Markelle Fultz Discussion

[cksdayoff]

whatever form he has, it wont be an issue since he's a natural shooter, with natural shot on his touch. i wouldn't be too worried with whatever form they all agree upon

[Kolkmania]

What is this? Fultz shot fine. Maybe it’s just for free throws. The one thing I felt pretty good about Fultz was his shooting. This just boggles my mind.

Read on Twitter

This is good.

There were some things that really needed some adjustment, one of them was Fultz' upward momentum from his legs. Shooting is about rhythm, you don't want forces to counteract which will lead to misses when you're tired and it creates inconsistent motions.

This is a picture of Fultz' workout prior to SL. You can see the space between his heels and the ground increasing while he's bringing the ball up to his set point (1-3). He's at the maximum height at 3 and as a result he can't bring any momentum from his legs to the ball when he's actually getting the ball to his release point (3-4).


Compare that to Curry's form. You can see a gradual elongation of his knees and momentum from his forefoot throughout the entire motion and reaching the maximum verticality when he's releasing the ball.


You can see the improvement in the video from Unbreakable. Now he needs to get comfortable with it and do it more in control, he loses balance a bit because it's so explosive. No need for that with free throws and such a relatively short distance.

Another thing that's apparent is his set point (3 in image) than in his college season. The red lines and circle indicate the positions of his arms and ball when he shot it in college.



Personally I would like to change it back, since it makes it easier to release it with the proper angle without pushing the ball like he did during scrimmage. Once again the quoted video indicates this transition back to his former set point.

At last for those who were wondering, this is what Fultz' likely wanted to change during the offseason. Some players in the NBA have a so called "one-motion" shot. This is when you simultaneously move the ball up with your upward momentum and extend your elbow to speed up the release, illustrated with picture below.



Most players bring the ball up to their set point and the only movement left is the extension of the elbow. The one isn't better than the other, most people with two-motion shots can adjust better in the air and shoot over people like Damian Lillard, Klay Thompson, Kevin Durant, etc and the one-motion shot is quicker.

This is a personal preference and Fultz should just choose which one he's more comfortable with, he used a two-motion shot in college and high school and imo probably suits him better as a tough shot maker.

Excuse me for the long post, but wanted to elaborate some of the things going on with Fultz mechanics, as so many people talk about it at the moment. We'll see how it develops, but with Fultz natural touch I'm not that worried.

[cksdayoff]

those shooting drills that fultz does in the video clip is something he’s always done since his highschool days

[Unbreakable99]

What is this? Fultz shot fine. Maybe it’s just for free throws. The one thing I felt pretty good about Fultz was his shooting. This just boggles my mind.

Read on Twitter

This is good.

There were some things that really needed some adjustment, one of them was Fultz' upward momentum from his legs. Shooting is about rhythm, you don't want forces to counteract which will lead to misses when you're tired and it creates inconsistent motions.

This is a picture of Fultz' workout prior to SL. You can see the space between his heels and the ground increasing while he's bringing the ball up to his set point (1-3). He's at the maximum height at 3 and as a result he can't bring any momentum from his legs to the ball when he's actually getting the ball to his release point (3-4).


Compare that to Curry's form. You can see a gradual elongation of his knees and momentum from his forefoot throughout the entire motion and reaching the maximum verticality when he's releasing the ball.


You can see the improvement in the video from Unbreakable. Now he needs to get comfortable with it and do it more in control, he loses balance a bit because it's so explosive. No need for that with free throws and such a relatively short distance.

Another thing that's apparent is his set point (3 in image) than in his college season. The red lines and circle indicate the positions of his arms and ball when he shot it in college.



Personally I would like to change it back, since it makes it easier to release it with the proper angle without pushing the ball like he did during scrimmage. Once again the quoted video indicates this transition back to his former set point.

At last for those who were wondering, this is what Fultz' likely wanted to change during the offseason. Some players in the NBA have a so called "one-motion" shot. This is when you simultaneously move the ball up with your upward momentum and extend your elbow to speed up the release, illustrated with picture below.



Most players bring the ball up to their set point and the only movement left is the extension of the elbow. The one isn't better than the other, most people with two-motion shots can adjust better in the air and shoot over people like Damian Lillard, Klay Thompson, Kevin Durant, etc and the one-motion shot is quicker.

This is a personal preference and Fultz should just choose which one he's more comfortable with, he used a two-motion shot in college and high school and imo probably suits him better as a tough shot maker.

Excuse me for the long post, but wanted to elaborate some of the things going on with Fultz mechanics, as so many people talk about it at the moment. We'll see how it develops, but with Fultz natural touch I'm not that worried.

You put a lot of time in this post. Nice breakdown.

[76ciology]

I really think Fultz got the Harden upside.

He's a three level scorer and triple threat player. Herky Jerky style throws off defenders..
Hesi pull-up similar to step back..
Spin move similar to euro step..
Elite PnR player..
Match-up nightmare on ISO possessing PG skills with SG body.

Currently, I really think thats what our player dev guys are trying to mold him by making him aggressive on attacking to the rim with a RELIABLE FT SHOOTING.

I would love him to jack up jumpers and not hurt his efficiency. But think long term.. doing so would limit his upside to maybe a CJ Mccullom or Gary Harris. If he continue to practice attacking to the rim and dishing to the open man, while being a plus defender, he’ll be what CJ and Garry Harris dream of becoming one day.

Just like most guards with natural shooting touch, he'll be an improved shooter as he age.

[smittybanton]

Interesting comment from Kenny Atkinson about Jeremy Lin and D'Angelo Russell, basically saying they will start together and one of them should be running the offense the whole game. Made me think of Ben and Markelle.

[Kobblehead]

While Fultz was technically proficient in scoring at all three levels....

- 61.6% at the rim
- 45.8% on mid-range jumpers
- 41.3% from three

...he leaned HEAVILY on the mid-range jumper for the majority of his scoring.

- 25.5% of field goals occurred at the rim
- 45.8% of field goals occurred on mid-range jumpers
- 28.7% of field goals occurred from beyond the arc

Given that the Sixers' offense has all but outlawed that shot, I think Markelle is going to have a hard time adjusting to scoring consistently at the NBA level.

[76ciology]

While Fultz was technically proficient in scoring at all three levels....

- 61.6% at the rim
- 45.8% on mid-range jumpers
- 41.3% from three

...he leaned HEAVILY on the mid-range jumper for the majority of his scoring.

- 25.5% of field goals occurred at the rim
- 45.8% of field goals occurred on mid-range jumpers
- 28.7% of field goals occurred from beyond the arc

Given that the Sixers' offense has all but outlawed that shot, I think Markelle is going to have a hard time adjusting to scoring consistently at the NBA level.

Important thing is he can and he will adjust

[Unbreakable99]

Does anyone think Fultz should come off the bench? I don’t think he’s ready to start. I don’t want his confidence to shatter. It might be best to have him run with the second unit. In the first preseason game he didn’t even look like he belonged. He looked like he was a JV player who got a chance to play in a Varsity game and was overwhelmed.

[LloydFree]

While Fultz was technically proficient in scoring at all three levels....

- 61.6% at the rim
- 45.8% on mid-range jumpers
- 41.3% from three

...he leaned HEAVILY on the mid-range jumper for the majority of his scoring.

- 25.5% of field goals occurred at the rim
- 45.8% of field goals occurred on mid-range jumpers
- 28.7% of field goals occurred from beyond the arc

Given that the Sixers' offense has all but outlawed that shot, I think Markelle is going to have a hard time adjusting to scoring consistently at the NBA level.

Don't forget, not only were a large percentage of his shots mid-range, they were contested mid-range shots. That is an even bigger no-no in Brett Brown's Offense. Honestly, though I'm​ not a big fan of Fultz's overall potential, I think he will get his points. If Brown plays him with Simmons, Fultz will get buckets in transition that he wouldn't get otherwise. He was also a pretty good 3 Point shooter against close-outs, in the games that I saw him at Washington. He'll get his points, if he gets the minutes.

[LloydFree]

Does anyone think Fultz should come off the bench? I don’t think he’s ready to start. I don’t want his confidence to shatter. It might be best to have him run with the second unit. In the first preseason game he didn’t even look like he belonged. He looked like he was a JV player who got a chance to play in a Varsity game and was overwhelmed.

Yes. I believe he should come off the bench, and if he isn't on the bench on opening night, I believe he will be there by game 10. The cross-matching on defense, will make it tough on the team during the early tough schedule. Right now Fultz won't offer anymore defense against a starting, quality, NBA point guard than Ben Simmons would offer. I believe Brett Brown will either run a big line-up and start Amir Johnson, or run a small line-up with Bayless, so they can gradually groom the offense in preparation for sliding Fultz into the line-up.

[Unbreakable99]

Does anyone think Fultz should come off the bench? I don’t think he’s ready to start. I don’t want his confidence to shatter. It might be best to have him run with the second unit. In the first preseason game he didn’t even look like he belonged. He looked like he was a JV player who got a chance to play in a Varsity game and was overwhelmed.

Yes. I believe he should come off the bench, and if he isn't on the bench on opening night, I believe he will be there by game 10. The cross-matching on defense, will make it tough on the team during the early tough schedule. Right now Fultz won't offer anymore defense against a starting, quality, NBA point guard than Ben Simmons would offer. I believe Brett Brown will either run a big line-up and start Amir Johnson, or run a small line-up with Bayless, so they can gradually groom the offense in preparation for sliding Fultz into the line-up.

Yeah. If Fultz continues to play like trash in the preseason then I think he will come off the bench. If Fultz plays well I think he starts the season starting. But the first two games are going to destroy his confidence right off the bat in going up against Wall and Beal and then Kyrie and Smart. Poor thing. Coach Brown needs to keep his spirits up. You don't want to lose the kid this early.

[Kobblehead]

I'd keep Fultz in the starting line-up. I think it's important that he learns how to play with, and off of, Simmons and Embiid. Sending him to the 2nd unit probably enables him to be the 30% usage Washington Fultz. Which just continues him developing habits of a #1 option. I don't think that's something I want from him.

[76ciology]

Should have just drafted Kuzma because if his NBA ready game


...more importantly, he looks like Ben Simmons that will make it extra tough for opponents to find Ben in transition.

[Kolkmania]

Starting is a prestige thing. I think it's better to let him start and substitute him back in with the bench unit at times. Benching him will shatter his confidence more than giving up some points against Wall and Kyrie (which everybody does).

And are we really going through with this Fultz is bad thing? I understand if other fan bases grab the opportunity to take him down, but the kid player 22 minutes with the team, 2 good Utah SL games and got injured at Vegas. That's surely enough sample size to dismiss his excellent play in college, high school and national team....

[Unbreakable99]

Should have just drafted Kuzma because if his NBA ready game


...more importantly, he looks like Ben Simmons that will make it extra tough for opponents to defend Ben in transition.

Kuzma as our PF would have been great. The Lakers got a good one. I think he easily will be a top 5 rookie.

[Kobblehead]

I didn't like Dennis Smith as a top prospect, but his physical tools and three level splits made him much more likely to be a high volume scorer than Markelle.

Fultz is gonna need his 40% three point stroke to translate for him to have a chance at being a 20 point scorer. His physical ability is ordinary and his scoring style (mid-range jumpers, often contested) is a frowned upon approach in the modern NBA.

I think we all need to re-adjust our expectations of Fultz. Forget scoring as his calling card. Let's focus on him as a secondary distributor and a deflection generator on the defensive side. If he can lock down those two aspects while being a decentish mid-volume scorer, I'll be happy.

[76ciology]

I didn't like Dennis Smith as a top prospect, but his physical tools and three level splits made him much more likely to be a high volume scorer than Markelle.

Fultz is gonna need his 40% three point stroke to translate for him to have a chance at being a 20 point scorer. His physical ability is ordinary and his scoring style (mid-range jumpers, often contested) is a frowned upon approach in the modern NBA.

I think we all need to re-adjust our expectations of Fultz. Forget scoring as his calling card. Let's focus on him as a secondary distributor and a deflection generator on the defensive side. If he can lock down those two aspects while being a decentish mid-volume scorer, I'll be happy.

Kobble, i think he can generate FTAs in the long term if he master the craft in attacking the rim. While he can be a good mid and 3pt shooter, given that he’s anove average(i’d guess) in college.

[Kobblehead]

Becoming a penetrator and getting to the rim/line is an uphill climb for guys that lack plus physical tools. It usually requires next level ball handling ability and/or inherent instincts to get to spots.

I'm not sure if Fultz possesses the inherent knack for getting by guys (he didn't show it at Washington). He's definitely going to have to work extremely hard to have advanced ball handling ability.

[LloydFree]

I'd keep Fultz in the starting line-up. I think it's important that he learns how to play with, and off of, Simmons and Embiid. Sending him to the 2nd unit probably enables him to be the 30% usage Washington Fultz. Which just continues him developing habits of a #1 option. I don't think that's something I want from him.

That's easy for us to say. Brett Brown has expectations of winning some games this year. I don't think he is going to watch this team lose the month of November, on the hypothetical that Fultz development will be damaged by playing 20 minutes off the bench, instead of 24 in the starting lineup. People think it's a crime for a teenager to come off the bench. Kobe sat behind Eddie Jones his first year or two, and it didn't crush him.

Either way, I think Brown will eventually settle on putting a veteran in the lineup specifically for defense, rather than Starting Fultz. In his rotation I could see him envisioning Embiid as Duncan, Amir Johnson as Tiago Splitter, Covington as Leonard, Redick as Green, Simmons as Parker and Fultz off the bench as Ginobli.