Joel: unchained.

[stormi]

Fox
Levert
Bridges
Johnson
Ayton

Yuck lol

[NBA Moses]

Fox
Levert
Bridges
Johnson
Ayton


Yuck lol

This is what you are realistically looking at. The players/trades will be different but it gives you a glimpse of A young athletic team on the upside whos going to improve and not lose to the Hawks G-league team.

Maxey,Tobias,Seth added depth.

[mjkvol]

I still think we need to stick with Jojo, unless we’re left with no options (bad luck in ben simmons trade and bad luck in draft).

Many are fixated on Biid. But just as life after Ben, I think most will be surprised that the alternate reality/future is not as bad or may even be better.

Maxey showed us that you dont need someone as popular as Ben to take over the PG position.

I believe there will come a day when the Embiid era ends and a new franchise player takes place and we’ll see how much better and easier it is than playing this russian roulette performance and availability with Embiid. Just as how Rockets went from the Yao Ming era to the James Harden era. But yeah, the gap in between these two eras are going to be rocky but it will sure come.

There is a better life after Jojo. But not yet.

The time between real franchise players can be interminable. Iverson was done here in 2006, and it was ten long years before we had anything to really get behind here (aside from the off court drama of The Process).

I believe we can still build a championship contender around Embiid ala late era David Robinson, but it's going to require some patience by ownership and the fan base allowing Morey to do it the right way.

Keep in mind Iverson was 31 y.o 1 dimensional scorer. His trade value was limited as well as the rest of that roster.

Morey has a 25 y.o. 3 time all-star in Simmons, 28 y.o. 4x all-star in Embiid. Morey should be able to build a young competitive nucleus around the trade pieces of Ben+Joel.

Ben + pieces/picks I'll take DeAaron Fox + Caris Levert
Joel- For instance Deandre Ayton , Mikal Bridges, Cameron Johnson

You go from an old slow team to a young athletic team. Most seem to be where I was last year, give it another year lets see what happens. We saw what happened in the past year. Joel got worked over by John Collins and Clint Capella , couldnt beat a mediocre Hawks team and this year has been a disaster without Ben.

My point about Iverson was more related to actually having a great player to watch night after night, not about building around him.

My problem with your solution is that we go from having one generational player and one who could have been to zero, basically a nice young team that will be a 6-8 seed at best. Unless those deals come with a boatload of unprotected or lightly protected picks, they are essentially franchise suicide.

A much better solution in the near term is to have everyone but Jo on the table going into the off season and finally build a team around him that complements what he does and doesn't do.

[stormi]

Fox
Levert
Bridges
Johnson
Ayton


Yuck lol

This is what you are realistically looking at. The players/trades will be different but it gives you a glimpse of A young athletic team on the upside whos going to improve and not lose to the Hawks G-league team.

Maxey,Tobias,Seth added depth.

Would rather watch Embiid play 1 on 5 until his body gives out than build that Pacers 2.0 team.

[76ciology]

I still think we need to stick with Jojo, unless we’re left with no options (bad luck in ben simmons trade and bad luck in draft).

Many are fixated on Biid. But just as life after Ben, I think most will be surprised that the alternate reality/future is not as bad or may even be better.

Maxey showed us that you dont need someone as popular as Ben to take over the PG position.

I believe there will come a day when the Embiid era ends and a new franchise player takes place and we’ll see how much better and easier it is than playing this russian roulette performance and availability with Embiid. Just as how Rockets went from the Yao Ming era to the James Harden era. But yeah, the gap in between these two eras are going to be rocky but it will sure come.

There is a better life after Jojo. But not yet.

The time between real franchise players can be interminable. Iverson was done here in 2006, and it was ten long years before we had anything to really get behind here (aside from the off court drama of The Process).

I believe we can still build a championship contender around Embiid ala late era David Robinson, but it's going to require some patience by ownership and the fan base allowing Morey to do it the right way.

Almost all team have franchise players, so i dont think its that hard to have one. We just had a hard time getting one because we either dont tank or we tank but we dont know how to draft or build a winning roster.

Morey isn’t building a Spurs team. I dont see us having a “late DRob era”. Morey is more of a GM who’s gonna trade Embiid if he is dragging down the team and doesnt see Embiid fitting as a player he can build around. And like I said, I see Embiid as a guy that we can build around. For now.

If Morey was GM for the Spurs, I think he’d trade both Tony Parker and Ginobili for a top tier star package to form a trio of Kawhi, TD and that top tier star.

In Morey’s eyes, you’re either a top tier star, a role player or an asset that is his mean to get another top tier star.

[mjkvol]

I still think we need to stick with Jojo, unless we’re left with no options (bad luck in ben simmons trade and bad luck in draft).

Many are fixated on Biid. But just as life after Ben, I think most will be surprised that the alternate reality/future is not as bad or may even be better.

Maxey showed us that you dont need someone as popular as Ben to take over the PG position.

I believe there will come a day when the Embiid era ends and a new franchise player takes place and we’ll see how much better and easier it is than playing this russian roulette performance and availability with Embiid. Just as how Rockets went from the Yao Ming era to the James Harden era. But yeah, the gap in between these two eras are going to be rocky but it will sure come.

There is a better life after Jojo. But not yet.

The time between real franchise players can be interminable. Iverson was done here in 2006, and it was ten long years before we had anything to really get behind here (aside from the off court drama of The Process).

I believe we can still build a championship contender around Embiid ala late era David Robinson, but it's going to require some patience by ownership and the fan base allowing Morey to do it the right way.

Almost all team have franchise players, so i dont think its that hard to have one. We just had a hard time getting one because we either dont tank or we tank but we dont know how to draft or build a winning roster.

Morey isn’t building a Spurs team. I dont see us having a “late DRob era”. Morey is more of a GM who’s gonna trade Embiid if he is dragging down the team and doesnt see Embiid fitting as a player he can build around. And like I said, I see Embiid as a guy that we can build around. For now.

If Morey was GM for the Spurs, I think he’d trade both Tony Parker and Ginobili for a top tier star package to form a trio of Kawhi, TD and that top tier star.

In Morey’s eyes, you’re either a top tier star, a role player or an asset that is his mean to get another top tier star.

I don't disagree, especially with the idea of trying to build around Embiid short term, but selling quickly if it wasn't feasible.

Regarding franchise players, sure most teams have one, but how many are true difference makers, or 'generational' talents that you can build a legitimate contender around? The number of that kind of player in the league is a hell of a lot smaller.

[Murray_17]

Morey has a 25 y.o. 3 time all-star in Simmons, 28 y.o. 4x all-star in Embiid. Morey should be able to build a young competitive nucleus around the trade pieces of Ben+Joel.

Ben + pieces/picks I'll take DeAaron Fox + Caris Levert
Joel- For instance Deandre Ayton , Mikal Bridges, Cameron Johnson

You go from an old slow team to a young athletic team. Most seem to be where I was last year, give it another year lets see what happens. We saw what happened in the past year. Joel got worked over by John Collins and Clint Capella , couldnt beat a mediocre Hawks team and this year has been a disaster without Ben.

Lol

You want to trade Joel because he's not "championship piece" and that's your team?

That 5 unit has even less shooting than our current starting one and is probably even worse as a defensive unit, which is an amazing feat.

[76ciology]

The time between real franchise players can be interminable. Iverson was done here in 2006, and it was ten long years before we had anything to really get behind here (aside from the off court drama of The Process).

I believe we can still build a championship contender around Embiid ala late era David Robinson, but it's going to require some patience by ownership and the fan base allowing Morey to do it the right way.

Almost all team have franchise players, so i dont think its that hard to have one. We just had a hard time getting one because we either dont tank or we tank but we dont know how to draft or build a winning roster.

Morey isn’t building a Spurs team. I dont see us having a “late DRob era”. Morey is more of a GM who’s gonna trade Embiid if he is dragging down the team and doesnt see Embiid fitting as a player he can build around. And like I said, I see Embiid as a guy that we can build around. For now.

If Morey was GM for the Spurs, I think he’d trade both Tony Parker and Ginobili for a top tier star package to form a trio of Kawhi, TD and that top tier star.

In Morey’s eyes, you’re either a top tier star, a role player or an asset that is his mean to get another top tier star.

I don't disagree, especially with the idea of trying to build around Embiid short term, but selling quickly if it wasn't feasible.

Regarding franchise players, sure most teams have one, but how many are true difference makers, or 'generational' talents that you can build a legitimate contender around? The number of that kind of player in the league is a hell of a lot smaller.

If you do it right, you dont need to be lucky.

A good example is the Lakers. You can get a handful of good ones (ingram, dlo, randle, lonzo and etc) then trade them all for that franchise player.

Usually teams would stop taking risks after they get a franchise player, then they’ll start trying to win it or the franchise player will pressure them to try to push the chips immediately for him to get his paycheck. Almost always, this will be an uphill climb while most of the time this will lead to the franchise player being disgruntled and asking to be traded.

For instance, if we dont get anything good from Ben while we get unlucky in the draft. If at some point Embiid doesnt see a light in the end of the tunnel, Embiid will likely (not 100% certainty) to be traded (i.e Kobe Bryant tantrums back then or Giannis showing signs to asking for a trade).

The problem with our franchise is they’re naive in playing this game.

There are several ways to get a franchise players if you know how to do it right. You don’t just straight up try to get it via draft or hope to get lucky via trade or FA.

In my opinion, you can always get a franchise player but just not whenever you want it. How short the waiting time is will depend on how good you play your cards well and how much you are willing to sacrifice.

We view Jojo highly. But I wouldnt mind Cade Cunningham or Jabari Smith over Jojo. Possibly, Ja Morant and Anthony Edwards in the future over Jojo. Jojo is a great player and i still dont want to trade him but he’s not someone like Giannis or KD that can carry a GLeague squad and is almost always assures you of ECF visit.

Is jojo a generational talent? Yes, on around half of the games (considering missed games and high inconsistency in performance). I can’t say the same thing on guys like Giannis, KD, Steph, Harden, Jokic and etc.

[Mik317]

this franchise struggles to get point guards who can dribble and occasionally shoot at the same time.

you are telling me that the best idea is to trade the only thing this team has going for it atm because its hard lol?

Yeah building around Jo is not as easy as building around scoring wings or a PG (the latter of which also hasn't really won many championships as the best player btw). And as much as I love the big oaf...he just may not ever be reliable and consistent enough to do it either. There is a reality in which yeah "selling high" is the "right" move....its just a dumb one tho. In the NBA getting a top 15 guy is hard. You don't trade that guy unless that guy asks for it via him threatening to leave....or it you truly have done all you can do. And considering my opening statement...we have not done so yet IMO. Its going to be a lot harder thanks to our GMs failure..but as long as you have a player like Jo, flaws and all...you can always try. The only reason I am as pissed at the current state of the team is because we do have a player like Jo and every night (if he isn't hurt or sad...or bored...or whatever lol) we have a shot to beat anyone. Iverson gave us that too. Iggy, who I love and defended to death...did not.

I know people are worried about his longevity and all that but i'm not. He falls apart, we tank and maybe then the league won't be as mad as we'd have his contract to blame for why we aren't signing mediocre vets to be mediocre lol. Team doesn't attract FA anyway so who gives a **** about Josh Harris' money?

The whole process was about getting the guys to build with. We got him. One wants out because his fee fees got hurt but still until Biid follows suit, you keep trying. Selling high doesnt make you better right away and every single team that has traded away their best players have gotten a lot worse...many of which are still bad despite getting godfather deals.

this might change if we get more Hawks level performances but even then while I'll be miserable and whiny, I don't think trading your good-great players unless they want out is the move..

[Mik317]

Steph hasn't made the playoffs in two years and Jokic has the same record as we do.

**** hard to do solo

[mjkvol]

If you do it right, you dont need to be lucky.

A good example is the Lakers. You can get a handful of good ones (ingram, dlo, randle, lonzo and etc) then trade them all for that franchise player.

Huge difference - the Lakers are a destination, a place where the best players want to be, ala AD essentially quitting until he got traded there. The Nets are the same being in NYC, and if Dolan hadn't completely f***ked up the Knicks they would be as well. Philly is a place good players might only choose to come if we have a legitimate championship contender.

There's a big difference between 'franchise' players and generational talents. There are a whole bunch of the former and a handful of the latter. We have one of them, and while he can't carry us on his back every night due to health, etc., he can anytime he's engaged. And he wants to be here!

Through complete managerial incompetence, horrible luck, and another generational talent who quit, this organization has failed Embiid, and us. Morey has a legitimate, albeit small, chance here to rectify those wrongs, and until every possibility to put a contender around Jo is exhausted, it's the only smart way to proceed.

[eyeatoma]

If you do it right, you dont need to be lucky.

A good example is the Lakers. You can get a handful of good ones (ingram, dlo, randle, lonzo and etc) then trade them all for that franchise player.

Huge difference - the Lakers are a destination, a place where the best players want to be, ala AD essentially quitting until he got traded there. The Nets are the same being in NYC, and if Dolan hadn't completely f***ked up the Knicks they would be as well. Philly is a place good players might only choose to come if we have a legitimate championship contender.

There's a big difference between 'franchise' players and generational talents. There are a whole bunch of the former and a handful of the latter. We have one of them, and while he can't carry us on his back every night due to health, etc., he can anytime he's engaged. And he wants to be here!

Through complete managerial incompetence, horrible luck, and another generational talent who quit, this organization has failed Embiid, and us. Morey has a legitimate, albeit small, chance here to rectify those wrongs, and until every possibility to put a contender around Jo is exhausted, it's the only smart way to proceed.

Agreed 100%

Sent from my SM-G998B using Tapatalk

[phillynative]

I still think we need to stick with Jojo, unless we’re left with no options (bad luck in ben simmons trade and bad luck in draft).

Many are fixated on Biid. But just as life after Ben, I think most will be surprised that the alternate reality/future is not as bad or may even be better.

Maxey showed us that you dont need someone as popular as Ben to take over the PG position.

I believe there will come a day when the Embiid era ends and a new franchise player takes place and we’ll see how much better and easier it is than playing this russian roulette performance and availability with Embiid. Just as how Rockets went from the Yao Ming era to the James Harden era. But yeah, the gap in between these two eras are going to be rocky but it will sure come.

There is a better life after Jojo. But not yet.

The time between real franchise players can be interminable. Iverson was done here in 2006, and it was ten long years before we had anything to really get behind here (aside from the off court drama of The Process).

I believe we can still build a championship contender around Embiid ala late era David Robinson, but it's going to require some patience by ownership and the fan base allowing Morey to do it the right way.

Keep in mind Iverson was 31 y.o 1 dimensional scorer. His trade value was limited as well as the rest of that roster.

Morey has a 25 y.o. 3 time all-star in Simmons, 28 y.o. 4x all-star in Embiid. Morey should be able to build a young competitive nucleus around the trade pieces of Ben+Joel.

Ben + pieces/picks I'll take DeAaron Fox + Caris Levert
Joel- For instance Deandre Ayton , Mikal Bridges, Cameron Johnson

You go from an old slow team to a young athletic team. Most seem to be where I was last year, give it another year lets see what happens. We saw what happened in the past year. Joel got worked over by John Collins and Clint Capella , couldnt beat a mediocre Hawks team and this year has been a disaster without Ben.

Lol Joel got worked over by John Collins and Clint Capella ? He averaged 30 /14/4 on a torn meniscus. Meanwhile Ben and Tobias didn't step up. One hid from the moment and the other didn't deliver. Those are the max players the 76ers chose to surround their franchise player.

[TeamHigh]

Yeah building around Jo is not as easy as building around scoring wings or a PG (the latter of which also hasn't really won many championships as the best player btw).

Is it? Is it really?

Which elite wing is leading their team with no other all-star caliber teammates into contention? Cause I can't think of anybody. Even Steph missed the playoffs last year and he's arguably the best/most influential player in the entire league. LeBron hasn't won any championships either without a second star, and he missed the playoffs altogether his first year in LA.

You need help to win in the NBA.

The popular imagination tends to break down players as bigs (essentially 1 position out of 5) and everyone else (essentially 4 out of 5 positions), and then selection bias themselves into saying, "See? Look there's so many more wing/guard oriented franchise players!" without the awareness that, well yeah... you would expect there to be a lot more because ~80% of the players are wings and guards. And when you typically need multiple elite players to be a championship roster, guess what that configuration is probably going to involve? Probably the group with the supermajority of total players and positions...

If we accept the baseline that even elite PGs and wings need help (see Steph and LeBron missing the playoffs), we can ask the question, where are all the elite bigs languishing on bad teams? If it's truly difficult to build around bigs, then there should be a lot of quality (all-star level and above) bigs that struggle to even make the playoffs, right? So where are they?

AD, Embiid, Jokic, Gobert, Giannis, Bam have all been on fairly consistent playoff teams and a number of them have real done damage in the playoffs.

So among the bigs that have been mostly on bad teams you have... KAT? Sabonis? Then who?

There's really no evidence to support the popular argument that bigs are harder to build around, except for the fact that there are a lot fewer bigs than non-bigs.

[erving4ever]

In the very early 90s and after years of PO failures, we traded Barkley to Pho for a bunch of JAGs. Charles then led a well built and powerful Pho team to the NBA Finals. The 76ers? We floundered in irrelevance for 8 years until we drafted Iverson.

We are familiar with the exploits of the AI and the 76ers during the early 2000s. After AI was traded in 2006, it took us years just to create a 7-8 seed that had no star and no chance to win a title. LoL

Years of The Process later on, the 76ers emerged again 10 years later with the Joel/Simmons era that produced perennial 50 win seasons, promising PO runs, and 2 legit stars on the roster(1 superstar MVP caliber player). It is not just Joel or Ben that have struggled to make very deep PO runs. CP3, AD, Giannis were questioned by many for years due to suspect efforts in the POs until they got paired with other elite players and better fitting teams. There are many other examples.

So historically, it takes us 8-10 years to emerge with a team that we can all be excited about. Unless you can trade Joel for another superstar, trading Joel borders on negligence. Do any of you want to go through a decade of irrelevance after we trade Embiid?

No, thank you. We take our chances with Joel. We go all out and find another star and a well fitting team around him. We hold out all hope that Embiid will, at some point, make a PO run that we will all remember 20 years from now. Why? Because he can. We have to see this through. Stay the course.

I am not willing to watch Joel lead the Suns to an NBA title. Nope. And if Embiid plays his entire career in Philly without winning a title, he will at least have provided the 76ers years of relevance, exciting PO runs, and another historic player to add in the 76ers pantheon of great players.

[Bum Adebayo]

Yeah building around Jo is not as easy as building around scoring wings or a PG (the latter of which also hasn't really won many championships as the best player btw).

Is it? Is it really?

Which elite wing is leading their team with no other all-star caliber teammates into contention? Cause I can't think of anybody. Even Steph missed the playoffs last year and he's arguably the best/most influential player in the entire league. LeBron hasn't won any championships either without a second star, and he missed the playoffs altogether his first year in LA.

You need help to win in the NBA.

The popular imagination tends to break down players as bigs (essentially 1 position out of 5) and everyone else (essentially 4 out of 5 positions), and then selection bias themselves into saying, "See? Look there's so many more wing/guard oriented franchise players!" without the awareness that, well yeah... you would expect there to be a lot more because ~80% of the players are wings and guards. And when you typically need multiple elite players to be a championship roster, guess what that configuration is probably going to involve? Probably the group with the supermajority of total players and positions...

If we accept the baseline that even elite PGs and wings need help (see Steph and LeBron missing the playoffs), we can ask the question, where are all the elite bigs languishing on bad teams? If it's truly difficult to build around bigs, then there should be a lot of quality (all-star level and above) bigs that struggle to even make the playoffs, right? So where are they?

AD, Embiid, Jokic, Gobert, Giannis, Bam have all been on fairly consistent playoff teams and a number of them have real done damage in the playoffs.

So among the bigs that have been mostly on bad teams you have... KAT? Sabonis? Then who?

There's really no evidence to support the popular argument that bigs are harder to build around, except for the fact that there are a lot fewer bigs than non-bigs.

The issue is that people assume we've had more than 1 star, just because Simmons made all star game a few times, but he is absolutely a fake star. The only star we had was Jimmy Butler and it shows, we almost beat the champions that year with only like half a year to gel and no preseason.

[76ciology]

It does not really matter on who’s better between the two for being better or worse does not mean you are or aren’t gonna win the championship.

But Jokic is better than Jojo right? Not just this year but including last season.

And this season he just went into another level, he possibly have the best or atleast top 3-5 defensive numbers along with arguably best offensive numbers based on RAPTOR and BPM.

Jokic also is a lot more consistent and durable than Jojo.

[NBA Moses]

Is jojo a generational talent? Yes, on around half of the games (considering missed games and high inconsistency in performance). I can’t say the same thing on guys like Giannis, KD, Steph, Harden, Jokic and etc.

I see it similarly.

"Championship Pieces" in their prime excel at every facet.We're talking MJ, Lebron,KD,Steph,recently Giannis.

Lets look at the qualifications of what makes up a championship player.

1.Skill- Joel rates high here. This is not the problem.
2.Heart/Desire- I cant question Joel here ,Ill give him max score.
3.Physicality/stamina/Ability to take over game/series- This is where Joel starts to lose "Championship Piece" status. Injured alot, not championship level conditioning.You need to dominate nightly. Joel is dominant once a week ehh maybe once a month.
4.Instinct/BB IQ- Not championship level.

I dont ever see Sixers winning with Joel being a Point Center/Wing/Guard. And Ive wished it for 5 yrs and Ive lost all hope that Joels low post game would be the answer. Its just not going to happen . Hes never going to be Wilt,Russell,Shaq,Hakeem, hes not even going to be Patrick Ewing or Robert Parrish.

IMo the only chance was Sixers developing Joel into a true low post center . Years of Weight room/strength , low post development,boxing out , rim protecting, controlling the paint. They let him do his thing on the perimeter, the only problem is Joel is an avg perimeter guy at best. He loses value every foot he moves away from the basket.

[Murray_17]

Is jojo a generational talent? Yes, on around half of the games (considering missed games and high inconsistency in performance). I can’t say the same thing on guys like Giannis, KD, Steph, Harden, Jokic and etc.

I see it similarly.

"Championship Pieces" in their prime excel at every facet.We're talking MJ, Lebron,KD,Steph,recently Giannis.

Lets look at the qualifications of what makes up a championship player.

1.Skill- Joel rates high here. This is not the problem.
2.Heart/Desire- I cant question Joel here ,Ill give him max score.
3.Physicality/stamina/Ability to take over game/series- This is where Joel starts to lose "Championship Piece" status. Injured alot, not championship level conditioning.You need to dominate nightly. Joel is dominant once a week ehh maybe once a month.
4.Instinct/BB IQ- Not championship level.

I dont ever see Sixers winning with Joel being a Point Center/Wing/Guard. And Ive wished it for 5 yrs and Ive lost all hope that Joels low post game would be the answer. Its just not going to happen . Hes never going to be Wilt,Russell,Shaq,Hakeem, hes not even going to be Patrick Ewing or Robert Parrish.

IMo the only chance was Sixers developing Joel into a true low post center . Years of Weight room/strength , low post development,boxing out , rim protecting, controlling the paint. They let him do his thing on the perimeter, the only problem is Joel is an avg perimeter guy at best. He loses value every foot he moves away from the basket.

What a random thing to say.

Like Giannis doesn't excel at every facet of the game, Curry doesn't too, not even Lebron or Jordan did.

Your qualifications are super random too, like, how do you get to 4? what's the IQ basketball difference between Giannis and Joel? Can you explain? lol

Giannis is versatile because the entire team is design around him, idem with Steph who complements himself amazingly with Draymond who also can play small 5 great or point center in transition and allows Steph to play off ball.

More over, why does Joel has to be a Point center? we're playing like that because we don't have a PG currently but Giannis is not a PG anymore and has not been one for like 3 years now.

Do we need Joel to play most low post center? yes, but there is a reason post ups are mostly gone, you just can pack the paint in the clutch and take a low post move away, it's also a less efficient play and makes doubling easier. Joel has also an elite midrange jump shot, why would you want to take that away from him?

Can Joel anchor a defense? probably, but have you see Joel USG%? asking him to score on the volume he does AND anchor a defense is just overkill.

The reason Joel often fail as a closer is because he's basically our entire offense, so you just need to do an early double on him most of the time and teams can predict he's gonna close because we don't have too many offensive weapons.

Comparing him with the guys you're doing is hilarious too, you're talking like all those guys played the same kind of game. Joel last year, btw, was the first center to score as efficiently as he did on that volume since Wilt, not even Shaq scored with that efficiency on that volume.

[mjkvol]

Do we need Joel to play most low post center? yes, but there is a reason post ups are mostly gone, you just can pack the paint in the clutch and take a low post move away, it's also a less efficient play and makes doubling easier. Joel has also an elite midrange jump shot, why would you want to take that away from him?

Can Joel anchor a defense? probably, but have you see Joel USG%? asking him to score on the volume he does AND anchor a defense is just overkill.

These are great points. You would be taking away from what makes Joel so unique and so special by making him an exclusively low post center. His mid range game is, as you say, elite, and to me is the primary strength of his game. If he improved his passing just a bit and made teams pay for doubling, he would literally be impossible to defend.

And yes, to anchor the defense while having to almost single-handedly carry the offense night after night? Show me the big who has ever pulled off that trick.