Our guards stink

[The-Stallion70]

Our issue with this Magic team is and has always been a lack of production and efficiency from our guards, except for maybe Cole.

Black just posted 8 points and 2 assists in 33 minutes. We need more production than that from the starting lead guard.

Suggs is now shooting 36% overall and 25% from 3. He doesn't appear to have made progress as an offensive player and if he has then it is too little progression for a third year player.

Ingles is averaging 2 points in 18 minutes, that's not enough production to convince me Mose shouldn't Jett out there to see if he can give us a lift.

Our front line needs help. Paolo can't do it all, Wendell already got hurt in five games.

If you're wondering why Markelle starts its because he is still the best overall two way guard on the team and because Cole's offensive mindset isn't the best fit next to Paolo and Franz.

[Bergmaniac]

Ingles is not a guard.

Cole has by far the worst on/off rating currently of all players on the team this season, he's been scoring very well but defensively he's been bad and his playmaking has been quite poor.

[Knightro]

Our issue with this Magic team is and has always been a lack of production and efficiency from our guards, except for maybe Cole.

Black just posted 8 points and 2 assists in 33 minutes. We need more production than that from the starting lead guard.

Suggs is now shooting 36% overall and 25% from 3. He doesn't appear to have made progress as an offensive player and if he has then it is too little progression for a third year player.

Ingles is averaging 2 points in 18 minutes, that's not enough production to convince me Mose shouldn't Jett out there to see if he can give us a lift.

Our front line needs help. Paolo can't do it all, Wendell already got hurt in five games.

If you're wondering why Markelle starts its because he is still the best overall two way guard on the team and because Cole's offensive mindset isn't the best fit next to Paolo and Franz.

Right now... the Magic don't have a good starting guard on their roster.

Fultz is a "starter" but a well below average one.

Cole is good as a 6th man. Bad as a starter.

Suggs is probably best served as a 20-25 MPG chaos agent off the bench since he is a poor dribbler and shooter.

Black doesn't do enough right now with the ball in his hands to be a good starting PG right now and isn't a good enough shooter (flukish hot start aside) to be a good starting SG right now. Maybe that changes down the road, but he's just not there right now.

They need to go out and get a star guard and have the pieces to do so.

[The-Stallion70]

Ingles is not a guard.

Cole has by far the worst on/off rating currently of all players on the team this season, he's been scoring very well but defensively he's been bad and his playmaking has been quite poor.

Coles on/off rating is obviously bad because he plays in the second unit.

Are you ignoring every other stat he's contributing except for on/off rating?

[Bergmaniac]

Ingles is not a guard.

Cole has by far the worst on/off rating currently of all players on the team this season, he's been scoring very well but defensively he's been bad and his playmaking has been quite poor.

Coles on/off rating is obviously bad because he plays in the second unit.

Are you ignoring every other stat he's contributing except for on/off rating?

I already said he's been scoring very well. What other stats are there in his favour? He rebounds very well for a point guard his size, but this doesn't move the needle all that much

And no, it's not obvious that his on/off rating is bad because he plays with the second unit. He's played over 60% of his minutes together with Franz, almost 50% together with Paolo, a decent chunk of time together with both of them and the results have been pretty bad.

[MartinsIzAfraud]

Our issue with this Magic team is and has always been a lack of production and efficiency from our guards, except for maybe Cole.

Black just posted 8 points and 2 assists in 33 minutes. We need more production than that from the starting lead guard.

Suggs is now shooting 36% overall and 25% from 3. He doesn't appear to have made progress as an offensive player and if he has then it is too little progression for a third year player.

Ingles is averaging 2 points in 18 minutes, that's not enough production to convince me Mose shouldn't Jett out there to see if he can give us a lift.

Our front line needs help. Paolo can't do it all, Wendell already got hurt in five games.

If you're wondering why Markelle starts its because he is still the best overall two way guard on the team and because Cole's offensive mindset isn't the best fit next to Paolo and Franz.

Right now... the Magic don't have a good starting guard on their roster.

Fultz is a "starter" but a well below average one.

Cole is good as a 6th man. Bad as a starter.

Suggs is probably best served as a 20-25 MPG chaos agent off the bench since he is a poor dribbler and shooter.

Black doesn't do enough right now with the ball in his hands to be a good starting PG right now and isn't a good enough shooter (flukish hot start aside) to be a good starting SG right now. Maybe that changes down the road, but he's just not there right now.

They need to go out and get a star guard and have the pieces to do so.

this is my hope that someone asks out, however, I really doubt our FO would make the big push. Hope to be wrong because it's tough watching us most nights.

[eyriq]

Black is a rookie and is playing extremely well in his opportunities. He should be exempt from this critique.

That said, the thesis is sound. The solution is to develop Black, Jett, and Suggs. The timeline allows this, as Franz and Paolo are developing into reliable 1st options.

[Ralof]

Here we go with someone else to blame.

At least Is not only on Markelle anymore

[VFX]

Again, everyone is talking about two different issues. There are different tasks between guards. To boil it all down to "the guards suck" is dumb. Anyone that has been watching this season knows the back court has been responsible for Orlando having the #2-3 defense in the league.

First off, the Magic aren't getting rid of guys on rookie deals especially Black and Suggs. So you can cry about it all you want, but it isn't happening.

1) Jalen has value even if it is off the bench or in situational lineups. For as much as people bitch about his shooting and turnovers, he creates more opportunities and possessions than he loses. Yeah, he needs to get better at shooting but at least he takes them. If he was a ++ shooter he would be an all-star level player. Pick your battles I guess.

2) Black is a rookie and looks insurmountably better than a lot of other rookies in similar situations. He didn't look good in a lineup with Cole. He's a point guard and I hope Mosely realizes this. He loses value guarding wings. He's hit more corner 3's than Fultz will in a season.

3) Cole is good off the bench and not as a starter. He is streaky offensively, which happens to be the only area he is needed in when he's not getting the occasional rebound. He makes lineups difficult to configure. Why? Because Black and Fultz don't look good when he's running the show or doing a miniature shooting guard impression. Only Suggs or Gary make sense in those lineups by creating off-ball movement that matters.

4) Gary is a similar situation. He's basically a more fluid TRoss with better defense. He shows up once every few games. I don't expect him to be here next season IF Howard can develop at all. He's only valuable because Orlando lacks floor spacing, whether hes "on" or not.

5) I'm not going to get into Fultz. He is what he is and he isn't available. He doesn't solve floor spacing and basically provides semi-consistent jumpers to alleviate lacking offense. Thats not good enough for a starter looking for an extension.

Orlando got out gunned by the best offensive backcourt in the league matching up with Cole and Black for nearly an entire half of basketball. Absolutely shocking, big deal.

If you actually care about "fixing" the guard situation, then you should be praying the FO is fielding offers for Fultz for a placeholder vet that can run a pick and roll offense with Paolo and take more than one 3 a game to space the floor. A majority of people don't like this suggestion for obvious reasons. Sorry, its the most logical.

[bigdogdylan5]

Our issue with this Magic team is and has always been a lack of production and efficiency from our guards, except for maybe Cole.

Black just posted 8 points and 2 assists in 33 minutes. We need more production than that from the starting lead guard.

Suggs is now shooting 36% overall and 25% from 3. He doesn't appear to have made progress as an offensive player and if he has then it is too little progression for a third year player.

Ingles is averaging 2 points in 18 minutes, that's not enough production to convince me Mose shouldn't Jett out there to see if he can give us a lift.

Our front line needs help. Paolo can't do it all, Wendell already got hurt in five games.

If you're wondering why Markelle starts its because he is still the best overall two way guard on the team and because Cole's offensive mindset isn't the best fit next to Paolo and Franz.

Right now... the Magic don't have a good starting guard on their roster.

Fultz is a "starter" but a well below average one.

Cole is good as a 6th man. Bad as a starter.

Suggs is probably best served as a 20-25 MPG chaos agent off the bench since he is a poor dribbler and shooter.

Black doesn't do enough right now with the ball in his hands to be a good starting PG right now and isn't a good enough shooter (flukish hot start aside) to be a good starting SG right now. Maybe that changes down the road, but he's just not there right now.

They need to go out and get a star guard and have the pieces to do so.

Ok who is that star?

[Residual-Heat]

Suggs needs to learn to calm the **** down on offense.

Cole has been fine for what we should expect from him at 13 mill/yr.

Black is 19 years old.

Harris is unreliable and frankly his defense is extremely inconsistent.

Fultz is expiring and just not a starter for this team.

Fultz and Harris need to go. Combine them with pick(s) and get a good PG/combo guard.

[eyriq]

The front office knew our backcourt sucked and invested two lottery picks into improving it. That's your answer, honestly.

[MasterGMer]

Should we start another discussion about Markelle Fultz?

He had flashes this season especially at Los Angeles when we played Lakers. He was a contributor in the 4th Q. But he still hasn't made a 3 yet this season.

Also AB is a rookie and he played immensely better than Fultz in his limited minutes both shooting and defense. Plus AB is on rookie contract which means in the next couple years he is cheap.

But Fultz? How much $$ is he going to demand from Magic next offseason? If we don't resign Fultz and Harris, we could have nearly 60M in cap space next summer. Is it writing on the wall that Fultz is letting go after this season? (He probably could demand a 20M per year contract)

Also if we indeed have that cap space next summer, I am looking at James Harden and Cam Thomas. Maybe Siakam also

But it all starts with this season! Go Magic!

[eyriq]

Should we start another discussion about Markelle Fultz?

He had flashes this season especially at Los Angeles when we played Lakers. He was a contributor in the 4th Q. But he still hasn't made a 3 yet this season.

Also AB is a rookie and he played immensely better than Fultz in his limited minutes both shooting and defense. Plus AB is on rookie contract which means in the next couple years he is cheap.

But Fultz? How much $$ is he going to demand from Magic next offseason? If we don't resign Fultz and Harris, we could have nearly 60M in cap space next summer. Is it writing on the wall that Fultz is letting go after this season? (He probably could demand a 20M per year contract)

Also if we indeed have that cap space next summer, I am looking at James Harden and Cam Thomas. Maybe Siakam also

But it all starts with this season! Go Magic!

I'm seeing a vision with Siakam in it for sure.

[MasterGMer]

Should we start another discussion about Markelle Fultz?

He had flashes this season especially at Los Angeles when we played Lakers. He was a contributor in the 4th Q. But he still hasn't made a 3 yet this season.

Also AB is a rookie and he played immensely better than Fultz in his limited minutes both shooting and defense. Plus AB is on rookie contract which means in the next couple years he is cheap.

But Fultz? How much $$ is he going to demand from Magic next offseason? If we don't resign Fultz and Harris, we could have nearly 60M in cap space next summer. Is it writing on the wall that Fultz is letting go after this season? (He probably could demand a 20M per year contract)

Also if we indeed have that cap space next summer, I am looking at James Harden and Cam Thomas. Maybe Siakam also

But it all starts with this season! Go Magic!

I'm seeing a vision with Siakam in it for sure.

I am seeing it too. He could be an upgrade over Jonathan Isaac especially on the offensive end. (But man, I like JI and JI's defense is better). But Siakam is 29 years old and he has been struggling shooting the ball so far this season.

If we spend a load of $$ on him, that means we are competing for a ring right away. Are we ready for that? Plus whose minutes are we going to take off from current rotation? Paolo is PF and JI is PF plus Wendell, Moe and Goga are Cs. No way he is coming to this team to be a back up because Siakam is in his prime.

Lots of moving parts. But if he is interested and available, I'd throw in some cash for him, because he is an upgrade and he could help this team a lot

The question at the end we should be asking is Is Siakam a good fit?

[bigdogdylan5]

Should we start another discussion about Markelle Fultz?

He had flashes this season especially at Los Angeles when we played Lakers. He was a contributor in the 4th Q. But he still hasn't made a 3 yet this season.

Also AB is a rookie and he played immensely better than Fultz in his limited minutes both shooting and defense. Plus AB is on rookie contract which means in the next couple years he is cheap.

But Fultz? How much $$ is he going to demand from Magic next offseason? If we don't resign Fultz and Harris, we could have nearly 60M in cap space next summer. Is it writing on the wall that Fultz is letting go after this season? (He probably could demand a 20M per year contract)

Also if we indeed have that cap space next summer, I am looking at James Harden and Cam Thomas. Maybe Siakam also

But it all starts with this season! Go Magic!

Fultz time in Orlando is at an end. Black looking competent so quickly with better size and defense with a better shot. Black is just not ready to run an offense just like every 19-20 year old PG lol. Fultz serves this purpose this year of being a bridge to Black. Suggs has to shoot better if he does he will have a chance to keep going if he doesn’t I expect them to get a SG who can shoot.

I don’t know where Howard fits in to this… I think he is getting the JJ treatment where he needs to be at least a decent defender before they give him minutes. Mosley is coaching for his job and the rookies have to earn his trust. Black has now Jett will have to. I guarentee if the shooting stays this piss poor Jett will get playing time.

[SloNick Russia]

With Fultz in the lineup we had below 14 TO/game as a team, about NBA average, in 3 games he missed we went over 17 TO/game, which is dead last in the NBA.

Sent from my SM-G9750 using RealGM mobile app

[Ralof]

With Fultz in the lineup we had below 14 TO/game as a team, about NBA average, in 3 games he missed we went over 17 TO/game, which is dead last in the NBA.

Aside from Fultz and the endless polemic about him on this board,the only priority this team should have is a good point guard with ball handling who does know nba game and take good decisions on the floor.

best example comes to my mind,is Chris Paul in 2019-2020 at thunder.

also,ricky rubio before his body(and so is game)declined too much

[RichCollab]

Fultz starts 100% when he is back.

[eyriq]

Fultz starts 100% when he is back.

Probably, but now that I've tasted Black in the SL I'm hooked.