Did we really draft a point guard with a #5 pick that cant dribble? (or shoot)

fateis007 · Post #1 » by **fateis007** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 3:44 am

The more I watch Jalen Suggs, the more concerned I get with his handle.

Our small forward drafted a few spots later is a 10x better ball handler then him. Could this be why raptors passed on him? Has a point guard ever been drafted this high that had this much trouble with his control of the ball? I am cringing when he puts it on the floor or gets pressured.

It's becoming a big problem because its rushing him a lot on his drives, like he is afraid to get stripped and cant keep his dribble alive, making him turn the ball over even more.

I thought when we drafted Oladipo, his handles were pretty rough like this, but he did eventually turn the corner. I really hope that is the case here.

Otherwise he will have to be an shooting guard for us, that cant shoot.

On the bright side, his D is pretty top notch.

thelead · Post #2 » by **thelead** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 3:50 am

We drafted a glue guy that you stick next to your star… still waiting for that star unfortunately

MasterGMer · Post #3 » by **MasterGMer** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 3:53 am

Besides ball handling, Suggs' biggest problem is his shooting and finishing around the rim. After he came back from injury, his finish ability has changed a lot. And I also have faith in his shooting. He will turn the corner eventually. His biggest problem, I agree with you, is turning the ball over and ball handling.

I really like Suggs' potential and upside. I do not regret drafting him at 5

Ducklett · Post #4 » by **Ducklett** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 4:00 am

Gives me Elfrid vibes. I think Suggs is much harder of a worker than Elfrid though so he can become great if he wants it.

pepe1991 · Post #5 » by **pepe1991** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 4:29 am

I don't think finishing around rim is that big of an issue itself. I think his poor handles make it look like it is because he hardly can go to desired spots on the floor

Suggs is more Marcus Smart than people, me included, wanted to admit. He plays very good defense but on offensive end he has very little to show. His passing & Playmaking are rather average, pick&roll is especially below average. His shooting is just bad.
And he can't take care of a ball. Having PG who is dancing with 1:1 ration on assists and turnovers is simply unheared of, for starting PG in nba. Even backup.

Big summer ahead of him.

VFX · Post #6 » by **VFX** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 4:46 am

The obligatory “rookie hasn’t met my standards in year 1” thread.

fateis007 · Post #7 » by **fateis007** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 4:57 am

MagicMatic wrote:The obligatory “rookie hasn’t met my standards in year 1” thread.

The obligatory he's just a rookie response.

You don't just learn to dribble the ball half way into the season, so it's a huge hole in his game currently on a pretty large sample size.

I am fine with developing raw talent, but considering it's the most essential skill set required to run that position, there is more then enough evidence to be concerned. I thought from his college days we were getting a more polished player imo.

I hope im wrong trust me, I am and was very excited to draft him and I hope he spends the offseason really working on nothing but that. I honestly think it's 10x more important then his shooting, as we have many examples of guards who dont shoot well, but stil carve out a space in this league, but not many that cant handle the rock.

Optimus_Steel · Post #8 » by **Optimus_Steel** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 4:58 am

MagicMatic wrote:The obligatory “rookie hasn’t met my standards in year 1” thread.

It's a legitimate concern even as a rookie. His handle is terrible right now and the other rookie is a 6'10 forward that handles the ball much better than he does. Developing ball handling is not impossible but it's hard to do for most NBA players. Not saying he won't but let's be honest it's a legit concern as he is supposed to be our PG of the future.

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JF5 · Post #9 » by **JF5** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 5:06 am

His shot has looked A LOT better than what it did the say compared to the start of the season. His dribbling does leave a lot to be desired but his handle will most likely get a lot better once the offseason happens. Once that does happen his offensive game should open up significantly.

He's a project... But it seems to me once to get settled completely you're going to have an absolute Two Way Star player. He's a smart player, hard working, and is physically gifted. You'll see stretches where he's all over the court and his impact on the game is undeniable on both ends of the court.

I'm not so worried considering the flashes he's shown.

MagicStarwipe · Post #10 » by **MagicStarwipe** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 5:07 am

Probably would have helped if he spent all his time developing his handle instead of dividing it with throwing a football around. He's not completely useless with his handle but definitely needs to tighten it up quite a bit and just be less loose with the ball in general.

VFX · Post #11 » by **VFX** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 5:10 am

fateis007 wrote:
MagicMatic wrote:The obligatory “rookie hasn’t met my standards in year 1” thread.

The obligatory he's just a rookie response.

You don't just learn to dribble the ball half way into the season, so it's a huge hole in his game currently on a pretty large sample size.

I am fine with developing raw talent, but considering it's the most essential skill set required to run that position, there is more then enough evidence to be concerned. I thought from his college days we were getting a more polished player imo.

I hope im wrong trust me, I am and was very excited to draft him and I hope he spends the offseason really working on nothing but that. I honestly think it's 10x more important then his shooting, as we have many examples of guards who dont shoot well, but stil carve out a space in this league, but not many that cant handle the rock.

I’m only worried about Suggs if he:

A: Doesn’t improve in 2 years time with what is considered a crazy work ethic.

B: Gets injured half as often as Jonathan Isaac.

He’s been impressive at times on both sides of the floor despite having some of these concerns. He had a very good system around him at Gonzaga. Orlando doesn’t have anything close to a semblance of an identity right now.

KillMonger · Post #12 » by **KillMonger** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 8:26 am

relax

Rainwater · Post #13 » by **Rainwater** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 8:27 am

You can learn how to shoot once you get into the league but learning how to dribble is something completely different. You are what you are with that skill typically.

fateis007 · Post #14 » by **fateis007** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 9:01 am

Rainwater wrote:You can learn how to shoot once you get into the league but learning how to dribble is something completely different. You are what you are with that skill typically.

To be fair, Oladipo looked the same way his rookie year, maybe not as bad, but he was constantly losing his handle and turning over the ball. his per 36 turn overs were 3.7, while Suggs has been 4.4, but similiar AST ratios.

Oladipo went hard on tightening up his handle in the offseason, and came back much improved the next year. And id say his allstar year at indiana, when his usage went up by over 20%, was also an improvement. So you can def tighten up your handles over time, unless you're Mario Hezonja

I would say that is what Suggs needs right now, is to tighten up his handle, because he does show a lot of explosive and crafty moves with the ball and we see glimpses.

jezzerinho · Post #15 » by **jezzerinho** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 10:24 am

I had Giddy in the same top tier as Suggs pre draft. If we'd taken Giddey at 5 wed be talking about how he doesn't have a shot and can't defend. If we'd taken Green, we'd be talking about tunnel vision and turnstile defence. And so on....

Suggs comes from a football background where it's about power. I'm not surprised he needs to reprogramme his body a bit for the type of fluidity and coordination that BB demands.

That's not to say I'm not disappointed. I thought offensively he'd be further along. Marcus Smart is certainly now a possible outcome for him, as Pepe said. I happen to like Smart though, so there's that!

Post #16 » by **SOUL** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 10:30 am

jezzerinho wrote:I had Giddy in the same top tier as Suggs pre draft. If we'd taken Giddey at 5 wed be talking about how he doesn't have a shot and can't defend. If we'd taken Green, we'd be talking about tunnel vision and turnstile defence. And so on....

Suggs comes from a football background where it's about power. I'm not surprised he needs to reprogramme his body a bit for the type of fluidity and coordination that BB demands.

That's not to say I'm not disappointed. I thought offensively he'd be further along. Marcus Smart is certainly now a possible outcome for him, as Pepe said. I happen to like Smart though, so there's that!

Yep, there is a fatal flaw for most rooks

Mobley is the one with the least amount of question marks but even he has areas to improve on

drsd · Post #17 » by **drsd** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 10:47 am

MagicMatic wrote:The obligatory “rookie hasn’t met my standards in year 1” thread.

It is hard to be a rookie. The PG position is the hardest to play in the NBA. Point 1 + point 2 means that all rookie PGs always suck.

What I like is Suggs defensive intensity.

..

drsd · Post #18 » by **drsd** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 10:48 am

jezzerinho wrote:Suggs comes from a football background where it's about power. I'm not surprised he needs to reprogramme his body a bit for the type of fluidity and coordination that BB demands.

For me, Suggs upside is to be a better version of Jameer Nelson.

..

RichCollab · Post #19 » by **RichCollab** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 10:52 am

Jalen has had wrist/thumb issues since Summer league. Could that be part of the problem?

Skybox · Post #20 » by **Skybox** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 12:36 pm

I like the Oladipo parallel. They are different players, but Oladipo's handles in traffic were horrible to watch in ORL but he offered enough other things (and physical gifts) to keep expectations high. I was attending a lot of games back then and it seemed like Oladipo lost the ball every time he dribbled into traffic. Suggs seems like he has the right mentality and I just hope he does it for ORL and not with the next team where he gets to play with an actual good player who truly expects to win some nights. This putrid mess of a season can break anyone's will. Hopefully, Mosley can maintain proper perspective in his young guys.

I don't like when he's compared to Franz, who is a very pleasant surprise for everyone in the league and, while I love the "football mentality" and toughness Suggs brings, it's not like he just picked up a basketball. He's been a two-sport star at an extremely high level his whole life. I believe he'll be great, or at least very solid, but I can't excuse his fundamentals as if he were some project from Congo.