Markelle Fultz Discussion III: For Fultz and going forward (see 2017 draft thread for trade discussion)

[gdog2004]

I guess it's about that time to trigger everyone:

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LOL. This is a secret peek into the life of a bunch of Sixer fans. Sometimes the truth bitch slaps you across the room.

[CeltsfanSinceBirth]

you cannot sit a guy because his shot is broken.

someone should be shanked (metaphorically) for this ****

This. The whole thing stinks of Colangelo trying to avoid criticism if you ask me. Fultz shouldn't have started the season because it was apparent that his shoulder wasn't right, but they still rolled him out there. Seems like Colangelo didn't want to take heat for the team drafting another injured player, so they minimized his injury and let him play.

Now, they're holding him back even though he's hinted on 2 different occasions that he might be playing soon. Of course, he has yet to be cleared, and now the team has Brett Brown saying that Fultz needs to be able to shoot the basketball? From an outsider's point of view - it seems like Colangelo doesn't want him to play because he doesn't want to take the heat for trading up, only to find out that the guy they drafted can't shoot anymore.

You guys have to remember - Colangelo bent over backwards to make sure that his prized 1st pick overall in Toronto, Andrea Bargnani, would succeed. When it was decided that he didn't rebound well enough to play the 5 (alongside Bosh), Colangelo traded for Jermaine O'Neal so they could move Bargnani to the SF spot. Terrible idea, since everyone knew damn well that there was no way he'd ever be able to guard 3s. So what does Colangelo do? He trades away Jermaine O'Neal (plus a 1st rounder) to Miami for Shawn Marion. Colangelo's justification - Bargnani would go back to the 5, and his lack of rebounding would be compensated for with the presence of a good rebounding SF in Marion.

You guys really deserve better than Colangelo. He is awful.

Hahaha

Bro, nice try.

Here’s the thing. Everyone makes mistakes. And quite frankly, smart guys like BC gets better whenever they make mistakes because they learn from it. It’s not like he’s scott layden or Billy King. BC has made several good moves for the team and other teams.

Everyone around the league viewed the Fultz trade as a great deal. Even RealGM’s own Reina graded Sixers A and Celtics C in the deal. Like I said, the second most valued type of player in the league after generational talents like LBJ and lead guards. Every contender has a lead guard.

You may say Bargnani was a flop. It could also mean that BC has a good vision on the big picture that stretch 4 and bigs who shoot 3s is the upcoming trend. Look at every big trying to shoot and play like Bargnani on offense knowadays. Bargnani has the tools to be a star. You just cant predict the work ethic and the intangibles of these kids.

Joe Dumars built a crazy good Pistons squad that won the championship. He also drafted Darko.

Phil Jackson won a bazillion number of rings, but he looked like a clown with his vision as Knicks GM. So can be said with Michael Jordan.

People laugh at MDA and Don Nelson back then. Look how they proved people wrong eventually.

Being right or wrong is relative to time. Great and average decision makers all make mistakes, the difference is in the frequency of mistakes. Do they learn from it or not.

You will learn eventually, just like the Raptors board did.

And bullocks on a GM not being able to predict the work ethic and intangibles of kids. That's their job. Hell, Colangelo was bragging about Bargnani scoring very high on aptitude tests before the draft.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?page=espnmag/bargnani

For years, NBA teams have used the Caliper Profile to evaluate potential draft picks. The Caliper is a personality profile used by numerous corporations and organizations to measure one's capacity to excel in specific situations. Over the past 24 years, Caliper has assessed more than 20,000 athletes, including NBA players from Detroit, San Antonio, Denver and Phoenix. Colangelo has long been sold on the system. When he heard how Bargnani measured up, he nearly dropped the phone.

"They said his upside and potential were off the charts," Colangelo says from the tunnel of the Air Canada Centre as Bargnani drains a three against the Cavaliers. "They said, 'Out of all the athletes we've profiled, we've never seen anything like this.' "

The test showed that Bargnani is virtually oblivious to what others think of him. And his tremendous ability to block out such potentially negative pressures enables him to focus completely on the task at hand. So the expectations and anxieties that come with being the No.1 pick, or the only Italian-born player in the league, or even taking a game-winning shot, don't even register with him.

Colangelo misinterpreted these test results though. The ability to block out negative pressures should have been seen as Andrea Bargnani not giving a flying **** about constructive criticism.

[76ciology]

This. The whole thing stinks of Colangelo trying to avoid criticism if you ask me. Fultz shouldn't have started the season because it was apparent that his shoulder wasn't right, but they still rolled him out there. Seems like Colangelo didn't want to take heat for the team drafting another injured player, so they minimized his injury and let him play.

Now, they're holding him back even though he's hinted on 2 different occasions that he might be playing soon. Of course, he has yet to be cleared, and now the team has Brett Brown saying that Fultz needs to be able to shoot the basketball? From an outsider's point of view - it seems like Colangelo doesn't want him to play because he doesn't want to take the heat for trading up, only to find out that the guy they drafted can't shoot anymore.

You guys have to remember - Colangelo bent over backwards to make sure that his prized 1st pick overall in Toronto, Andrea Bargnani, would succeed. When it was decided that he didn't rebound well enough to play the 5 (alongside Bosh), Colangelo traded for Jermaine O'Neal so they could move Bargnani to the SF spot. Terrible idea, since everyone knew damn well that there was no way he'd ever be able to guard 3s. So what does Colangelo do? He trades away Jermaine O'Neal (plus a 1st rounder) to Miami for Shawn Marion. Colangelo's justification - Bargnani would go back to the 5, and his lack of rebounding would be compensated for with the presence of a good rebounding SF in Marion.

You guys really deserve better than Colangelo. He is awful.

Hahaha

Bro, nice try.

Here’s the thing. Everyone makes mistakes. And quite frankly, smart guys like BC gets better whenever they make mistakes because they learn from it. It’s not like he’s scott layden or Billy King. BC has made several good moves for the team and other teams.

You look at Fultz and see how he also possess the same kind of revolutionary upside for a PG. He has the size that allows you to go positionless on D, he is an elite PnR player and a multi dimensional offensive player. There’s only a few team that won’t have any mismatches matching up against Biid, Ben and Fultz in terms of size and athleticism.

Everyone around the league viewed the Fultz trade as a great deal. Even RealGM’s own Reina graded Sixers A and Celtics C in the deal. Like I said, the second most valued type of player in the league after generational talents like LBJ and lead guards. Every contender has a lead guard.

You may say Bargnani was a flop. It could also mean that BC has a good vision on the big picture that stretch 4 and bigs who shoot 3s is the upcoming trend. Look at every big trying to shoot and play like Bargnani on offense knowadays. Bargnani has the tools to be a star. You just cant predict the work ethic and the intangibles of these kids.

Joe Dumars built a crazy good Pistons squad that won the championship. He also drafted Darko.

Phil Jackson won a bazillion number of rings, but he looked like a clown with his vision as Knicks GM. So can be said with Michael Jordan.

People laugh at MDA and Don Nelson back then. Look how they proved people wrong eventually.

Being right or wrong is relative to time. Great and average decision makers all make mistakes, the difference is in the frequency of mistakes. Do they learn from it or not.

You will learn eventually, just like the Raptors board did.

And bullocks on a GM not being able to predict the work ethic and intangibles of kids. That's their job. Hell, Colangelo was bragging about Bargnani scoring very high on aptitude tests before the draft.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?page=espnmag/bargnani

For years, NBA teams have used the Caliper Profile to evaluate potential draft picks. The Caliper is a personality profile used by numerous corporations and organizations to measure one's capacity to excel in specific situations. Over the past 24 years, Caliper has assessed more than 20,000 athletes, including NBA players from Detroit, San Antonio, Denver and Phoenix. Colangelo has long been sold on the system. When he heard how Bargnani measured up, he nearly dropped the phone.

"They said his upside and potential were off the charts," Colangelo says from the tunnel of the Air Canada Centre as Bargnani drains a three against the Cavaliers. "They said, 'Out of all the athletes we've profiled, we've never seen anything like this.' "

The test showed that Bargnani is virtually oblivious to what others think of him. And his tremendous ability to block out such potentially negative pressures enables him to focus completely on the task at hand. So the expectations and anxieties that come with being the No.1 pick, or the only Italian-born player in the league, or even taking a game-winning shot, don't even register with him.

Colangelo misinterpreted these test results though. The ability to block out negative pressures should have been seen as Andrea Bargnani not giving a flying **** about constructive criticism.

So? Thats Bargnani. He’s not Fultz.

Like I said, who knows whats going on with these players. If Bargnani had a crazy work ethic he would have been great and better equiped than LMA. He’s game was built for the modern NBA.

Whats done is done. BC knows what he is doing. He’s not Scott Layden or some incompetent GM. BC is a good GM (im not saying he’s great) who has his share of mistakes like RC Buford and Danny Ainge.

[JojoSlimbiid]

Interrupt your regularly scheduled Celtic fan troll job to bring you some clips.

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I think if it get's to a point where the long distance shooting hasn't improved near the all-star break they'll just toss him out there and get him to play within the arc. That's what I would do

[AI_Efficiency]

Interrupt your regularly scheduled Celtic fan troll job to bring you some clips.

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I think if it get's to a point where the long distance shooting hasn't improved near the all-star break they'll just toss him out there and get him to play within the arc. That's what I would do

It was hard to see from distance, but I thought his free throws looked solid there.

[cksdayoff]

free throws look smooth as silk.

[ShowYaLuv25]

Free throws look awesome.

[kriss73]

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Men, I really miss the "simple" and "clear" injuries of Embiid and Simmons.

In this case you need the KGB+CIA+Mossad to find out what's the true problem

[Bigballer74]

His FT stroke looks silky smooth here

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[XDevilBoiX]

We keep getting videos of him shooting, I can careless about it. Are they gonna keep releasing videos of him until the end of the season? I want to read about a return date, only this dam organization won’t release dates of when a player returns.

[ProcessDoctor]

I think at this point it's more likely his shot will return, but this whole situation has been so bizarre and drawn out. I really hope when he's ready we can put this situation behind us and bury it.

[HotelVitale]

And bullocks on a GM not being able to predict the work ethic and intangibles of kids. That's their job. Hell, Colangelo was bragging about Bargnani scoring very high on aptitude tests before the draft...Colangelo misinterpreted these test results though. The ability to block out negative pressures should have been seen as Andrea Bargnani not giving a flying **** about constructive criticism.

I don't like BC at all as our GM (and I think Ainge is a GM) but this is a junk sportstalk way of thinking. Every quality/characteristic a player has can be good or bad, and we've seen a complete range of physical and mental personalities succeed. There was no 'misreading' that quality of Bargnani--his ability to block pressure could've easily been a positive thing but Barg just didn't make it work. Self-sufficient players work well all the time, it's only when players fail that people go scrambling to blame someone and start saying ish like 'how could anyone miss that he had type O blood, he was doomed to bust!'

In general it's really hard to predict prospects because NBA success is mostly about doing what you do at NBA speed and pace (and against NBA athletes), and things like immediate reaction, microscopic muscle movements, etc aren't quantifiable. Someone has to have the basic size/athleticism/ability but most prospects have a solid package of all 3 (or else enough of one to hope he gets competent at the other two), but top picks always do and you can't really tell about the rest of the crucial little things until players are playing at the NBA level for a long time. I think some GMs/scouts often make dumb mistakes--they rely too much on college samples, they overestimate polish, they don't look at speed enough--but there's no key or magical data set that tells you who'll work out, it's always going to be hard to tell what players can actually do consistently in something as fluid and high intensity as NBA games.

[LongLiveHinkie]

I don't know what specific person or persons are responsible for getting Fultz back to the way he was, but if this is still an issue by the time the season is over, they need to be fired. Not necessarily because they did anything wrong per se, for all we know they've tried everything they could. But for more of a "If you can't fix him, we'll find somebody who can" type of thing.

When I was diagnosed with a chronic illness, I wasn't getting better under my doctors. I still felt sick an unwell, and I truly thought they were sincerely trying everything they could, but nothing was working to get me better. So one day I told them it's nothing personal against them, but I'm not satisfied with where I'm at, and I'm going to see another doctor and keep seeing doctors until I can find one to get me well. It ended up being the best move I ever made, and they understood. A new doctor tried some other stuff, and it helped.

Blind people are given artificial eyesight, people have limbs reattached, hardcore drug addicts become sober. If modern medicine and/or sports training can accomplish that, Fultz can get his jumper back. And if the staff on this team can't fix it, they better damn well find someone who can. He's too important to our future.

[Cheatergriffin]

Free throws in the vids look dramatically better, optimistically have to think this extends to 3pt territory and pull up jumpers sooner than most think.

1 small step for markelle, 1 giant leap for 6er nation.

[the_process]

The Sixers are seriously the worst team ever at controlling a message. It’s like they don’t employ any PR people at all.

On a lighter note, Fultz’s FT form is much improved even from UW. And he should be able to translate that back out to the floor in due time.

[ExplosionsInDaSky]

Tomorrow we will get a completely different update.

[timLH]

BC is trying to play him as the saviour in our playoff run when our schedule is easier!


OK I forgot the green font, but we need to play him, whether he is good or not.

[76ciology]

I think he plays against the Celts

[Sixerscan]

I think he plays against the Celts

Lol they already said he's out.

[76ciology]

I think he plays against the Celts

Lol they already said he's out.

I have a dream