Magic Extend Jeff Weltman and John Hammond's Contracts Through the 2025-2026 Season

[Xatticus]

Was Isaac "in the running" for DPOY? What, did he finish second or third? Did he get a lot of votes? Was he "in the running" for 1st-team All-Defensive? So did he make the 2nd team? Because I don't remember any of that.

Before he went down with Injury in the 2019-2020 season

This write up was in Mid December of 2019

Still slight of build at 6-foot-11 and just 210 pounds, Isaac is currently leading the NBA in blocked shots, swatting 2.7 per game.

Isaac is improving as a rebounding presence for the Orlando Magic at the defensive end, now getting 5.4 defensive boards per game — an increase of more than one per 36 minutes over last season — while also averaging 1.2 steals and committing only 2.4 fouls in 30.9 minutes per game.

It’s at the rim where Isaac’s 7-foot-1 wing span becomes a problem for opposing shooters. He’s allowing 63.7 percent shooting on 16.3 shots per game in the restricted area, but that is a number that should come down as Isaac adds some bulk to his frame.

Among bigs, Isaac is in the 98th percentile with a block rate of 4.6 percent and in the 92nd percentile at a 1.8 percent steal rate. The defensive glass is an issue — again because of his lack of strength and bulk — where his 15.8 percent rebounding rate on the defensive end is only in the 43rd percentile.

https://hoopshabit.com/2019/12/14/kawhi-leonard-jonathan-isaac-top-nba-defensive-player-ladder/5/

also from Fansided

Before injuries derailed his 2019 season, Isaac was off to a promising start. In the 34 games he played, he was averaging 5.1 defensive rebounds per game, 1.6 steals per game and 2.3 blocks per game. Those are All-Defense numbers and borderline DPOY numbers. Unfortunately, that season was cut significantly short.

https://hoopshabit.com/2021/06/04/orlando-magic-3-goals-jonathan-isaac/4/

From Yahoo

Jonathan Isaac was having a breakout season for Orlando. He had become a go-to defensive stopper for the Magic, a long, athletic, switchable defender averaging 2.4 blocks and 1.6 steals a game. He was going to get All-Defensive team votes this season and looked like a future Defensive Player of the Year candidate. (On offense he’s averaged 12 points and 6.9 rebounds a game, both career bests, but he is still a project.

https://www.yahoo.com/now/jonathan-isaac-al-farouq-aminu-230000434.html

I will give you that Isaac helped the 2018-19 team make the playoffs, although he only averaged 9.6 ppg, 5.5 rpg and 1.3 bpg that season. But he did not help the 2019-20 team make the playoffs when he only played in 34 games that year. He played less than half the season.

With JI's impact defensively and a stretch of games where they didn't have the defensive advantage and they were losing. If he doesn't play those 34 games I really believe this team doesn't make the playoffs. But that's just another conversation.

I agree that Clifford deserves his share of credit for the two playoff appearances, and it's true that Weltman hired Cliff. But Weltman blew up the roster the very next year after they made two consecutive playoffs, which ran Cliff out of town. So does Weltman get credit for hiring Clifford but no blame for blowing up what Cliff was building, thereby letting a good coach go? That is the circular nature of your argument. If Weltman came in here with any kind of vision then he would have done one of two things: 1) Hired a good coach and started building a team around what was already here; or, 2) Gutted the roster and tanked. Instead he waffled and did both and now here we are *5 years* after he was hired with the worst team in the league.

The team was broken up because their original core in Vucevic/Fournier/Gordon all demanded to be traded. Gordon alluded to this when he publically made remarks after a game right before the deadline that he and others (Fournier, Vucevic, and probably Ross) felt the same way about wanting to go different ways.

Fournier indicated he wanted to moved during that off-season prior, and it recently came out when he was here when Chicago was playing in Orlando when Vucevic himself wanted to be moved privately and he was working with WeHam to get it done.

TBH I believe WeHam wanted to rebuild immediately, but like someone here said the Organization was wanting to make the Playoffs desperately. So the only way they could do it was by keeping the Vets and implementing a few pieces and a Vet Coach with recent success that would get them in (which happened in back-to-back seasons with those playoff appearances). They achieved that objective and were extended now they can a fresh start that they probably initially wanted like the Fans here did.

Anyone who wants to credit Weltman for little things he has done here and there should consider, five years into his tenure, how far away we are from being relevant. And if you like the direction of the rebuild, consider what he's rebuilding -- his own mess. It's like crediting a pilot who crashed a plane for successfully opening the emergency hatches.

I''m a person who sees it in multiple ways. But the fact of the matter is they answer to Alex Martins/Devos/Top Team Executives (guys who don't know crap about basketball). If those guys wanted playoff appearances within a certain amount of time, then WeHam has to go into a direction where has to rely on Veteran Players and Coaches to get them there and keep the suits happy. Its Political Game on top of having the medium of trying to build something of substance that can last going into the future.

Again, when the original Core of Fournier/Gordon/Vucevic all wanted to the leave the team at once, WeHam probably said to the Suits they could turn this around within 2 Seasons after moving on from those guys. Since they were able to follow through with the playoff appearances which was probably the main objective, now they can rebuild the team into what they and what the fans want.

This expands as to what I'm talking about

Watch on YouTube

I agree with pretty much everything you have said in this post. I don't know what sort of conversations took place. I don't know what mandates Weltman had when he took the job. I do recall that Vogel was to be given a chance by the new regime, which tells me that the goal out of the gates was to get a lot better in a hurry.

My concern is that this front office had done next to nothing until their feet were held to the fire. When the core asked out, they took action. Something good happened. If their feet aren't held to the fire, will they do anything? Repeatedly drafting in slot and punting on 2nd-round picks is an indictment. Inactivity, in general, is a bad thing. Trading is an inherently good thing. I feel as though we have finally taken a step in the right direction, but I'm not all that confident that that single step is indicative of more to come.

I'm not out on this front office. I actually like Weltman. I'm just not very confident in their abilities at this point in time.

[Magic_Kingdom]

Was Isaac "in the running" for DPOY? What, did he finish second or third? Did he get a lot of votes? Was he "in the running" for 1st-team All-Defensive? So did he make the 2nd team? Because I don't remember any of that.

Before he went down with Injury in the 2019-2020 season

This write up was in Mid December of 2019

Still slight of build at 6-foot-11 and just 210 pounds, Isaac is currently leading the NBA in blocked shots, swatting 2.7 per game.

Isaac is improving as a rebounding presence for the Orlando Magic at the defensive end, now getting 5.4 defensive boards per game — an increase of more than one per 36 minutes over last season — while also averaging 1.2 steals and committing only 2.4 fouls in 30.9 minutes per game.

It’s at the rim where Isaac’s 7-foot-1 wing span becomes a problem for opposing shooters. He’s allowing 63.7 percent shooting on 16.3 shots per game in the restricted area, but that is a number that should come down as Isaac adds some bulk to his frame.

Among bigs, Isaac is in the 98th percentile with a block rate of 4.6 percent and in the 92nd percentile at a 1.8 percent steal rate. The defensive glass is an issue — again because of his lack of strength and bulk — where his 15.8 percent rebounding rate on the defensive end is only in the 43rd percentile.

https://hoopshabit.com/2019/12/14/kawhi-leonard-jonathan-isaac-top-nba-defensive-player-ladder/5/

also from Fansided

Before injuries derailed his 2019 season, Isaac was off to a promising start. In the 34 games he played, he was averaging 5.1 defensive rebounds per game, 1.6 steals per game and 2.3 blocks per game. Those are All-Defense numbers and borderline DPOY numbers. Unfortunately, that season was cut significantly short.

https://hoopshabit.com/2021/06/04/orlando-magic-3-goals-jonathan-isaac/4/

From Yahoo

Jonathan Isaac was having a breakout season for Orlando. He had become a go-to defensive stopper for the Magic, a long, athletic, switchable defender averaging 2.4 blocks and 1.6 steals a game. He was going to get All-Defensive team votes this season and looked like a future Defensive Player of the Year candidate. (On offense he’s averaged 12 points and 6.9 rebounds a game, both career bests, but he is still a project.

https://www.yahoo.com/now/jonathan-isaac-al-farouq-aminu-230000434.html

I will give you that Isaac helped the 2018-19 team make the playoffs, although he only averaged 9.6 ppg, 5.5 rpg and 1.3 bpg that season. But he did not help the 2019-20 team make the playoffs when he only played in 34 games that year. He played less than half the season.

With JI's impact defensively and a stretch of games where they didn't have the defensive advantage and they were losing. If he doesn't play those 34 games I really believe this team doesn't make the playoffs. But that's just another conversation.

I agree that Clifford deserves his share of credit for the two playoff appearances, and it's true that Weltman hired Cliff. But Weltman blew up the roster the very next year after they made two consecutive playoffs, which ran Cliff out of town. So does Weltman get credit for hiring Clifford but no blame for blowing up what Cliff was building, thereby letting a good coach go? That is the circular nature of your argument. If Weltman came in here with any kind of vision then he would have done one of two things: 1) Hired a good coach and started building a team around what was already here; or, 2) Gutted the roster and tanked. Instead he waffled and did both and now here we are *5 years* after he was hired with the worst team in the league.

The team was broken up because their original core in Vucevic/Fournier/Gordon all demanded to be traded. Gordon alluded to this when he publically made remarks after a game right before the deadline that he and others (Fournier, Vucevic, and probably Ross) felt the same way about wanting to go different ways.

Fournier indicated he wanted to moved during that off-season prior, and it recently came out when he was here when Chicago was playing in Orlando when Vucevic himself wanted to be moved privately and he was working with WeHam to get it done.

TBH I believe WeHam wanted to rebuild immediately, but like someone here said the Organization was wanting to make the Playoffs desperately. So the only way they could do it was by keeping the Vets and implementing a few pieces and a Vet Coach with recent success that would get them in (which happened in back-to-back seasons with those playoff appearances). They achieved that objective and were extended now they can a fresh start that they probably initially wanted like the Fans here did.

Anyone who wants to credit Weltman for little things he has done here and there should consider, five years into his tenure, how far away we are from being relevant. And if you like the direction of the rebuild, consider what he's rebuilding -- his own mess. It's like crediting a pilot who crashed a plane for successfully opening the emergency hatches.

I''m a person who sees it in multiple ways. But the fact of the matter is they answer to Alex Martins/Devos/Top Team Executives (guys who don't know crap about basketball). If those guys wanted playoff appearances within a certain amount of time, then WeHam has to go into a direction where has to rely on Veteran Players and Coaches to get them there and keep the suits happy. Its Political Game on top of having the medium of trying to build something of substance that can last going into the future.

Again, when the original Core of Fournier/Gordon/Vucevic all wanted to the leave the team at once, WeHam probably said to the Suits they could turn this around within 2 Seasons after moving on from those guys. Since they were able to follow through with the playoff appearances which was probably the main objective, now they can rebuild the team into what they and what the fans want.

This expands as to what I'm talking about

Watch on YouTube

But what does it say about the job Weltman has done since he's been here that "tanking" meant getting rid of Hennigan's players and going forward with Weltman's core of players? Now that the team is built around Weltman's additions -- Isaac, Bamba, Okeke, Anthony, Fultz, Hampton, Harris, Wagner, Suggs, Carter -- it is the worst team in the NBA by a large margin. He has had five drafts and four lottery picks over five years, and this is the talent he has assembled. An 8-38 team.

As for Isaac being "in the running" for DPOY based on articles written about what he did over 34 games in 2019 -- if that qualifies as "in the running" for you then we'll have to agree to disagree. To me it shows he got off to a good start but that's it. We have no idea how the season would have progressed because he got injured on January 1.

[JF5]

But what does it say about the job Weltman has done since he's been here that "tanking" meant getting rid of Hennigan's players and going forward with Weltman's core of players? Now that the team is built around Weltman's additions -- Isaac, Bamba, Okeke, Anthony, Fultz, Hampton, Harris, Wagner, Suggs, Carter -- it is the worst team in the NBA by a large margin. He has had five drafts and four lottery picks over five years, and this is the talent he has assembled. An 8-38 team.

What type of argument is this? Its year one in a clear rebuilding situation.

1. They traded all their Best Players/Core Vets including an All-Star Caliber talent
2. 2 of the Key Players/Young Talent that helped the Magic get to previous playoff appearances are out with injury (and have been out for 1 or 2 full seasons at this point)
3. This team is filled with a bunch of 1st and 2nd year players and a rookie coach. Nobody in their right mind and knows basketball is going to expect anything from this this team until realistically 2-3 years from now.
4. As I mentioned before they earned their credit by making back-to-back playoff appearances with 2 of those young guys they drafted.

It seems like you're reaching at this point with this specific segment of your argument.

As for Isaac being "in the running" for DPOY based on articles written about what he did over 34 games in 2019 -- if that qualifies as "in the running" for you then we'll have to agree to disagree. To me it shows he got off to a good start but that's it. We have no idea how the season would have progressed because he got injured on January 1.

We can agree to disagree... But its obvious with the Stats (Ridiculous 2.3 Blocks a game and 1.6 Steals per game) with the On/Off numbers, the Advanced Stats like DPM/DTRG and the eye test with his impact defensively that he was definitely going to make an All-Defensive Team.

I don't think someone's output drops off significantly near the halfway point of the season unless they're playing on a significant injury. A player is just that good usually at that point.

[SOUL]

As for Isaac being "in the running" for DPOY based on articles written about what he did over 34 games in 2019 -- if that qualifies as "in the running" for you then we'll have to agree to disagree. To me it shows he got off to a good start but that's it. We have no idea how the season would have progressed because he got injured on January 1.

Not sure what kind of argument is this though.. if someone plays extremely high level defense for 34 games.. you think they're just not gonna play defense randomly after that? It's one thing to say he would've won, who knows, but he was certainly in conversations for it and prob would've gotten first team all defense as long as our team was decent.

It's not something like a hot shooting streak.. one doesn't luck into being a top five defender 34 games in a row.

[Magic_Kingdom]

As for Isaac being "in the running" for DPOY based on articles written about what he did over 34 games in 2019 -- if that qualifies as "in the running" for you then we'll have to agree to disagree. To me it shows he got off to a good start but that's it. We have no idea how the season would have progressed because he got injured on January 1.

Not sure what kind of argument is this though.. if someone plays extremely high level defense for 34 games.. you think they're just not gonna play defense randomly after that? It's one thing to say he would've won, who knows, but he was certainly in conversations for it and prob would've gotten first team all defense as long as our team was decent.

It's not something like a hot shooting streak.. one doesn't luck into being a top five defender 34 games in a row.

The argument was that Isaac was "in the running" for DPOY in 2019-20. Those were the poster's words. My argument is that if you only play 34 games, and don't play any regular season games past January 1, you aren't "in the running" for anything. You didn't even play half a season. What is so hard to understand about that?

If he had stayed healthy that season -- which is a huge if -- I'm sure he would have continued to play good defense but would his defensive stats have stayed exactly where they were? We have no way of knowing. But it doesn't matter because we don't even consider giving end of the year awards to guys who only played 34 games.

[Magic_Kingdom]

But what does it say about the job Weltman has done since he's been here that "tanking" meant getting rid of Hennigan's players and going forward with Weltman's core of players? Now that the team is built around Weltman's additions -- Isaac, Bamba, Okeke, Anthony, Fultz, Hampton, Harris, Wagner, Suggs, Carter -- it is the worst team in the NBA by a large margin. He has had five drafts and four lottery picks over five years, and this is the talent he has assembled. An 8-38 team.

What type of argument is this? Its year one in a clear rebuilding situation.

1. They traded all their Best Players/Core Vets including an All-Star Caliber talent
2. 2 of the Key Players/Young Talent that helped the Magic get to previous playoff appearances are out with injury (and have been out for 1 or 2 full seasons at this point)
3. This team is filled with a bunch of 1st and 2nd year players and a rookie coach. Nobody in their right mind and knows basketball is going to expect anything from this this team until realistically 2-3 years from now.
4. As I mentioned before they earned their credit by making back-to-back playoff appearances with 2 of those young guys they drafted.

It seems like you're reaching at this point with this specific segment of your argument.

As for Isaac being "in the running" for DPOY based on articles written about what he did over 34 games in 2019 -- if that qualifies as "in the running" for you then we'll have to agree to disagree. To me it shows he got off to a good start but that's it. We have no idea how the season would have progressed because he got injured on January 1.

We can agree to disagree... But its obvious with the Stats (Ridiculous 2.3 Blocks a game and 1.6 Steals per game) with the On/Off numbers, the Advanced Stats like DPM/DTRG and the eye test with his impact defensively that he was definitely going to make an All-Defensive Team.

I don't think someone's output drops off significantly near the halfway point of the season unless they're playing on a significant injury. A player is just that good usually at that point.

So Weltman and Hammond have done a good job in your opinion and deserved four-year extensions? Because when you begin your argument by saying this is year 1 of a rebuild, you are being extremely generous in your characterization. Welman and Hammond didn't just get here -- they have had five drafts, including four lottery picks. All six of their first-round picks, including all four of their lottery picks, are on the current roster. And it is by far the worst team in the NBA. So because they got rid of all Hennigan's players we are supposed to ignore that they have had more than sufficient time to build and cultivate this roster? I view this rebuild as an admission that they utterly failed to improve or add to the team in five years. I guess you and Alex Martins agree, I just don't see it.

[JF5]

So Weltman and Hammond have done a good job in your opinion and deserved four-year extensions? Because when you begin your argument by saying this is year 1 of a rebuild, you are being extremely generous in your characterization.

I view this rebuild as an admission that they utterly failed to improve or add to the team in five years. I guess you and Alex Martins agree, I just don't see it.

It's really difficult having this conversation with you because you have a very rigid view as to what you as a fan wanted the Magic to do and what the Organization themselves wanted for the team after 2017.

Look at the language at this excerpts of your post.

When Weham got hired YOU thought it was rebuild.

The Organization was thinking of a Playoff Push/Retool as they likely recognized they had done enough rebuilding (as it had already been 5+ years at that point) and they felt they had the talent to do it but they needed new leadership in WeHam.

Welman and Hammond didn't just get here -- they have had five drafts, including four lottery picks. All six of their first-round picks, including all four of their lottery picks, are on the current roster. And it is by far the worst team in the NBA. So because they got rid of all Hennigan's players we are supposed to ignore that they have had more than sufficient time to build and cultivate this roster?

You YOURSELF conveniently leave out that the team made the playoffs 2 out of the 4 years under WeHam (with key core guys they've drafted and traded for). The most success this team has seen in years after being a top 5-7 lottery team for 5+ consecutive years. You think that's not going to factor into the decision of keep these guys?

You can't pick and choose the narrative if you don't look at the context and body of work in totality.

The argument was that Isaac was "in the running" for DPOY in 2019-20. Those were the poster's words. My argument is that if you only play 34 games, and don't play any regular season games past January 1, you aren't "in the running" for anything. You didn't even play half a season. What is so hard to understand about that?

You've got to be kidding me...

My Original Quote

To say a guy who was in the running for DPOY and 1st All-Defensive team before he got injured is a bad pick is asinine. Considering again he helped this team get to the playoffs TWICE with the league's better defenses in both years when he played extended minutes.

You're telling me that right now there is nobody that talks about potential Award candidates during any point of the season? All this talk apparently happens at the end of the season.

For example I can't say Stephen Curry is in the running for MVP in the moment because he hasn't played the full season yet? You understand how ridiculous that sounds?

[pepe1991]

Nobody was "winning" award in December of any season, Isaac got hurt during last 2 days of 2019, of 2019-20 season.

Today, for example, Durant's injury, halfway through a season, means he is out of MVP race. There is basically unwritten rule that you can't win some award if you don't play at least 65 games to even enter conversation. Just like only one time in nba history, MVP award was given to player who's team failed to win 50 games. Nobody ever said it's illegal to crown MVP player who's team is sub 50-32 record, but common sense is that MVP of regular season should be player who leads team to great record and/OR leads bad/injuried/banged up team to massive overachivments. People today are blown out what Derozan is doing, what Lebron is doing at his age, what Ja Morant is doing with young team, but every single person with common sense knows that MVP race is Steph ( overwhelming favorite), Giannis, Jokic & Embiid this year. For all reasons mentioned above.
And Durant, if he recovers in fast enough time to catch up to 65-ish game played ( and wins scoring title).

Was Isaac in talks about DPOY early on? Yes. But in that moment Davis was leading race, and if you look at actual DPOY votes you will figure two things:
a) Isaac didn't get single vote ( again, unwritten sample size rule)
b) Giannis, despite Davis "winning" it in December, won by having 243 votes more than Davis, who ended up collecting 200 votes total. So it was homerun of an award.

So Isaac never got hurt, played until lockdown, played in bubble for more than few min, than maybe he would be in conversation for ALL nba defenive team and in DPOY. But he would never won DPOY because competition was super stiff and made of super popular names and stars such are Giannis, Davis, Gobert , Simmons.
And serious question, how many of you know who was all nba defensive team member last year? I know i don't, because it's usless award. So you only care about it because Isaac, not because it means anything. TBH i have no damn clue who are all nba first team members, let alone defensive teams.
So... Eric Bledsoe, Matisse Thybulle, Marcus Smart, Patrick Beverly are just some of names who made to all nba defensvie team. You guys view them as elite player because of it?

Weltman and Hammond had 5 years to decide what they want. They wasted 4 years doing close to nothing with players they didn't draft. After 4 years one of Hennigan guys demanded a trade, other said he is not returning. So they started rebuild. Can we not pretend that sucking is some mastermind strategy of rebuild? It's completley based on luck of ping pong balls. And even if you get lucky, that still does not mean you will be able to build competitve, let alone winning roster down the road.

[zaymon]

Sacramento Kings would kill for our front office. Two back to back playoffs and then rebuild to raise the ceiling even more ? Kings in 16 years couldnt do half of the things we did in 5.
Posters who want to judge our front office by our win/loss record, first year into rebuild are insane.

[OrlChamps2030]

Sacramento Kings would kill for our front office. Two back to back playoffs and then rebuild to raise the ceiling even more ? Kings in 16 years couldnt do half of the things we did in 5.
Posters who want to judge our front office by our win/loss record, first year into rebuild are insane.

Imagine beating your chest over being better than the Kings

[pepe1991]

Kings would be playoff taems many, many times, if they play 52 games vs taems from East, opposite of 52 games vs East.
Historically, East is worst conference and always way easier to make playoffs.
For years winning 38 wins was enough to make playoffs on East. On west 48 wins wasn't enough at times.

[zaymon]

Kings would be playoff taems many, many times, if they play 52 games vs taems from East, opposite of 52 games vs East.
Historically, East is worst conference and always way easier to make playoffs.
For years winning 38 wins was enough to make playoffs on East. On west 48 wins wasn't enough at times.

Its a blessing becouse you can have good team and still pick in the lottery. You can find positives and negatives in every situation.