Hinkie in Hindsight?

[aHealthy3]

It's hard to fault Hinkie too much for the Okafor pick, his only real blunder in hindsight. At the time I wanted Mudiay, but he hasn't looked great and it's easy to see how the pressure of Embiid being out another year at the time influenced that pick. Another thing I disagreed with at the time was picking Dario over Zach Lavine, and I think at this point we'd make that swap pretty easily, but I'm certainly not upset about having Dario here. Honestly though, still kind of surprised that Sam didn't go for Lavine. Freak athlete in college who could already hit the 3 at a decent clip, and knowing our other pick Embiid wasn't going to play would seemingly make him even more appealing than another stash. Lavine would be a perfect fit with our core right now

Every trade he ever made was probably a win, with the Kings deal being his final gift to us, the gift that keeps on giving. Really wish we had Sam here to deal with the logjam of bigs because he obviously had a plan for it, while BC pretty much just came in and botched that whole situation.

[kriss73]

Sign me up not to prefer Lavine over Saric yet.
Saric had played overseas for 2 years, but he has just started to play in the nba and, most important, to live in USA.

Of course he has nowhere near the athleticism of Lavine but I have a feeling that he is a better overall basketball player.

Lavine is a great scorer, nice dunker, but what else?

We complain about Saric's defense, but what about Lavine's?
Is TT happy?

Time will tell

[kriss73]

Yesterday night showed what I meant about Dario

[jbent87]

Yesterday night showed what I meant about Dario

yesterday is why Dario was a fantastic pick, even if he never becomes more than a 6th man. He put the team on his back during a crucial 5 minute run in the 4th quarter and the entire team rallied behind him.

But again, I guess he's never coming over.

[Skates]

Rudy Gay's torn Achilles' tendon says hello and how does that pick swap option look now?

[ZzAzZ]

Was fuming when we traded Jrue Holiday for about an hour and been a Hinkie fan ever since that hour passed and I actually thought about it.

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[HartfordWhalers]

Bringing back Jrue (for free in free agency) would be hysterical.

[Unbreakable99]

This is a great article about Hinkie from 2015. Read the last line in the article very carefully. I know we aren't there yet and need more pieces but I think we can say we all now know.

http://www.businessinsider.com/sam-hinkie-explains-sixers-tanking-plan-2015-2

When asked when he'll know when the rebuilding process is complete and he has the right players in place, Hinkie responded ominously, "We'll all know. We'll all know."

[ZzAzZ]

This is a great article about Hinkie from 2015. Read the last line in the article very carefully. I know we aren't there yet and need more pieces but I think we can say we all now know.

http://www.businessinsider.com/sam-hinkie-explains-sixers-tanking-plan-2015-2

When asked when he'll know when the rebuilding process is complete and he has the right players in place, Hinkie responded ominously, "We'll all know. We'll all know."

I remember the quote that sold me on Hinkie was when he said he's not the type of guy you'd wanna watch a game with because he's more concerned with whether a shot should have gone in rather than if it did or not.

That's pretty much all I care about offensively and defensively. If you play good defense, I can live with a made shot and if you take a good shot, I can live with it not going in. I can't handle the other way around though, even if shots are falling for us and not for them. I love that a gm would think that way like a coach would.

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[OleSchool]

Bringing back Jrue (for free in free agency) would be hysterical.

We could use another defensive wing, isnt Iggy a FA too?

[SexDrugsPnR]

This is a great article about Hinkie from 2015. Read the last line in the article very carefully. I know we aren't there yet and need more pieces but I think we can say we all now know.

http://www.businessinsider.com/sam-hinkie-explains-sixers-tanking-plan-2015-2

When asked when he'll know when the rebuilding process is complete and he has the right players in place, Hinkie responded ominously, "We'll all know. We'll all know."

thanks for digging that up. i remember that press conference and especially that last line very well and now i would agree the time has come when we all know. you can already see that this is not linear growth the team is showing. this is exponential improvement.

[jbent87]

keep bumping these Hinkie articles. It's almost spooky how level headed he approached this entire process, with the CORRECT foresight he had. Which makes the outrage against him throughout, that much more ridiculous. How can you look back at anything he said and say he was wrong, or out of line?

"We will not bat a thousand on every single draft pick. We also have them by the bushelful, in part, because of that. We don't have any hubris that we will get them all right. We're not certain that we have an enormous edge over anybody else. In some cases, we might not have an edge at all."

The easy resolution regarding that quote is that he batted .500 on draft picks in Simmons, Embiid, Nerlens, Okafor. When you consider that the latter 2 players are not done growing and cannot legitimately be called failures yet, and not even considering Dario or what is still yet to come, it just makes you shake your head. How were people so angered by such a common sense approach to this rebuild? It doesn't make sense.

[aHealthy3]

Sign me up not to prefer Lavine over Saric yet.
Saric had played overseas for 2 years, but he has just started to play in the nba and, most important, to live in USA.

Of course he has nowhere near the athleticism of Lavine but I have a feeling that he is a better overall basketball player.

Lavine is a great scorer, nice dunker, but what else?

We complain about Saric's defense, but what about Lavine's?
Is TT happy?

Time will tell

Lavine is a 21 year old guard with freak athleticism who is already averaging 20 on solid efficiency, shooting over 40% from 3. Not good on D yet but has some tools to grow on that end. He's made significant strides every year since he's been drafted, and is still a full year younger than Dario. I like Dario as well, but with all respect, in our current situation I'm making that swap pretty easily.

[Dupp]

He was a great Gm

[Ericb5]

This depends on your definition of franchise player. I thought about this recently and posted it elsewhere but I'm defining franchise player aka superstar as a player that can be a #1 on a championship team. In the current NBA I count 8 players that currently fit that description: Curry, Lebron, Durant, Kawhi, Harden, CP3, Westbrook, Paul George... I put Porzingis in a category of other young players with star but not superstar potential - these guys likely top out as #2s on a championship squad. Other members include Jokic, Russell, Booker, Wiggins, Ingram. It's not impossible that one of these guys makes a huge jump and moves up a tier in the future but this is how I'm projecting them currently.

That's basically my definition too. Stars are all stars. Superstars/franchise players are guys that will contend for an MVP award.

I can't tell if you guys are being serious. There are 8-10 players who are real superstars, so then everyone one else who's either good or promising is in one other tier? Seems like self-serving sour grapes.

Porzingis might never make it to legit MVP candidate status but any tier system that throws him in with Ingram--who hasn't been remotely good at all and aside from length has zero special attributes--seems designed to not see either how good he is now and his likely ceiling. I get that your point is 'someday these 8 guys could be secondary all-stars' but lumping together some guys who are already terrific players with some other top 3 picks who've been mediocre at best seems like it's designed to make us feel great about having a potential elite Embiid while shrugging off everyone else we didn't get.

(Also what would Anthony Davis need to do to get to your 'superstar' category? 29/12/2 (and 1.5 st/2.5 bl) on great efficiency, while playing on a team that has maybe 3-4 real NBA players (and singlehandedly dragging them out of the cellar). Not sure how someone like Paul George is outplaying him.)

Porzingis and Ingram are similar ceiling players imo. They both have the potential to turn into all stars.

That doesn't mean that Ingram is as good as Porzingis is today, but neither of them are all stars yet.


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[kriss73]

Sign me up not to prefer Lavine over Saric yet.
Saric had played overseas for 2 years, but he has just started to play in the nba and, most important, to live in USA.

Of course he has nowhere near the athleticism of Lavine but I have a feeling that he is a better overall basketball player.

Lavine is a great scorer, nice dunker, but what else?

We complain about Saric's defense, but what about Lavine's?
Is TT happy?

Time will tell

Lavine is a 21 year old guard with freak athleticism who is already averaging 20 on solid efficiency, shooting over 40% from 3. Not good on D yet but has some tools to grow on that end. He's made significant strides every year since he's been drafted, and is still a full year younger than Dario. I like Dario as well, but with all respect, in our current situation I'm making that swap pretty easily.

Stats are great but I would like to hear Thibodeau saying something like this about Zach before declaring him the better pick.



It could happen of course, Lavine is a nice prospect. But it could even happen that Saric is going to score 20 on solid efficiency and shooting over 40% from 3.
I ask only some time before drawing a line.
A one or two years nothing more.

[FreesFro]

Dario has the intangibles. He does things that help you win that don't show up in the boxscore. He's only going to get better. You know why? Because he wants it so bad. You can see it in him on the court. Hope he's a Sixer for a long time.

[aHealthy3]

Sign me up not to prefer Lavine over Saric yet.
Saric had played overseas for 2 years, but he has just started to play in the nba and, most important, to live in USA.

Of course he has nowhere near the athleticism of Lavine but I have a feeling that he is a better overall basketball player.

Lavine is a great scorer, nice dunker, but what else?

We complain about Saric's defense, but what about Lavine's?
Is TT happy?

Time will tell

Lavine is a 21 year old guard with freak athleticism who is already averaging 20 on solid efficiency, shooting over 40% from 3. Not good on D yet but has some tools to grow on that end. He's made significant strides every year since he's been drafted, and is still a full year younger than Dario. I like Dario as well, but with all respect, in our current situation I'm making that swap pretty easily.

Stats are great but I would like to hear Thibodeau saying something like this about Zach before declaring him the better pick.



It could happen of course, Lavine is a nice prospect. But it could even happen that Saric is going to score 20 on solid efficiency and shooting over 40% from 3.
I ask only some time before drawing a line.
A one or two years nothing more.

True, Thibs hasn't come out and called Lavine "blue collar" yet that I've seen. Valid argument for Dario.

I don't think even some of the biggest Dario optimists see him ever really being a 20 ppg scorer (like Lavine is at 21 years old). His upside is like a rich man's prime Boris Diaw. There's nothing wrong with that at all, I like Dario. But if we were offered Lavine straight up right now it would be pretty shocking if we declined.

[HotelVitale]

Porzingis and Ingram are similar ceiling players imo. They both have the potential to turn into all stars. That doesn't mean that Ingram is as good as Porzingis is today, but neither of them are all stars yet.

My point was that it was disingenuous and self-serving to reduce all players with vaguely similar 'ceiling' to the same category. Ceiling is a goofy criterion anyway-- what actually matters is likely maximum or peak, and by that measure Ingram is far far behind Porzingis. Ingram has been total junk this year--which is fine, most rookies are--and his 'ceiling' is based on him developing a bunch of things that many many NBA prospects don't develop; right now he's mechanical, can't drive past anyone and isn't shooting very well. Porzingis is already a good starter and basically was from the jump (which is an incredible achievement), and he would've had a good chance at being an all-star this very year if the Knicks were say a 5th seed.

[Kobblehead]

Friendly reminder than Brandon Ingram was a very mediocre prospect and a terrible Top 5 selection.