AB vs Suggs development comparison

[Skybox]

ORL sends: Isaac, WCJ, KCP, #25
POR sends: Simons, Ayton

Why POR: 3 really useful vets and a frp for two guys that aren’t in future team vision.

*If Mose can get through to Ayton defensively, he’s as physically imposing as any big man in the league. He doesn’t have to be great, but he could be more than good enough pretty easily with some effort…I think this is the kind of project that Mosely is built for. Mosley’s whole rep as an assistant was “connects with and relates to players” “in-shape enough to work with them personally” and “defense”…those traits were really highlighted in the book I’m reading (about Luka) called “The Wonderboy”…he’s clearly not an X&O guy - maybe this is where he shines?

Ayton is a large expiring…at worst. The deal is worthy of consideration just for that…but could be MUCH more if he and Simons accept more limited but elite roles and are receptive to long-term, lower salary extensions.

[ORLMagicGirl15]

Where does the AB and Suggs comparison come to play? I just see a trade request for Portland’s Simon and Ayton for JI, KCP, and WCJ.

[eyriq]

Where does the AB and Suggs comparison come to play? I just see a trade request for Portland’s Simon and Ayton for JI, KCP, and WCJ.

He's being cheeky. AB vs Suggs convos took place in the trade thread so obviously trade ideas should take place in the AB vs Suggs thread.

[MartinsIzAfraud]

ORL sends: Isaac, WCJ, KCP, #25
POR sends: Simons, Ayton

Why POR: 3 really useful vets and a frp for two guys that aren’t in future team vision.

*If Mose can get through to Ayton defensively, he’s as physically imposing as any big man in the league. He doesn’t have to be great, but he could be more than good enough pretty easily with some effort…I think this is the kind of project that Mosely is built for. Mosley’s whole rep as an assistant was “connects with and relates to players” “in-shape enough to work with them personally” and “defense”…those traits were really highlighted in the book I’m reading (about Luka) called “The Wonderboy”…he’s clearly not an X&O guy - maybe this is where he shines?

Ayton is a large expiring…at worst. The deal is worthy of consideration just for that…but could be MUCH more if he and Simons accept more limited but elite roles and are receptive to long-term, lower salary extensions.

Not sure you can take this gamble… it would be 2 steps forward with the guard spot and 1 step back at the C spot. Ayton really has that Mo Bamba lack of care when it comes to basketball.

What’s your reasoning for including Isaac and WCJ? Just salary match?

[eyriq]

ORL sends: Isaac, WCJ, KCP, #25
POR sends: Simons, Ayton

Why POR: 3 really useful vets and a frp for two guys that aren’t in future team vision.

*If Mose can get through to Ayton defensively, he’s as physically imposing as any big man in the league. He doesn’t have to be great, but he could be more than good enough pretty easily with some effort…I think this is the kind of project that Mosely is built for. Mosley’s whole rep as an assistant was “connects with and relates to players” “in-shape enough to work with them personally” and “defense”…those traits were really highlighted in the book I’m reading (about Luka) called “The Wonderboy”…he’s clearly not an X&O guy - maybe this is where he shines?

Ayton is a large expiring…at worst. The deal is worthy of consideration just for that…but could be MUCH more if he and Simons accept more limited but elite roles and are receptive to long-term, lower salary extensions.

You missed an opportunity for a Suggs AND AB trade lol

This trade is fascinating. We clear out a lot of long-term money, providing the flexibility needed to re-sign Simons without choking the life out of our lower salary slots.

[Skybox]

ORL sends: Isaac, WCJ, KCP, #25
POR sends: Simons, Ayton

Why POR: 3 really useful vets and a frp for two guys that aren’t in future team vision.

*If Mose can get through to Ayton defensively, he’s as physically imposing as any big man in the league. He doesn’t have to be great, but he could be more than good enough pretty easily with some effort…I think this is the kind of project that Mosely is built for. Mosley’s whole rep as an assistant was “connects with and relates to players” “in-shape enough to work with them personally” and “defense”…those traits were really highlighted in the book I’m reading (about Luka) called “The Wonderboy”…he’s clearly not an X&O guy - maybe this is where he shines?

Ayton is a large expiring…at worst. The deal is worthy of consideration just for that…but could be MUCH more if he and Simons accept more limited but elite roles and are receptive to long-term, lower salary extensions.

Not sure you can take this gamble… it would be 2 steps forward with the guard spot and 1 step back at the C spot. Ayton really has that Mo Bamba lack of care when it comes to basketball.

What’s your reasoning for including Isaac and WCJ? Just salary match?

Very little commitment on ORL's part...in fact, we get the guy we need (Simons) and unload good players that can be (somewhat) replaced for less salary. Eyriq pointed out that Ayton is expiring...of course, any trade that doesn't include AB is OK with him . KCP is just a money match and, sadly, a dump...he's actually very good player and, despite a lot of other trade suggestions, POR has to have some interest in the players coming back unless they're just expiring fodder for a pick...and, truthfully, ORL can't affort to just re-up guys to salary match and give away all of our expirings and be left with a massive payroll. So, it hurts to move off 3 good players, but that's a LOT of guaranteed money going out.

I LOVE WCJ as a mentor, backup, and PF to Clingan (who is the Center of the present and future in POR)
I LOVE KCP as a mentor, defender and occasional SF with Scoot, Sharpe, and Avidja - that's a strong group getting stronger
I LOVE slimmed-down Isaac on any team - especially ORL...but you've got to give some value to get
Notice that the pick is #25, that's in light of the fact that we're providing 3 serious rotation players, not just junk filler

Ayton's still very young (and expiring)...as I said, we sure didn't hire Mosely for his X's & O's...low-commitment, huge upside, incredible giant of a player.

The trade could get our finances on point at the same time giving ORL a good long look at a tremendous prospect...one that would rival Flagg if he was still coming out of U of Arizona. Worth a look at least.

[MartinsIzAfraud]

ORL sends: Isaac, WCJ, KCP, #25
POR sends: Simons, Ayton

Why POR: 3 really useful vets and a frp for two guys that aren’t in future team vision.

*If Mose can get through to Ayton defensively, he’s as physically imposing as any big man in the league. He doesn’t have to be great, but he could be more than good enough pretty easily with some effort…I think this is the kind of project that Mosely is built for. Mosley’s whole rep as an assistant was “connects with and relates to players” “in-shape enough to work with them personally” and “defense”…those traits were really highlighted in the book I’m reading (about Luka) called “The Wonderboy”…he’s clearly not an X&O guy - maybe this is where he shines?

Ayton is a large expiring…at worst. The deal is worthy of consideration just for that…but could be MUCH more if he and Simons accept more limited but elite roles and are receptive to long-term, lower salary extensions.

Not sure you can take this gamble… it would be 2 steps forward with the guard spot and 1 step back at the C spot. Ayton really has that Mo Bamba lack of care when it comes to basketball.

What’s your reasoning for including Isaac and WCJ? Just salary match?

Very little commitment on ORL's part...in fact, we get the guy we need (Simons) and unload good players that can be (somewhat) replaced for less salary. Eyriq pointed out that Ayton is expiring...of course, any trade that doesn't include AB is OK with him . KCP is just a money match and, sadly, a dump...he's actually very good player and, despite a lot of other trade suggestions, POR has to have some interest in the players coming back unless they're just expiring fodder for a pick...and, truthfully, ORL can't affort to just re-up guys to salary match and give away all of our expirings and be left with a massive payroll. So, it hurts to move off 3 good players, but that's a LOT of guaranteed money going out.

I LOVE WCJ as a mentor, backup, and PF to Clingan (who is the Center of the present and future in POR)
I LOVE KCP as a mentor, defender and occasional SF with Scoot, Sharpe, and Avidja - that's a strong group getting stronger
I LOVE slimmed-down Isaac on any team - especially ORL...but you've got to give some value to get
Notice that the pick is #25, that's in light of the fact that we're providing 3 serious rotation players, not just junk filler

Ayton's still very young (and expiring)...as I said, we sure didn't hire Mosely for his X's & O's...low-commitment, huge upside, incredible giant of a player.

The trade could get our finances on point at the same time giving ORL a good long look at a tremendous prospect...one that would rival Flagg if he was still coming out of U of Arizona. Worth a look at least.

Yeah can see this for sure but I’m not positive the FO would just dump WCJ/KCP. I’d honestly rather slim this offer down and go:
Isaac, Gary, & Jett for Simmons. If they absolutely want a 1st if throw in 25 but not 16.

They get a defensive guy in Isaac who can cover for the guards. Jett is a throw in young guy who can possibly get it going on a team not really competing. 25 is to take on Isaac salary and then Gary just a dump.

[Skybox]

Not sure you can take this gamble… it would be 2 steps forward with the guard spot and 1 step back at the C spot. Ayton really has that Mo Bamba lack of care when it comes to basketball.

What’s your reasoning for including Isaac and WCJ? Just salary match?

Very little commitment on ORL's part...in fact, we get the guy we need (Simons) and unload good players that can be (somewhat) replaced for less salary. Eyriq pointed out that Ayton is expiring...of course, any trade that doesn't include AB is OK with him . KCP is just a money match and, sadly, a dump...he's actually very good player and, despite a lot of other trade suggestions, POR has to have some interest in the players coming back unless they're just expiring fodder for a pick...and, truthfully, ORL can't affort to just re-up guys to salary match and give away all of our expirings and be left with a massive payroll. So, it hurts to move off 3 good players, but that's a LOT of guaranteed money going out.

I LOVE WCJ as a mentor, backup, and PF to Clingan (who is the Center of the present and future in POR)
I LOVE KCP as a mentor, defender and occasional SF with Scoot, Sharpe, and Avidja - that's a strong group getting stronger
I LOVE slimmed-down Isaac on any team - especially ORL...but you've got to give some value to get
Notice that the pick is #25, that's in light of the fact that we're providing 3 serious rotation players, not just junk filler

Ayton's still very young (and expiring)...as I said, we sure didn't hire Mosely for his X's & O's...low-commitment, huge upside, incredible giant of a player.

The trade could get our finances on point at the same time giving ORL a good long look at a tremendous prospect...one that would rival Flagg if he was still coming out of U of Arizona. Worth a look at least.

Yeah can see this for sure but I’m not positive the FO would just dump WCJ/KCP. I’d honestly rather slim this offer down and go:
Isaac, Gary, & Jett for Simmons. If they absolutely want a 1st if throw in 25 but not 16.

They get a defensive guy in Isaac who can cover for the guards. Jett is a throw in young guy who can possibly get it going on a team not really competing. 25 is to take on Isaac salary and then Gary just a dump.

that may be more likely...but Gary isn't even a dump, he's already a TO and Jett is an expiring (at worst)...doesn't save us a lot. All things being equal, I'd like to keep Isaac...I think yours requires #16 and, quite possibly, POR has no interest in mine...we'll know when it's done I guess.

[MartinsIzAfraud]

Very little commitment on ORL's part...in fact, we get the guy we need (Simons) and unload good players that can be (somewhat) replaced for less salary. Eyriq pointed out that Ayton is expiring...of course, any trade that doesn't include AB is OK with him . KCP is just a money match and, sadly, a dump...he's actually very good player and, despite a lot of other trade suggestions, POR has to have some interest in the players coming back unless they're just expiring fodder for a pick...and, truthfully, ORL can't affort to just re-up guys to salary match and give away all of our expirings and be left with a massive payroll. So, it hurts to move off 3 good players, but that's a LOT of guaranteed money going out.

I LOVE WCJ as a mentor, backup, and PF to Clingan (who is the Center of the present and future in POR)
I LOVE KCP as a mentor, defender and occasional SF with Scoot, Sharpe, and Avidja - that's a strong group getting stronger
I LOVE slimmed-down Isaac on any team - especially ORL...but you've got to give some value to get
Notice that the pick is #25, that's in light of the fact that we're providing 3 serious rotation players, not just junk filler

Ayton's still very young (and expiring)...as I said, we sure didn't hire Mosely for his X's & O's...low-commitment, huge upside, incredible giant of a player.

The trade could get our finances on point at the same time giving ORL a good long look at a tremendous prospect...one that would rival Flagg if he was still coming out of U of Arizona. Worth a look at least.

Yeah can see this for sure but I’m not positive the FO would just dump WCJ/KCP. I’d honestly rather slim this offer down and go:
Isaac, Gary, & Jett for Simmons. If they absolutely want a 1st if throw in 25 but not 16.

They get a defensive guy in Isaac who can cover for the guards. Jett is a throw in young guy who can possibly get it going on a team not really competing. 25 is to take on Isaac salary and then Gary just a dump.

that may be more likely...but Gary isn't even a dump, he's already a TO and Jett is an expiring (at worst)...doesn't save us a lot. All things being equal, I'd like to keep Isaac...I think yours requires #16 and, quite possibly, POR has no interest in mine...we'll know when it's done I guess.

i'm done with isaac dude can't play more than 3-5 minutes a stretch and provides nothing offensively. 51% TS and 47.4 EFG for a team that needs help doesn't cut it. Go let him be someone else's problem and let that team break him down vs wasting what little cap space we have to maneuver. Feel like Portland wouldn't mind Jett as an off ball type guy but hes JAG again.

Feel like if a deal with Portland gets done it's either Isaac or KCP outgoing with others. KCP doesn't really make sense for Portland unless they want to chase for a play in spot.

[Idiosyncratic]

Not sure Portland is going to want to take back much salary as they are about to get new ownership.

Apparently there has been some smoke around the Blazers re-signing Simons, but Blazers fans seem relieved that maybe that won't happen now with the impending sale. Maybe they want to keep books clear for new ownership? Not sure if there is historical precedent for this or not.

[MartinsIzAfraud]

Not sure Portland is going to want to take back much salary as they are about to get new ownership.

Apparently there has been some smoke around the Blazers re-signing Simons, but Blazers fans seem relieved that maybe that won't happen now with the impending sale. Maybe they want to keep books clear for new ownership? Not sure if there is historical precedent for this or not.

basically what i've read is current owners are in the same mindset of weltman.. don't make many moves let the youth play its way through growing pains and hope to hit on a player or two. Issue is Simons while not young is still playing 20+ minutes taking away from Sharpe and Scoot and being just good enough they can't land a top pick. SO current owner is ok being stuck in no man's land and not fully tanking out

[fendilim]

Yuck. Overrated because of being a hometown product.

[BadMofoPimp]

A deal like that has zero chance of happening. As if Portland would take on 3 bad multi-year contracts just to get the 16th pick is laughable.

[drsd]

A deal like that has zero chance of happening. As if Portland would take on 3 bad multi-year contracts just to get the 16th pick is laughable.

At one level I agree. But, the Blazers will struggle to get to the salary floor. Every bad team needs 3 medium-overpaid vets to tank.

But this is were players like Anthony and Howard come in. They are additian "what-if" sweetners.

Ayton and Simons for Caldwell-Pope, Anthony, Howard, and Harris (SnT) with the 16, both the Magic's SRPs works financially.
I agree that Portland can get a better deal than that, so maybe, the Magic needs to throw in their 2027 FRP. And some more SPRs.

[SloNick Russia]

I think Simons and Dominayton sure can bring down our staple defense and finally get everybody fired.

Sent from my SM-S928B using RealGM mobile app

[JoshuaPotter]

I think Simons and Dominayton sure can bring down our staple defense and finally get everybody fired.

Sent from my SM-S928B using RealGM mobile app

We are due for another rebuild.

[BadMofoPimp]

A deal like that has zero chance of happening. As if Portland would take on 3 bad multi-year contracts just to get the 16th pick is laughable.

At one level I agree. But, the Blazers will struggle to get to the salary floor. Every bad team needs 3 medium-overpaid vets to tank.

But this is were players like Anthony and Howard come in. They are additian "what-if" sweetners.

Ayton and Simons for Caldwell-Pope, Anthony, Howard, and Harris (SnT) with the 16, both the Magic's SRPs works financially.
I agree that Portland can get a better deal than that, so maybe, the Magic needs to throw in their 2027 FRP. And some more SPRs.

Portland can easily get to the salary floor by signing someone to a 1 year $20+ mil deal like Tim Hardaway Jr anyone for that matter. They would never take on 3 multi-year bad contracts just to move a solid player like Simons and Aytons expiring just to get a mid round 1st. Just not going to happen. I understand Magic fans seem to skew rationale to make it seem good, but it is just not a good deal for Portland no matter how you justify it. Just post on the Blazers board or better yet the General board then you would understand. Throw in AB and another 1st and maybe that would start discussions.

[p0peye]

ORL sends: Isaac, WCJ, KCP, #25
POR sends: Simons, Ayton

Why POR: 3 really useful vets and a frp for two guys that aren’t in future team vision.

*If Mose can get through to Ayton defensively, he’s as physically imposing as any big man in the league. He doesn’t have to be great, but he could be more than good enough pretty easily with some effort…I think this is the kind of project that Mosely is built for. Mosley’s whole rep as an assistant was “connects with and relates to players” “in-shape enough to work with them personally” and “defense”…those traits were really highlighted in the book I’m reading (about Luka) called “The Wonderboy”…he’s clearly not an X&O guy - maybe this is where he shines?

Ayton is a large expiring…at worst. The deal is worthy of consideration just for that…but could be MUCH more if he and Simons accept more limited but elite roles and are receptive to long-term, lower salary extensions.

With Paolo's and Franz's new contracts, I think we are done with high salary players. I get the expiring, but what's the point - are we looking to dump salary?

[SHAQ32]

AB vs Justise Winslow or Stanley Johnson is a better comparison

[eyriq]

AB vs Justise Winslow or Stanley Johnson is a better comparison

Only if you stop watching after the draft. AB’s already a better passer than either ever were, defends guards not just wings, and actually processes the game like a real guard. Winslow and Stanley were tweeners with no position, AB’s a jumbo guard with a plan. Not the same sport.