76ers 2023-24 Season Thread Part 1

[phillynative]

Compared to someone who shoots more than 3 a game.

Or provides secondary rim protection or can create his own shots near the end of the game and so forth and do on…

The latter two points have nothing to do with providing spacing for Joel.

As for the first point, if a wing or guard shoots less than three 3’s a game, maybe that’s affecting spacing. As a PF, that’s just normal. It’s like complaining that Aaron Gordon is affecting Jokic’s spacing.

Except Tobi makes about 20 more mil than Gordon and his best skillset is supposed to be his scoring.

[Sportfan73]

Third leading scorer during the playoffs last year on the 4 conference finalists

Boston - Smart 14.9 PPG
Heat - Vincent 12.7 PPG
Nuggets - Porter 13.4
Lakers - Reaves 16.9

For reference Tobias who has been seemingly invisible this year is averaging 17.2.

The top 2 guys get fed the ball in the playoffs and the others have to find other ways to contribute.

Problem is Tobias does NO good role player stuff either. He’s a horrible third option/role player guy

[Mik317]

Tobias' biggest issue is that he takes possessions to get going. And said possessions often entail slow post ups into a contested jumper. Those possesions suck when its our best player lol let alone our 3rd.

looking at the guys sixerscan posted...those guys got those points primarily as release valve semi high volume shooters. Tobias needs too much usage to get his at times. During his good run to start the year, he was shooting quickly, cutting and also pushing on the break....lately he has reverted to the clear out 1 on 1 post ups and maybe 1 often poorly timed 3.

But this is also why I don't think Siakam is that guy either. The "ideal" third guy is ironically an Oubre type chucker who competes on defense....or a prime Klay Thompson lol. Its not easy to find because most dudes want on ball reps or are terrible on defense. It also doesn't solve the lack of rim pressure outside 0f Maxey eiether.

Not fixing all of the issues with one dude...hopefully Morey realizes that but I doubt it.

[Sixerscan]

Third leading scorer during the playoffs last year on the 4 conference finalists

Boston - Smart 14.9 PPG
Heat - Vincent 12.7 PPG
Nuggets - Porter 13.4
Lakers - Reaves 16.9

For reference Tobias who has been seemingly invisible this year is averaging 17.2.

The top 2 guys get fed the ball in the playoffs and the others have to find other ways to contribute.

Problem is Tobias does NO good role player stuff either. He’s a horrible third option/role player guy

This was more about preferring to target a defense first guy in a trade instead of a scorer than anything to do with Tobias.

[Stanford]

It’s like complaining that Aaron Gordon is affecting Jokic’s spacing.

Joel needs a lot more spacing for his game to work than Jokic. Jokic makes his own space.

[76ciology]

Tobias has been hurting the spacing for Embiid to operate in the paint for the last 3 years

Compared to what? He was a PF spending almost all of his time in the corner, shooting 39% from 3 last year. Tobias had other flaws down the stretch last year, but if Embiid can’t find space with that scenario, it’s not on Tobi.

Im just raising my point by being sarcastic.

[Sixerscan]

People cover Tobias on the three point line regardless how how many 3s he’s taking I feel like. That’s what spacing actually is after all.

[76ciology]

My point is Siakam and Tobi are the same level of 3pt shooter.

If you think Tobi is not hurting our spacing, then so would Siakam.

And if you are worried about Siakam shooting 20% on 3, then you should also put some weight in evaluating Og’s performance and Tobi’s 3pt shooting this season.

[76ciology]

Watch these tapes.

Look at Tobi’s defender and Siakam’s defender

Spoiler:

Tobi

Watch on YouTube

Siakam

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Their defenders can’t just be on the paint because they would be called for defensive 3. And they respect their ability to be average corner 3s.

And when both Tobi and Siakam defender were leaving them, he has to keep looking at them because they can just cut to the basket.

[Mik317]

Siakam and Tobias are both guys who needs reps to truly impact but aren't good enough to truly warrant said reps but also can in theory do enough other things that you put up with it. Tobias for all of his many flaws was "fine" last playoff run. His issues come when the team needs him to do more and do it on demand....because our best players are AWOL lol. That and his contract is what makes it hard on him. He just aint that guy.

Siakam is similar but might be more capable of stepping up in said moments despite the similar flaws because he had been the guy for some playoff runs. The issue becomes the fact that he is due for a new contract and it could quickly become deja vu if he is just Cameroonian Tobias.

also I keep saying it...not sure he really likes Jo and apparently also may not like Nurse....and apparently we may not even like him so all of this could be moot lol.

[youngcrev]

Siakam and Tobias are both guys who needs reps to truly impact but aren't good enough to truly warrant said reps but also can in theory do enough other things that you put up with it. Tobias for all of his many flaws was "fine" last playoff run. His issues come when the team needs him to do more and do it on demand....because our best players are AWOL lol. That and his contract is what makes it hard on him. He just aint that guy.

Siakam is similar but might be more capable of stepping up in said moments despite the similar flaws because he had been the guy for some playoff runs. The issue becomes the fact that he is due for a new contract and it could quickly become deja vu if he is just Cameroonian Tobias.

also I keep saying it...not sure he really likes Jo and apparently also may not like Nurse....and apparently we may not even like him so all of this could be moot lol.

I don't think that's necessarily true of Siakam. He's put up accolades as the lead guy in Toronto, making 2 all star teams and 1 all NBA selection, but he was far more efficient in their championship year with lower usage (with Kawhi and Gasol operating in similar areas as Embiid). I think you get a better overall player if you move him down on the totem pole offensively, while obviously having more of an ability to carry a heavier load when necessary than Tobias. Toronto's offense has been surprisingly pretty good with him on the floor as the main guy over the last few years if you check his on/off numbers.

I imagine some of the negative views about him here has simply been that he hasn't been very good specifically against us. Same reason people seem to think Boucher is a lights out shooter. I think Embiid specifically presents problems for him since he can lay off of him and give him issues at the rim.

The shooting is obviously an issue, but he checks pretty much every other box we'd be looking in a 3rd guy. I get if that's enough for people to X him out, but I think you can find enough other things for him to do to make up for it.

[mjkvol]

The things that give me pause with OG are how much he will cost to trade for and re-sign. Is he worth $30+ mil annually? His advanced stats are meh and he's failed to develop any shot-creating ability.

$30 mil for a player just entering his prime, a legit 3&D guy who provides the wing defender we desperately need? Given where salaries are going, I'd say we'd be damn lucky to lock OG up for $30 mil.

[LeonJordanJr24]

We need another scorer more than anything we got 3 rn. Embiid,Maxey and Oubre.

We need another guard/wing with size .

We have plenty of forwards who can hold down the 4 spot if we move Tobias. Batum, Morris and Covington. Reed and Bamba at the 5 is fine. We have oubre and house at the 3 which is solid too. We need to add a third scorer who can ball handle some and allow melton to be 6th man.

[youngcrev]

The things that give me pause with OG are how much he will cost to trade for and re-sign. Is he worth $30+ mil annually? His advanced stats are meh and he's failed to develop any shot-creating ability.

$30 mil for a player just entering his prime, a legit 3&D guy who provides the wing defender we desperately need? Given where salaries are going, I'd say we'd be damn lucky to lock OG up for $30 mil.

30M would be great.

The idea of giving him 40+ is what gives me pause, and that feels like the direction his contract is going.

[ProcessDoctor]

The things that give me pause with OG are how much he will cost to trade for and re-sign. Is he worth $30+ mil annually? His advanced stats are meh and he's failed to develop any shot-creating ability.

$30 mil for a player just entering his prime, a legit 3&D guy who provides the wing defender we desperately need? Given where salaries are going, I'd say we'd be damn lucky to lock OG up for $30 mil.

30M would be great.

The idea of giving him 40+ is what gives me pause, and that feels like the direction his contract is going.

Exactly, he could get an offer *starting* 30% of the cap, which is ~$40 mil. Is he that good?

[Mik317]

OG is still about projection a bit. Like does he have some self creation ability locked away or something....his floor as one of the better defenders and a capable corner 3 guy is still a highly sought after skillset.

idk if he does tho

[fkd215]

Our biggest need right now is wing defense. We’re ranked 2nd on offensive rating but 15 to in defensive rating according to nba.com. So I’m in on OG, but also really like the idea of Dorian Finney -Smith, who would cost us less to acquire, leaving resources for another ball handler.

[Sportfan73]

Our biggest need right now is wing defense. We’re ranked 2nd on offensive rating but 15 to in defensive rating according to nba.com. So I’m in on OG, but also really like the idea of Dorian Finney -Smith, who would cost us less to acquire, leaving resources for another ball handler.

Rumors are they wanted two firsts last deadline and price may have gone UP from there. So I’m not sure he’d be so cheap

[ProcessDoctor]

If we want to use the assets by the deadline and get TWO forwards...


PHI out: Harris, Korkmaz, Martin, 2026 OKC 1st, 2028 LAC 1st, 2029 PHI 1st, two 2nds
PHI in: Anunoby, Grant

POR out: Grant, Brogdon
POR in: Harris, Korkmaz, Martin, 2026 OKC 1st, two 2nds via PHI

TOR out: Anunoby
TOR in: Brogdon, 2028 LAC 1st, 2029 PHI 1st


Maxey/Beverley/Springer
Oubre/Melton/Smith
Anunoby/Batum/House
Grant/Covington/Morris
Embiid/Reed/Bamba


Then next year anyone not named Maxey, Springer, Anunoby, Grant, Reed, or Embiid would have to return on a team-friendly deal, the MLE, or a vet min.

[Sixerscan]

If we want to use the assets by the deadline and get TWO forwards...


PHI out: Harris, Korkmaz, Martin, 2026 OKC 1st, 2028 LAC 1st, 2029 PHI 1st, two 2nds
PHI in: Anunoby, Grant

POR out: Grant, Brogdon
POR in: Harris, Korkmaz, Martin, 2026 OKC 1st, two 2nds via PHI

TOR out: Anunoby
TOR in: Brogdon, 2028 LAC 1st, 2029 PHI 1st


Maxey/Beverley/Springer
Oubre/Melton/Smith
Anunoby/Batum/House
Grant/Covington/Morris
Embiid/Reed/Bamba


Then next year anyone not named Maxey, Springer, Anunoby, Grant, Reed, or Embiid would have to return on a team-friendly deal, the MLE, or a vet min.

Think you’d need the new arena built for them to pay basically 4 maxes for years into the future like that.