clearly not being 100% in half the games he's pretty elite in my book.

On the other hand, Trae Young's FT attempts and free throw drawing rate are both way down from last season, so the new rules are affecting him much more than Harden.

So when Harden doesn't get free throws he struggles, but when the refs fold and start giving him calls again, he's great again? Thanks for making my point for me.

Also, for the Trae part of your post, you proved me right again in that I said he's getting better and better as the season goes on with the rule changes without having to draw free throws as much. And I hate Trae just as much as I hate Harden for the record. But I'm giving Trae the credit he deserves for learning to play the right way.
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Re: 2021-2022 Regular Season Game 16: Orlando Magic (4-11) at Brooklyn Nets (11-5) - 11/19/21 - 7:30pm ET 

Post#388 » by The Real Dalic » Sat Nov 20, 2021 7:31 pm

Alright, I'm not going to respond to the people that personally insult anymore, just reporting and moving on. Not sure why some have to attack the person and not the post. Just disagree with the post, I shouldn't be called a clown just because I have a different opinion.
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Re: 2021-2022 Regular Season Game 16: Orlando Magic (4-11) at Brooklyn Nets (11-5) - 11/19/21 - 7:30pm ET 

Post#389 » by Skybox » Sat Nov 20, 2021 7:44 pm

The Real Dalic wrote:Alright, I'm not going to respond to the people that personally insult anymore, just reporting and moving on. Not sure why some have to attack the person and not the post. Just disagree with the post, I shouldn't be called a clown just because I have a different opinion.


you're right. I apologize...we all disagree all day here, no need for name calling.
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Re: 2021-2022 Regular Season Game 16: Orlando Magic (4-11) at Brooklyn Nets (11-5) - 11/19/21 - 7:30pm ET 

Post#390 » by The Real Dalic » Sat Nov 20, 2021 8:13 pm

Skybox wrote:
The Real Dalic wrote:Alright, I'm not going to respond to the people that personally insult anymore, just reporting and moving on. Not sure why some have to attack the person and not the post. Just disagree with the post, I shouldn't be called a clown just because I have a different opinion.


you're right. I apologize...we all disagree all day here, no need for name calling.

All good. Just wanted to say I will start reporting more just because it feels like it gets more and more hostile around here. It's okay we all disagree on things. We should be able to defend our positions without having to insult each other or think less of others.
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Re: 2021-2022 Regular Season Game 16: Orlando Magic (4-11) at Brooklyn Nets (11-5) - 11/19/21 - 7:30pm ET 

Post#391 » by Skybox » Sat Nov 20, 2021 8:32 pm

The Real Dalic wrote:
Skybox wrote:
The Real Dalic wrote:Alright, I'm not going to respond to the people that personally insult anymore, just reporting and moving on. Not sure why some have to attack the person and not the post. Just disagree with the post, I shouldn't be called a clown just because I have a different opinion.


you're right. I apologize...we all disagree all day here, no need for name calling.

All good. Just wanted to say I will start reporting more just because it feels like it gets more and more hostile around here. It's okay we all disagree on things. We should be able to defend our positions without having to insult each other or think less of others.


Agree...but I still think you're nuts concerning the annual MVP candidate :wink:
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Re: 2021-2022 Regular Season Game 16: Orlando Magic (4-11) at Brooklyn Nets (11-5) - 11/19/21 - 7:30pm ET 

Post#392 » by The Real Dalic » Sun Nov 21, 2021 12:41 am

Skybox wrote:
The Real Dalic wrote:
Skybox wrote:
you're right. I apologize...we all disagree all day here, no need for name calling.

All good. Just wanted to say I will start reporting more just because it feels like it gets more and more hostile around here. It's okay we all disagree on things. We should be able to defend our positions without having to insult each other or think less of others.


Agree...but I still think you're nuts concerning the annual MVP candidate :wink:

Lol, that's fine with me. It is a very unpopular opinion for sure.
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