So what's the pivot? (Beal, Lavine, or smaller moves)? - Post Harden ideas and rumors

[the_process]

It was 3 picks and 4 swaps plus Allen who became another pick plus Lavert who became Oladipo.

The picks aren’t all equal. The valuable picks and swaps in that trade are the ones 5-7 years from now when Durant and harden are retired. This off-season no one is going to value like the 28h pick in the 2021 draft very much. Probably the reason you forgot about the pick they got for Allen is because it’s just the Bucks 2021 which is similarly a low value.

Anytime anyone talks about Maxey and the 2021 first they try to roll it into a much bigger package. That’s because those assets by themselves aren’t very valuable.

Yes I did forget Jarrett Allen. I didn’t forget the swaps, but those are unlikely to convey and are basically irrelevant.

You’re telling me you can reliably predict that Harden and Durant are going to be completely healthy each of those 4 years including 6 years from now? If we trade a swap for 2022 wouldn’t you be sweating Simmons or Embiid getting hurt? There’s some upside there.

The upside is minimal. I see Houston going through a “Wolves phase” or “Kings phase”. They are entering a rebuild with a questionable FO and a cheap owner in a COVID economic climate. Outlook not so good. As far as BKN goes they should be good the next 3 years, after that mediocre should prevent any swaps from happening.

[LloydFree]

It was 3 picks and 4 swaps plus Allen who became another pick plus Lavert who became Oladipo.

The picks aren’t all equal. The valuable picks and swaps in that trade are the ones 5-7 years from now when Durant and harden are retired. This off-season no one is going to value like the 28h pick in the 2021 draft very much. Probably the reason you forgot about the pick they got for Allen is because it’s just the Bucks 2021 which is similarly a low value.

Anytime anyone talks about Maxey and the 2021 first they try to roll it into a much bigger package. That’s because those assets by themselves aren’t very valuable.

Yes I did forget Jarrett Allen. I didn’t forget the swaps, but those are unlikely to convey and are basically irrelevant.

You’re telling me you can reliably predict that Harden and Durant are going to be completely healthy each of those 4 years including 6 years from now? If we trade a swap for 2022 wouldn’t you be sweating Simmons or Embiid getting hurt? There’s some upside there.

Houston is basically sweating out a pick swap for this year, that they just made last year. They can't even depend on Tanking this year, because if they fall out of the top 4, I believe they have to swap with the worst of Miami and OKC. Swaps are as bad as picks sometimes.

I think Jalen Brown is a Celtic, and not a Net, due to a swap.

[the_process]

Yes I did forget Jarrett Allen. I didn’t forget the swaps, but those are unlikely to convey and are basically irrelevant.

You’re telling me you can reliably predict that Harden and Durant are going to be completely healthy each of those 4 years including 6 years from now? If we trade a swap for 2022 wouldn’t you be sweating Simmons or Embiid getting hurt? There’s some upside there.

Houston is basically sweating out a pick swap for this year, that they just made last year. They can't even depend on Tanking this year, because if they fall out of the top 4, I believe they have to swap with the worst of Miami and OKC. Swaps are as bad as picks sometimes.

I think Jalen Brown is a Celtic, and not a Net, due to a swap.

I realize HOU isn’t tanking. I think they’re going to be poorly run for awhile. Bad on accident as opposed to bad on purpose I suppose. Kings or Wolves-esque. Yes, there’s a chance HOU gets extra value later. I don’t personally consider it a high chance.

What the bigger point here is, IMO, using assets for Lowry means that many less assets available in the summer when a better option becomes available. There is no obviously available move right now that is going to catapult the Sixers over the Nets this year. They may not even be able to beat the Bucks. And that doesn’t even mention the Raptors and Celtics, who while less talented are good at getting in the Sixers heads.

[LloydFree]

You’re telling me you can reliably predict that Harden and Durant are going to be completely healthy each of those 4 years including 6 years from now? If we trade a swap for 2022 wouldn’t you be sweating Simmons or Embiid getting hurt? There’s some upside there.

Houston is basically sweating out a pick swap for this year, that they just made last year. They can't even depend on Tanking this year, because if they fall out of the top 4, I believe they have to swap with the worst of Miami and OKC. Swaps are as bad as picks sometimes.

I think Jalen Brown is a Celtic, and not a Net, due to a swap.

I realize HOU isn’t tanking. I think they’re going to be poorly run for awhile. Bad on accident as opposed to bad on purpose I suppose. Kings or Wolves-esque. Yes, there’s a chance HOU gets extra value later. I don’t personally consider it a high chance.

What the bigger point here is, IMO, using assets for Lowry means that many less assets available in the summer when a better option becomes available. There is no obviously available move right now that is going to catapult the Sixers over the Nets this year. They may not even be able to beat the Bucks. And that doesn’t even mention the Raptors and Celtics, who while less talented are good at getting in the Sixers heads.

Just because there is no obvious move that will catapult the 76ers above the (fully healthy) Nets, doesn't mean you just sit there and hoard assets. Its 60-40, Durant will even be healthy, when the ECF is in play. Stuff like the #28th pick, Tyrese Maxey or Isaiah Joe, shouldn't be off the table when trying to put yourself in position to win the Championship if the opportunity presents itself.

[stormi]

Houston is basically sweating out a pick swap for this year, that they just made last year. They can't even depend on Tanking this year, because if they fall out of the top 4, I believe they have to swap with the worst of Miami and OKC. Swaps are as bad as picks sometimes.

I think Jalen Brown is a Celtic, and not a Net, due to a swap.

I realize HOU isn’t tanking. I think they’re going to be poorly run for awhile. Bad on accident as opposed to bad on purpose I suppose. Kings or Wolves-esque. Yes, there’s a chance HOU gets extra value later. I don’t personally consider it a high chance.

What the bigger point here is, IMO, using assets for Lowry means that many less assets available in the summer when a better option becomes available. There is no obviously available move right now that is going to catapult the Sixers over the Nets this year. They may not even be able to beat the Bucks. And that doesn’t even mention the Raptors and Celtics, who while less talented are good at getting in the Sixers heads.

Just because there is no obvious move that will catapult the 76ers above the (fully healthy) Nets, doesn't mean you just sit there and hoard assets. Its 60-40, Durant will even be healthy, when the ECF is in play. Stuff like the #28th pick, Tyrese Maxey or Isaiah Joe, shouldn't be off the table when trying to put yourself in position to win the Championship if the opportunity presents itself.

I definitely do agree with you. This discussion makes my brain spin. Masai went for it during a year where KD, Curry and Klay had been running rampant and were pulverizing Lebron and Harden year after year. Injuries and things of that sort are unpredictable.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/31041397/brooklyn-nets-kevin-durant-get-more-imaging-injured-hamstring

KD is still looking battered. And none of the top teams are really cruising atm.

I'm down with making a move, but on the flip side I hate the mentality from some fans like it's the end of the world if we don't perform a win now move as if Ben is 39 and Joel is 40. I'm in the wait and see camp I guess.

[Mik317]

as I stated in other threads. I would be a terrible ass GM because i'd either pull a Danny Ainge and hoard my **** or haphazardly trade dudes away after a bad game lol.

BUT taking a step back from my inherent bias for young players and future picks (aka more young players) founded after decades of never having any here.....lets be realistic in terms of Maxey and friends actual upside. I am/was scared of trading Ben for the off chance he figures things out....if Maxey reaches his peak...he might be Lou Williams. Nice to have but not the end of the world in reality. Thybulle's ideal ceiling is probably Danny Green with a vlog. Joe is probably Black Furkan. And the reality is that they probably don't have the room to grow here anyway.

BUT BUT... I feel like we have used this same ideology in the past as well...and then be sad when we are relying on corpses to man the bench..or even start. I feel like even with the realistic if not a bit pessimistic outcome of those guys, we need to make sure whatever we get back is at least around for a season or two. Lowry's age IMO doesn't seem like it fits that criteria...and while he is a fellow CD alum..man has not exactly been the model of consistency in the playoffs IIRC. DeRozan got the brunt of it but Lowry was a major part of the choke jobs (tbf running into LeThanos didn't help). I think Oladipo is washed and looking for that South Beach Pay Check...and even if he isn't...he feels like Josh Richardson 2.0 in terms of fit as a guy who can hit 3s but not the way we want him to and isn't that great of a creator to offset that. Fournier is also a playoff choke artist IMO..and also has some Josh tendencies. TRoss has been a Sixer for years lol so you just know he will come here and shoot like 25% from 3. So none of the rumored names really excite me....and yet even going the "cheaper" route will probably require capital of some sort...for slight gain.

I am down with whatever at this stage honestly tho. I feel like we are technically close but also not that close. I also don't think the answer has an obvious solution at the moment. We need a Jimmy Butler who can and will shoot high volume 3s...but that guy isn't for sale or perhaps even exists lol.

Going to be interesting to see what the FO chooses. This is what Morey is here for tho.

[the_process]

Houston is basically sweating out a pick swap for this year, that they just made last year. They can't even depend on Tanking this year, because if they fall out of the top 4, I believe they have to swap with the worst of Miami and OKC. Swaps are as bad as picks sometimes.

I think Jalen Brown is a Celtic, and not a Net, due to a swap.

I realize HOU isn’t tanking. I think they’re going to be poorly run for awhile. Bad on accident as opposed to bad on purpose I suppose. Kings or Wolves-esque. Yes, there’s a chance HOU gets extra value later. I don’t personally consider it a high chance.

What the bigger point here is, IMO, using assets for Lowry means that many less assets available in the summer when a better option becomes available. There is no obviously available move right now that is going to catapult the Sixers over the Nets this year. They may not even be able to beat the Bucks. And that doesn’t even mention the Raptors and Celtics, who while less talented are good at getting in the Sixers heads.

Just because there is no obvious move that will catapult the 76ers above the (fully healthy) Nets, doesn't mean you just sit there and hoard assets. Its 60-40, Durant will even be healthy, when the ECF is in play. Stuff like the #28th pick, Tyrese Maxey or Isaiah Joe, shouldn't be off the table when trying to put yourself in position to win the Championship if the opportunity presents itself.

Sure, if somebody becomes available that actually can make a difference, then use the assets.

[the_process]

I realize HOU isn’t tanking. I think they’re going to be poorly run for awhile. Bad on accident as opposed to bad on purpose I suppose. Kings or Wolves-esque. Yes, there’s a chance HOU gets extra value later. I don’t personally consider it a high chance.

What the bigger point here is, IMO, using assets for Lowry means that many less assets available in the summer when a better option becomes available. There is no obviously available move right now that is going to catapult the Sixers over the Nets this year. They may not even be able to beat the Bucks. And that doesn’t even mention the Raptors and Celtics, who while less talented are good at getting in the Sixers heads.

Just because there is no obvious move that will catapult the 76ers above the (fully healthy) Nets, doesn't mean you just sit there and hoard assets. Its 60-40, Durant will even be healthy, when the ECF is in play. Stuff like the #28th pick, Tyrese Maxey or Isaiah Joe, shouldn't be off the table when trying to put yourself in position to win the Championship if the opportunity presents itself.

I definitely do agree with you. This discussion makes my brain spin. Masai went for it during a year where KD, Curry and Klay had been running rampant and were pulverizing Lebron and Harden year after year. Injuries and things of that sort are unpredictable.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/31041397/brooklyn-nets-kevin-durant-get-more-imaging-injured-hamstring

KD is still looking battered. And none of the top teams are really cruising atm.

I'm down with making a move, but on the flip side I hate the mentality from some fans lIke it's the end of the world if we don't perform a win now move as if Ben is 39 and Joel is 40. I'm in the wait and see camp I guess.

To be fair, Masai trading DeRozan, Poeltl, and a 1st for Green and Kawhi required no thought. The Raps wanted to reset after multiple years of playoff failures.

[stormi]

Just because there is no obvious move that will catapult the 76ers above the (fully healthy) Nets, doesn't mean you just sit there and hoard assets. Its 60-40, Durant will even be healthy, when the ECF is in play. Stuff like the #28th pick, Tyrese Maxey or Isaiah Joe, shouldn't be off the table when trying to put yourself in position to win the Championship if the opportunity presents itself.

I definitely do agree with you. This discussion makes my brain spin. Masai went for it during a year where KD, Curry and Klay had been running rampant and were pulverizing Lebron and Harden year after year. Injuries and things of that sort are unpredictable.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/31041397/brooklyn-nets-kevin-durant-get-more-imaging-injured-hamstring

KD is still looking battered. And none of the top teams are really cruising atm.

I'm down with making a move, but on the flip side I hate the mentality from some fans lIke it's the end of the world if we don't perform a win now move as if Ben is 39 and Joel is 40. I'm in the wait and see camp I guess.

To be fair, Masai trading DeRozan, Poeltl, and a 1st for Green and Kawhi required no thought. The Raps wanted to reset after multiple years of playoff failures.

I wasn't even thinking about that move, that was a no brainer. I was thinking about the double down on Gasol at the deadline. I guess they had to though, there was no certainty Kawhi would stay - and he didn't lol.

[Tomjas]

Just about the only really young guy that I wouldn’t trade is Reed

Far from finished article obviously but just seems to be something about him

[LloydFree]

I definitely do agree with you. This discussion makes my brain spin. Masai went for it during a year where KD, Curry and Klay had been running rampant and were pulverizing Lebron and Harden year after year. Injuries and things of that sort are unpredictable.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/31041397/brooklyn-nets-kevin-durant-get-more-imaging-injured-hamstring

KD is still looking battered. And none of the top teams are really cruising atm.

I'm down with making a move, but on the flip side I hate the mentality from some fans lIke it's the end of the world if we don't perform a win now move as if Ben is 39 and Joel is 40. I'm in the wait and see camp I guess.

To be fair, Masai trading DeRozan, Poeltl, and a 1st for Green and Kawhi required no thought. The Raps wanted to reset after multiple years of playoff failures.

I wasn't even thinking about that move, that was a no brainer. I was thinking about the double down on Gasol at the deadline. I guess they had to though, there was no certainty Kawhi would stay - and he didn't lol.

The Raptors getting Gasol at the deadline, won them the Championship.

[Skates]

Maxey, Joe and Reed have all showed a ton more promise than their draft positions. Reed tore up the G-league, Joe has impressed defensively for a 'shooter only' guy and on a team that could let young guys make mistakes and impress at the same time, Maxey would have played a ton more and put up numbers. Each needs to develop, it isn't like they are a trio of future MVP's, but they all look like solid future contributors with a lot more value than being treated as throw-ins on a buy low opportunity for the other team we are trading with. It is easy to blow and miss on draft picks from 20 to the late 50's. and those are where our future picks will fall in the next few years. Spend those hit or miss chances or get the value for your young guys that you think a year or two will give you. A young Lou Williams in Maxey? In not too much time he will become a valuable trade chip, not untradable, but not giving up future developed value at a huge discount. Joe looks better than I ever expected, more like a Korver with defensive possibilities that Korver and Korkie never had. Reed I don't think is even eligible to be traded as a two way player and won't be converted, if at all, till after the deadline.

The idea is not win now at all costs when you have two young superstars (and yes, anyone can get injured, we all know that) and another near all star in his prime years. If you get good value, the value you think they are worth, by all means trade the young guys, but if you think they will be far more valuable trade chips or players in a year, don't send them out as tidbits, use future firsts that are likely overvalued to do that, rather than picks you already feel like you hit on.

[DCasey91]

I like Oli over Lowry because of their expiring salary situation and over Derozan because of fit/Rockets tanking. The intended lineup I advocated is very well balanced 1-9. If it takes a high first rounder so be it.

Harris’s contract is more than likely moved in the off-season (don’t like it as it’s results based but that’s the corner the 76ers management as put themselves into).

4 all star talents with an MVP & DPOY caliber duo is right there for contention. Wouldn’t pay attention to previous games from Oli, if he has 5 good ones someone that’s contending will be all over it. He fits the description more than well enough.

Sure there is bad blood but if there was ever a chance for a high upswing potential at low cost this would be it. One move and the team is setup nicely in the playoffs. If Oli goes then he goes but wasting a year of Embiid’s prime isn’t the route I want to go down especially this year as it’s so open. Next year there’s more than a fair chance that the Nets will
Have a very dominate 2yr span. (Lebron old, GSW old both are just as injury prone as Nets though Nets are more stacked with deeper talent). Suns/Nuggets darkhorse in the next two years.

We should be contending this year and for the next 3. If we don’t get 1 through to 9 setup suitably it’s directly on the Owner/GM. Had more than enough time/chances to do that

[eyeatoma]

I like Oli over Lowry because of their expiring salary situation and over Derozan because of fit/Rockets tanking. The intended lineup I advocated is very well balanced 1-9. If it takes a high first rounder so be it.

Harris’s contract is more than likely moved in the off-season (don’t like it as it’s results based but that’s the corner the 76ers management as put themselves into).

4 all star talents with an MVP & DPOY caliber duo is right there for contention. Wouldn’t pay attention to previous games from Oli, if he has 5 good ones someone that’s contending will be all over it. He fits the description more than well enough.

Sure there is bad blood but if there was ever a chance for a high upswing potential at low cost this would be it. One move and the team is setup nicely in the playoffs. If Oli goes then he goes but wasting a year of Embiid’s prime isn’t the route I want to go down especially this year as it’s so open. Next year there’s more than a fair chance that the Nets will
Have a very dominate 2yr span. (Lebron old, GSW old both are just as injury prone as Nets though Nets are more stacked with deeper talent). Suns/Nuggets darkhorse in the next two years.

We should be contending this year and for the next 3. If we don’t get 1 through to 9 setup suitably it’s directly on the Owner/GM. Had more than enough time/chances to do that

Can we please stop calling him Oli lol.

[phifans]

I like Oli over Lowry because of their expiring salary situation and over Derozan because of fit/Rockets tanking. The intended lineup I advocated is very well balanced 1-9. If it takes a high first rounder so be it.

Harris’s contract is more than likely moved in the off-season (don’t like it as it’s results based but that’s the corner the 76ers management as put themselves into).

4 all star talents with an MVP & DPOY caliber duo is right there for contention. Wouldn’t pay attention to previous games from Oli, if he has 5 good ones someone that’s contending will be all over it. He fits the description more than well enough.

Sure there is bad blood but if there was ever a chance for a high upswing potential at low cost this would be it. One move and the team is setup nicely in the playoffs. If Oli goes then he goes but wasting a year of Embiid’s prime isn’t the route I want to go down especially this year as it’s so open. Next year there’s more than a fair chance that the Nets will
Have a very dominate 2yr span. (Lebron old, GSW old both are just as injury prone as Nets though Nets are more stacked with deeper talent). Suns/Nuggets darkhorse in the next two years.

We should be contending this year and for the next 3. If we don’t get 1 through to 9 setup suitably it’s directly on the Owner/GM. Had more than enough time/chances to do that

Can we please stop calling him Oli lol.

Yeah don't know why but it reminds me of Kevin Ollie ...

[Murray_17]

Read on Twitter

It seems we're close to see if all this "Tucker to the sixers after a buyout" rumors are true or not.... if the Rockets don't find a trade first

[51X3RF4N]

Read on Twitter

It seems we're close to see if all this "Tucker to the sixers after a buyout" rumors are true or not.... if the Rockets don't find a trade first

The Rockets are such a poorly run organization. Who knows what they will do? They're apparently asking for a legit asset for Tucker, who clearly doesn't want to be there.

And they passed on Ben Simmons AND Thybulle in a package for Harden so they could have what exactly??

I bet they end up trading Tucker for something they can't even use anyways.

Sent from my SM-G986U using RealGM mobile app

[Sixerscan]

I like Oli over Lowry because of their expiring salary situation and over Derozan because of fit/Rockets tanking. The intended lineup I advocated is very well balanced 1-9. If it takes a high first rounder so be it.

Harris’s contract is more than likely moved in the off-season (don’t like it as it’s results based but that’s the corner the 76ers management as put themselves into).

4 all star talents with an MVP & DPOY caliber duo is right there for contention. Wouldn’t pay attention to previous games from Oli, if he has 5 good ones someone that’s contending will be all over it. He fits the description more than well enough.

Sure there is bad blood but if there was ever a chance for a high upswing potential at low cost this would be it. One move and the team is setup nicely in the playoffs. If Oli goes then he goes but wasting a year of Embiid’s prime isn’t the route I want to go down especially this year as it’s so open. Next year there’s more than a fair chance that the Nets will
Have a very dominate 2yr span. (Lebron old, GSW old both are just as injury prone as Nets though Nets are more stacked with deeper talent). Suns/Nuggets darkhorse in the next two years.

We should be contending this year and for the next 3. If we don’t get 1 through to 9 setup suitably it’s directly on the Owner/GM. Had more than enough time/chances to do that

Am I missing something? They are both expiring.

[Sixerscan]

Read on Twitter

It seems we're close to see if all this "Tucker to the sixers after a buyout" rumors are true or not.... if the Rockets don't find a trade first

The Rockets are such a poorly run organization. Who knows what they will do? They're apparently asking for a legit asset for Tucker, who clearly doesn't want to be there.

And they passed on Ben Simmons AND Thybulle in a package for Harden so they could have what exactly??

I bet they end up trading Tucker for something they can't even use anyways.

Sent from my SM-G986U using RealGM mobile app

It’s going to be some ridiculous team like Thibs is going to trade picks for him and bench Toppin.

[Murray_17]

Am I missing something? They are both expiring.

He also is looking for a bigger contract than whatever Lowry is gonna get