2016 NBA Draft/College Basketball Thread

[kriss73]

https://sports.yahoo.com/news/vertical-comp--k-d--and-brandon-ingram-153255100.html

Nice comparison. I'm a fan of Ingram, but I agree with this scouting report.
So, maybe anyone has to lower a little bit his expectations.

[Negrodamus]

https://sports.yahoo.com/news/vertical-comp--k-d--and-brandon-ingram-153255100.html

Nice comparison. I'm a fan of Ingram, but I agree with this scouting report.
So, maybe anyone has to lower a little bit his expectations.

He didn't do what Durant did because of two things:

1. He played at Duke where he was more of a perimeter player than Durant was. Durant was filling the void of Aldridge from the year before, but he was also the entire team I felt like. He took way more shots than Ingram did, and at a similar clip.

2. He's not Durant. Durant is arguably the best player in the league. But I'll take Durant lite from this draft. Durant lite is still a freak of nature.

[kriss73]

https://sports.yahoo.com/news/vertical-comp--k-d--and-brandon-ingram-153255100.html

Nice comparison. I'm a fan of Ingram, but I agree with this scouting report.
So, maybe anyone has to lower a little bit his expectations.

He didn't do what Durant did because of two things:

1. He played at Duke where he was more of a perimeter player than Durant was. Durant was filling the void of Aldridge from the year before, but he was also the entire team I felt like. He took way more shots than Ingram did, and at a similar clip.

2. He's not Durant. Durant is arguably the best player in the league. But I'll take Durant lite from this draft. Durant lite is still a freak of nature.

Regarding the Duke context, you're right. And your "Durant-lite" definition is really on target.

[76ciology]

https://sports.yahoo.com/news/vertical-comp--k-d--and-brandon-ingram-153255100.html

Nice comparison. I'm a fan of Ingram, but I agree with this scouting report.
So, maybe anyone has to lower a little bit his expectations.

He didn't do what Durant did because of two things:

1. He played at Duke where he was more of a perimeter player than Durant was. Durant was filling the void of Aldridge from the year before, but he was also the entire team I felt like. He took way more shots than Ingram did, and at a similar clip.

2. He's not Durant. Durant is arguably the best player in the league. But I'll take Durant lite from this draft. Durant lite is still a freak of nature.

this. I'd take Durant lite over Blake Griffin, PEAK Lamar Odom or Giannis.

In the NBA, if you can score from the perimeter, it's easy for you to break down the defense and be a playmaker because of the nature of the pick and roll and the strength of the drive and draw game.

[Ericb5]

https://sports.yahoo.com/news/vertical-comp--k-d--and-brandon-ingram-153255100.html

Nice comparison. I'm a fan of Ingram, but I agree with this scouting report.
So, maybe anyone has to lower a little bit his expectations.

He didn't do what Durant did because of two things:

1. He played at Duke where he was more of a perimeter player than Durant was. Durant was filling the void of Aldridge from the year before, but he was also the entire team I felt like. He took way more shots than Ingram did, and at a similar clip.

2. He's not Durant. Durant is arguably the best player in the league. But I'll take Durant lite from this draft. Durant lite is still a freak of nature.

this. I'd take Durant lite over Blake Griffin, PEAK Lamar Odom or Giannis.

In the NBA, if you can score from the perimeter, it's easy for you to break down the defense and be a playmaker because of the nature of the pick and roll and the strength of the drive and draw game.

There in lies the problem taking Ingram over Simmons. Ingram is Durant-light, and Simmons is actually on the level of Durant. He is just a different kind of player.

Simmons is going to be a top 5 player in the league, and is every bit as talented as people like Durant, Westbrook, and Curry.

Ingram is like Durant skills wise, but isn't on the same level talent wise.

We need to see the forest through the trees. I think that people are getting caught up in the skills that Ingram has and how much easier they would be to mesh into our team, but Simmons is a "throw away the script" type of talent.

Just imagine someone looking at Iverson coming out of college and not taking him because they needed a point guard.

Talent trumps everything else. Nobody seems to argue that Ingram is at the same level talent wise. They just argue for his skills, and that should not be part of the equation at the top of the draft.

Simmons gets out of bed with more God given talent than anyone in the draft. We should take our chances with him and try to develop his skills.

Give him the ball on offense, and let him guard the 3, and 4 on defense. Let the other team deal with him, and then pick up the pieces with the rest of our roster.

Embiid and Simmons would be the most talented young duo in the league.







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[Negrodamus]

He didn't do what Durant did because of two things:

1. He played at Duke where he was more of a perimeter player than Durant was. Durant was filling the void of Aldridge from the year before, but he was also the entire team I felt like. He took way more shots than Ingram did, and at a similar clip.

2. He's not Durant. Durant is arguably the best player in the league. But I'll take Durant lite from this draft. Durant lite is still a freak of nature.

this. I'd take Durant lite over Blake Griffin, PEAK Lamar Odom or Giannis.

In the NBA, if you can score from the perimeter, it's easy for you to break down the defense and be a playmaker because of the nature of the pick and roll and the strength of the drive and draw game.

There in lies the problem taking Ingram over Simmons. Ingram is Durant-light, and Simmons is actually on the level of Durant. He is just a different kind of player.

Simmons is going to be a top 5 player in the league, and is every bit as talented as people like Durant, Westbrook, and Curry.

Ingram is like Durant skills wise, but isn't on the same level talent wise.

We need to see the forest through the trees. I think that people are getting caught up in the skills that Ingram has and how much easier they would be to mesh into our team, but Simmons is a "throw away the script" type of talent.

Just imagine someone looking at Iverson coming out of college and not taking him because they needed a point guard.

Talent trumps everything else. Nobody seems to argue that Ingram is at the same level talent wise. They just argue for his skills, and that should not be part of the equation at the top of the draft.

Simmons gets out of bed with more God given talent than anyone in the draft. We should take our chances with him and try to develop his skills.

Give him the ball on offense, and let him guard the 3, and 4 on defense. Let the other team deal with him, and then pick up the pieces with the rest of our roster.

Embiid and Simmons would be the most talented young duo in the league.

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I mean, we've been through this argument, but Durant's issues coming into the league is that he was a stick figure. It's a similar issue that Ingram has. Skill wise, they have/had the full package (shooting, defense, dribbling, etc) and they have the length mixed with athleticism to be elite. They both also made it to the NCAA tourney, which I think should count for something.

Simmons lacks a fundamental skill that is necessary to be elite in the NBA, shooting. He's a great athlete, but for his position, he lacks length. He also walked into a similar situation as Durant, a team that lost plenty of talent, and didn't answer the calling like Durant did (his Texas team was a 4 seed; it wasn't even like it was a question whether he'd make it in the tourney).

It's not that he's just bad at shooting, it's that he's afraid to even shoot it when left alone. That said, like I said earlier in this thread, shooting aside, if he can guard (or just stay in front of and make his presence known) Durant, LeBron, George, Carmelo, etc then I'm completely fine with sacrificing some shooting for the talents he brings, but if he's an undersized PF that can't shoot or defend, then we have a problem.

[Negrodamus]

Tell me what the difference is between Ben Simmons and 2014 NBA Champion Boris Diaw when he was coming into the league?

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XlaT8QceN74[/youtube]

Diaw has a better wingspan (I think I saw it at 7'3) but is 2-3 inches shorter. Diaw had/has a better jumpshot. Diaw looked like a can't miss prospect.

I say 2014 NBA Champion Boris Diaw because he has had success. He was once the MIP in 2006. But he is a great piece on a championship team. A great role player. He's not an NBA all-star. That's no slight to Simmons because getting great role players out of a draft is huge, but I think Ingram has a better chance to become a star.

[Negrodamus]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zMpITktldM[/youtube]

Another thing to consider, watch how many times Ingram finishes with his left hand when he's right hand dominant. I honestly thing that's huge. Okafor is similar in that he can finish with either hand which allows him to put his body between the defender and the shot.

Watch D'Angelo Russell last year at OSU. He was terrified of his off hand (right hand) and would force up a left handed layup in traffic. Ingram is truly ahead skill wise. He just needs to grow into his body and get more lift in those legs.

I'll spare Simmons in this post.

[Negrodamus]

Whoever gets Jamal Murray will have some fun games whenever they play against GSW. Curry vs Murray could be some high scoring matchups.

[XtremeDunkz]

Mannnnn if Boston gets Ingram or Simmons.. All they will be missing is a rim protector.

[ET Da Gawd]

Simmons Jahlil Embiid will be the anti gsw lineup, mismatch at 3-5...


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[ProcessDoctor]

Mannnnn if Boston gets Ingram or Simmons.. All they will be missing is a rim protector.

I think it would be fun if Philly and Boston ended up with those two prospects (as long as we end up with the better of the two ). Although we would still be a step or two behind in the rebuild process, those match-ups would be great in 3-4 years.

[freshie2]

Rewind a few months ago, and I believe the talk was how Simmons finishes in traffic with either hand. Today, we see that Ingram uses his left as well as his right...these are the top 2 picks in the draft...are we shocked that they both can use either hand?? It's amazing how Simmons gets slighted by some...I can't imagine they have watched more than a handful of games/clips if they think he's such a bad option. The Sixers have to get either the first or second pick...both are great prospects with tremendous upside, but also a lot of room for growth. It will be interesting to see which one has the better NBA career...Simmons has more star quality-better rebounder/ball handler/distributor, and obviously Ingram has more length and a better perimeter shot, but either would be a huge upgrade to the roster.

[Negrodamus]

Rewind a few months ago, and I believe the talk was how Simmons finishes in traffic with either hand. Today, we see that Ingram uses his left as well as his right...these are the top 2 picks in the draft...are we shocked that they both can use either hand?? It's amazing how Simmons gets slighted by some...I can't imagine they have watched more than a handful of games/clips if they think he's such a bad option. The Sixers have to get either the first or second pick...both are great prospects with tremendous upside, but also a lot of room for growth. It will be interesting to see which one has the better NBA career...Simmons has more star quality-better rebounder/ball handler/distributor, and obviously Ingram has more length and a better perimeter shot, but either would be a huge upgrade to the roster.

I mean the #2 pick last year exclusively didn't use his right hand and would go out of his way to not lay up with his off hand. It's kinda like when Simmons throws a right one handed shot in lieu of shooting a jump shot.

I think there's a misconception that I don't think Simmons is a great talent. He definitely is talented and unique, but a lot of things need to happen in order for him to become a superstar in this league. Ingram isn't flawless, but he possesses many of the attributes necessary to be a superstar in this league.

Lets start with wingspan. If you look at the best players, they all of an above average to elite wingspan. There are exceptions (Curry, Butler, Thompson), but those guys fell a bit in their drafts because of that reason or other questions: Curry's lack of athleticism, Butler's above average college stats.

Ingram has elite length. Simmons has above average length for a 3, mediocre length for a PF. If Simmons has the athleticism to be able to guard other 3s well, then sign me up for him as the #1 pick. Otherwise, I'm not ready to adjust an entire team to fit the needs of an undersized PF that can't shoot.

[freshie2]

I don't worry about his ability to defend a 3 or a 4. His jumper and selflessness are what I'd like to see improve, but those are minor concerns. Ingrams shot and length are fantastic, and he's a great prospect as well...I just haven't seen enough to put him above Simmons.

If the lottery puts the sixers at 2 and 4, I'd be more than ok with Simmons/Murray or Ingram/Dunn...I may have had too much Kool aid, but I see the quick turn around if everything goes well may 17th.

[Dell]

Interesting option with either the Heat or OKC picks is Petr Cornelie. 20 years old, DX has him at over 7 feet without shoes. Great athlete and shot over 40% from 3 this year. I'll gamble on his upside and let him develop overseas for a couple more years.

[Negrodamus]

I don't worry about his ability to defend a 3 or a 4. His jumper and selflessness are what I'd like to see improve, but those are minor concerns. Ingrams shot and length are fantastic, and he's a great prospect as well...I just haven't seen enough to put him above Simmons.

If the lottery puts the sixers at 2 and 4, I'd be more than ok with Simmons/Murray or Ingram/Dunn...I may have had too much Kool aid, but I see the quick turn around if everything goes well may 17th.

I think either of those scenarios puts us in a situation where we will improve a crazy amount. I know rookies should not be expected to save a team, but that amount of playmaking injected into a backcourt is just too much.

My biased opinion is that if we get Dunn/Ingram, we could see something special next year. Ingram needs time to fill out and improve his burst a little bit and Dunn needs to work on limited turnovers, but those two can bring defense and unique playmaking that this team currently doesn't have from it's wings.

I just want to see Dunn, Ingram, Covington, Noel/Okafor, and Embiid all on the court at the same time just once. That's gotta be an average wingspan of 7'0 with Dunn being the outlier.

[ET Da Gawd]

Good game so far, congrats to Buddy on being the Big12's all time scorer

[phantom84]

Hart is outplaying Hield lol.

[ET Da Gawd]

Things getting interesting..
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