The 2022 NBA Draft Thread Part 2

[Skybox]

Film breakdown with Jabari

Watch on YouTube

Jabari all day. Such a weapon. So few questions...just do it and let's get going on the trade/FA market

[tiderulz]

Film breakdown with Jabari

Watch on YouTube

Jabari all day. Such a weapon. So few questions...just do it and let's get going on the trade/FA market

the questions are there though. can he improve his handle? can he develop a post game? can he develop a midrange game? is his defense solid without the best shot blocker behind him?

[thelead]

Film breakdown with Jabari

Watch on YouTube

Jabari all day. Such a weapon. So few questions...just do it and let's get going on the trade/FA market

the questions are there though. can he improve his handle? can he develop a post game? can he develop a midrange game? is his defense solid without the best shot blocker behind him?

Your first two questions are valid. The last two, not so much. His midrange game is fine today.... sans the improved handle. And his defense was very good even when Kessler was not in the game. I'm not worried one bit about his defense. He may not be top-tier elite on defense but that definitely isn't what this team is lacking.

[Skybox]

Jabari all day. Such a weapon. So few questions...just do it and let's get going on the trade/FA market

the questions are there though. can he improve his handle? can he develop a post game? can he develop a midrange game? is his defense solid without the best shot blocker behind him?

Your first two questions are valid. The last two, not so much. His midrange game is fine today.... sans the improved handle. And his defense was very good even when Kessler was not in the game. I'm not worried one bit about his defense. He may not be top-tier elite on defense but that definitely isn't what this team is lacking.

I completely agree with your response...the midrange concern is baseless, IMO. Might be among his strongest spots. His defense is superb, every large person doesn't have to be a shot-blocking specialist-especially as he'll play more perimeter D. If Isaac is healthy, they could form a fearsome defensive duo - Wagner and WCJ make for a potent frontline rotation, IMO. I'd love to upgrade our backup center spot (maybe even move up for Kessler?) and let Bamba go - or, just keep Bamba on a team-friendly deal and hope he accepts the bench role and contributes at least as well as he did this past season.

Jabari is an easy choice for me...the future of our backcourt is a bigger concern, 3 decent prospects who need the ball-somethings gotta give. Hopefully, a significant trade for a legit SG or, at least, keep Gary Harris and take draft swings at possible replacements.

[pepe1991]

He shot 32% from mid range in nba. That's worst than Aaron Gordon

I wouldn't put much stock in it, but every time he made jabstep mid range it was all over news. BUT nobody wanted to say how ineffective that shot for him was.

It's not Jabari doesn't have mid range, it's fact that he thinks he is Aldrige/ Durant from that range and settles for some of the worst shots i've seen since Cole Anthony college days.

Don't cry in couple of years how Chet is jack of all tools and two way game changer while your favorite team drafted glorified 3 and D guy on ridicilous usage to justfy draft stock.

In general you want big toolbox for first overall skill because not all skills will translate in nba.
Jabari Smith selling point is defense ( overrated college gimmicky defense behind best shotblocker in college last 20 years) and shooting.

Chet's selling point is basically everything but weight.

[cedric76]

He shot 32% from mid range in nba. That's worst than Aaron Gordon

I wouldn't put much stock in it, but every time he made jabstep mid range it was all over news. BUT nobody wanted to say how ineffective that shot for him was.

It's not Jabari doesn't have mid range, it's fact that he thinks he is Aldrige/ Durant from that range and settles for some of the worst shots i've seen since Cole Anthony college days.

Don't cry in couple of years how Chet is jack of all tools and two way game changer while your favorite team drafted glorified 3 and D guy on ridicilous usage to justfy draft stock.

In general you want big toolbox for first overall skill because not all skills will translate in nba.
Jabari Smith selling point is defense ( overrated college gimmicky defense behind best shotblocker in college last 20 years) and shooting.

Chet's selling point is basically everything but weight.

I can bet with you that in couple of years Jabari will be better than Chet

[Skybox]

He shot 32% from mid range in nba. That's worst than Aaron Gordon

I wouldn't put much stock in it, but every time he made jabstep mid range it was all over news. BUT nobody wanted to say how ineffective that shot for him was.

It's not Jabari doesn't have mid range, it's fact that he thinks he is Aldrige/ Durant from that range and settles for some of the worst shots i've seen since Cole Anthony college days.

Don't cry in couple of years how Chet is jack of all tools and two way game changer while your favorite team drafted glorified 3 and D guy on ridicilous usage to justfy draft stock.

In general you want big toolbox for first overall skill because not all skills will translate in nba.
Jabari Smith selling point is defense ( overrated college gimmicky defense behind best shotblocker in college last 20 years) and shooting.

Chet's selling point is basically everything but weight.

Even if Chet had a functional human body to compete with 300 other physical freaks of nature, his game is no more complete than Jabari's. Chet is a fantastic instinctual shot blocker but he can't move his feet or switch on the perimeter like Jabari. Calling Chet a ball handler is like the people calling Barnes the next Magic Johnson last summer-good handle for a big guy, but more sideshow than truly an effective NBA "handle". Paolo also has some tremendous traits and weaknesses...For me, I'm skipping the guy with the great likelihood of being shown to be physically overmatched and ineffective against NBA athletes-that's clearly Chet. He may be the best player in the draft, but I can't stand another Bamba situation where an "amazing shot blocker" gets bounced out of the painted area and ends up listlessly roaming the perimeter or another Isaac story where we cheer signs of greatness between injuries. Just my take...I'll take (debatably) slightly less upside over so much greater likelihood of contributing early and for a long time. Personally, I don't think anyone has greater upside than Jabari due to his shooting, but even if I didn't believe that, I just can't bet on Chet not getting brutalized by opposing players a foot shorter.

[tiderulz]

Jabari all day. Such a weapon. So few questions...just do it and let's get going on the trade/FA market

the questions are there though. can he improve his handle? can he develop a post game? can he develop a midrange game? is his defense solid without the best shot blocker behind him?

Your first two questions are valid. The last two, not so much. His midrange game is fine today.... sans the improved handle. And his defense was very good even when Kessler was not in the game. I'm not worried one bit about his defense. He may not be top-tier elite on defense but that definitely isn't what this team is lacking.

actually, if you look at his shot chart, his midrange game is not fine today. but again, there are questions about Jabari

[j-ragg]

Chet’s red flag isn’t only the weight, just the biggest one by far.

I know tiderulz has posted the stats a few times but his pedestrian games against any ranked team/team with a normal sized center were concerning. He’s not ancient of course but a little older than the other top guys. Not much of a half court offensive threat yet other than being a great finisher.

[MAGICian619]

Chet’s red flag isn’t only the weight, just the biggest one by far.

I know tiderulz has posted the stats a few times but his pedestrian games against any ranked team/team with a normal sized center were concerning. He’s not ancient of course but a little older than the other top guys. Not much of a half court offensive threat yet other than being a great finisher.

[img][img]https://i.ibb.co/QHL8gTv/Advanced-Stats.png[/img][/img]

Do we want the best player in this draft or not? Chet impacts the game more in every way when compared to Jabari.

[j-ragg]

Chet’s red flag isn’t only the weight, just the biggest one by far.

I know tiderulz has posted the stats a few times but his pedestrian games against any ranked team/team with a normal sized center were concerning. He’s not ancient of course but a little older than the other top guys. Not much of a half court offensive threat yet other than being a great finisher.

[img][img]https://i.ibb.co/SmbQjMw/Advanced-Stats.png[/img][/img]

Do we want the best player in this draft or not? Chet impacts the game more in every way when compared to Jabari.

Impacts the game** in every way, agreed.


**so long as games are against WCC competition.

I’d be fine with any of the top 3 fwiw. Prefer Jabari by a hair. They all have their glaring flaws.

[pepe1991]

He shot 32% from mid range in nba. That's worst than Aaron Gordon

I wouldn't put much stock in it, but every time he made jabstep mid range it was all over news. BUT nobody wanted to say how ineffective that shot for him was.

It's not Jabari doesn't have mid range, it's fact that he thinks he is Aldrige/ Durant from that range and settles for some of the worst shots i've seen since Cole Anthony college days.

Don't cry in couple of years how Chet is jack of all tools and two way game changer while your favorite team drafted glorified 3 and D guy on ridicilous usage to justfy draft stock.

In general you want big toolbox for first overall skill because not all skills will translate in nba.
Jabari Smith selling point is defense ( overrated college gimmicky defense behind best shotblocker in college last 20 years) and shooting.

Chet's selling point is basically everything but weight.

Even if Chet had a functional human body to compete with 300 other physical freaks of nature, his game is no more complete than Jabari's. Chet is a fantastic instinctual shot blocker but he can't move his feet or switch on the perimeter like Jabari. Calling Chet a ball handler is like the people calling Barnes the next Magic Johnson last summer-good handle for a big guy, but more sideshow than truly an effective NBA "handle". Paolo also has some tremendous traits and weaknesses...For me, I'm skipping the guy with the great likelihood of being shown to be physically overmatched and ineffective against NBA athletes-that's clearly Chet. He may be the best player in the draft, but I can't stand another Bamba situation where an "amazing shot blocker" gets bounced out of the painted area and ends up listlessly roaming the perimeter or another Isaac story where we cheer signs of greatness between injuries. Just my take...I'll take (debatably) slightly less upside over so much greater likelihood of contributing early and for a long time. Personally, I don't think anyone has greater upside than Jabari due to his shooting, but even if I didn't believe that, I just can't bet on Chet not getting brutalized by opposing players a foot shorter.

Chet's left nut has more BBIQ than Bamba will ever grasp. Also their motor is polar opposite. One is letargic slob, other is high edge competitior that gets feisty even at practices but people don't see it because of his frame.

Whole body/frame talk to me is silly at this stage. NBA's drug testing is such a stupid thing that you can bet almost everything that majority of players who are willing to do so, are on HGH at least over summer to heal. I have friend who at age of 19 went with steroid compounds from 176 pounds on 6'8 body to 235 pounds over 5 months on some underground shady stuff. Am I advertisting PEDs? No. But fitness has been part of my life for 15 years so i'm not fool and idiot and some nba examples are so damn obvious steroid takes. From Howard to Giannis and other "freaks". Fitness industry in general is the shadiest industry out there. Scams , fake natties, untracable new compounds, sarms being sold and advertised on tik tok, kids taking trenbolon, 23 years old kid on prescription TRT ( let's not even get into TRT and US regulation of it, you crush your natural testosteron, get tested, get presciption from doctor to take TRT, he says one dosage, you do it double and you have , legally , 3 times more free flowing testosterone than anybody normal, but it's legal , because doctor said so).





Eating isn't rocket science. Gaining muscles while in caloric surplus isn't rocket science. Adding something that isn't even illegal like slow diagestic protein, creatine & mass gainers isn't rocket science. What, however ,is rocket science, is basketball skill & insticts, ones that Holmgren has more than anybody else in this draft.

[basketballRob]

I think I heard Chet only had like 12 shots in isolation. Pretty sure he only had around 14 jump shots in the halfcourt. The far majority of his baskets came in transition and that just won't happen in the NBA. Almost all of his driving to the basket highlights were in transition.

I heard another person say that only really good players have ever averaged 2 blks. 2 assists in the NBA were all really good players. I don't think it's a given that Chet ever has 2 BPG in the NBA. Bamba averaged the exact same amount of blocks and steals as Chet per 100 possessions and he played against tougher competition. Mo has never averaged 2 blocks. He also had nearly 40 lbs on Chet when drafted and people here were saying he can't play a whole season or his legs will break.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

[MartinsIzAfraud]

He shot 32% from mid range in nba. That's worst than Aaron Gordon

I wouldn't put much stock in it, but every time he made jabstep mid range it was all over news. BUT nobody wanted to say how ineffective that shot for him was.

It's not Jabari doesn't have mid range, it's fact that he thinks he is Aldrige/ Durant from that range and settles for some of the worst shots i've seen since Cole Anthony college days.

Don't cry in couple of years how Chet is jack of all tools and two way game changer while your favorite team drafted glorified 3 and D guy on ridicilous usage to justfy draft stock.

In general you want big toolbox for first overall skill because not all skills will translate in nba.
Jabari Smith selling point is defense ( overrated college gimmicky defense behind best shotblocker in college last 20 years) and shooting.

Chet's selling point is basically everything but weight.

Even if Chet had a functional human body to compete with 300 other physical freaks of nature, his game is no more complete than Jabari's. Chet is a fantastic instinctual shot blocker but he can't move his feet or switch on the perimeter like Jabari. Calling Chet a ball handler is like the people calling Barnes the next Magic Johnson last summer-good handle for a big guy, but more sideshow than truly an effective NBA "handle". Paolo also has some tremendous traits and weaknesses...For me, I'm skipping the guy with the great likelihood of being shown to be physically overmatched and ineffective against NBA athletes-that's clearly Chet. He may be the best player in the draft, but I can't stand another Bamba situation where an "amazing shot blocker" gets bounced out of the painted area and ends up listlessly roaming the perimeter or another Isaac story where we cheer signs of greatness between injuries. Just my take...I'll take (debatably) slightly less upside over so much greater likelihood of contributing early and for a long time. Personally, I don't think anyone has greater upside than Jabari due to his shooting, but even if I didn't believe that, I just can't bet on Chet not getting brutalized by opposing players a foot shorter.

Chet's left nut has more BBIQ than Bamba will ever grasp. Also their motor is polar opposite. One is letargic slob, other is high edge competitior that gets feisty even at practices but people don't see it because of his frame.

Whole body/frame talk to me is silly at this stage. NBA's drug testing is such a stupid thing that you can bet almost everything that majority of players who are willing to do so, are on HGH at least over summer to heal. I have friend who at age of 19 went with steroid compounds from 176 pounds on 6'8 body to 235 pounds over 5 months on some underground shady stuff. Am I advertisting PEDs? No. But fitness has been part of my life for 15 years so i'm not fool and idiot and some nba examples are so damn obvious steroid takes. From Howard to Giannis and other "freaks". Fitness industry in general is the shadiest industry out there. Scams , fake natties, untracable new compounds, sarms being sold and advertised on tik tok, kids taking trenbolon, 23 years old kid on prescription TRT ( let's not even get into TRT and US regulation of it, you crush your natural testosteron, get tested, get presciption from doctor to take TRT, he says one dosage, you do it double and you have , legally , 3 times more free flowing testosterone than anybody normal, but it's legal , because doctor said so).

The frame part isn't silly, how many times have we seen this "unicorn" player who just needs to add weight and keep it. It's why in every review you read of Chet his biggest issue is strength/adding & keeping the needed weight..

On top of that dude look at Chet seriously and tell me that he can gain & KEEP 20-30lbs and still move the way he does. There's more chance of me winning the lotto vs. that happening. If anything he'll likely gain the weight and slow down even more, so playing him on the perimeter will be ever more of an issue and then we've got what a bit better Isaac? On top of that what from this FO & medical staff & strength department has shown you we're capable of developing a player in terms of strength/bulk.

The way I look at it seems like Chet & Jabari are 1a 1b and if I'm a GM whose got to show something over the next 2-3 years I'm taking the more NBA ready body who might have a smaller ceiling but his starting floor is much higher.

[MAGICian619]

Chet’s red flag isn’t only the weight, just the biggest one by far.

I know tiderulz has posted the stats a few times but his pedestrian games against any ranked team/team with a normal sized center were concerning. He’s not ancient of course but a little older than the other top guys. Not much of a half court offensive threat yet other than being a great finisher.

[img][img]https://i.ibb.co/SmbQjMw/Advanced-Stats.png[/img][/img]

Do we want the best player in this draft or not? Chet impacts the game more in every way when compared to Jabari.

Impacts the game** in every way, agreed.


**so long as games are against WCC competition.

I’d be fine with any of the top 3 fwiw. Prefer Jabari by a hair. They all have their glaring flaws.

This argument is probably worse than the Chet is too skinny argument.

Strength of Schedule last season:

Gonzaga: 18
Duke: 22
Auburn: 31

https://www.teamrankings.com/ncaa-basketball/ranking/schedule-strength-by-other

Since when did the SEC "we da best" argument carry over to basketball? This is not college football. Good ball players go all over. You can have the opinion that the WCC is weaker than the SEC, but at the end of the day, Gonzaga had the toughest strength of schedule when compared to Duke and Auburn.

[MAGICian619]

When there are 2 guys so close and every reason listed to not take Jabari is a basketball reason and every reason listed not to take Chet is a non basketball reason.

It's like you guys are trying to talk yourself into not taking the best player.

[MartinsIzAfraud]

[img][img]https://i.ibb.co/SmbQjMw/Advanced-Stats.png[/img][/img]

Do we want the best player in this draft or not? Chet impacts the game more in every way when compared to Jabari.

Impacts the game** in every way, agreed.


**so long as games are against WCC competition.

I’d be fine with any of the top 3 fwiw. Prefer Jabari by a hair. They all have their glaring flaws.

This argument is probably worse than the Chet is too skinny argument.

Strength of Schedule last season:

Gonzaga: 18
Duke: 22
Auburn: 31

https://www.teamrankings.com/ncaa-basketball/ranking/schedule-strength-by-other

Since when did the SEC "we da best" argument carry over to basketball? This is not college football. Good ball players go all over. You can have the opinion that the WCC is weaker than the SEC, but at the end of the day, Gonzaga had the toughest strength of schedule when compared to Duke and Auburn.

his production vs P5 conferences is pretty scary if you ask me. It's less a strength of schedule thing and P5 conferences have a lot more bigger better athletic dudes who can play vs WCC conference teams who might have 2. His game stats have been posted 10000 times as well if you want to look them up.

[MAGICian619]

Impacts the game** in every way, agreed.


**so long as games are against WCC competition.

I’d be fine with any of the top 3 fwiw. Prefer Jabari by a hair. They all have their glaring flaws.

This argument is probably worse than the Chet is too skinny argument.

Strength of Schedule last season:

Gonzaga: 18
Duke: 22
Auburn: 31

https://www.teamrankings.com/ncaa-basketball/ranking/schedule-strength-by-other

Since when did the SEC "we da best" argument carry over to basketball? This is not college football. Good ball players go all over. You can have the opinion that the WCC is weaker than the SEC, but at the end of the day, Gonzaga had the toughest strength of schedule when compared to Duke and Auburn.

his production vs P5 conferences is pretty scary if you ask me. It's less a strength of schedule thing and P5 conferences have a lot more bigger better athletic dudes who can play vs WCC conference teams who might have 2. His game stats have been posted 10000 times as well if you want to look them up.

You do realize the P5 term was made up like 3-4 years ago right? And literally was only used in football and now for some reason its creeping into basketball.

[Skin]

the questions are there though. can he improve his handle? can he develop a post game? can he develop a midrange game? is his defense solid without the best shot blocker behind him?

Your first two questions are valid. The last two, not so much. His midrange game is fine today.... sans the improved handle. And his defense was very good even when Kessler was not in the game. I'm not worried one bit about his defense. He may not be top-tier elite on defense but that definitely isn't what this team is lacking.

I completely agree with your response...the midrange concern is baseless, IMO. Might be among his strongest spots. His defense is superb, every large person doesn't have to be a shot-blocking specialist-especially as he'll play more perimeter D. If Isaac is healthy, they could form a fearsome defensive duo - Wagner and WCJ make for a potent frontline rotation, IMO. I'd love to upgrade our backup center spot (maybe even move up for Kessler?) and let Bamba go - or, just keep Bamba on a team-friendly deal and hope he accepts the bench role and contributes at least as well as he did this past season.

Jabari is an easy choice for me...the future of our backcourt is a bigger concern, 3 decent prospects who need the ball-somethings gotta give. Hopefully, a significant trade for a legit SG or, at least, keep Gary Harris and take draft swings at possible replacements.

Everyone 100% healthy. Last minutes of the game with the game on the line, who is your starting 5 and at what positions?

[MartinsIzAfraud]

This argument is probably worse than the Chet is too skinny argument.

Strength of Schedule last season:

Gonzaga: 18
Duke: 22
Auburn: 31

https://www.teamrankings.com/ncaa-basketball/ranking/schedule-strength-by-other

Since when did the SEC "we da best" argument carry over to basketball? This is not college football. Good ball players go all over. You can have the opinion that the WCC is weaker than the SEC, but at the end of the day, Gonzaga had the toughest strength of schedule when compared to Duke and Auburn.

his production vs P5 conferences is pretty scary if you ask me. It's less a strength of schedule thing and P5 conferences have a lot more bigger better athletic dudes who can play vs WCC conference teams who might have 2. His game stats have been posted 10000 times as well if you want to look them up.

You do realize the P5 term was made up like 3-4 years ago right? And literally was only used in football and now for some reason its creeping into basketball.

Point still stands that the WCC as a whole isn't anywhere near the level of competition as the bigger well known conferences. There's a lot of reasons for that, money obviously is the biggest reason.