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Around the League: Playoffs and beyond!

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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#741 » by Kobblehead » Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:03 pm

Wilfried wrote:Kemba wants out of Boston ... funny

What is going to be the return? Who will be interested in that contract ?

Mavs are a natural trade partner because they also have an unhappy player on a bad contract (Porzingis).
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#742 » by Wilfried » Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:09 pm

Kobblehead wrote:
Wilfried wrote:Kemba wants out of Boston ... funny

What is going to be the return? Who will be interested in that contract ?

Mavs are a natural trade partner because they also have an unhappy player on a bad contract (Porzingis).


Think the Mavs need to upgrade. What is Kemba going to add? And they will lose (a bit of) defense and shot blocking.

Was also thinking about the Lakers ... Kuzma + KCP?
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#743 » by Kobblehead » Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:13 pm

The Mavs need guys that can score. Kemba can still do that. And again, a big part of that trade would be moving off the albatross Porzingis who is currently a major headache for them on and off the court.
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#744 » by Kobblehead » Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:14 pm

I could see the Lakers being interested. Especially if someone offers Shroder a big deal and they lose him.
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#745 » by Sixersftw » Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:40 pm

I was fine with Joker winning the MVP. Thats the way the cookie crumbles and he was great in the regular season. Gobert though? My dude is a joke. It sucks that he's gonna go down in history and be compared to the likes of Zo, Ben Wallace, Dikembe, etc.
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#746 » by LloydFree » Thu Jun 10, 2021 1:34 pm

Sixersftw wrote:I was fine with Joker winning the MVP. Thats the way the cookie crumbles and he was great in the regular season. Gobert though? My dude is a joke. It sucks that he's gonna go down in history and be compared to the likes of Zo, Ben Wallace, Dikembe, etc.

Gobert is a better basketball player than Dikembe ever pretended to be.
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#747 » by LloydFree » Thu Jun 10, 2021 1:40 pm

Kobblehead wrote:The Mavs need guys that can score. Kemba can still do that. And again, a big part of that trade would be moving off the albatross Porzingis who is currently a major headache for them on and off the court.

Two of the 5 worst contracts in the NBA. Wall, Love (and maybe Klay) are the only others close. Sure, they look like a match, but I don't believe Boston would do the deal, because Porzingis' contract is longer, and I don't think the Mavericks would do the deal because they already have 1-way players that offer the same things as Kemba, for a fraction of the cost.
Fischella wrote:I think none of you guys that are pro-Embiid no how basketball works today.. is way easier to win it all with Omer Asik than Olajuwon.
Actually if you ask me which Center I want for my perfect championship caliber team, I will chose Asik hands down
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#748 » by Negrodamus » Thu Jun 10, 2021 3:42 pm

While we're on the discussion of DPOY:

Read on Twitter


Meanwhile the Wizards averaged 110 ppg against us and took a game from us (ATL currently hanging 115 on us per game). Probably the worst team in the playoffs was pouring points on us, a team with 3 DPOY candidates. If that doesn't say something about defense in the playoffs, I don't know what does. I love Ben, but if the argument for his value is "yea but he's incredible on the defensive end", then it's not a great argument.
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#749 » by cool93 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 4:13 pm

Gome on guys, DPOY is regular season award and Gobert is ELITE defensive anchor in regular season. That doesn't translate into the playoffs, but it doesn't and shouldn't matter.

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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#750 » by blargh » Thu Jun 10, 2021 5:34 pm

Negrodamus wrote:While we're on the discussion of DPOY:

Meanwhile the Wizards averaged 110 ppg against us and took a game from us (ATL currently hanging 115 on us per game). Probably the worst team in the playoffs was pouring points on us, a team with 3 DPOY candidates. If that doesn't say something about defense in the playoffs, I don't know what does.


Not sure what that’s supposed to say. We had one of the best defenses in the regular season, and we’ve had one of the best defenses in the playoffs so far. We have definitely won games in the playoffs due to our defense.
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#751 » by Negrodamus » Thu Jun 10, 2021 5:48 pm

blargh wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:While we're on the discussion of DPOY:

Meanwhile the Wizards averaged 110 ppg against us and took a game from us (ATL currently hanging 115 on us per game). Probably the worst team in the playoffs was pouring points on us, a team with 3 DPOY candidates. If that doesn't say something about defense in the playoffs, I don't know what does.


Not sure what that’s supposed to say. We had one of the best defenses in the regular season, and we’ve had one of the best defenses in the playoffs so far. We have definitely won games in the playoffs due to our defense.


I think it's pretty clear what it's supposed to say. Teams, especially in the playoffs, are going to score. It's inevitable. The problem we're facing is that our only creators we rely heavily on for baskets are Embiid (injury prone) and Tobias (does not draw fouls).

Of course we have won games with defense in the playoffs, that's our entire identity. Still we drop a game to a terrible team, almost choke away the first game of that series. We lose homecourt advantage to the Hawks because they caught a heater and no amount of defense was going to stop that barrage of scoring; so we were in a position to keep up which is something our personnel is not really equipped with doing. Obviously they went cold and we caught back up, but that's due to their youth. If we are fortunate enough to survive this series, the Nets are not going to go ice cold if they go up huge on us.

We also caught a glimpse of Ben's shortcoming as a star defensive player in the first game when Trae drew Ben's 3rd foul and we needed to send Ben back onto Bogdan, someone decidedly less impactful on the game. If a stud scorer is cold from deep, they find other ways of production (generating assists, scoring at the foul line, etc). The league is decidedly anti defense and that's where we hang our hats.
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#752 » by LloydFree » Thu Jun 10, 2021 6:18 pm

Negrodamus wrote:
blargh wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:While we're on the discussion of DPOY:

Meanwhile the Wizards averaged 110 ppg against us and took a game from us (ATL currently hanging 115 on us per game). Probably the worst team in the playoffs was pouring points on us, a team with 3 DPOY candidates. If that doesn't say something about defense in the playoffs, I don't know what does.


Not sure what that’s supposed to say. We had one of the best defenses in the regular season, and we’ve had one of the best defenses in the playoffs so far. We have definitely won games in the playoffs due to our defense.


I think it's pretty clear what it's supposed to say. Teams, especially in the playoffs, are going to score. It's inevitable. The problem we're facing is that our only creators we rely heavily on for baskets are Embiid (injury prone) and Tobias (does not draw fouls).

Of course we have won games with defense in the playoffs, that's our entire identity. Still we drop a game to a terrible team, almost choke away the first game of that series. We lose homecourt advantage to the Hawks because they caught a heater and no amount of defense was going to stop that barrage of scoring; so we were in a position to keep up which is something our personnel is not really equipped with doing. Obviously they went cold and we caught back up, but that's due to their youth. If we are fortunate enough to survive this series, the Nets are not going to go ice cold if they go up huge on us.

We also caught a glimpse of Ben's shortcoming as a star defensive player in the first game when Trae drew Ben's 3rd foul and we needed to send Ben back onto Bogdan, someone decidedly less impactful on the game. If a stud scorer is cold from deep, they find other ways of production (generating assists, scoring at the foul line, etc). The league is decidedly anti defense and that's where we hang our hats.

5 of the 8 teams remaining in the playoffs were top 10 in defensive rating. All 4 of the remaining Western teams were top 13 in defensive rating.
Fischella wrote:I think none of you guys that are pro-Embiid no how basketball works today.. is way easier to win it all with Omer Asik than Olajuwon.
Actually if you ask me which Center I want for my perfect championship caliber team, I will chose Asik hands down
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#753 » by Negrodamus » Thu Jun 10, 2021 6:37 pm

LloydFree wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:
blargh wrote:
Not sure what that’s supposed to say. We had one of the best defenses in the regular season, and we’ve had one of the best defenses in the playoffs so far. We have definitely won games in the playoffs due to our defense.


I think it's pretty clear what it's supposed to say. Teams, especially in the playoffs, are going to score. It's inevitable. The problem we're facing is that our only creators we rely heavily on for baskets are Embiid (injury prone) and Tobias (does not draw fouls).

Of course we have won games with defense in the playoffs, that's our entire identity. Still we drop a game to a terrible team, almost choke away the first game of that series. We lose homecourt advantage to the Hawks because they caught a heater and no amount of defense was going to stop that barrage of scoring; so we were in a position to keep up which is something our personnel is not really equipped with doing. Obviously they went cold and we caught back up, but that's due to their youth. If we are fortunate enough to survive this series, the Nets are not going to go ice cold if they go up huge on us.

We also caught a glimpse of Ben's shortcoming as a star defensive player in the first game when Trae drew Ben's 3rd foul and we needed to send Ben back onto Bogdan, someone decidedly less impactful on the game. If a stud scorer is cold from deep, they find other ways of production (generating assists, scoring at the foul line, etc). The league is decidedly anti defense and that's where we hang our hats.

5 of the 8 teams remaining in the playoffs were top 10 in defensive rating. All 4 of the remaining Western teams were top 13 in defensive rating.


Well, the point isn't that defense has no importance. The point is that elite defense can be mitigated by drawing fouls. To reference one of our DPOY candidate:

Read on Twitter


Thybulle then has to play Trae differently despite playing airtight defense. Meanwhile, there's a ton of recourse if you're an elite offensive player and your shot isn't falling.
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#754 » by Kobblehead » Thu Jun 10, 2021 11:29 pm

LloydFree wrote:Two of the 5 worst contracts in the NBA. Wall, Love (and maybe Klay) are the only others close. Sure, they look like a match, but I don't believe Boston would do the deal, because Porzingis' contract is longer, and I don't think the Mavericks would do the deal because they already have 1-way players that offer the same things as Kemba, for a fraction of the cost.

Don't be surprised if those deals end up being the same length.

Kemba is smart enough to pick up that option. Porzingis is dumb/delusional enough to opt out and think he's getting a second max.
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#755 » by Kobblehead » Thu Jun 10, 2021 11:54 pm

In addition to having good defensive players, another way to ensure your defense translates to the playoffs is when you have creators on the offensive end that can attack the opposing team's best scorers, defensively. Tiring them out and making them work on both ends.
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#756 » by 76ciology » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:07 am

Kobblehead wrote:In addition to having good defensive players, another way to ensure your defense translates to the playoffs is when you have creators on the offensive end that can attack the opposing team's best scorers, defensively. Tiring them out and making them work on both ends.


Against the Hawks, I like how we clamped down Trae using Ben’s length. Then we hunted him with the Seth-Tobi PnR, force them to switch then Tobi posting Trae.

Hawks adjusted by putting Trae on Green, this stopped the entire scheme.

Hawks also subbed Huerter over Hill, whereas Huerter attacked Seth’s defense.
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#757 » by 76ciology » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:15 am

Spoiler:
Negrodamus wrote:
LloydFree wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:
I think it's pretty clear what it's supposed to say. Teams, especially in the playoffs, are going to score. It's inevitable. The problem we're facing is that our only creators we rely heavily on for baskets are Embiid (injury prone) and Tobias (does not draw fouls).

Of course we have won games with defense in the playoffs, that's our entire identity. Still we drop a game to a terrible team, almost choke away the first game of that series. We lose homecourt advantage to the Hawks because they caught a heater and no amount of defense was going to stop that barrage of scoring; so we were in a position to keep up which is something our personnel is not really equipped with doing. Obviously they went cold and we caught back up, but that's due to their youth. If we are fortunate enough to survive this series, the Nets are not going to go ice cold if they go up huge on us.

We also caught a glimpse of Ben's shortcoming as a star defensive player in the first game when Trae drew Ben's 3rd foul and we needed to send Ben back onto Bogdan, someone decidedly less impactful on the game. If a stud scorer is cold from deep, they find other ways of production (generating assists, scoring at the foul line, etc). The league is decidedly anti defense and that's where we hang our hats.

5 of the 8 teams remaining in the playoffs were top 10 in defensive rating. All 4 of the remaining Western teams were top 13 in defensive rating.


Well, the point isn't that defense has no importance. The point is that elite defense can be mitigated by drawing fouls. To reference one of our DPOY candidate:

Read on Twitter


Thybulle then has to play Trae differently despite playing airtight defense. Meanwhile, there's a ton of recourse if you're an elite offensive player and your shot isn't falling.


One thing ive been thinking is maybe the right way to play defense against stars is pretty much having multiple guys playing against him and letting him kick it out where you then have to just try to make quick defensive rotations.

Like on that drive by Trae, some of our guy have to come to help and also block Trae’s path. But yeah, you’re vulnerable to giving up a 3. That is when you then make close outs to shooters by defensive rotations.

So the best way is to trap before he gets that deep. Make sure he has to make longer distance passes, which allows you to have better chance to intercept it. Rather than him
going deep and making a short distance pass to his teammate at the corner.

I do think this is a good exercise for us. Our defense is equipped to slow down Trae. At worst we can just put Ben on him and Ben’s length could make it tough for Trae to pull up or passing it out.

The problem lies on the future playoff series like Nets or Bucks. Where I hope Ben’s defense is good enough to clamp down KD or Giannis. If not, we’ll have to step up on help/team defense.
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#758 » by 76ciology » Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:15 am

Nets Bucks game 3.
- Look at the quality of shots Bucks is getting compared to the Nets. This is why Nets have the edge over anyone on crunch time IMO. Just brush screen on KD and its basically an open jumper.
- The way KD and Kyrie are generating their shots, they’re so natural on crunch time.
- Our PFs, a couple of them will be activated if we face the Bucks, have to watch how Griffin defends Giannis or Tucker on KD.
- Ben should watch on Blake defends Giannis.
- Ben should watch how Giannis on offense. Roll man and a lot of attack push off and spin move to get a basket.
- how to beat the Nets? Get the ball out of KD’s hands and let guys like Bruce Brown beat you.
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#759 » by GoSixersBro » Fri Jun 11, 2021 12:46 pm

76ciology wrote:Nets Bucks game 3.
- Look at the quality of shots Bucks is getting compared to the Nets. This is why Nets have the edge over anyone on crunch time IMO. Just brush screen on KD and its basically an open jumper.
- The way KD and Kyrie are generating their shots, they’re so natural on crunch time.
- Our PFs, a couple of them will be activated if we face the Bucks, have to watch how Griffin defends Giannis or Tucker on KD.
- Ben should watch on Blake defends Giannis.
- Ben should watch how Giannis on offense. Roll man and a lot of attack push off and spin move to get a basket.
- how to beat the Nets? Get the ball out of KD’s hands and let guys like Bruce Brown beat you.


Nets botched that possession so badly. Brown drew the defense in after getting the ball, but should've kicked out to Blake, heck maybe even Harris in the right corner. Big win for Bucks. Hope that series goes 7.
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Re: Around the League: Playoffs and beyond! 

Post#760 » by Eyeamok » Fri Jun 11, 2021 3:27 pm

One thing I really dislike about the modern NBA is the way guys will be right under the rim and kick it out for a 3 point shot. What's wrong with a 2 point shot when you are at the rim?
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