2016-2017 College Basketball / '17 NBA Draft Thread Volume 2

[TheAntiTrump]

1.NBADraft.net is an awful source for information.(They once said DeShawn Stevenson was the next MJ)

2.Go watch all his highlights/games available online. Let me know how many times you see him explode off a dribble and finish by a defender or break his man down 1-1

Like I said, I see some of the intrigue with him, But personally I wouldn't touch him with a top 10 pick.

Look, it does not matter what you think, or what I think. In the end the proof will be in the pudding. In other words, what he shows in his individual workouts and in his Physical tests. But remember, smarts are always more important then supreme Athleticism. Smarts ( High B-ball IQ always wins out ) I don't know how he will turn out. But I do know that you, nor anyone else can definitely guarantee that Ntilikina won't be any worse then Ball-Fultz-Fox, or anyone else.

SO you make a post asking about something, then respond to replies by saying it doesn't matter what you think?

Probably the wrong place to be posting questions then, considering this is a discussion forum.

No. I am interested in what you think. But in the end, it does not matter what either of us think cause neither of us work for the Sixers, or make the decisions. Whomever THEY like is all that matters.

[PhilasFinest]

Look, it does not matter what you think, or what I think. In the end the proof will be in the pudding. In other words, what he shows in his individual workouts and in his Physical tests. But remember, smarts are always more important then supreme Athleticism. Smarts ( High B-ball IQ always wins out ) I don't know how he will turn out. But I do know that you, nor anyone else can definitely guarantee that Ntilikina won't be any worse then Ball-Fultz-Fox, or anyone else.

SO you make a post asking about something, then respond to replies by saying it doesn't matter what you think?

Probably the wrong place to be posting questions then, considering this is a discussion forum.

No. I am interested in what you think. But in the end, it does not matter what either of us think cause neither of us work for the Sixers, or make the decisions. Whomever THEY like is all that matters.

Fair enough I suppose...

Have you seen Ntilikina play at all?

[TheAntiTrump]

SO you make a post asking about something, then respond to replies by saying it doesn't matter what you think?

Probably the wrong place to be posting questions then, considering this is a discussion forum.

No. I am interested in what you think. But in the end, it does not matter what either of us think cause neither of us work for the Sixers, or make the decisions. Whomever THEY like is all that matters.

Fair enough I suppose...

Have you seen Ntilikina play at all?

Just what you have, limited Highlights. Look, in the end, we will likely have a top-5 pick. And I definitely don't want him there. Now we all have our own thoughts. But mine....I want Fultz 1st....and if not him, then either Monk/Dennis Smith. Even over Jackson, who to me has a lot of concerns. And Tatum, who I just don't like at all. His best upside is not even better then what Covington is now. Ball ( No Interest )...Fox...also no interest.

[phiphan]

The Fiba U18 semi final and championship are (or were) both available online. Frank was pretty good in the second half of the semi and had a great final. To my eye he isn't explosive and he has miles to go on his ball handling for an NBA PG, but is passable for a wing.

[Unbreakable99]

I respect everyone's opinion. But where this Ntilikina is not Athletic and is slow statements are coming from I don't know. The kid is extremely quick and Athletic. From the scouts at NBAdraft.net




NBA Comparison: Dennis Schroder/Gary Payton

Strengths: Elite size for a point guard with very good athleticism and quickness … Impressive wingspan (close to 7 ft)… Very mature for his age with a good basketball IQ … He has a thin frame, but his body structure suggests that he can add weight and increase his muscle tone nicely …[b] A true point guard with a “pass first” mentality[/b] … He can control the pace of the game nicely … Excellent passer with great court vision … He is always looking to find the open teammate … He can pass on the move and also while penetrating … Excels on the open court and loves to run the break … [b]Great ball handler … He has a nice hesitation dribble and he has also an improving crossover dribble on his repertoire[/b] … [b]Possesses an explosive first step [/b]… Really good on ISO situations thanks to his athleticism, length and excellent ball handling … He can create his own shoot and score off the dribble from mid-range and has also a floater as a counter move … When he has time to gather he can finish strong at the rim… Improving 3-point shooter… He is already very good on Pick and Roll situations as the ball handler, because he shows patience and is always looking for the right choice … His body and physical tools are his biggest weapons on Defense … He has great lateral quickness which helps him stay in front of his man … When he is motivated on Defense he can be a lockdown defender … His length and athleticism help him make a lot of steals … Versatile defender with the potential to guard multiple positions in the future … He has a high upside

Do you have any clips to show his quickness? I haven't seen any. I don't see a quick twitch athlete. No explosion. I'm always open for proof otherwise though.

Last time I checked...you are not a professional scout. The people at NBADraft.net, and DX have over 50 years scouting experience. I an sorry but I will take their word over the 5 minutes of video that you have watched.

No I'm not a scout. I trust myself though. I don't have to scout to know how athletic someone is. And just because someone writes for a site doesn't make them more knowledgeable than others who don't. I trust some people on this board on their evaluations.

[TheAntiTrump]

Do you have any clips to show his quickness? I haven't seen any. I don't see a quick twitch athlete. No explosion. I'm always open for proof otherwise though.

Last time I checked...you are not a professional scout. The people at NBADraft.net, and DX have over 50 years scouting experience. I an sorry but I will take their word over the 5 minutes of video that you have watched.

No I'm not a scout. I trust myself though. I don't have to scout to know how athletic someone is. And just because someone writes for a site doesn't make them more knowledgeable than others who don't. I trust some people on this board on their evaluations.

Yes but, being athletic has little or nothing to do with being a great Basketball player. Smarts do. Fundamentals do. And no one can deny Ntilikina has them both in abundance.

[eagereyez]

Fultz didn't appreciate Ball's comment lol.

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

I love it. I hope their rivalry blossoms in the NBA.

[PLO]

No one's really mentioned the fit Ntilikina would have with Simmons; Ntilikina doesn't really have the handles to be a primary guy at this stage (though he could develop that) but we have that in Simmons AND Ntilikina is already quite good off-ball. Its true Ntilikina doesn't have a quick first step but I'm not really sure we need him to be blowing by guys in our passing-based offense, but he's more than explosive enough. The pluses with Ntilikina are his physical measurements (which are off the charts), young age, game IQ, and his defense - in fact defensively he's easily the best guard in this class of all the top prospects. He really has a lot of upside - he does a lot of things pretty well and because of his physical measurements has the scope to become elite in several areas because of his tender age.

The comparison with Exum is OK I guess except Exum is quicker, but Ntilikina has a much better game sense at the same stage - Exum was really an iso scorer as a junior (because of how far ahead he was of other juniors) whereas Ntilikina has many more team oriented attributes (can run a PnR etc) because he's been playing at mens level at an earlier stage of his career. Whatever else you can say about Exum he's already a good defender, Ntilikina will likely step into the league and be that straight away, on top of whatever else he could develop into on the other end of the floor.

Players like DSJ and Monk really worry me because its likely you're getting someone who is a gaping hole on defense - I think DSJ is the better prospect than Ntilikina but Ntilikina is the better fit for us because we have Simmons. Getting the right guard is crucial for us - its the difference for us between being an actual contender and just a playoff team (look at the Celtics with Isiah Thomas - ridiculous offensive player, but I'm pretty sure I'm right in saying he's close to being a net negative for his team because of his historically bad defense).

I've heard one Euro scout say that Ntilikina is a better prospect than Tony Parker at the same age - with our draft and stash strategy of Euro players I figure we would be looking very closely at Ntilikina and be doing the groundwork on him. I'm not saying he's a top 5 prospect in this draft but if we are in that next bracket of picks it would be foolish to discount him as a selection for us. One thing I do know is that we need guards - if, as seems likely, the Laker pick carries over until next year, we'll be 95% picking a guard with our selection, and if we're at pick 8 and Ntilikina is there I would be quite happy with getting him.

[the_process]

Considering the Sixers are going to be drafting 8 or 9 I would think Ntilikina is a very likely target for BC.

[nitocobola]

Let's hope that lolangelo selects the bust of the draft.

[Negrodamus]

Let's hope that lolangelo selects the bust of the draft.

Let's not? I'd rather have a winning team than spiting Colangelo.

[Negrodamus]

After watching the physicality of the NBA game tonight (it's much more pronounced in person, and much more leeway than the NCAA), I'm even more on board with Thornwell. Players get away with essentially grabbing each other (looking at you, Simba) and are, more often than not, bailed out on help defense. Those are two things Thornwell does exceptionally well: play very aggressive man defense while helping on a beat man or playing the passing lanes well.

[shawn_hemp]

1. Josh Jackson
2. Malik Monk
3. Dennis Smith Jr
4. Markelle Fultz
5. Lonzo Ball
6. Jayson Tatum
7. Frank Ntilikina
8. Johnathan Isaac
9. De'Aaron Fox
10. Terrence Ferguson

considering none of these guys are still playing (idk about Ntilikina or Ferguson actually), this is pretty much what I'm sticking with until draft day.

I've never seen Fultz as the clear #1 pick, but I've just kind of went with it assuming the Sixers would have no chance at him anyway.

But I'm gonna predict right now that this guy is an absolutely horrific defender in the NBA

And Malik Monk will not be. Not saying he's Tony Allen, but he should be able to be better than JJ Redick, who is an ok defender.

Like what has everyone been basing this defensive comparison between Fultz and Monk off of? Wingspan? Because if that's it, then Tony Wroten should have been a better defender than either of them. Maybe it's just me, but whenever I watched Fultz play, he didn't give one lick of effort on much of anything. And he is not a good defender. At all. If Monk was an inch taller with a couple inch longer arms he'd be the #1 pick

And their shooting ability will be about the same

And Fultz is a better ball handler. Sure. No argument

But I just don't think it is as important for this team as it seems. Monk is the better off ball player. If we sign a PG in free agency, I really can't see us needing Malik Monk to take guys off the dribble very often.

[eagereyez]

I watched a Brett Brown video as he talks about this draft and what he's looking for and yeah....people need to start preparing themselves for Malik Monk.

Of course he said that. We have a glaring lack of quality shooters on this team. Our two best players are going to do the majority of their damage in the paint. They will need proper spacing.

[Sixerscan]

I watched a Brett Brown video as he talks about this draft and what he's looking for and yeah....people need to start preparing themselves for Malik Monk.

Of course he said that. We have a glaring lack of quality shooters on this team. Our two best players are going to do the majority of their damage in the paint. They will need proper spacing.

1. Monk isn't the only good shooter in this draft.
2. Brett doesn't make the draft picks.

[eagereyez]

I watched a Brett Brown video as he talks about this draft and what he's looking for and yeah....people need to start preparing themselves for Malik Monk.

Of course he said that. We have a glaring lack of quality shooters on this team. Our two best players are going to do the majority of their damage in the paint. They will need proper spacing.

1. Monk isn't the only good shooter in this draft.
2. Brett doesn't make the draft picks.

1. Never said he was, although he is the best.
2. Wasn't my point, and a smart GM should weigh their coach's opinion anyway.

My point is that shooting is paramount for this team moving forward. That is priority numero uno moving forward with the core we have.

[Sixerscan]

Of course he said that. We have a glaring lack of quality shooters on this team. Our two best players are going to do the majority of their damage in the paint. They will need proper spacing.

1. Monk isn't the only good shooter in this draft.
2. Brett doesn't make the draft picks.

1. Never said he was, although he is the best.
2. Wasn't my point, and a smart GM should weigh their coach's opinion anyway.

My point is that shooting is paramount for this team moving forward. That is priority numero uno moving forward with the core we have.

Was more in response to the post you quoted.

[Unbreakable99]

Hypothetical. Let's say the Lakers pick does convey and we are picking at 4 and 6. 3 different scenarios.

1. Would you try to trade both picks to see if we can move up to 2? If we did try to trade up do you think that would be enough?

2. What if we just stay at 4 and 6 and just take someone at 4 and then try to trade the 6th pick for a player? If we did this then what player do you think we could get for the 6th pick?

3. Same as the 2nd question by keeping 4 and drafting a player but for the 6th pick instead of trading for a player would you trade that pick to a team for a 2018 unprotected pick? And if we traded the 6th pick do you think it's reasonable to expect we can get an unprotected 18 pick?

I'm starting to think if we only get 4 and 6 to not use both and keep moving it to the next draft so that we can still have 2 picks for next year and then maybe the next year we could do the same if we don't think it's worth drafting two players.

Please answer all three versions if you can.

[PLO]

Hypothetical. Let's say the Lakers pick does convey and we are picking at 4 and 6. 3 different scenarios.

1. Would you try to trade both picks to see if we can move up to 2? If we did try to trade up do you think that would be enough?

2. What if we just stay at 4 and 6 and just take someone at 4 and then try to trade the 6th pick for a player? If we did this then what player do you think we could get for the 6th pick?

3. Same as the 2nd question by keeping 4 and drafting a player but for the 6th pick instead of trading for a player would you trade that pick to a team for a 2018 unprotected pick? And if we traded the 6th pick do you think it's reasonable to expect we can get an unprotected 18 pick?

I'm starting to think if we only get 4 and 6 to not use both and keep moving it to the next draft so that we can still have 2 picks for next year and then maybe the next year we could do the same if we don't think it's worth drafting two players.

Please answer all three versions if you can.

1. The only guy I would move up for is Fultz, would I give up both picks for that, probably, though its close. Its close because if you draft Fultz you give him the keys to the offence which neutralizes Simmons quite a bit. I love Fultz as a prospect and couldn't pass on him, the fit with us is only so-so.

2. It depends on who we draft at 4 and who is there at 6; if Isaac is there at 6 and we've drafted a guard at 4 I'm taking him - effectively he's a stash because he would be playing extremely limited minutes in the first few years but he has great upside. He's probably not going to end up being the 6th (or higher) player picked in this draft but he's just too good as a prospect to pass up for me. He will have more utility for me than someone like a Monk for example, though I could understand picking a PG first then say a Monk at 6 just in terms of draft strategy and fit with our roster.

3. I'm in favour of a "bird in the hand" strategy, especially given this is a good draft - we don't really know too much about next years draft except its a lot better for talls, where we are basically set at. We are ready to compete now - and besides if the Lakers pick doesn't convey in 2017 we have a pipeline to 2018 and 2019 with the Kings pick. Both squads are pretty atrocious and a high pick is almost a surety in both those years.

[shawn_hemp]

Hypothetical. Let's say the Lakers pick does convey and we are picking at 4 and 6. 3 different scenarios.

1. Would you try to trade both picks to see if we can move up to 2? If we did try to trade up do you think that would be enough?

2. What if we just stay at 4 and 6 and just take someone at 4 and then try to trade the 6th pick for a player? If we did this then what player do you think we could get for the 6th pick?

3. Same as the 2nd question by keeping 4 and drafting a player but for the 6th pick instead of trading for a player would you trade that pick to a team for a 2018 unprotected pick? And if we traded the 6th pick do you think it's reasonable to expect we can get an unprotected 18 pick?

I'm starting to think if we only get 4 and 6 to not use both and keep moving it to the next draft so that we can still have 2 picks for next year and then maybe the next year we could do the same if we don't think it's worth drafting two players.

Please answer all three versions if you can.

1. Probably not 4 and 6 just to move up two spots. That's a bit steep. I would rather have 2 potential starters than 1, just about always. I would hope those 2 picks get you to 2 because that's a nice come up for a team like Boston if they do that considering they could get a big man later anyway

2. Idk, Eric Bledsoe? First name that came to mind

3. I'd rather just pick this year. 4.Jayson Tatum, 6. Malik Monk. Would be nice