So what's the pivot? (Beal, Lavine, or smaller moves)? - Post Harden ideas and rumors

[76ciology]

I'd make that deal, at this point.

This team's ability to win an eventual title will be determined by the underclassman creators we bring into the organization over the next few drafts to pair with Maxey.

You're more likely to get an underclassman creator if you're drafting in the lottery.

Don't you think we should be trying to surround Simmons and especially Embiid with players who will be giving us what we need in the next 1 or 2 seasons given Embiid's level of play right now and history.

Nope.

Whether Embiid stays the same, improve or decline, adding a lottery player type shotcreator will make us a better team in the future.

While you’re doing this while just handing out low impact players like Maxey, Thybulle or Milton. All 3 guys doesnt affect your winning, as soon as you find a cheap replacement via FA.

Team building is in phases. I feel we’re in the phase of where we see the Celts has been for like the last 10 years. Every year try to win a title while you try to accumulate assets on the sideline.

While the last phase is like the Nets right now, where the Nets can’t afford to trade Joe Harris for a lottery pick because they have a very limited window. That the steep decline in their stars in the upcoming years wont be able to offset the incoming lottery talent.

This is also why, I find going after pick swaps, picks or lottery pick while not giving up biid, ben or tobi should be what we’re targeting if there is no big moves to be make.

Barnes and kings pick swap
Eric Gordon and a first from rox or a pick swap from rox
Terrence Ross and a first from magic or a pick swap from rox

Are three trades i do have in mind.

Sound crazy? Well, it’s less crazy than giving up a pick or two for lowry or Wiz wanting to trading Beal for Tobias.

[kriss73]

Read on Twitter

other than repackaging it for a star.

Pretty much this. I interpreted it as he has decently strong value league wide, not that we were necessarily shopping him

Thy basically suggest that if a team is going to trade with the sixers for a package in which Matisse is included, that team could suddenly flip him for a lottery pick.
Maybe there is something in the works.

[kriss73]

I'm convinced: we cannot waste this seasons of Joel.
Time to go make the Bucks/Nets/LAL/CLips move and give up Maxey and 2 firsts plus swaps for another an All Star with at least 2/3 years window with us.

I don't know, but we need him.
I' m looking to the Nets:

The "Joel/Tobias/Howard" frontcourt can match "Durant/DAJ/Green"
Seth shooting can match Joe Harris'
Shake/Tisse/Kork can match Shamet/Brown/Claxton

Even Ben could match or slow down Irving.
But no way D.Green can compete on any level with Harden.

Time is now....but can't be for a rental. It has to be a 2-3 years window.

[zaz102]

I'm convinced: we cannot waste this seasons of Joel.
Time to go make the Bucks/Nets/LAL/CLips move and give up Maxey and 2 firsts plus swaps for another an All Star with at least 2/3 years window with us.

I don't know, but we need him.
I' m looking to the Nets:

The "Joel/Tobias/Howard" frontcourt can match "Durant/DAJ/Green"
Seth shooting can match Joe Harris'
Shake/Tisse/Kork can match Shamet/Brown/Claxton

Even Ben could match or slow down Irving.
But no way D.Green can compete on any level with Harden.

Time is now....but can't be for a rental. It has to be a 2-3 years window.

I think I'm starting to feel the same way as you. On top of that, they beat the Lakers and Jazz. Harris has been consistently good for so long now, I don't think he's going to regress. I'm starting to think they have a chance if they get the player you're talking about.

[DCasey91]

Irving will eat us alive, crazy good finisher, elite shooter, elite handles, elite guards can basically give us the business regularly. Elite 3 lvl scoring guard to

Imagine a way better offensive Mitchell, that’s Irving. And he’s the second/third option of the team.

We are not Mano e Manoing the Nets you’ll get blown the heck out.

If you look at their career playoff averages will we be walked of the court in 5. That’s there average and they are in their prime.
For Harden the East is mid dif for him lol.
And Durant is a sleepwalking 30/7/5 on elite efficiency whenever he feels like it.

Only plusn we have is our huge adv of size and home court, and the biggest question is health.

You can’t bring a Curry/Green backcourt into a playoff scenario and not expect it be ugly (it’s that way in the reg season).

Never understood the Durant/Harden/Irving combo wouldn’t work offensively

Have you seen Irving catch shoot and fire/pnr shooting
Have you seen Durant drop 30 with no system for him
And Harden just does Harden things lol

[kriss73]

I'm convinced: we cannot waste this seasons of Joel.
Time to go make the Bucks/Nets/LAL/CLips move and give up Maxey and 2 firsts plus swaps for another an All Star with at least 2/3 years window with us.

I don't know, but we need him.
I' m looking to the Nets:

The "Joel/Tobias/Howard" frontcourt can match "Durant/DAJ/Green"
Seth shooting can match Joe Harris'
Shake/Tisse/Kork can match Shamet/Brown/Claxton

Even Ben could match or slow down Irving.
But no way D.Green can compete on any level with Harden.

Time is now....but can't be for a rental. It has to be a 2-3 years window.

I think I'm starting to feel the same way as you. On top of that, they beat the Lakers and Jazz. Harris has been consistently good for so long now, I don't think he's going to regress. I'm starting to think they have a chance if they get the player you're talking about.

I dont' know who fits the bill...but has to be someone playing inthe backcourt.

Maybe you can package up expirings, Maxey, Tisse , 2 firsts and 3 swaps and the cover the Tisse's hole on the bench with a buyout guy.

[youngcrev]

Irving will eat us alive, crazy good finisher, elite shooter, elite handles, elite guards can basically give us the business regularly. Elite 3 lvl scoring guard to

Imagine a way better offensive Mitchell, that’s Irving. And he’s the second/third option of the team.

We are not Mano e Manoing the Nets you’ll get blown the heck out.

If you look at their career playoff averages will we be walked of the court in 5. That’s there average and they are in their prime.
For Harden the East is mid dif for him lol.
And Durant is a sleepwalking 30/7/5 on elite efficiency whenever he feels like it.

Only plusn we have is our huge adv of size and home court, and the biggest question is health.

You can’t bring a Curry/Green backcourt into a playoff scenario and not expect it be ugly (it’s that way in the reg season).

Never understood the Durant/Harden/Irving combo wouldn’t work offensively

Have you seen Irving catch shoot and fire/pnr shooting
Have you seen Durant drop 30 with no system for him
And Harden just does Harden things lol

Offense was never the concern with that trio other than how they'd manage the egos in terms of usage, defense was, and justifiably so.

I don't think they're some unbeatable juggernaut with that defense. They could be an outlier team with amount of pure offensive talent they have, but all offense no defense teams have traditionally failed to meet expectations in the playoffs.

[eyeatoma]

I'm convinced: we cannot waste this seasons of Joel.
Time to go make the Bucks/Nets/LAL/CLips move and give up Maxey and 2 firsts plus swaps for another an All Star with at least 2/3 years window with us.

I don't know, but we need him.
I' m looking to the Nets:

The "Joel/Tobias/Howard" frontcourt can match "Durant/DAJ/Green"
Seth shooting can match Joe Harris'
Shake/Tisse/Kork can match Shamet/Brown/Claxton

Even Ben could match or slow down Irving.
But no way D.Green can compete on any level with Harden.

Time is now....but can't be for a rental. It has to be a 2-3 years window.

Who are you thinking? Lavine? Beal? Are they even available? I agree with you though, we need to strike now. Just not sure we can get a deal.

Lowry might be the most realistic, and he may not be enough. Let's see I guess, maybe Morey has some magic up his sleeve.

[Kobblehead]

I'd make that deal, at this point.

This team's ability to win an eventual title will be determined by the underclassman creators we bring into the organization over the next few drafts to pair with Maxey.

You're more likely to get an underclassman creator if you're drafting in the lottery.

Don't you think we should be trying to surround Simmons and especially Embiid with players who will be giving us what we need in the next 1 or 2 seasons given Embiid's level of play right now and history.

The ultimate "what they need" is talented creators to carry the perimeter scoring load, though.

If we wanted to maximize Embiid in 2020-2023, we should have drafted creators in the drafts that preceded the window.

- We chose the all-around Simmons in 2016 over the creators in that draft. Not necessarily a mistake, but it's a choice we made.
- We tried in 2017 with Fultz but we didn't vet the personality well enough.
- We stupidly didn't even consider Alexander in 2018 and focused on "fit" guys (Bridges, Bridges, Knox) to help (mistake) and ended up with a non NBA player altogether.
- In 2019, we didn't trade up high enough to land Walker and we settled for a defensive specialist instead

Morey stopped the slide by landing Maxey in the 2020 draft. Maxey is going to make a major impact for us in 2022 and 2023. Moving Thybulle for a lotto pick and hopefully landing another underclassman creator to pair with Maxey would increase our title chances even more in 2023-2024.

[kriss73]

I'm convinced: we cannot waste this seasons of Joel.
Time to go make the Bucks/Nets/LAL/CLips move and give up Maxey and 2 firsts plus swaps for another an All Star with at least 2/3 years window with us.

I don't know, but we need him.
I' m looking to the Nets:

The "Joel/Tobias/Howard" frontcourt can match "Durant/DAJ/Green"
Seth shooting can match Joe Harris'
Shake/Tisse/Kork can match Shamet/Brown/Claxton

Even Ben could match or slow down Irving.
But no way D.Green can compete on any level with Harden.

Time is now....but can't be for a rental. It has to be a 2-3 years window.

Who are you thinking? Lavine? Beal? Are they even available? I agree with you though, we need to strike now. Just not sure we can get a deal.

Lowry might be the most realistic, and he may not be enough. Let's see I guess, maybe Morey has some magic up his sleeve.

I think neither are available, so yeah the rental could be the only path.
It's a shame Houston is not a good trade partner for us (Moreygate) but I would give Green-Maxey-First for Oladipo and the I will try to sign&trade him to Miami for Robinson(?) in the summer.

Lowry could be another option of course, but not for full package above.

[zaz102]

I'm convinced: we cannot waste this seasons of Joel.
Time to go make the Bucks/Nets/LAL/CLips move and give up Maxey and 2 firsts plus swaps for another an All Star with at least 2/3 years window with us.

I don't know, but we need him.
I' m looking to the Nets:

The "Joel/Tobias/Howard" frontcourt can match "Durant/DAJ/Green"
Seth shooting can match Joe Harris'
Shake/Tisse/Kork can match Shamet/Brown/Claxton

Even Ben could match or slow down Irving.
But no way D.Green can compete on any level with Harden.

Time is now....but can't be for a rental. It has to be a 2-3 years window.

Who are you thinking? Lavine? Beal? Are they even available? I agree with you though, we need to strike now. Just not sure we can get a deal.

Lowry might be the most realistic, and he may not be enough. Let's see I guess, maybe Morey has some magic up his sleeve.

I think neither are available, so yeah the rental could be the only path.
It's a shame Houston is not a good trade partner for us (Moreygate) but I would give Green-Maxey-First for Oladipo and the I will try to sign&trade him to Miami for Robinson(?) in the summer.

Lowry could be another option of course, but not for full package above.

One thing I'll say is it feels good having Morey at the helm at such a crucial time.

[elchengue20]

Our next moves are the last chance to make the whole process a championship one.

If we mess things up like the last 3 or 4 years, its over.

[ProcessDoctor]

I'm convinced: we cannot waste this seasons of Joel.
Time to go make the Bucks/Nets/LAL/CLips move and give up Maxey and 2 firsts plus swaps for another an All Star with at least 2/3 years window with us.

I don't know, but we need him.
I' m looking to the Nets:

The "Joel/Tobias/Howard" frontcourt can match "Durant/DAJ/Green"
Seth shooting can match Joe Harris'
Shake/Tisse/Kork can match Shamet/Brown/Claxton

Even Ben could match or slow down Irving.
But no way D.Green can compete on any level with Harden.

Time is now....but can't be for a rental. It has to be a 2-3 years window.

Who are you thinking? Lavine? Beal? Are they even available? I agree with you though, we need to strike now. Just not sure we can get a deal.

Lowry might be the most realistic, and he may not be enough. Let's see I guess, maybe Morey has some magic up his sleeve.

I think neither are available, so yeah the rental could be the only path.
It's a shame Houston is not a good trade partner for us (Moreygate) but I would give Green-Maxey-First for Oladipo and the I will try to sign&trade him to Miami for Robinson(?) in the summer.

Lowry could be another option of course, but not for full package above.

Yea it’s unfortunate he’s on the Rockets because he’s the most realistic target until LaVine and/or Beal demand a trade. It’s still worth offering the package you mentioned (maybe the NYK 2nd instead of our 1st?) and seeing what happens.

We could then swing Bradley + Kork + cash for Bjelica.

Playoff 8:

Curry/Milton
Oladipo/Milton
Harris/Thybulle
Simmons/Bjelica
Embiid/Bjelica

I think that gives us a much better shot against the Nets. Defensively match up Dipo vs Kyrie, Simmons vs Harden, and Harris/Embiid vs Durant. Good mix of shot-creation, defense, and shooting off the bench.

[GutUNC]

"We have to make the move now" to keep up is a great tagline but not really useful considering the current marketplace. Unless that piece gets us to legit contender status - and I don't see that guy out there at the deadline - this reads like a short-sighted Tobias type move.

[davesilver]

"We have to make the move now" to keep up is a great tagline but not really useful considering the current marketplace. Unless that piece gets us to legit contender status - and I don't see that guy out there at the deadline - this reads like a short-sighted Tobias type move.

Agreed. Short-sighted moves are how we got here in the first place. We win trades by being patient for the right opportunity to present itself. I'd roll the dice on Embiid being this level for another year or two.

[Mik317]

Beal requires giving up the Harden package. That does not make us a contender this year.
LaVine is balling. But is worse than Beal IMO (if only slightly) and I doubt the Bulls are trading him for Tobias..soooooo
Lowry is old and Toronto/Masai aren't going to just give him to us either.

And those are the only moves (that I know of...I mean Curry could get into a spat with the Warriors ownership and ask for a trade tommorow for all I know...brb gonna worship satan for this to happen ) that even raises the end outcome this season IMO. Embiid is amazing right now. Ben seems to have figured out some things and Tobias as been sneaky clutch this year...and yet I still highly doubt we will win it all this year. We lack firepower at the end of the day and honestly should have lost last night if Mitchell didn't take things personal and tried to solo us himself down the stretch...thats going to be the case against the Nets more than likely..and the case against whoever comes out of the West IMO.

That sounds super emo I know..but there is some light. Yeah we need the shot creator man but we also need absolute gunners..the latter aren't as hard to find...in say... a draft or FA. Thats where Morey has been silently good at with Houston for example. This year is a quiet rebuild to get back to where we were at during "RUN IT BACK" time before Elton and the gang decided bUllY bALl was the wave.

Use Sam's weird orchard metaphor. Our orchard had a drought and caught on fire too...gotta replenish that right now...and that takes time.

[sodmoraes]

There were people here that didnt want Harden, because he's 31, but want Lowry? I wouldnt trade Maxey and picks for him. He would be good here but he's too old.
We need a Lavine/Beal kinda player, a true shot creator.


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[kriss73]

"We have to make the move now" to keep up is a great tagline but not really useful considering the current marketplace. Unless that piece gets us to legit contender status - and I don't see that guy out there at the deadline - this reads like a short-sighted Tobias type move.

The Tobias AND Butler moves (both rentals) almost worked.
It depends on the price, imho.

[zaz102]

There were people here that didnt want Harden, because he's 31, but want Lowry? I wouldnt trade Maxey and picks for him. He would be good here but he's too old.
We need a Lavine/Beal kinda player, a true shot creator.


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I was leaning away from Harden whereas I may be interested in Lowry. This is due to the cost (Simmons, multiple firsts) that Lowry would not cost. Also, I would hope he would sign a fair deal for the next couple years. Also, I wasn't quite convinced that the Sixers could be contenders whereas I am more convinced now.

That being said, I'm not a GM and as some previous posters mentioned, a lot depends on the deal which we are not privy ro. I don't really care who they trade for as long as it's a smart move (small improvement while maintaining flexibility or a big improvement that is not an overpay or is a superstar like Harden).

[Stanford]

There were people here that didnt want Harden, because he's 31, but want Lowry?

Trade packages are completely different. The Harden package is the Lowry package plus Ben Simmons.