Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 6

[zaz102]

It's just so weird how bad this guy wants to get traded to a lottery team.

I'm guessing, but i think a big part of it is he figured his time was up in Philly anyway and was just trying to get a little control. I'm going to guess it hasn't really turned out like he'd like and is just looking for anywhere but here at this point.

[FireMorey]

If you'd take McCollum over Kyrie, you've lost the plot. Insanity. Fox or Lavine you could argue, but I think both are highly unlikely.

There really aren't a lot of realistic names left, that's the problem. In what world would the Kings or Bulls think Simmons makes them a better team than Fox or Lavine.

Kyrie feels like the only star star you could get. Otherwise, Sexton, Beasley & Russell, Levert & picks, Anunoby maybe, Kuminga and picks. Don't think there's much else on the table.

Outside of Kyrie, Sexton probably remains the best likely get.

[DCasey91]

I'd do Ingram for Ben, but I'm way more interested in Fox. I do think there are still limitations with Ingram while Fox is near a perfect fit with Embiid and the way our team is currently constructed.

I can’t quite get the reasoning here. I’m more inclined to go for the Fisher/Kobe/Shaq approach then go for a high usage guard one. Embiid ain’t a PNR big man operator.

Both aren’t defenders but Ingram has size, but aren’t great shooters but once again Ingram has size and can shoot over the top and is a better shooter anyway.

I see more limitations with Fox than with Ingram imo.

I’m saying give 40+ shots to Embiid/Ingram and clog the game up it’s a simple approach but that’s what we need.

Get a Pritchard as the PG who just sets up the two and shoots all day long.

[Mik317]

Kyrie is also not realistic.

Neither team wants to make the other better for one...and most teams don't want to bail the nets out period.
Kyrie is also a flight risk...not than Ben isn't lol but it is something to take into consideration.

Honestly not sure what is realistic at this stage tho. The Petty Betty in me don't want to send him to Minny because he might be happy about that and Kat and DLo and even Edwards would shield him. I want him to "get his wish" and go somewhere and be the man...but being petty doesn't help anyone.

There are very few deals I'd say no to right now tho lol. So over this whole thing ha

[Mik317]

I'd do Ingram for Ben, but I'm way more interested in Fox. I do think there are still limitations with Ingram while Fox is near a perfect fit with Embiid and the way our team is currently constructed.

I can’t quite the reasoning here. I’m more inclined to go for the Fisher/Kobe/Shaq approach then go for a high usage guard one. Embiid ain’t a PNR big man operator.

Both aren’t defenders but Ingram has size, but aren’t great shooters but once again Ingram has size and can shoot over the top and is a better shooter anyway.

I see more limitations with Fox than with Ingram imo.

I’m saying give 40+ shots to Embiid/Ingram and clog the game up it’s a simple approach but that’s what we need.

Get a Pritchard as the PG who just sets up the two and shoots all day long.

This is based off of nothing but hopes and dreams but you could in theory make the argument that Jo doesn't need a "real" PG; just needs capable passers and willing shooters. Korkmaz is not that but you saw the outline of that type of player. Ingram doesn't fully fit that either as he has settled into more of a mid range guy than 3pter IIRC. He's actually a better Tobias in terms of offensive skillset...but again I don't see the Pels trading him any time soon with Zion pulling the Mik challenge and being a fat slob...so it s a moot point more than likely.

[Negrodamus]

I'd do Ingram for Ben, but I'm way more interested in Fox. I do think there are still limitations with Ingram while Fox is near a perfect fit with Embiid and the way our team is currently constructed.

I can’t quite get the reasoning here. I’m more inclined to go for the Fisher/Kobe/Shaq approach then go for a high usage guard one. Embiid ain’t a PNR big man operator.

Both aren’t defenders but Ingram has size, but aren’t great shooters but once again Ingram has size and can shoot over the top and is a better shooter anyway.

I see more limitations with Fox than with Ingram imo.

I’m saying give 40+ shots to Embiid/Ingram and clog the game up it’s a simple approach but that’s what we need.

Get a Pritchard as the PG who just sets up the two and shoots all day long.

Because Ingram shies away from contact and takes fadeaway midrange shots. He's also not the distributor that Fox is. I'm fine with either, but Fox gets into the lane on his own and pulls the defense towards him while Ingram is great at getting off his own shot. Embiid would feast around the basket on dumpoffs and missed shots.

I don't see Ingram maximizing Embiid quite as much as Fox would. Both would be an insanely better fit than Ben, however.

[Tomjas]

Some of you have had emotions cloud your judgement

Simmons wasn’t going to play again

Morey is an idiot

Joel is no leader

All are true

[Stanford]

Some of you have had emotions cloud your judgement

saj mot

[Mik317]

lol.

its impressive that the spiciest thing you can say about Ben is that he won't show up.

Jo's comments aren't a great look. Morey asking for the world is dumb too and bit us in the ass. Yep. And yet you constantly act like those are the bigger issues...when they aren't. Ben has 4 years left on his deal and is acting like a child right now. This specific situation has more to say about Ben than it does Morey or Jo. Constantly going "b-but they are mean toooo" is simply not the great point you think it is.

Yeah everyone involved messed this up....but one guy has a bigger role to play than you constantly act. That is in fact Ben's biggest issue...its never him...its always someone else...something else needs to change or be different. And yeah in some aspects sure....but dude has to step up eventually, no?

[DCasey91]

I'd do Ingram for Ben, but I'm way more interested in Fox. I do think there are still limitations with Ingram while Fox is near a perfect fit with Embiid and the way our team is currently constructed.

I can’t quite get the reasoning here. I’m more inclined to go for the Fisher/Kobe/Shaq approach then go for a high usage guard one. Embiid ain’t a PNR big man operator.

Both aren’t defenders but Ingram has size, but aren’t great shooters but once again Ingram has size and can shoot over the top and is a better shooter anyway.

I see more limitations with Fox than with Ingram imo.

I’m saying give 40+ shots to Embiid/Ingram and clog the game up it’s a simple approach but that’s what we need.

Get a Pritchard as the PG who just sets up the two and shoots all day long.

Because Ingram shies away from contact and takes fadeaway midrange shots. He's also not the distributor that Fox is. I'm fine with either, but Fox gets into the lane on his own and pulls the defense towards him while Ingram is great at getting off his own shot. Embiid would feast around the basket on dumpoffs and missed shots.

I don't see Ingram maximizing Embiid quite as much as Fox would. Both would be an insanely better fit than Ben, however.

Can I counterpoint?

A slashing guard who isn’t a great shooter/sub average defender with Embiid isn’t the best course fo action to me but I could be wrong.

Ingram’s midrange has value in closed off playoff settings. His FTR is fine, his size is more than fine on both ends (adv Ingram over Fox).

Also speed plays a factor, more halfcourt centric offense for Embiid please. It’s going to be ISO heavy so there is overlap but for me Fox isn’t efficient enough to offset that fact.

Now to the playmaking ability there is truth to that but I don’t find Fox to be a premier setup man because if he was the Kings should be a far better team. I see him more of a slashing SG masquerading as a PG. Butler is Fox’s mould + bringing in really good defense, more physical, and draws a lot more fouls.

Overall to me and we can stay firm on who we prefer (nothing wrong with Fox) I see more min/max with the Embiid/Ingram duo. Would mean Harris has to finally go. (But he should be gone anyway).

[Negrodamus]

“He enters the facility and ignores most 76ers staffers. For instance, when the 76ers’ security official greeted Simmons on Sunday, the three-time All-Star just walked right by him. When others greet him, Simmons typically has given no response. It’s not a requirement for Simmons to talk to people inside the facility, but those present say he has been disengaged and not an active participant.“

In Simmons’ first meeting with team personnel last week, a meeting that included Rivers, president of basketball operations Daryl Morey and general manager Elton Brand, sources said Simmons reiterated that he was not mentally ready to rejoin the team after the past several months.

The 76ers are not trying to move Simmons and have made clear that they will not deal him at this time, according to sources. The franchise wants Simmons to show up to practices and games, to be engaged and to perform to his capabilities. Simmons is not against playing, but he is not mentally ready yet, sources insist.

"On Sunday and Monday, he completed less than a handful of total defensive drills at practice — nothing more, nothing less. He played a few defensive stands in a scrimmage on Sunday. On Monday, Simmons participated in one drill, talking more to G League coaches than his 76ers coaches as the first team went through preparation for the opener in New Orleans with Tyrese Maxey in Simmons’ place in the starting lineup, sources said. Throughout his first two days of practice, Simmons did not sprint in a live scrimmage setting. He conducted some one-on-one work with coaches, working up a sweat.

https://theathletic.com/2900382/2021/10/19/ben-simmons-and-sixers-at-odds-again-whats-been-going-on-at-practices-and-whats-next-for-both-sides/

[Stanford]

Jo's comments aren't a great look.

Oh, please. Every one of us would say something much worse than anything Joel has said. He's been tame considering the man he's talking about.

[Kobblehead]

I'll take Ingram over Fox, but I'll happily take either.

Fox is a better positional defender so he offers two-way play that Ingram can't.

However, Ingram is a far better floor spacer and on/off threat. Also, Ingram presents a lot more mismatches because there's very few players that tall that can guard an elite shotcreator like him.

[DCasey91]

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Remember Ingram plays on a team with poor floor spacing. Fox on the otherhand had very good spacing. Halfcourt playoff play I think Ingram will shine.

They do have similarities in their games. It’s Ingram for me (btw he’s has the Sixers clogged setup for two seasons now so he’d be very used to it lol which isn’t a great thing).

[Kobblehead]

Jo's comments aren't a great look.

Nah, I like this from him. Far more geniune and less phony that the junk he was spewing earlier in the offseason with his halfassed diplomatic comments about Ben and how the fans should be better.

[Negrodamus]

I can’t quite get the reasoning here. I’m more inclined to go for the Fisher/Kobe/Shaq approach then go for a high usage guard one. Embiid ain’t a PNR big man operator.

Both aren’t defenders but Ingram has size, but aren’t great shooters but once again Ingram has size and can shoot over the top and is a better shooter anyway.

I see more limitations with Fox than with Ingram imo.

I’m saying give 40+ shots to Embiid/Ingram and clog the game up it’s a simple approach but that’s what we need.

Get a Pritchard as the PG who just sets up the two and shoots all day long.

Because Ingram shies away from contact and takes fadeaway midrange shots. He's also not the distributor that Fox is. I'm fine with either, but Fox gets into the lane on his own and pulls the defense towards him while Ingram is great at getting off his own shot. Embiid would feast around the basket on dumpoffs and missed shots.

I don't see Ingram maximizing Embiid quite as much as Fox would. Both would be an insanely better fit than Ben, however.

Can I counterpoint?

A slashing guard who isn’t a great shooter/sub average defender with Embiid isn’t the best course fo action to me but I could be wrong.

Ingram’s midrange has value in closed off playoff settings. His FTR is fine, his size is more than fine on both ends (adv Ingram over Fox).

Also speed plays a factor, more halfcourt centric offense for Embiid please. It’s going to be ISO heavy so there is overlap but for me Fox isn’t efficient enough to offset that fact.

Now to the playmaking ability there is truth to that but I don’t find Fox to be a premier setup man because if he was the Kings should be a far better team. I see him more of a slashing SG masquerading as a PG. Butler is Fox’s mould + bringing in really good defense, more physical, and draws a lot more fouls.

Overall to me and we can stay firm on who we prefer (nothing wrong with Fox) I see more min/max with the Embiid/Ingram duo. Would mean Harris has to finally go. (But he should be gone anyway).

Of course you can counterpoint. Here's my counterpoint to your counterpoint:

-Fox is actually a better shooter (percentage-wise) from everywhere on the court other than 3FG and 16ft-3FG than Ingram.
-Fox also is assisted on 16% of his 2FG, 52% 3FG; Ingram 37% 2FG, 79% 3FG. Difficulty on shots is harder for Fox.
-Defensively, Fox has a 2.1 STL% compared to Ingrams 1.0 STL%. Defense is deflections and turnovers which Fox is decidedly better.

Fox also hasn't played with good players yet.

[Philly2good]

Imagine thinking we will get Fox or Ingram for Simmons

[KramerDSP]

I can’t see New Orleans trading for Ben Simmons with the express purpose of making Zion Williamson happy. Zion needs a stretch 5 so that he can play like Barkley.

[spikeslovechild]

this will def come up in the next CBA

Darryl stay un-intentionally making enemies lol. Agents will be pissed and then we really won't get any players then hurr durr (jk)

Lol other agents hate rich paul

[ProcessDoctor]

I think the only way Fox becomes available is if the Kings start off horribly. They're a franchise in need of a playoff appearance, but they probably feel no pressure to move Fox right now.