Fantasy Trade Thread 2019-2020 Post Season

[51X3RF4N]

My thing is if Charlotte will take Horford and #21 for Zeller and Rozier, you have to take it.

[Kobblehead]

Nah, I can't give up #21 for Rozier.

If they don't want to take Horford, then do Richardson plus salary.

You can't let 4 drafts go by and only have Matisse Thybulle to show for it. That's how franchises crash and burn.

[stormi]

https://arjb10.shinyapps.io/radialplots/

Using comparative plots to compare targets we've been discussing recently.

Lavine isn't chasms away from Beal

Richardsons metrics portray very little on court impact from him

Hield is underrated

Acquire CP3 at all costs

[Kobblehead]

Other than Chris Paul, none of those guys are going to solve our halfcourt shotcreation woes IMO.

All three of Beal, Lavine and Hield rely on offense being run for them as opposed to scoring off the dribble against primary defenders.

Go get Jrue Holiday, Chris Paul or John Wall. Those three guys are far more likely to be a real solution IMO.

[DT RAW]

How does zach lavine not score off the dribble. Wut

[VDT]

Wall is laughable, i would not want him even in his prime, let alone now. Jrue also doesnt really help us much with perimeter creating imo, at least if you want to win a title. Paul has the talent but at 35 he is limited. Mind you, no one of the above is really a scorer. From those that you mentioned Beal has probably the best combination of skills and age. From those potentially available i would prefer Harden.

Alternatively, we could potentially trade for both Beal and Paul, however i feel that the Wizards would want to try to win with this core one more time and that Paul is going to another team that can offer more.

[stormi]

John Wall in 2020. I'm dying

[BullyKing]

You know my original reaction was to laugh off the idea of someone like Wall as well but really... we are in such a bad place that our only option might be to go after someone that everyone believes is cooked and just hope for a bounce back. Like I'm not sure if we have the assets where we could actually reasonably afford to get someone like CP3 and so we need to be trying to find the next CP3.

[youngcrev]

John Wall was a good player, but even before the injuries he would have been a bad fit Embiid and Simmons. And with 3 years, 133M remaining with a 15% trade kicker, I just can't see taking on that risk when I don't even think the best case scenario would be that great.

[VDT]

It is likely that we dont have the assets to get Paul.

But Wall is not a good candidate to bet on. For one he is not a good fit even in his prime. Simmons, Embiid and Wall need the ball in their hands and they dont really space the floor. Harris, if he is not part of the trade needs the ball also. It will just make the team chemistry worse and we will be straightforward to defend, just pack the paint. Moreover, Wall is not in his prime, he had a serious injury and chances are he is not going to be nearly as good, if not completely washed up, as he was, especially since he relies on his athleticism a lot. Even if he is able to return to a solid level of play with no further injuries (highly unlikely) his first year back he is going to be pretty bad and that's almost a certainty. He has played less than 80 games in the last 3+ years and by the time the season starts he will have been out of the court for more than two straight years, he will need most if not all of the first year just to get used to playing a gain.

You also have to think that OKC taking Paul is completely different because they were not trying to win and they got a lot of picks as compensation. The risk vs reward was completely different. With Wall i see mainly risk and almost no reward.

[ProcessDoctor]

NOP out: Holiday, Hart
NOP in: Richardson, Barnes, Korkmaz, #21, 2022 PHI 1st

PHI out: Harris, Richardson, Korkmaz, #21, NYK 2021 2nd, 2022 PHI 1st
PHI in: Holiday, Hield

SAC out: Hield, Barnes
SAC in: Harris, Hart, 2021 NYK 2nd

[skulky]

I don’t think cp3 has enough left in the tank to get us there. I also have serious concerns of cp3, embiid, and Simmons all being on the court when it matters most. If a deal wasn’t going to cost us Thybulle and multiple first round picks it would be more appealing. I just think it’s a desperate move that would burry us.

I think we need to look towards Daryl Morey in Houston and just winning in the margins. Big priority being to move horford at minimal cost. The team obviously made a lot of mistakes. We’re going to need to make smart little moves to build back up. I think one of the bigger mistakes was to give away our young role players or not sign any solid complimentary role players in hopes of maximizing cap space for a star that never came, and then just using all that cap space on 2 higher end role players that aren’t great fits. Having some of those mid tier contracts makes a big trade much easier. I do really like horford to Charlotte for rozier and zeller, depending on the sweetener on our end. The trade has the added benefit of having 2 much more moveable contracts. Zeller being a 15 mil expiring and rozier 2 years at about 18 mil.

[Kobblehead]

Wait, are we sad about losing Jimmy or are we still attaching mythical value to "fit?" Because it doesn't make sense for both to be true.

Wall is among the best defenders in the NBA and is a blur in the halfcourt scoring off the dribble. He's a walking Finals MVP archetype. I think it's crazy to poo poo the idea of adding him.

It's not like every other player being discussed doesn't have durability concerns and bloated contracts. At least if we hit on Wall, it presents the highest potential reward out of all these guys.

[VDT]

Wall had an achilles injury and hasnt stepped foot on the court for two years. What exactly are people expecting from him? He is also paid 45 mil for the next three years.

The fit is absolutely an issue and it would be an issue with Butler. There is only one ball and keeping Butler would ultimately mean that we would have to move Simmons. I prefer Paul without doubt, whether we can get him is another question.

[51X3RF4N]

Wall had an achilles injury and hasnt stepped foot on the court for two years. What exactly are people expecting from him? He is also paid 45 mil for the next three years.

The fit is absolutely an issue and it would be an issue with Butler. There is only one ball and keeping Butler would ultimately mean that we would have to move Simmons. I prefer Paul without doubt, whether we can get him is another question.

We should have moved Simmons and kept Butler with JJ and Joel. We could have gotten a nice package for Ben last off-season, and Brett might still have his job as his team might be on the brink of sweeping the Bucks in the 2nd round on Jimmy's back...

[Kobblehead]

Wall had an achilles injury and hasnt stepped foot on the court for two years. What exactly are people expecting from him? He is also paid 45 mil for the next three years.

The fit is absolutely an issue and it would be an issue with Butler. There is only one ball and keeping Butler would ultimately mean that we would have to move Simmons. I prefer Paul without doubt, whether we can get him is another question.

2013 Dwayne Wade, at the minimum.

Which is still a 6'4" 210 pound playoff monster that can score off the dribble and lock guys down on the perimeter (the only two traits that matter in playoff basketball).

[VDT]

Wall had an achilles injury and hasnt stepped foot on the court for two years. What exactly are people expecting from him? He is also paid 45 mil for the next three years.

The fit is absolutely an issue and it would be an issue with Butler. There is only one ball and keeping Butler would ultimately mean that we would have to move Simmons. I prefer Paul without doubt, whether we can get him is another question.

2013 Dwayne Wade, at the minimum.

Which is still a 6'4" 210 pound playoff monster that can score off the dribble and lock guys down on the perimeter (the only two traits that matter in playoff basketball).

That's wishful thinking. Wall was probably never as good as regular season 2013 Wade in terms of scoring. There is only one comparable year, which was Wall's career year.

Wall is a career 19 ppg scorer on 51.9% TS. This means that he should shoot less if he wants to help his team. And these stats were up to when he was 28 years old. His best year was 4 years ago, since then he has been declining and the last two years he hasnt played a single game (since Dec 18). And he had an achilles injury, the most serious basketball injury.

I find players of his archetype (Rose, Westbrook, Wall), athletic pgs with bad shooting and questionable basketball iq as limiting a team's potential. They can carry a team to a degree but they dont work well in a team oriented offense and their impact rapidly diminishes as you get more stars on the team and their usage is reduced.

I genuinely dont see any advantage in getting Wall. Horrific fit, questionable health and a huge contract with disproportionately low level of play.

[Kobblehead]

Fit and spacing look pretty in the regular season but that doesn't do jack in the playoffs.

You need guys that can guard their position and score off the dribble. All that other stuff is fluff. Wall performs those two traits better than almost anyone at his position. Walking Finals MVP archetype.

If you think Paul's shooting and scoring efficiency makes him a better target, that's fine. He's also like 6'1" and 35 and would cost more to acquire because his current trade value is higher.

[the_process]

If you can get Washington to add decent value to a Wall/Harris deal, for example a 9 for 21 swap, it’s an avenue definitely worth exploring.

[ProcessDoctor]

I would easily do Harris for Wall. There’s no upside with Harris. Put two shooters between Wall, Simmons, and Embiid and we’d be fine. It’s not like Harris has been a sharp-shooter since arriving here.