So Now What? Post-Butler Plans

[gdog2004]

Brand has a great but tough job. He was gifted two stars with a challenging fit, and BC squandered most of the assets to complete the puzzle.

I think the best case scenario would be jimmy taking a slightly more reasonable contract to stay with us. If his value has taken a little dip this year, maybe we don’t have to go max years.

Brand also needs to stumble onto his own Middleton draft steal type of starter. Maybe a Lowry type prospect that needs a change of scenery...somebody who doesn’t cost us max money or a type 5 pick. Just finding value that others overlook.

Given Jimmy's comments that he doesn't plan to play forever, I think that is the most likely outcome - max contract but at 4 years instead of 5.

I think Jimmy needs to recognize that he is NOT a max player and not the best player on this team either.
He is very good, but this is Embiid and Ben's team. It will never be Jimmy's team because he's not THAT good.
If Kawhi or KD were here ? Different story.

[BullyKing]

Brand has a great but tough job. He was gifted two stars with a challenging fit, and BC squandered most of the assets to complete the puzzle.

I think the best case scenario would be jimmy taking a slightly more reasonable contract to stay with us. If his value has taken a little dip this year, maybe we don’t have to go max years.

Brand also needs to stumble onto his own Middleton draft steal type of starter. Maybe a Lowry type prospect that needs a change of scenery...somebody who doesn’t cost us max money or a type 5 pick. Just finding value that others overlook.

Given Jimmy's comments that he doesn't plan to play forever, I think that is the most likely outcome - max contract but at 4 years instead of 5.

I think Jimmy needs to recognize that he is NOT a max player and not the best player on this team either.
He is very good, but this is Embiid and Ben's team. It will never be Jimmy's team because he's not THAT good.
If Kawhi or KD were here ? Different story.

And I think you need to recognize that max salaries are not reserved for the best player on a team only but are merely a function of the market. Someone is offering Butler the max so if you want to keep him and not let him walk for nothing, that's going to be the price.

[NBA Moses]

No it won't lol. We gave away two huge pieces to sign him. We will offer him the full max regardless and he will likely take it. Reason he was desperate to get traded so he could be eligible for full max and not take 30m less in free agency.

2 wrongs dont make a right.

It would be catastrophic to re-sign Butler if he is a bad fit . What they gave up to get him is irrelevant and i wouldnt characterize Saric + Covongton as "HUGE PIECES".

[mplsfonz23]

Given Jimmy's comments that he doesn't plan to play forever, I think that is the most likely outcome - max contract but at 4 years instead of 5.

I think Jimmy needs to recognize that he is NOT a max player and not the best player on this team either.
He is very good, but this is Embiid and Ben's team. It will never be Jimmy's team because he's not THAT good.
If Kawhi or KD were here ? Different story.

And I think you need to recognize that max salaries are not reserved for the best player on a team only but are merely a function of the market. Someone is offering Butler the max so if you want to keep him and not let him walk for nothing, that's going to be the price.

Good post. This is what happened to Wiggins.
I think the thing here is Butler does think he's worth it, and will want a 5 year deal. I have said this before here and got savaged, but if the FO tries to lowball him, you may have a situation on your hands like we did.
If that happens, I think a sign and trade would be the only way to get something back.
The good news is, your team is in good shape cap wise that letting him walk for nothing won't hurt so bad.

[gdog2004]

Given Jimmy's comments that he doesn't plan to play forever, I think that is the most likely outcome - max contract but at 4 years instead of 5.

I think Jimmy needs to recognize that he is NOT a max player and not the best player on this team either.
He is very good, but this is Embiid and Ben's team. It will never be Jimmy's team because he's not THAT good.
If Kawhi or KD were here ? Different story.

And I think you need to recognize that max salaries are not reserved for the best player on a team only but are merely a function of the market. Someone is offering Butler the max so if you want to keep him and not let him walk for nothing, that's going to be the price.

I do recognize that BUT, how many teams do you think will offer 29-30 year old Jimmy Butler a max deal ?
He's not going to get any better you know ?

[VDT]

Unfortunately if Butler insists on a 5 year max he will get it simply because the FO would look like idiots if he leaves because of that. They are going to double down on that trade and hope he doesnt decline much or get injured in the next 5 year.

[LloydFree]

The next 3-4 months will dictate whether JImmy Butler + Sixers are in each others long term plans. At this stage in his career I'm hesitant whether Jimmy is a Max player but if the Sixers show well in the playoffs it will most likely happen.

Yup. Jimmys future here will be determined in the playoffs.

No it won't lol. We gave away two huge pieces to sign him. We will offer him the full max regardless and he will likely take it. Reason he was desperate to get traded so he could be eligible for full max and not take 30m less in free agency.

He wanted to have the opportunity to get the full max. But the 76ers shouldn't do it. The 4 year Max, is too much for him but that's just the price of doing business. But the 76ers can't give him that 5th year. They cannot allow themselves to be on the hook for 45 million to a 35 year old Butler, just as Embiid heads into Free-agency. It would be poor planning.

[ProcessDoctor]

Other teams can only offer Butler a 4-year max, so does he really have that much leverage if he wants 5 years? Our 4-year max offer would still be more than any other teams.

[gdog2004]

I would take a hard look at Dennis Smith Jr and cut ties completely with Fultz. He can definitely get his own shot and hopefully will make better decisions down the road. But he is talented.

[BullyKing]

I think Jimmy needs to recognize that he is NOT a max player and not the best player on this team either.
He is very good, but this is Embiid and Ben's team. It will never be Jimmy's team because he's not THAT good.
If Kawhi or KD were here ? Different story.

And I think you need to recognize that max salaries are not reserved for the best player on a team only but are merely a function of the market. Someone is offering Butler the max so if you want to keep him and not let him walk for nothing, that's going to be the price.

I do recognize that BUT, how many teams do you think will offer 29-30 year old Jimmy Butler a max deal ?
He's not going to get any better you know ?

It only takes one team and there's a ton of teams with max space and only a couple players who will definitely be more in demand (Kawhi, Durant, Klay?). Butler is no doubt getting a max offer from someone.

[Sixerscan]

The way people talk about max contracts is the weirdest thing. It's an artificial construct literally designed to put a *CAP* on how much players can make.

If Butler's max was 35% and he only got 30% people wouldn't have an issue. But because his max is 30% suddenly it's a "max" and there's discussion of whether he's a "max" player.

[BullyKing]

The way people talk about max contracts is the weirdest thing. It's an artificial construct literally designed to put a *CAP* on how much players can make.

If Butler's max was 35% and he only got 30% people wouldn't have an issue. But because his max is 30% suddenly it's a "max" and there's discussion of whether he's a "max" player.

It's the reductive fallacy that since AD is only making X and Butler is not as good as AD, then Butler cannot be worth X. As you point out, the problem with this thinking isn't that Butler isn't worth X, its that AD is worth much more than X but that's all he can be paid.

[Negrodamus]

https://www.reddit.com/r/sixers/comments/aj6nr0/zach_lowe_and_jackie_macmullan_on_jimmy_butler/

Interesting.

[Mik317]

yall know what time it is

[76ciology]

yall know what time it is

Post game party

[sixerguy]

Given Jimmy's comments that he doesn't plan to play forever, I think that is the most likely outcome - max contract but at 4 years instead of 5.

I think Jimmy needs to recognize that he is NOT a max player and not the best player on this team either.
He is very good, but this is Embiid and Ben's team. It will never be Jimmy's team because he's not THAT good.
If Kawhi or KD were here ? Different story.

And I think you need to recognize that max salaries are not reserved for the best player on a team only but are merely a function of the market. Someone is offering Butler the max so if you want to keep him and not let him walk for nothing, that's going to be the price.

This [bolded] seems to be the biggest culprit of how bad GMs think. It ain't "nothing" if you consider saving 35 million a year on your cap. We learned this with Mutombo right? I'd be perfectly fine with taken a step back one year to move forward again the next. I'm not betting the next 4-5 years of our future on Jimmy Butler, let him go to another team.

[still in payne]

We may be in luck for the Denver game. Jokic and Harris got off the bench during a tussle between Plumlee and Favors. Announcers wondering if there will be the normal 1 game suspensions.

[phifans]

I think Jimmy needs to recognize that he is NOT a max player and not the best player on this team either.
He is very good, but this is Embiid and Ben's team. It will never be Jimmy's team because he's not THAT good.
If Kawhi or KD were here ? Different story.

And I think you need to recognize that max salaries are not reserved for the best player on a team only but are merely a function of the market. Someone is offering Butler the max so if you want to keep him and not let him walk for nothing, that's going to be the price.

This [bolded] seems to be the biggest culprit of how bad GMs think. It ain't "nothing" if you consider saving 35 million a year on your cap. We learned this with Mutombo right? I'd be perfectly fine with taken a step back one year to move forward again the next. I'm not betting the next 4-5 years of our future on Jimmy Butler, let him go to another team.

35 million on your cap is meanningless if you dont use it. What actually matters is how you use these cap if you dont want to spend it on Jimmy. And no cap space wont be there forever just because you dont use it so that "taken a step back" theory also wont work.

[BullyKing]

I think Jimmy needs to recognize that he is NOT a max player and not the best player on this team either.
He is very good, but this is Embiid and Ben's team. It will never be Jimmy's team because he's not THAT good.
If Kawhi or KD were here ? Different story.

And I think you need to recognize that max salaries are not reserved for the best player on a team only but are merely a function of the market. Someone is offering Butler the max so if you want to keep him and not let him walk for nothing, that's going to be the price.

This [bolded] seems to be the biggest culprit of how bad GMs think. It ain't "nothing" if you consider saving 35 million a year on your cap. We learned this with Mutombo right? I'd be perfectly fine with taken a step back one year to move forward again the next. I'm not betting the next 4-5 years of our future on Jimmy Butler, let him go to another team.

Well, you can't just save it for next year. So unless you're getting Kawhi or Durant, there's no better way to use it.

[sixerguy]

And I think you need to recognize that max salaries are not reserved for the best player on a team only but are merely a function of the market. Someone is offering Butler the max so if you want to keep him and not let him walk for nothing, that's going to be the price.

This [bolded] seems to be the biggest culprit of how bad GMs think. It ain't "nothing" if you consider saving 35 million a year on your cap. We learned this with Mutombo right? I'd be perfectly fine with taken a step back one year to move forward again the next. I'm not betting the next 4-5 years of our future on Jimmy Butler, let him go to another team.

35 million on your cap is meanningless if you dont use it. What actually matters is how you use these cap if you dont want to spend it on Jimmy. And no cap space wont be there forever just because you dont use it so that "taken a step back" theory also wont work.

I'd wager that teams that "let a player walk for nothing" had a better record overall 4-5 years later than teams that resigned the player. The NBA is filled with examples of this - it's short-term thinking, GMs make signings in fear of their job, of having losing seasons so they mortgage the future by making these Otto Porter moves. And it's also not human nature to "sell high and buy low". The good GMs do it though.