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Welcome Zhaire Smith

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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1141 » by Wilfried » Wed Oct 9, 2019 7:22 pm

Zhaire needs you to be ready when we have to let go J Rich in free agency in 2 seasons
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1142 » by GeorgeMarcus » Wed Oct 9, 2019 10:20 pm

Is he really behind guys like Shake and Korkmaz in the rotation?
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1143 » by Kobblehead » Wed Oct 9, 2019 10:30 pm

If last night's rotation is an indicator, Zhaire Smith is in the 12-15 roster spot range. Which means he wouldn't even take off his warmup in a regular season game. Not a good look.
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1144 » by BullyKing » Thu Oct 10, 2019 2:17 am

He's also the youngest guy on the roster by two years. I think it's ok to be patient with him. That's what goods teams do. Draft raw athletic guys and develop them for a few years and then you get a contributor out of nowhere.
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the plan is to get as good as quickly as possible....I fully believe we could have been a borderline playoff team last year by adding young veterans....using or draft picks and cap space.....can I specifically tell you who? no.
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1145 » by Ericb5 » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:38 am

BullyKing wrote:He's also the youngest guy on the roster by two years. I think it's ok to be patient with him. That's what goods teams do. Draft raw athletic guys and develop them for a few years and then you get a contributor out of nowhere.


In the process years he would play a lot of minutes, but on a team like we have now he can be a pure prospect for a few years. It’s a luxury.


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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1146 » by Kobblehead » Thu Oct 10, 2019 4:12 pm

BullyKing wrote:He's also the youngest guy on the roster by two years. I think it's ok to be patient with him. That's what goods teams do. Draft raw athletic guys and develop them for a few years and then you get a contributor out of nowhere.

True, I just assumed his defensive ability and basketball IQ would allow him to contribute on the fly while the rest of his game gradually developed. I just don't like the optics of him getting jumped in the rotation by someone coming into the program after him (Thybulle). Or him in close competition with guys you'd assume he'd be clearly ahead of (Milton, Korkmaz, Shayock).
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1147 » by youngcrev » Thu Oct 10, 2019 4:41 pm

Kobblehead wrote:
BullyKing wrote:He's also the youngest guy on the roster by two years. I think it's ok to be patient with him. That's what goods teams do. Draft raw athletic guys and develop them for a few years and then you get a contributor out of nowhere.

True, I just assumed his defensive ability and basketball IQ would allow him to contribute on the fly while the rest of his game gradually developed. I just don't like the optics of him getting jumped in the rotation by someone coming into the program after him (Thybulle). Or him in close competition with guys you'd assume he'd be clearly ahead of (Milton, Korkmaz, Shayock).


It seems like there's a lot of overlap with him and Ennis in the skills department. Athletic wings that are more known for their defense, like to hit the offensive boards, lack ball handling/playmaking skills, can hit an open J but aren't really shooters. Putting them both on the floor (particularly with Ben) might be an issue. That might be who Zhaire has to beat out to have a significant role.
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1148 » by ankle420breaker » Thu Oct 10, 2019 5:53 pm

youngcrev wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:
BullyKing wrote:He's also the youngest guy on the roster by two years. I think it's ok to be patient with him. That's what goods teams do. Draft raw athletic guys and develop them for a few years and then you get a contributor out of nowhere.

True, I just assumed his defensive ability and basketball IQ would allow him to contribute on the fly while the rest of his game gradually developed. I just don't like the optics of him getting jumped in the rotation by someone coming into the program after him (Thybulle). Or him in close competition with guys you'd assume he'd be clearly ahead of (Milton, Korkmaz, Shayock).


It seems like there's a lot of overlap with him and Ennis in the skills department. Athletic wings that are more known for their defense, like to hit the offensive boards, lack ball handling/playmaking skills, can hit an open J but aren't really shooters. Putting them both on the floor (particularly with Ben) might be an issue. That might be who Zhaire has to beat out to have a significant role.


youngcrev wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:
BullyKing wrote:He's also the youngest guy on the roster by two years. I think it's ok to be patient with him. That's what goods teams do. Draft raw athletic guys and develop them for a few years and then you get a contributor out of nowhere.

True, I just assumed his defensive ability and basketball IQ would allow him to contribute on the fly while the rest of his game gradually developed. I just don't like the optics of him getting jumped in the rotation by someone coming into the program after him (Thybulle). Or him in close competition with guys you'd assume he'd be clearly ahead of (Milton, Korkmaz, Shayock).


It seems like there's a lot of overlap with him and Ennis in the skills department. Athletic wings that are more known for their defense, like to hit the offensive boards, lack ball handling/playmaking skills, can hit an open J but aren't really shooters. Putting them both on the floor (particularly with Ben) might be an issue. That might be who Zhaire has to beat out to have a significant role.


Agree his skill set is a bit redundant here. Z's athleticism is elite, but he's still totally raw and essentially going into his true first year in the league. Really not shocked that he's a fringe rotation guy to start the season.

Having Thybulle coming in and leapfrogging him out of the gate is a delightful problem to have. Despite being a rook, he's older, bigger, more polished, and could turn out to be a better shooter than Zhaire.

Early indications are that Matisse will have a spot in the rotation. Agree with above that Ennis will be the guy Zhaire has to beat out for playing time.

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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1149 » by nrok10307 » Thu Oct 10, 2019 6:27 pm

Ericb5 wrote:
BullyKing wrote:He's also the youngest guy on the roster by two years. I think it's ok to be patient with him. That's what goods teams do. Draft raw athletic guys and develop them for a few years and then you get a contributor out of nowhere.


In the process years he would play a lot of minutes, but on a team like we have now he can be a pure prospect for a few years. It’s a luxury.


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Agreed - he is young with a ton of potential. Needs to keep grinding and developing. Sixers aren't tanking, so they are going to play the vets. It's a long season, so he'll get plenty of run in the D-league and get some minutes due to rest/injury.

Sidenote: Elton Brand has built a really deep and versatile roster :nod:
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1150 » by LloydFree » Thu Oct 10, 2019 7:25 pm

Kobblehead wrote:
BullyKing wrote:He's also the youngest guy on the roster by two years. I think it's ok to be patient with him. That's what goods teams do. Draft raw athletic guys and develop them for a few years and then you get a contributor out of nowhere.

True, I just assumed his defensive ability and basketball IQ would allow him to contribute on the fly while the rest of his game gradually developed. I just don't like the optics of him getting jumped in the rotation by someone coming into the program after him (Thybulle). Or him in close competition with guys you'd assume he'd be clearly ahead of (Milton, Korkmaz, Shayock).

Milton and Shayock are 3 years older than him too. Zhaire came in so young, that some of the one-and-dones from this year's draft are older than him. They got 2 years to see what he is. Hopefully he doesn't get too frustrated while he's growing.
Fischella wrote:I think none of you guys that are pro-Embiid no how basketball works today.. is way easier to win it all with Omer Asik than Olajuwon.
Actually if you ask me which Center I want for my perfect championship caliber team, I will chose Asik hands down
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1151 » by HotelVitale » Thu Oct 10, 2019 8:38 pm

Kobblehead wrote:
BullyKing wrote:He's also the youngest guy on the roster by two years. I think it's ok to be patient with him. That's what goods teams do. Draft raw athletic guys and develop them for a few years and then you get a contributor out of nowhere.
True, I just assumed his defensive ability and basketball IQ would allow him to contribute on the fly while the rest of his game gradually developed. I just don't like the optics of him getting jumped in the rotation by someone coming into the program after him (Thybulle). Or him in close competition with guys you'd assume he'd be clearly ahead of (Milton, Korkmaz, Shayock).


I always thought his pure defensive ability was overstated--he was a nice defensive prospect but wasn't projecting as a sure fire elite defender, and people were reading way too much into a handful of plays against non-NBA caliber player. Basketball IQ is also super relative and has a lot to do with what you can and can't get away with, which differs massively from HS to college to the pros; in Zhaire's case his perceived high IQ was mostly about his timing and ability to pick his spots, but that was propped up by his size + athletic ability being able to effect the game in a way that won't happen as easily in the NBA. It's easy to look in control when you're by far the best athlete on the court, in the NBA he often won't be that or at least will just be like 15% more athletic than the next best guy.

Always thought Zhaire a typical one-and-done upside pick who was going to have to develop/improve a lot to be good and wasn't going to be very useful if he didn't. Don't think there's any reason to be down on him for not being ready to contribute yet, but might be a good time to recalibrate expectations if you thought he was a killer prospect capable to stepping in day one.
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1152 » by phillynative » Fri Oct 11, 2019 12:30 am

HotelVitale wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:
BullyKing wrote:He's also the youngest guy on the roster by two years. I think it's ok to be patient with him. That's what goods teams do. Draft raw athletic guys and develop them for a few years and then you get a contributor out of nowhere.
True, I just assumed his defensive ability and basketball IQ would allow him to contribute on the fly while the rest of his game gradually developed. I just don't like the optics of him getting jumped in the rotation by someone coming into the program after him (Thybulle). Or him in close competition with guys you'd assume he'd be clearly ahead of (Milton, Korkmaz, Shayock).


I always thought his pure defensive ability was overstated--he was a nice defensive prospect but wasn't projecting as a sure fire elite defender, and people were reading way too much into a handful of plays against non-NBA caliber player. Basketball IQ is also super relative and has a lot to do with what you can and can't get away with, which differs massively from HS to college to the pros; in Zhaire's case his perceived high IQ was mostly about his timing and ability to pick his spots, but that was propped up by his size + athletic ability being able to effect the game in a way that won't happen as easily in the NBA. It's easy to look in control when you're by far the best athlete by far on the court, in the NBA he often won't be that or at least will just be like 15% more athletic than the next best guy.

Always thought Zhaire a typical one-and-done upside pick who was going to have to develop/improve a lot to be good and wasn't going to be very useful if he didn't. Don't think there's any reason to be down on him for not being ready to contribute yet, but might be a good time to recalibrate expectations if you thought he was a killer prospect capable to stepping in day one.


This. I believe managenent saw him as a blank canvas. They are going to develop him and see his potential through. Matisse is more of a sure thing with a lower ceiling.
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1153 » by MVP1992 » Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:06 am

Would be nice if he could be temporarily traded (2 years) to a team to get more court time in exchange for a player who fits Sixers win it now time frame.

Then bring him back.

Can't imagine anything worse than being in his shoes knowing the next year or two you'll be training your arse off but gaining bugger all in actual court time experience and growth.
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1154 » by LloydFree » Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:54 am

MVP1992 wrote:Would be nice if he could be temporarily traded (2 years) to a team to get more court time in exchange for a player who fits Sixers win it now time frame.

Then bring him back.

Can't imagine anything worse than being in his shoes knowing the next year or two you'll be training your arse off but gaining bugger all in actual court time experience and growth.

You can't imagine anything worse than being 20 years old and being paid 3 million dollars per year to train and practice with one of the best teams in the NBA?

I think he'll be alright.
Fischella wrote:I think none of you guys that are pro-Embiid no how basketball works today.. is way easier to win it all with Omer Asik than Olajuwon.
Actually if you ask me which Center I want for my perfect championship caliber team, I will chose Asik hands down
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1155 » by BullyKing » Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:58 am

LloydFree wrote:
MVP1992 wrote:Would be nice if he could be temporarily traded (2 years) to a team to get more court time in exchange for a player who fits Sixers win it now time frame.

Then bring him back.

Can't imagine anything worse than being in his shoes knowing the next year or two you'll be training your arse off but gaining bugger all in actual court time experience and growth.

You can't imagine anything worse than being 20 years old and being paid 3 million dollars per year to train and practice with one of the best teams in the NBA?

I think he'll be alright.


The team also very nearly killed him last year so I think simply being healthy but not playing will be a welcome improvement for the kid.
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1156 » by MVP1992 » Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:01 am

LloydFree wrote:
MVP1992 wrote:Would be nice if he could be temporarily traded (2 years) to a team to get more court time in exchange for a player who fits Sixers win it now time frame.

Then bring him back.

Can't imagine anything worse than being in his shoes knowing the next year or two you'll be training your arse off but gaining bugger all in actual court time experience and growth.

You can't imagine anything worse than being 20 years old and being paid 3 million dollars per year to train and practice with one of the best teams in the NBA?

I think he'll be alright.



Yeah, I was maybe a bit hyperbolic. But context...

I'd kill to be in his shoes. But it'd be frustrating as hell to be sitting on the sidelines. Thinking about his long term future development. Is it stunting his growth as a player or nothing to worry about?
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1157 » by Kobblehead » Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:06 am

It's possible that being unable to earn a 20 mpg role this year hurts his development. Young players gotta play.
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1158 » by LloydFree » Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:15 am

MVP1992 wrote:
LloydFree wrote:
MVP1992 wrote:Would be nice if he could be temporarily traded (2 years) to a team to get more court time in exchange for a player who fits Sixers win it now time frame.

Then bring him back.

Can't imagine anything worse than being in his shoes knowing the next year or two you'll be training your arse off but gaining bugger all in actual court time experience and growth.

You can't imagine anything worse than being 20 years old and being paid 3 million dollars per year to train and practice with one of the best teams in the NBA?

I think he'll be alright.



Yeah, I was maybe a bit hyperbolic. But context...

I'd kill to be in his shoes. But it'd be frustrating as hell to be sitting on the sidelines. Thinking about his long term future development. Is it stunting his growth as a player or nothing to worry about?

I don't think its anything to worry about and I don't think it's hurting his development. When Josh Richardson and Matisse Thybulle were 20-21 years old, they were playing for free against College kids. This guy is practicing against grown men every day.

Guys like Lou Williams and Kendrick Perkins came into the league young and barely played their 1st two years and they were fine. He'll be fine.
Fischella wrote:I think none of you guys that are pro-Embiid no how basketball works today.. is way easier to win it all with Omer Asik than Olajuwon.
Actually if you ask me which Center I want for my perfect championship caliber team, I will chose Asik hands down
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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1159 » by Ericb5 » Fri Oct 11, 2019 7:25 am

BullyKing wrote:
LloydFree wrote:
MVP1992 wrote:Would be nice if he could be temporarily traded (2 years) to a team to get more court time in exchange for a player who fits Sixers win it now time frame.

Then bring him back.

Can't imagine anything worse than being in his shoes knowing the next year or two you'll be training your arse off but gaining bugger all in actual court time experience and growth.

You can't imagine anything worse than being 20 years old and being paid 3 million dollars per year to train and practice with one of the best teams in the NBA?

I think he'll be alright.


The team also very nearly killed him last year so I think simply being healthy but not playing will be a welcome improvement for the kid.


How is what happened to him last year the team’s fault?

I just read that he ate sesame seeds not knowing that he was allergic to them.


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Re: Welcome Zhaire Smith 

Post#1160 » by HotelVitale » Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:59 pm

MVP1992 wrote:Yeah, I was maybe a bit hyperbolic. But context...kill to be in his shoes. But it'd be frustrating as hell to be sitting on the sidelines. Thinking about his long term future development. Is it stunting his growth as a player or nothing to worry about?


Don’t think playing big minutes in game helps your development at all. New Players need to get a sense of game speed so it helps to get some exposure, but rawer players mostly need to drill like crazy certain moves and skills that they can use/get away with in the nba so they can become second nature. And then they have to work on decision making at nba speed/spacing, which is totally unpredictable and often takes many years to get down. For the first phase, practice games, d league, and full speed drills probably helps get those fundamentals tuned up more than full games. It’s different for every prospect but very few folks still in deep development seem to benefit from getting 35 minutes on a bad team over 15 on a good one, just makes them flail around and do things outside of what will be their future, sustainable nba role/game. Big reason why players who have modest roles to step into in years 2-4 seem to have the best track record of development.

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