Welcome James Harden!

76ciology · Post #1801 » by **76ciology** » Thu May 11, 2023 10:28 pm

Maybe being bad or lazy is a way to manipulate the defense or atleast gets you some legs for crucial stretches

#vet

rocketsfan100 · Post #1802 » by **rocketsfan100** » Thu May 11, 2023 10:53 pm

HotelVitale wrote:
ProcessDoctor wrote:Harden snubbed from All-NBA honors. When we win the chip this year, he'll be considered a bonafide top-25 player of all time. Might even crack the top 20.

No snub there really, he wasn’t one of the best 6 guards in the league this year. Dame was the last guard in and Harden didn’t have a better season than him. Also we don't need a Harden that's a top-15 player to do our thing the rest of the PO--just need him to be about what he was in the RS overall but consistently.

EDIT: Dame's season easily beats Harden's in most 'metrics' I'm looking at (though Harden looks pretty good in all of them):
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/nba-player-ratings/
http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/rpm
https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2023_advanced.html

Hardens role was to play second fiddle to Joel. Put Dame on hardens role then watch dames numbers will also dip. Plus dame dosent have anywhere near hardens playmaking skills. It harden in dames role like Game 1 and 4 watch him score 40 plus.

If harden goes back to Houston watch him average 28- to 31 a night again

HotelVitale · Post #1803 » by **HotelVitale** » Fri May 12, 2023 7:14 pm

rocketsfan100 wrote:
HotelVitale wrote:
ProcessDoctor wrote:Harden snubbed from All-NBA honors. When we win the chip this year, he'll be considered a bonafide top-25 player of all time. Might even crack the top 20.

No snub there really, he wasn’t one of the best 6 guards in the league this year. Dame was the last guard in and Harden didn’t have a better season than him. Also we don't need a Harden that's a top-15 player to do our thing the rest of the PO--just need him to be about what he was in the RS overall but consistently.

EDIT: Dame's season easily beats Harden's in most 'metrics' I'm looking at (though Harden looks pretty good in all of them):
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/nba-player-ratings/
http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/rpm
https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2023_advanced.html

Hardens role was to play second fiddle to Joel. Put Dame on hardens role then watch dames numbers will also dip. Plus dame dosent have anywhere near hardens playmaking skills. It harden in dames role like Game 1 and 4 watch him score 40 plus.

If harden goes back to Houston watch him average 28- to 31 a night again

I appreciate Harden's current game a lot but this really shouldn't be an argument. If Harden can score 32+ ppg on 65% TS (like Dame just did) while not just seeming like an endless chuck-machine, then sure he should make an all-NBA team. If you honestly think that this version of Harden will have no problem whatsoever getting to those numbers next year, okay. It doesn't seem like it's doing him any favors to assume that, since he's clearly trying to move into a pass-first lower-volume role (which he was quite good at this year) and he's clearly much less capable of consistently driving and creating than before. It kinda seems like you just really believe in him and that's cool, but I don't feel like it makes any sense to think that his best role now is trying to score 30+ anymore (while it is still a perfectly fine role for Dame).

rocketsfan100 · Post #1804 » by **rocketsfan100** » Sun May 14, 2023 10:38 pm

To all the classy and welcoming Sixers fan who genuinely made us harden fans welcome on this board I want to thank you for everything. I think the writing is on the wall that Harden played his last game as a Sixers player but despite everything the Sixers are a team I will cheer be it from here or afar. Maxey has made me a humongous fan of his regardless of what happens with harden.

brannigan73 · Post #1805 » by **brannigan73** » Sun May 14, 2023 11:25 pm

James is a basketball genius. I know a lot of people dont like he dribble heavy style of game but I love his passing and when he is on the all around skill he shows. I think he picked up some pressure related yips over the years because they way his outside shot disappeared at times during the play-offs after a solid year shooting the three is bizarre. He'll most likely be in Houston next year if we can get the TPE for it maybe we can salvage something out of this nucleus. We got him for Ben Simmons so I'm not going to cry about it like it was some terrible trade because it wasnt it was a good trade. Unfortunately we got James Harden a top 20ish player i the league not the one who was top 5-7. The stuff that killed this franchise was letting Butler walk, signing Harris, trading the rights to Mikael Bridges, and drafting Fultz. Not trading Benamin for James.

Bum Adebayo · Post #1806 » by **Bum Adebayo** » Sun May 14, 2023 11:31 pm

brannigan73 wrote:James is a basketball genius. I know a lot of people dont like he dribble heavy style of game but I love his passing and when he is on the all around skill he shows. I think he picked up some pressure related yips over the years because they way his outside shot disappeared at times during the play-offs after a solid year shooting the three is bizarre. He'll most likely be in Houston next year if we can get the TPE for it maybe we can salvage something out of this nucleus. We got him for Ben Simmons so I'm not going to cry about it like it was some terrible trade because it wasnt it was a good trade. Unfortunately we got James Harden a top 20ish player i the league not the one who was top 5-7. The stuff that killed this franchise was letting Butler walk, signing Harris, trading the rights to Mikael Bridges, and drafting Fultz. Not trading Benamin for James.

Drafting Simmons too, we would be better with Ingram and Brown.

mjkvol · Post #1807 » by **mjkvol** » Mon May 15, 2023 1:40 am

rocketsfan100 wrote:To all the classy and welcoming Sixers fan who genuinely made us harden fans welcome on this board I want to thank you for everything. I think the writing is on the wall that Harden played his last game as a Sixers player but despite everything the Sixers are a team I will cheer be it from here or afar. Maxey has made me a humongous fan of his regardless of what happens with harden.

You guys were great and brought a lot to the board this season. We'll see where we are with James soon enough.

NYSixersFan · Post #1808 » by **NYSixersFan** » Mon May 15, 2023 2:09 am

Let him walk. maybe a sign and trade. I don't want him back.

Arsenal · Post #1809 » by **Arsenal** » Mon May 15, 2023 2:14 am

Only want him back for a lowball. Like $25M/yr. Or if he opts in.

Otherwise get rid of him and get a TPE.

ExplosionsInDaSky · Post #1810 » by **ExplosionsInDaSky** » Mon May 15, 2023 2:17 am

I love the playmaking of James Harden. He definitely can still read the floor and the game. He's still very good during the regular season, but we needed that from him in the playoffs. He delivered two incredible games for us against Boston which were awesome, but a big part of me is ready to move on from him. I think we need to, but I may feel differently in a couple weeks. It really depends on what we can do with the other parts of the roster.

M2J · Post #1811 » by **M2J** » Mon May 15, 2023 8:09 am

Harden losing the ball several times just from nerves and air pressure in a game 7.... Bothers me

rocketsfan100 · Post #1812 » by **rocketsfan100** » Mon May 15, 2023 8:33 am

M2J wrote:Harden losing the ball several times just from nerves and air pressure in a game 7.... Bothers me

As a long time fan unfortunately it’s all too familiar in elimination games. It’s really painful

ExplosionsInDaSky · Post #1813 » by **ExplosionsInDaSky** » Mon May 15, 2023 11:14 am

rocketsfan100 wrote:
M2J wrote:Harden losing the ball several times just from nerves and air pressure in a game 7.... Bothers me

As a long time fan unfortunately it’s all too familiar in elimination games. It’s really painful

I was gonna say... You're a Harden fan, you've followed him, this is a trend of his right? I remember his very first playoff game as a Rocket. He went nuts in that game, but yeah, over the years he's been bad in clutch games.

Jay555 · Post #1814 » by **Jay555** » Mon May 15, 2023 11:35 am

ExplosionsInDaSky wrote:
rocketsfan100 wrote:
M2J wrote:Harden losing the ball several times just from nerves and air pressure in a game 7.... Bothers me

As a long time fan unfortunately it’s all too familiar in elimination games. It’s really painful

I was gonna say... You're a Harden fan, you've followed him, this is a trend of his right? I remember his very first playoff game as a Rocket. He went nuts in that game, but yeah, over the years he's been bad in clutch games.

I am a long time fan. I have been saying it. Dude needs to see a psychologist or maybe he's seen one? Need a better one if so...

He's done this countless times. Sure he's given you great moments like in G1 and G4 but G6, G7 is not something that's new to us..

Kolkmania · Post #1815 » by **Kolkmania** » Mon May 15, 2023 11:43 am

M2J wrote:Harden losing the ball several times just from nerves and air pressure in a game 7.... Bothers me

The amount of times he stumbled with the ball in his hands was so painful to see. Also there were so many times that he had the opportunity to take a midrange jump or go to the basket, but he chose to pull it back and let Embiid iso on a set defense.

Obviously still a fantastic player, but he crumbles under pressure.

I thought his defense was actually surprisingly decent. He moved his feet, went for the rebounds, etc. So I do think there's a place for him on this team, but we need to transition to Maxey as the primary shotcreator.
Ultimately it is up to him. I don't think we're going to offer him an extraordinary long term contract, so he needs to either have peace with a smaller role and get another shot on a championship or score a bunch of worthless points for an irrelevant team.

HardenGoat · Post #1816 » by **HardenGoat** » Mon May 15, 2023 11:47 am

ExplosionsInDaSky wrote:
rocketsfan100 wrote:
M2J wrote:Harden losing the ball several times just from nerves and air pressure in a game 7.... Bothers me

As a long time fan unfortunately it’s all too familiar in elimination games. It’s really painful

I was gonna say... You're a Harden fan, you've followed him, this is a trend of his right? I remember his very first playoff game as a Rocket. He went nuts in that game, but yeah, over the years he's been bad in clutch games.

It’s hard to understand. He plays better in a flowing offense and when you are protecting a lead. The floor also has to be spaced otherwise he is going to defer shots by looking to pass. He’s not the scorer he once was, he had those two games in him but he can’t sustain that effort. I think what Embiid was referring to was the team has to make their shots otherwise the defense can overplay the paint game and take away the PNR. Game 5 showed how the offense can perform. Not sure how you fix this. Becoming Embiid centric early in a game is not the answer unless he learns how to play like Jokic from that position. That might require a different coach that recognizes a new set of plays to work on with cutters.

ExplosionsInDaSky · Post #1817 » by **ExplosionsInDaSky** » Mon May 15, 2023 12:48 pm

If he comes back, his role has to be reduced. You can't rely on him as a lead guard in a playoff series where he's scoring 9 points in a game 7 and putting up horrible shooting percentages in other games. The turnovers, lack of focus, the flopping, crying for fouls. It's all very annoying and it's why I didn't like him in Houston. He's getting his shot blocked by guys like Derrick White at this point in his career. You can't win with him playing as a shell of his former self. Harden isn't what he used to be and unless we get creative with a new head coach I don't see any reason to bring him back. Let him walk.

Hipster Doofus · Post #1818 » by **Hipster Doofus** » Mon May 15, 2023 3:42 pm

I wouldn't lose sleep if he was not a Sixer next year.

Miami has been in the Eastern finals three times with Jimmy Butler and a bunch of undrafted players, more or less.

They lost Tyler Herro weeks ago and the team hummed along like nothing happened, no excuses given. If that happened here, an injury would've been used as a first excuse.

It's all about heart and some talent and grit. Harden has the talent, but not the heart and grit.

Same thing could be said for some of our other players too...

Next.

mjkvol · Post #1819 » by **mjkvol** » Mon May 15, 2023 8:10 pm

ExplosionsInDaSky wrote:I love the playmaking of James Harden. He definitely can still read the floor and the game. He's still very good during the regular season, but we needed that from him in the playoffs. He delivered two incredible games for us against Boston which were awesome, but a big part of me is ready to move on from him. I think we need to, but I may feel differently in a couple weeks. It really depends on what we can do with the other parts of the roster.

If not for Harden, that series would have been over in four or five games.

I'd love to see this same group (minus Tobias) just one time with a legitimate coach before I pull the plug. If Harden goes, we will not be better and will just be that much closer to rebuild time.

the_process · Post #1820 » by **the_process** » Wed May 17, 2023 4:37 pm

Houston is apparently very confident Harden is coming back.

A giant TPE and shedding the choker wouldn't be the worst thing in the world, except now you have to replace him. Would the Wiz take a 29 1st straight up for Beal (salary into the Harden TPE)? That's your only possible play.

Harden possibly leaving is just one of the reasons D'Antoni will be the next coach.