Welcome Simmons

[Sixerscan]

Giannis is overrated though, and Lebron is one of the most athletic and strong players ever. Simmons isn't Lebron athletic or strong. He's not as athletic is Giannis either. Simmons will need a jumper to become a superstar. That doesn't mean he has to shoot 40% from 3, but he has to be at least league average for him to be a superstar.

He hasn't played a game yet. This is how development works. You give him some clear cut stuff to improve at. Then once he masters that he moves onto other things.

This idea that he's just going to improve at everything is unrealistic.

I didn't mention everything, just his jumper. It's a necessity he improves it. I have confidence he will improve it, the question is how much.

Let's face it, and I'm going to be perfectly blunt here. Ben Simmons has to reach a certain level, and if he does not reach that level as a player, then basically we have wasted two years of tanking with very little to show for it. If Ben Simmons does not become a bonafide stone cold NBA superstar, then last year's tank season(and the one with Okafor) will have been a complete and total waste.

And as someone who has fully supported The Process, and tanking... you couldn't have supported it more than I did... if Simmons does not become a superstar then The Process will have been a failure. I hate to admit it. Tanking 3 years to only get one superstar out of it is a failure. So basically the entire process hinges on Simmons' development.

Agreed! I'm just saying that every focus does not have to be on him shooting league average from 3 right now. I like how they are focusing on him finishing at the rim and being money from the line. The jumper will come.

[LongLiveHinkie]

He hasn't played a game yet. This is how development works. You give him some clear cut stuff to improve at. Then once he masters that he moves onto other things.

This idea that he's just going to improve at everything is unrealistic.

I didn't mention everything, just his jumper. It's a necessity he improves it. I have confidence he will improve it, the question is how much.

Let's face it, and I'm going to be perfectly blunt here. Ben Simmons has to reach a certain level, and if he does not reach that level as a player, then basically we have wasted two years of tanking with very little to show for it. If Ben Simmons does not become a bonafide stone cold NBA superstar, then last year's tank season(and the one with Okafor) will have been a complete and total waste.

And as someone who has fully supported The Process, and tanking... you couldn't have supported it more than I did... if Simmons does not become a superstar then The Process will have been a failure. I hate to admit it. Tanking 3 years to only get one superstar out of it is a failure. So basically the entire process hinges on Simmons' development.

Disagree. If Simmons never reaches superstar level and only becomes another Iguoldala then it's not a total waste. It would be disappointing though. We would just have an Igoudlala level player who can be a 3rd piece on a championship level team. He just wouldn't be a guy who could be he guy to take on the scoring lead. We would just have to find a guy who can. Maybe this draft will be one. I find it very hard that Simmons busts. His floor without ever getting a jump shot should a top least be an above average player.

Tanking 3 years to wind up with Embiid, Okafor(who won't even be here next year and may be cut for nothing or traded for a low 2nd) and Iguodala? How can that be anything other than a failure? An Iguodala type can be an important complimentary piece, but you don't tank and win 10 freaking games to get that. For that kind of suffering you need to be rewarded a star for it to be worth it.

[LongLiveHinkie]

He hasn't played a game yet. This is how development works. You give him some clear cut stuff to improve at. Then once he masters that he moves onto other things.

This idea that he's just going to improve at everything is unrealistic.

I didn't mention everything, just his jumper. It's a necessity he improves it. I have confidence he will improve it, the question is how much.

Let's face it, and I'm going to be perfectly blunt here. Ben Simmons has to reach a certain level, and if he does not reach that level as a player, then basically we have wasted two years of tanking with very little to show for it. If Ben Simmons does not become a bonafide stone cold NBA superstar, then last year's tank season(and the one with Okafor) will have been a complete and total waste.

And as someone who has fully supported The Process, and tanking... you couldn't have supported it more than I did... if Simmons does not become a superstar then The Process will have been a failure. I hate to admit it. Tanking 3 years to only get one superstar out of it is a failure. So basically the entire process hinges on Simmons' development.

Agreed! I'm just saying that every focus does not have to be on him shooting league average from 3 right now. I like how they are focusing on him finishing at the rim and being money from the line. The jumper will come.

I never meant he needs a jumper right now necessarily, but in 3 years or so when we are ready(hopefully) to contend for a title, he needs to have a reliable jumper by then. league average at least. Hell, I'll even settle for 33% from 3, if he can knock down 15-17 regularly.

[Ericb5]

Giannis is overrated though, and Lebron is one of the most athletic and strong players ever. Simmons isn't Lebron athletic or strong. He's not as athletic is Giannis either. Simmons will need a jumper to become a superstar. That doesn't mean he has to shoot 40% from 3, but he has to be at least league average for him to be a superstar.

Giannis isn't overrated but I agree that Simmons must shoot better. If he can't shoot it will limit him greatly. Players will go under screens. He can still be effective and even great without a reliable jumper but it will be a lot tougher.

Depends on what you think of Giannis. He isn't a #1 on a championship team. I've heard people refer to him as one of the 8 best NBA players, and in that respect, he is definitely overrated. He's not a superstar yet.

Ben Simmons was being lauded as "the next Lebron" or "the next Magic" coming out of the draft. Now, even if they were hyperbole, the hype of Ben Simmons was a talent with the ability to become one of the 5 best players in the NBA if not one of the top 3. He had that kind of hype. For him to reach that level, then he needs a jumper.

I think last year that you could make the argument that Giannis wasn't a superstar yet, but this year he cemented it. As to whether he is a top ten player yet, I haven't really thought about it, but he probably is.




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[LongLiveHinkie]

Curry, Lebron, Durant, Harden, Westbrook, Davis, Klay, Towns, Leonard, George are all guys I have as definitely better. Then there are guys like Paul, Butler, Wall, Kyrie who may possibly be better also. If I had to ballpark Giannis, I put him in the 14-18 range.

But I have a strong sticking point with guys who can't shoot.

[CoreyGallagher]

Giannis right now is better than Towns, Klay, and George, imo.

Chris Paul is better than him, Butler may be.

I'd probably consider him just outside top 10, myself.

[Sixerscan]

My good friend Joel Embiid is better than Mr Greek freak. Let all the Bucks fans pray we never end up in a series where this has to be proven.

[LongLiveHinkie]

I don't think Giannis can take over a game like George, Klay, Towns can when they get hot. Giannis puts up numbers, but when you watch him, he doesn't really have the offensive game to take over a game offensively and carry his team on his back in crunch time. Not on their level anyway. He pretty much has to attack the rim to be successful.

I think Embiid is better too, but didn't list him because he didn't officially get there yet with his injury issues.

[AI_Efficiency]

I don't think Giannis can take over a game like George, Klay, Towns can when they get hot. Giannis puts up numbers, but when you watch him, he doesn't really have the offensive game to take over a game offensively and carry his team on his back in crunch time. Not on their level anyway. He pretty much has to attack the rim to be successful.

I think Embiid is better too, but didn't list him because he didn't officially get there yet with his injury issues.

George as in Paul George? He's not in the top 20 right now in PER, win shares per 48, vorp, real plus minus. He's like a fringe star. Giannis is prob fringe top 10 player in the league and he's 22.

[LongLiveHinkie]

George carried his team to multiple conference finals. Fringe star... please. Giannis hasn't done squat in this league yet.

[AdotSmoove]

George carried his team to multiple conference finals. Fringe star... please. Giannis hasn't done squat in this league yet.

Yeah, but it's likely PG will never do squat in the league again, at least not on that level.


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[LongLiveHinkie]

I don't see why not. He's not even close to 30 yet and is fully recovered from his broken leg. Paul George is a stud.

[bedjawII]

I didn't mention everything, just his jumper. It's a necessity he improves it. I have confidence he will improve it, the question is how much.

Let's face it, and I'm going to be perfectly blunt here. Ben Simmons has to reach a certain level, and if he does not reach that level as a player, then basically we have wasted two years of tanking with very little to show for it. If Ben Simmons does not become a bonafide stone cold NBA superstar, then last year's tank season(and the one with Okafor) will have been a complete and total waste.

And as someone who has fully supported The Process, and tanking... you couldn't have supported it more than I did... if Simmons does not become a superstar then The Process will have been a failure. I hate to admit it. Tanking 3 years to only get one superstar out of it is a failure. So basically the entire process hinges on Simmons' development.

Disagree. If Simmons never reaches superstar level and only becomes another Iguoldala then it's not a total waste. It would be disappointing though. We would just have an Igoudlala level player who can be a 3rd piece on a championship level team. He just wouldn't be a guy who could be he guy to take on the scoring lead. We would just have to find a guy who can. Maybe this draft will be one. I find it very hard that Simmons busts. His floor without ever getting a jump shot should a top least be an above average player.

Tanking 3 years to wind up with Embiid, Okafor(who won't even be here next year and may be cut for nothing or traded for a low 2nd) and Iguodala? How can that be anything other than a failure? An Iguodala type can be an important complimentary piece, but you don't tank and win 10 freaking games to get that. For that kind of suffering you need to be rewarded a star for it to be worth it.

Agreed it will be disappointing if BS doesn't become a stud! But you've missed the entire point of the process. We have multiple methods to acquire another stud. It doesn't have to be BS. If BS had a catastrophic injury tomorrow and could never play again it would be a setback but not devastating. We still have FA and most likely 3 top five picks in the next 3 years.

[Ericb5]

Simmons is not Iguodala. Jesus.

Simmons is going to be a superstar pure and simple. He is going to be Westbrook, Harden or Durant.

The only reason that he isn't our franchise player is because we have Embiid who is even better.



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[AI_Efficiency]

George carried his team to multiple conference finals. Fringe star... please. Giannis hasn't done squat in this league yet.

What's your evidence he carried his team to conference finals or is this just on the eye test? He had plenty of teammate help. Maybe you've noticed his former pal George Hill is about to get massively paid this offseason and was very underrated in Indy. Paul George's career playoff PER is around 18 which is about his career average. Win shares per 48 similar too. Nothing screams he carried his team. You might just be misjudging him based on that series against the Heat where George almost helped Indy win.

Also to your point that Giannis hasn't done anything. He's 22. This was his first real superstar season. And in that season he got his team to the same record as Paul George's pacers besides having two main contributors (Middleton and Jabari) hurt and never healthy together.

[Ericb5]

You don't have to have team success to be a superstar. Cousins and Davis are both superstars and they have never had winning records.

Giannis is a monster of a player, who keeps getting better. If he keeps improving as much as he improved last year he could be the best player in the league in the next few years.



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[LongLiveHinkie]

George carried his team to multiple conference finals. Fringe star... please. Giannis hasn't done squat in this league yet.

What's your evidence he carried his team to conference finals or is this just on the eye test? He had plenty of teammate help. Maybe you've noticed his former pal George Hill is about to get massively paid this offseason and was very underrated in Indy. Paul George's career playoff PER is around 18 which is about his career average. Win shares per 48 similar too. Nothing screams he carried his team. You might just be misjudging him based on that series against the Heat where George almost helped Indy win.

Also to your point that Giannis hasn't done anything. He's 22. This was his first real superstar season. And in that season he got his team to the same record as Paul George's pacers besides having two main contributors (Middleton and Jabari) hurt and never healthy together.

Evidence? lol he was the best player on a team that got to the ECF. Best players always are the reason why teams get as far as they do in the NBA Playoffs. If he didn't, then they never would have made it as far as they did.

And of course he is only 22. Which is why George is better right now. Giannis could become better down the road, but he is not a better player. George has a more versatile offensive game and has proven he can take a team deep into the playoffs. He has much more of a track record right now. When Giannis develops more of a track record, we can revisit it, but right now he is not a better player than Paul George.

[76thBearCub]

I like both Paul George and Giannis. Let's just hope Simmons gets to that level.

[Unbreakable99]

What Paul George did in game 1 is the reason you trade for him. I want PG.

[XtremeDunkz]

Yeah let's trade for George and watch him leave after next year lol. Come on man. If George wants to play here, we can sign him out right next off seasons for nothing. If he doesn't, trading for him by giving up assets wouldn't change that.