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Just throwing that out there.

I was surprised you guys were not commenting on this... We are 3-0 since he went out against the Bobcats (we loss this one) and the team has played real well, especially distributing the ball which is proved by the balance scoring. I like how the team is going right now because Carlos really looks to set up his teammates and keeps moving the ball until he finds a good shot for somebody and then Keyon comes with a change of pace and with his harassing defense and picks it right were it was left. In the other hand Jameer sometimes looks confused with the ball, tries to drive to the basket and jumps in the air not knowing where his teammates are and gets LOTS of turnovers. If Nelson could at least get us a player that can help us at PF (Joe Smith, Kurt Thomas) or PG (Marcus Williams, Beno Udrih, Chris Duhon) and/or a future pick, I'd be more than willing to part ways with him. What do you guys think???

I think Arroyo and Dooling should be the PG combo even when Jameer comes back as long as we continue to play well. At the very least I think Arroyo should stay the starter.

Arroyo can't defend. In the 1st half of tonight's game, he repeatedly left his man expecting his teammates to cover for him. I'm thinking that since no one ever rotated over to his guy, it means the rest of the team was playing man-to-man defense. He also played too far off his man & still allowed them to blow by him.

He's lost his mojo, he played well early this year but for whatever reason be it injuries and whatnot has just struggled recently.

I would like to see him off the bench for a little and lead the second unit, bottom line...we should not be beyond the trade Deadline with Arroyo, Dooling AND Nelson on the roster, one needs to be shipped out to upgrade PF or SG in some sort of deal.

And just to finish what I said we HAVE to keep Keyon, so its more like Carlos or Jameer. Keyon just has a better chance of guarding the Billups and Kidds of the world better and with Evans and Bogans we don't have to keep him on Rip Hamilton all the time now IMO. Arroyo and Nelson are too similar, 1 must go.

Well, Nelson looks to return to the @Detroit game. We'll see.

Keyon is garbage at running the point. I know you guys see that. I don't see his dribble, dribble, dribble, shoot offense holding up much longer. Jameer on the whole is better than Arroyo I believe.

drsd wrote:Well, Nelson looks to return to the @Detroit game. We'll see.

so our 3 game winnig streak is over thanks for the bad news lol

i say keep whatever formation keeps bringing wins. if it's Arroyo + Keyon, then stick with it. If they lose it, or Jameer gets really hot and starts bringin W's, then roll with that.

i agree that one of those guys needs to go to help us fill another hole by the trade deadline though.... however, maybe the extra man overlap is what can help us get through the slumps of individual players?

Arroyo's play has improved although he still isnt the answer. Nelson like arroyo is also a bad defender. Keyon dooling is a good combo guard to bring off the bench it's just that he cant really run the point consistently. Dooling is a great man on man defender but lacks the handle and vision to a be a starting pg. We need to bring in a starting pg if we want to be elite. I've been saying it for the last 3 years. Nelson could be a 6th man candidate but he isnt starting material on a championship calibre team.

uhh this is dumb. jameer is the best poing guard on this team. he actually trys to get howard involved instead of holding on to the ball forever like keyon and carlos. and carlos just plain sucks. he doesn't play defense and he bogs down the offense.

and i hate how arroyo, keyon, and jameer all see playing time in one game. personally i think it messes up the flow of our offense with three seperate playing styles at the point in once game. you got carlos hopping all over the court with behind the back dribbles, keyon ball hogging if hedo isn't running the point for him, and jameer jumping in the air with no where to go.

szimab01 wrote:Arroyo's play has improved although he still isnt the answer. Nelson like arroyo is also a bad defender. Keyon dooling is a good combo guard to bring off the bench it's just that he cant really run the point consistently. Dooling is a great man on man defender but lacks the handle and vision to a be a starting pg. We need to bring in a starting pg if we want to be elite. I've been saying it for the last 3 years. Nelson could be a 6th man candidate but he isnt starting material on a championship calibre team.

Well, Arroyo was the softest start in the last game. So, again it looks like he needs to return to the bench.

arroyo's easily the best point guard on the team right now. he's the best passer/distributer, limits his turnovers, and usually shoots less than 5 FG attempts. and his 3 point shooting has been above exceptional lately(35%).

I think we need to cut Jameer a little slack. We know that he can be a good point gaurd in this league. We have seen glimpses of it the past few years. He still has plenty of room (and time) to improve. Many of the eilte PGs in the league didn't become all-stars, or even MVP, calibar player until several years in the league:

Steve Nash's 4th year stats: 8.6 PPG, 4.9 APG
Billup's 4th year: 8.6 PPG, 3.0 APG

There are other PGs who started out as great PGs, but it seems like all of them took several years to become comfotable a "floor generals." Even players like Jason Kidd didn't get into their prime until later in their careers.

I think we look at a coule recent PGs who were drafted an made an immediate impact on their team and think that is the standard (Paul, Williams), but I just don't think that's the case. The PG position is the only postition that you learn more each year. That is why you see a lot of older point gaurds being the best (Kidd, Nash, Stockton, Billups, even Gary Payton). We all know Jameer will be one of those players the Magic gets rid of and then he becomes one of the best PGs of all time. We need to be patient and make sure we have back-ups that can carry the load while he is developing.

Another point (sorry for the long post): I lost me father last year at the age of 25 and let me tell you, it really messed me up. No matter how much I tried to put it in the back of my head, it still affected me on a daily basis. I almost got fired from my job and was just struggling to function on a daily basis. Understand that I was exremely close to my dad and talked to him everyday and saw him at least a few times a week, but it seems like Jameer was very close to his father as well. People would try to get me back to functioning, but I remember thinking, "People can't understand what I am going through, because they have never been there." Obviously, this has an affect on Jameer. He broke down in the locker room after a text. It's been almost a year and a half for me and I am just know feeling like myself. Just something to think about...

Jameer is our guy for right now. This win streak has less to do with PG play and more to do with Rashard stepping it up. Whether Carlos or Jameer or Keyon is on the floor, none of them can determine whether or not Rashard's shots drop. And I know they can determine how often he gets the ball and whatnot, but Lewis has been getting more aggressive, which is the style of play he flourishes in.

I'm not so sure that Jameer is any better or any worse than Arroyo, I think it is the inconsistent time these guys are getting. One day one starts the tnext they get 3min off the bench. They have no shot at getting into a groove.

I've been under the belief that we have to many 'ok' bench players. We need to just pick two PG's and let them play. My preference is Jameer/Arroyo and Dooling. And keep Bogans as our SG/SF bench player and bring in Cook.

I think a smaller more consistent bench rotation will and has shown in the last 5 games does wonders.

p.s. What JJ did in the last 3 min just gets me more frustrated. He is such a pure shooter, i'm so shocked that he rides the pine jsut because of his lack of defensive toughness. He should play the last 3 or 4min of every first half and the first 3 or 4 min of every 2nd half. He'd keep the tempo up and help the offense get back into its flow.

Please otis and svg, trade him or play him.

Its all about Wins, not who plays the best. Of course Jameer puts up better numbers than Carlos, but Carlos is getting W's while Jameer was struggling with them.
And lets not forget that Dooling has come up with key plays against Detroit and Memphis in crucial points of each game. Every time each team had a run on us, Dooling had a steal and a buzzer beating lay-in or a nasty cross to dunk on Detroit. So just because Jameer puts up numbers doesn't mean he's the best for this team. We have numbers (118million of them)!

hey does anybody know what our team turnover averages were in the games jameer has missed??