ImageImageImage

Joel: unchained.

Moderators: HartfordWhalers, BullyKing, Foshan, sixers hoops, Sixerscan

User avatar
76ciology
RealGM
Posts: 61,072
And1: 23,345
Joined: Jun 06, 2002

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#341 » by 76ciology » Mon Jan 17, 2022 6:22 am

I think both Embiid and Jokic are both great players.

The comparison between the two are like comparing prime Kawhi Leonard and Stephen Curry. You can win a championship with either one of them.

We all know what Embiid is. He is probably the best two way (scorer/defender) C right now. And may go down as the best scoring C after Wilt.

I dont think Jokic is fools gold. Just as I dont think Steph was a gimmick before they start winning 73 games and people bombing 3s. Jokic has godly basketball IQ that allows him to see plays before it unfolds, along with godly soft touch with a shot release that is almost impossible to challenge.

I just think he plays unorthodox for the C position that why he looks funny, no pun intended to the Joker.

I dont really care on who’s better between the two. But for Jojo to win MVP, he has to not look at it at a individual performance standpoint. His best chance is to play at this level (performance wise and availability wise) and also get us the best record in the east or for Nuggets to underperform despite this performance by jokic.
There’s never been a time in history when we look back and say that the people who were censoring free speech were the good guys.
TeamHigh
Junior
Posts: 277
And1: 173
Joined: Feb 26, 2015

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#342 » by TeamHigh » Mon Jan 17, 2022 7:19 am

Jokic definitely isn't fool's gold. He's an absolutely elite player and the Nuggets are statistically a very good team when he's on the floor. He's easily a top 10 player who's uniqueness is sometimes unappreciated by opposing fans simply because he's not the most athletic.

I do agree that his effectiveness drops in the playoffs when his lack of rim protection and switchability is exposed. You really need to be good at at least one of those two things as a center, and ideally probably both. If you can neither defend the rim at a high level nor switch out and cover small, your team is in for a hard time. That's why Booker and CP3 walked into a million wide open 10-15 footers that they buried like layups. We had similar issues in our sweep against the C's, where we insisted on playing drop coverage (thanks Ime) in an attempt to preserve Embiid's energy levels. It's the kind of defense that doesn't work against playoff caliber offenses, and thankfully we changed it the next year. But I'm not sure if Jokic has it in him to press up against the PnR, since he's not particularly quick laterally.

This alone is a big reason why Jokic has negative net ratings in the last couple of playoffs and Joel is the league leader in 3-year playoff LeBron:
Read on Twitter


The Nuggets are missing 2 max contracts and their backup center situation is an awful mess. Like Greg Monroe levels of bad. And that's making the non-Jokic minutes look so bad that it looks like the Nuggets have no talent around Jokic. I do agree that it's a bit overblown. Their starting lineup is probably better than ours even without MPJ and Murray. If we combined our rosters the non-C starters would probably be Monte, Seth, Barton, and AG (3 out of 4 Nuggets), though Maxey would get plenty of run.

A lot of people are still under the impression that Tobi is good because of decent counting stats, but they don't see how atrocious he's been in terms of game impact (and why Morey is so desperate to trade him).

Unfortunately the lack of national games is causing people to overlook the hard carry that Embiid is doing right now. But people will slowly come around if he keeps this up.
eyeatoma
RealGM
Posts: 26,871
And1: 10,792
Joined: Feb 25, 2005
Location: An Indian in Indonesia
     

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#343 » by eyeatoma » Mon Jan 17, 2022 9:05 am

TheBallsDeeper wrote:
eyeatoma wrote:
TheBallsDeeper wrote:Embiid right now is clearly the best player in the league. He is dominating on both ends of the floor.

Without him the Sixers would be playing for the number one pick. The current roster is terrible, they are prime process bad. I do not consider Simmons as part of the roster anymore, which leaves Tobias Harris as the second-best player. Would Harris be the second-best player on any other team in the league?
Players like Curry, Green, Thybulle and Maxey would not start on any contender, but are regular starters for the Sixers. Korkmaz started yesterday, and he probably would not get picked up if he was waived tomorrow, Milton is probably the same (outside of covid ravaged teams top-ups).

Embiid is carrying them to a mid-seed in playoffs - I don't think there is another player in the league right now that could do that.


Jokic stans would say Jokic, but I'm not very impressed with their record and I think our roster is just as bad if not worse than theirs. They tend to disagree on that part as well lol.

I think Jokic is fools gold.

Everyone gets way too excited about a 7 foot player making fancy passes, but Denver are not going to win a championship with him at center. Everyone dismisses Ben Simmons because he can not do one of the main skills needed for a guard, but Jokic has a similar issue as a center.

He's basically a 7 foot slow point guard, who can not really defend any position on the floor at a decent level. Teams need a good a defender at center, play-making can come from every position, but rim-protecting and elite defense come from the center. I don't care what his box scores look like, I think he is the most overrated player in the league and would take about 20 centers before him.


Haha, dare you to say this on the general board. They would have an aneurysm.
Eyeamok
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,465
And1: 3,372
Joined: Mar 02, 2006

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#344 » by Eyeamok » Mon Jan 17, 2022 2:42 pm

Without BS playing Joel is turning into the true leader of the team. He is telling everyone follow my example and follow me lead. And they are responding. Something BS would not or could not do. I believe Joel is trying to create a team of guys that work hard every game and he wants to be the hardest worker out there. Yes having a good trade would be an upgrade but Joel is doing his part to build up what we have right now. MVP for this guy.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/33069145/joel-embiid-no-urgency-change-anything-surging-philadelphia-76ers
The Accession of Paul Reed is upon us !

You want it to be one way....but it's the other way.

Marlo
User avatar
Stanford
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 52,033
And1: 16,751
Joined: Feb 07, 2005
Location: Parts Unknown
   

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#345 » by Stanford » Mon Jan 17, 2022 2:51 pm

I haven't watched any Nuggets games this season but everyone (outside of Philadelphia) has said that Jokic is actually a plus defender. Are they wrong?
User avatar
Bum Adebayo
Head Coach
Posts: 7,468
And1: 3,933
Joined: Apr 28, 2016
   

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#346 » by Bum Adebayo » Mon Jan 17, 2022 4:30 pm

TheBallsDeeper wrote:Embiid right now is clearly the best player in the league. He is dominating on both ends of the floor.

Without him the Sixers would be playing for the number one pick. The current roster is terrible, they are prime process bad. I do not consider Simmons as part of the roster anymore, which leaves Tobias Harris as the second-best player. Would Harris be the second-best player on any other team in the league?
Players like Curry, Green, Thybulle and Maxey would not start on any contender, but are regular starters for the Sixers. Korkmaz started yesterday, and he probably would not get picked up if he was waived tomorrow, Milton is probably the same (outside of covid ravaged teams top-ups).

Embiid is carrying them to a mid-seed in playoffs - I don't think there is another player in the league right now that could do that.


Goes to show you how much easier life is for him without Ben Simmons, he can finally show leadership and improve his passing now that offense is not 4 vs 5.
Horrible takes since 2016
User avatar
Bum Adebayo
Head Coach
Posts: 7,468
And1: 3,933
Joined: Apr 28, 2016
   

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#347 » by Bum Adebayo » Mon Jan 17, 2022 4:31 pm

Jokic has been a top 10 player last two years or so, that's extremely impressive, few players can get to that level, we need to be fair and admit how good he is.
Horrible takes since 2016
Eyeamok
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,465
And1: 3,372
Joined: Mar 02, 2006

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#348 » by Eyeamok » Mon Jan 17, 2022 6:48 pm

Bum Adebayo wrote:
TheBallsDeeper wrote:Embiid right now is clearly the best player in the league. He is dominating on both ends of the floor.

Without him the Sixers would be playing for the number one pick. The current roster is terrible, they are prime process bad. I do not consider Simmons as part of the roster anymore, which leaves Tobias Harris as the second-best player. Would Harris be the second-best player on any other team in the league?
Players like Curry, Green, Thybulle and Maxey would not start on any contender, but are regular starters for the Sixers. Korkmaz started yesterday, and he probably would not get picked up if he was waived tomorrow, Milton is probably the same (outside of covid ravaged teams top-ups).

Embiid is carrying them to a mid-seed in playoffs - I don't think there is another player in the league right now that could do that.


Goes to show you how much easier life is for him without Ben Simmons, he can finally show leadership and improve his passing now that offense is not 4 vs 5.


Embiid must have know this or felt it. But still wanted what everyone thought was best for the team BS playing. Show how much of a true leader and team player Joel is.
The Accession of Paul Reed is upon us !

You want it to be one way....but it's the other way.

Marlo
TheBallsDeeper
Starter
Posts: 2,010
And1: 2,112
Joined: Nov 20, 2017
       

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#349 » by TheBallsDeeper » Mon Jan 17, 2022 10:10 pm

eyeatoma wrote:
TheBallsDeeper wrote:
eyeatoma wrote:
Jokic stans would say Jokic, but I'm not very impressed with their record and I think our roster is just as bad if not worse than theirs. They tend to disagree on that part as well lol.

I think Jokic is fools gold.

Everyone gets way too excited about a 7 foot player making fancy passes, but Denver are not going to win a championship with him at center. Everyone dismisses Ben Simmons because he can not do one of the main skills needed for a guard, but Jokic has a similar issue as a center.

He's basically a 7 foot slow point guard, who can not really defend any position on the floor at a decent level. Teams need a good a defender at center, play-making can come from every position, but rim-protecting and elite defense come from the center. I don't care what his box scores look like, I think he is the most overrated player in the league and would take about 20 centers before him.


Haha, dare you to say this on the general board. They would have an aneurysm.

I would, but got banned from that place a while ago.

First Strike was for calling someone baiting people a troll
Second strike was for calling someone a racist piece of **** (he had said that if he sees a group of tall black people standing together he assumes they are about to rob him)
Third strike was for writing "stay quiet and let the adults talk" to a troll trying to derail a thread.

Apparently I have to write an apology to the head mod to be reinstated. Not interested.
eyeatoma
RealGM
Posts: 26,871
And1: 10,792
Joined: Feb 25, 2005
Location: An Indian in Indonesia
     

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#350 » by eyeatoma » Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:06 pm

TheBallsDeeper wrote:
eyeatoma wrote:
TheBallsDeeper wrote:I think Jokic is fools gold.

Everyone gets way too excited about a 7 foot player making fancy passes, but Denver are not going to win a championship with him at center. Everyone dismisses Ben Simmons because he can not do one of the main skills needed for a guard, but Jokic has a similar issue as a center.

He's basically a 7 foot slow point guard, who can not really defend any position on the floor at a decent level. Teams need a good a defender at center, play-making can come from every position, but rim-protecting and elite defense come from the center. I don't care what his box scores look like, I think he is the most overrated player in the league and would take about 20 centers before him.


Haha, dare you to say this on the general board. They would have an aneurysm.

I would, but got banned from that place a while ago.

First Strike was for calling someone baiting people a troll
Second strike was for calling someone a racist piece of **** (he had said that if he sees a group of tall black people standing together he assumes they are about to rob him)
Third strike was for writing "stay quiet and let the adults talk" to a troll trying to derail a thread.

Apparently I have to write an apology to the head mod to be reinstated. Not interested.
Lmao the general board is a cesspool. The reasons for you being banned sound ludicrous.

Sent from my SM-G998B using Tapatalk
eyeatoma
RealGM
Posts: 26,871
And1: 10,792
Joined: Feb 25, 2005
Location: An Indian in Indonesia
     

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#351 » by eyeatoma » Tue Jan 18, 2022 5:03 am

OMG, Chillz y'all!!!

Read on Twitter
Sportfan73
Assistant Coach
Posts: 3,905
And1: 1,315
Joined: Jun 18, 2015
   

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#352 » by Sportfan73 » Tue Jan 18, 2022 5:07 am

eyeatoma wrote:OMG, Chillz y'all!!!

Read on Twitter

Lillard is wack as hell for not wanting to play with Jo and preferring Ny. Everyone in the league who is even prospectively leaving their team should want to play with Joel over anyone
eyeatoma
RealGM
Posts: 26,871
And1: 10,792
Joined: Feb 25, 2005
Location: An Indian in Indonesia
     

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#353 » by eyeatoma » Thu Jan 20, 2022 3:49 am

We are not worthy!

Read on Twitter


MVP!!
Sixerscan
Senior Mod - 76ers
Senior Mod - 76ers
Posts: 33,658
And1: 16,011
Joined: Jan 25, 2005

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#354 » by Sixerscan » Thu Jan 20, 2022 5:14 am

He is so good
Wilfried
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,148
And1: 1,884
Joined: May 24, 2007

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#355 » by Wilfried » Thu Jan 20, 2022 7:49 am

This is why Morey cannot panic and sell Simmons for peanuts.
We have an MVP calibre player in his prime (given he can keep this up for 2-3 more seasons), we need to keep calm en keep our 'assets' (Simmons, Tobias' contract, ...) to get that second banana next to Embiid to really compete.
phifans
Veteran
Posts: 2,793
And1: 586
Joined: Feb 10, 2009
         

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#356 » by phifans » Thu Jan 20, 2022 8:38 am

Wilfried wrote:This is why Morey cannot panic and sell Simmons for peanuts.
We have an MVP calibre player in his prime (given he can keep this up for 2-3 more seasons), we need to keep calm en keep our 'assets' (Simmons, Tobias' contract, ...) to get that second banana next to Embiid to really compete.


Yeah but 2-3 years is not long enough for you to be calm and patient ...
Wilfried
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,148
And1: 1,884
Joined: May 24, 2007

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#357 » by Wilfried » Mon Jan 24, 2022 9:55 am

He's aiming for the scoring title, right?
phillynative
General Manager
Posts: 8,677
And1: 2,682
Joined: Dec 13, 2014

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#358 » by phillynative » Mon Jan 24, 2022 11:26 am

eyeatoma wrote:We are not worthy!

Read on Twitter


MVP!!


Wish they also charted the shot attempts as well.
Murray_17
RealGM
Posts: 11,430
And1: 9,784
Joined: Mar 20, 2020
   

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#359 » by Murray_17 » Tue Jan 25, 2022 9:48 pm



From the last Thinking Basketball pod
elchengue20
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,783
And1: 1,461
Joined: Aug 17, 2013

Re: Joel: unchained. 

Post#360 » by elchengue20 » Tue Jan 25, 2022 9:59 pm

Like i sayed and others have sayed here in the past, ofensively hes evolved into a 7 foot/280 Khawi Leonard. Thats fricking unstoppable.

The only one you could argue its better than him its KD, then no one else its close as a 1vs1 scorer.

We really have a top 5 player in the NBA and the best two player in the league. Hope we can finally put together a good roster around him who fits and play to his strenghts. I dont think he can sustain this level of play for more than 3 seasons, and there is always a pretty high injury risk with Biid.

Next offseason at the latest we have to go ALL IN and try to win NOW.

Return to Philadelphia 76ers