Denton: VanGundy wont play Nelson to justify contract

magictreat · Post #1 » by **magictreat** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 12:58 am

By John Denton
FLORIDA TODAY

ORLANDO -- Physically, Jameer Nelson is the smallest player on the Orlando Magic's roster at barely 5-feet, 11-inches and 190 pounds.

But in some ways Nelson, who is teased constantly by his teammates for his pint-sized frame, has become the proverbial 500-pound elephant in the locker room no one wants to discuss.

Even though he's healthy now from a nagging foot injury, Nelson has fallen out of head coach Stan Van Gundy's rotation and plummeted all the way to third-string status. Shocking stuff, indeed for the player who was named a co-captain before the season and one who received a five-year contract extension in late October that could be worth $35 million.

Nelson, seemingly one of the Magic's core players these last four seasons, was pulled out of Friday's win in Philadelphia after just seven minutes. He did not play at all against Indiana on Saturday or in Monday's loss to Dallas as Van Gundy instead opted for starter Carlos Arroyo and top reserve Keyon Dooling.

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reddog4720 · Post #2 » by **reddog4720** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 1:17 am

My only argument to this is Jameer offers so much more offensively than Arroyo, and sometimes Dooling.

I strongly think that consistency has been the problem with our rotation. Our PG's are not great, so they can't afford to have inconsistent playing time. I think SVG has finally noticed this, I just don't agree with the two his selected.

All three of our PG's are pretty bad at defense, as well as the rest of our team. This isn't going to change. So we better put the lineup out there that can score 110. For this season at least.

This is going to be the endless struggle for the rest of the season. Otis is to stubborn to make a trade.

Ahhhh....the life of a magic fan. It's an endless struggle.

LetItRain · Post #3 » by **LetItRain** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 1:20 am

And he shouldn't play Nelson to justify his contract. Nelson should earn his PT just like everyone else.

And I hope to god that Otis is not pushing SVG to play Nelson b/c he signed him to that contract. Hopefully Otis is leaving the coaching up to the coach, and not trying to cover up for a (potential) mistake.

DiplomaticMagic · Post #4 » by **DiplomaticMagic** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 1:26 am

I must be Jameer Nelson's biggest fan. I liked him last year too. And I hate seeing him sit on the bench. A 100% Jameer >>>> Arroyo & Dooling...He is the one who moves the offense..hes the one who lobs it for Dwight..he is the pg! Not to mention he's really good friends with Dwight. Shipping Jameer could hurt Dwight's feelings on the organization. We've already seen it a little in T-mac with Mike Miller and definetly Steve-O with Mobley.

richboy · Post #5 » by **richboy** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 2:12 am

Why did Otis have to run to give Jameer an extention again?

Post #6 » by **craig01** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 2:18 am

richboy wrote:Why did Otis have to run to give Jameer an extention again?

Couldn't agree more, as is the case with thousands of others that asked that same question.

This could be the time that Nelson begins to fulfill his future role.

"the spark plug that comes off the bench with somewhat of a green light to score"

magicfan4life05 · Post #7 » by **magicfan4life05** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 2:18 am

jameer is still counting the teams with capspace this offseason on his hands, can we please leave him alone...

Shishnizzle · Post #8 » by **Shishnizzle** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 3:48 am

When we are playing teams with bigger point guards(most of the league) Dooling is the best option because he play's the best defense out of all of them, and I think he has done a good job on the offensive end because Hedo is playing point forward. If Nelson keeps his dribble alive and gets in the sweet spot for his mid range jumper, then he is good but he is still a liability on defense. I don't agree with all of the hate Otis people around here, but the only reason to have re signed Jameer was for future trades. He has value and it was a good move to sign him because once you go over the cap the way we are you want to keep your assets if you can. I know Philly would love to have him.

lovehoops01 · Post #9 » by **lovehoops01** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 3:52 am

I think there are a lot of misconceptions. For one, that Jameer has to be the starting point guard. Starting next season, he's only making the equivalent of the $5 million exception, maybe just a tiny bit more. Most starting point guards who are not on their rookie contracts are making at least a couple million a year more than that. So, even if he doesn't start, I don't necessarily think his contract is a bad one.

I think SVG holds some responsibility for this, too. Nelson was playing good at the end of last season and the start of this season. What has happened to him since then? I personally don't think either of the other point guards have played better and the constant tweaking of the guard lineups has been unsettling, too.

Plus, SVG said he wanted to come here and coach THIS team. And so far, it seems the only people he really wants to coach are Dwight and Hedo. We might find is openness fun for fans, but I'm not sure how much he is helping his team or its confidence. If you ask me, he's teetering on the edge of being able to keep them together. Already Carlos and Mo were yelling at each on the court last night. Maybe a similarity between he and his brother. Push too hard.

penn24 · Post #10 » by **penn24** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 4:01 am

lovehoops01 wrote:
Plus, SVG said he wanted to come here and coach THIS team. And so far, it seems the only people he really wants to coach are Dwight and Hedo. We might find is openness fun for fans, but I'm not sure how much he is helping his team or its confidence. If you ask me, he's teetering on the edge of being able to keep them together. Already Carlos and Mo were yelling at each on the court last night. Maybe a similarity between he and his brother. Push too hard.

Not to turn this into an SVG thread...but...to piggyback off this thinking...

I respect the fact that he mans up and takes blame for certain aspects of the game that he controls, but I think he seems too uncertain about solutions sometimes. There is definitely a tangible sense of tension at some level with this team....and when will it boil over? This season? Next season? When we face adversity in the playoffs? It's something we'll have to wait and see about.

The Nelson thing is very puzzling to me...I think we have sorely missed what he brings to the table, especially what he brings to the table on nights when he is 'on'. And to me it begs the question...when does Otis come down and and whisper in SVG's ear to play Nelson so that the investment is justified...if at all?

drsd · Post #11 » by **drsd** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 8:28 am

But the one thing that you have to have as a coach is a belief that you are playing the guys that you think gives you the best chance to win.

Cold!

This could not be a clearer statement from Coach Man.

Dunkin On Ya · Post #12 » by **Dunkin On Ya** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 1:55 pm

If we aren't going to use him, we need to deal him. That is a lot of money to just be sitting there.

pikimagic · Post #13 » by **pikimagic** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 2:06 pm

deal him with arroyo,ePat, for one of the millers ?thats mike or andre

happypedro12 · Post #14 » by **happypedro12** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 7:13 pm

Ya I just hope we're not playing him b/c we're gonna trade him

D12Howard · Post #15 » by **D12Howard** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 9:11 pm

well if thats the case, Van Gundy better not be playing Arroyo in order to justify all the puerto ricans coming into the arena...

Jameer>>>>Arroyo

mhectorgato · Post #16 » by **mhectorgato** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 9:12 pm

D12Howard wrote:well if thats the case, Van Gundy better not be playing Arroyo in order to justify all the puerto ricans coming into the arena...

Jameer>>>>Arroyo

The last game I went to I didn't see any PR flags or even hear the salsa music when he made a bucket.

drsd · Post #17 » by **drsd** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 9:35 pm

SOme nice discussion on thonight's game thread.

But for this point, look at the StM quote for how much he doesn't care who starts (as long as Dooling is the super sub).

Arroyo is a "low-assist" guy

Not a great support line from one's coach, especially when the guy fighting for your job keeps getting DNPCDs.

Magic lose this game, and Carlos gets next games DNPCD!

Post #18 » by **craig01** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 9:42 pm

Half a season in, and I'm not really very thrilled with the handling of this.

Both PG's are erratic. Both play well at times. Both stink at times.

I don't really approve much of the "let the other guy rot on the bench theory".

Yeah, there's not room for 3 in a typical game, but how long is it until Dooling once again becomes the 3rd man out? He's already been there too. And in his case, we've seen how short lived his productivity can be at PG.

Magic PG's playing time = attached to a tether ball pole.

LBPTarHeel27 · Post #19 » by **LBPTarHeel27** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 9:54 pm

Meanwhile....Jason Kidd is just waiting for us to trade for him to take over as starter.

mhectorgato · Post #20 » by **mhectorgato** » Wed Feb 6, 2008 10:02 pm

LBPTarHeel27 wrote:Meanwhile....Jason Kidd is just waiting for us to trade for him to take over as starter.

What do we have that will salary match, we're willing to give up and what NJ needs?

JKidd is making 19.7 so we'd need to send out about 14.7

I don't think they want Shard or Hedo because they already have RJ at the 3.

The only one they might be interested in would be SVG, but his doesn't count in player trades.