Summer 2019 Free Agency Thread

[Negrodamus]

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That "IDK but not Philly" sounded waaay worse that if he just named one of the options (Lakers, HOU etc). I would be so depressed if Butler leaves and we max out Harris.

Mitchell’s one sided rivalry with us is so adorable.

It's sad to me because we could have just drafted him at 3 and not be in this current situation.

[eyeatoma]

No, I don’t think both come back. Thing could change based on what other free agents decide on, but as of now I only think one of those two are back

which one?

as of right now i would put my money on Jimmy, unless he flat out refuses to return.

Thanks! Is your inkling on Tobi that he doesn't want to be on the team, or that he'll only stay if we give the max? Also will we give the max, publicly we keep saying we will.

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[cool93]

which one?

as of right now i would put my money on Jimmy, unless he flat out refuses to return.

i could live with that. the horford as pf plan B rumor worries me a bit though. watching butler & horford decline in a couple years could be tough.

At least if it's Butler&Horford we legitimately can win a title next 2-3 years. If it's Harris&Horford, I won't be so optimistic.

Simmons/Butler/Horford/Embiid with someone else passable on defence could be really great.

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[fl311]

as of right now i would put my money on Jimmy, unless he flat out refuses to return.

i could live with that. the horford as pf plan B rumor worries me a bit though. watching butler & horford decline in a couple years could be tough.

At least if it's Butler&Horford we legitimately can win a title next 2-3 years. If it's Harris&Horford, I won't be so optimistic.

Simmons/Butler/Horford/Embiid with someone else passable on defence could be really great.

Sent from my G3416 using RealGM mobile app

Harris/Horford gives you a little more cap space for other moves to fill out the roster.

Im not a fan of Horford at 4 years, but that is probably what they would look at in the event he becomes an option.

[smittybanton]

I think the Atlanta Hawks may be the surprise team for Al Horford.

[AirP.]

So, now we are seeking the opinion of Donovan Mitchell?

Can't wait to see what other "experts" we start following over the coming days.

Wait, do I need to only post Woj, Lowe or Shams info? Personally, I like looking at more (even non-experts info) because you sometimes get insight from a different point of view. I'd love to know Mitchell's reasoning to be so strong about his thoughts on Butler and Philly, wish he would have elaborated on that subject.

You can post whatever you want. Mitchell has zero inside info on Butler. He has no reasoning outside of making a guess based on what “reports” are out there.

How would you know what insights he may or may not have? I would assume he has connections to agents, his own coaching staff and front office, and players he has personal relationships with and hears things that that the general public won't ever hear of. I'd also say 95-99% of the information is just that information/chatter that is actually happening but never leads to something solid. The wonderful thing about information, it can be utilized to have an understanding of what someone or an organization may or may not want to do.

Once again, I hope this is all over soon and the 76ers bring back their full starting lineup and have a true chance at a championship for the next half-decade.

[fl311]

which one?

as of right now i would put my money on Jimmy, unless he flat out refuses to return.

Thanks! Is your inkling on Tobi that he doesn't want to be on the team, or that he'll only stay if we give the max? Also will we give the max, publicly we keep saying we will.

Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk

Its gonna be about $$ and years. If both get max offers, both stay. If one can get a max on another team and be a 2nd option, one will leave.

Dont think both want to be a 2nd/3rd/4th option. Ben and his development is a major factor

[mhunt]

as of right now i would put my money on Jimmy, unless he flat out refuses to return.

i could live with that. the horford as pf plan B rumor worries me a bit though. watching butler & horford decline in a couple years could be tough.

At least if it's Butler&Horford we legitimately can win a title next 2-3 years. If it's Harris&Horford, I won't be so optimistic.

Simmons/Butler/Horford/Embiid with someone else passable on defence could be really great.

Sent from my G3416 using RealGM mobile app

agreed...butler/horford gives them a really strong 2-3 year window to bring home a championship.

[eyeatoma]

as of right now i would put my money on Jimmy, unless he flat out refuses to return.

Thanks! Is your inkling on Tobi that he doesn't want to be on the team, or that he'll only stay if we give the max? Also will we give the max, publicly we keep saying we will.

Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk

Its gonna be about $$ and years. If both get max offers, both stay. If one can get a max on another team and be a 2nd option, one will leave.

Dont think both want to be a 2nd/3rd/4th option. Ben and his development is a major factor

Thanks so annoying. Are they at all inclined to trade Ben.

Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk

[fl311]

Wait, do I need to only post Woj, Lowe or Shams info? Personally, I like looking at more (even non-experts info) because you sometimes get insight from a different point of view. I'd love to know Mitchell's reasoning to be so strong about his thoughts on Butler and Philly, wish he would have elaborated on that subject.

You can post whatever you want. Mitchell has zero inside info on Butler. He has no reasoning outside of making a guess based on what “reports” are out there.

How would you know what insights he may or may not have? I would assume he has connections to agents, his own coaching staff and front office, and players he has personal relationships with and hears things that that the general public won't ever hear of. I'd also say 95-99% of the information is just that information/chatter that is actually happening but never leads to something solid. The wonderful thing about information, it can be utilized to have an understanding of what someone or an organization may or may not want to do.

Once again, I hope this is all over soon and the 76ers bring back their full starting lineup and have a true chance at a championship for the next half-decade.

I dont want to burst your bubble but players like Donovan Mitchell are not in the loop as to what their front office is up to.

Players like Lebron have more of a say and are involved.

He really has no idea as to what is going on with other teams and is just making a guess.

[FireMorey]

This really will all come down to whether or not Joshua Harris keeps his word. Brand said he was given every resource by ownership to keep their players. Let’s see if that was the truth.

[hookshot199]

I really feel like Jimmy is living off of reputation as a defender at this point. I was not impressed what so ever with his D. Not saying he’s bad, but the elite shut down guy that he has a reputation for was no where to be seen in my opinion. Not sure if my expectations were too high based on reading what a defensive presence he was, or he’s just made business decisions to ramp down his D at this point in his career.

Philly plays a switching defense, the guy with the ball can choose to get Butler or Simmons switched off him for a more favorable defensive player which makes a huge difference and gives Butler less time against the guy with the ball. I'm used to seeing Butler trying to stick to his man, fighting through picks and making his man work, with Philly, not much of that at all, just take your switch and like it.

Spoiler:

To me, it seemed like he had a number of defensive plays most players don't make.

Watch on YouTube

And there's so much people miss like Butler knowing where to be and blocking out the other team to allow teammates to get rebounds... which contribute to less possessions for the other team.

Watch on YouTube

Even in the playoffs, he made huge defensive plays, AI liked this one...

Watch on YouTube

I get Butler isn't a gifted player like some of the top tier guys, but there are VERY FEW players that seem to make big plays in crunch time, Butler is one of those few players who seem to make those crucial big plays on BOTH sides of the ball. If you want success in the playoffs, these are the type of players you acquire or keep.

Jimmy Butler is a gifted player. That's not the point. He doesn't help maximize Joel Embiid and/or especially Ben Simmons on offense. He actually competes against them for the ball and space on the court. Even if you're of the mind that Jimmy Butler is worth Max salary well into his thirties, there has to be some acknowledgement that those three players cause each other to provide diminished returns on court. The 76ers should be in the business of accentuating Simmons and Embiid, not paying premium prices to put players in that they can't coexist on court.

It is my view, assuming there is truth to the Butler S&T reports, that Ainge and the Celtics will be in the middle of the eventual outcome. If reports are accurate that Ainge has targeted Kemba Walker and that he will make announcement on shortly after free-agency opens on Sunday night, the Celtics will have, assuming they extend Kemba a $32 mil max deal, around $106 mil on their payroll not counting the 33 pick.

Assuming Horford leaves (seems likely) and in light of trading Baynes to Phoenix, the Celtics won't have a center, starting or backup. I'm not counting Williams, and Tatum is small as a 4.

Of course Ainge has options using one of the exceptions, but the max he can go (if I understand the MLE rules correctly) is around $9 mil.

So then the question is: What is Ainge willing to part with to bring Capella and his $15 mil contract to Boston? Does he even want Capella? And if not, what other options is he considering and at what price? There are a slew of free-agent centers out there, some like Vucevic are out of his price range.

https://hoopshype.com/2019/06/21/nba-free-agency-2019-centers/

And then with respect to the Sixers: Can Morey convince Ainge to send Smart or Jaylen Brown to Philly as part of a three-way deal. I would love Smart if we could get him. He would provide Jimmy-like toughness. He is 25 and under contract for another three years. I also like Jaylen Brown, who apparently wasn't happy last season with reduced minutes as Brad Stevens tried to reintegrate damaged-goods Hayward and is due for a payday soon as a restricted free agent, thus under team control for whoever tries to sign him.

I don't know what other third team options are available, but I would surely consider Brown or Smart, a Houston pick and perhaps something from the Celtics. Downside: Ainge tries to win every deal. But if Jimmy wants to walk, the ball's pretty much in Morey's court to make it happen.

I'm not in favor of bringing in Gordon if we're re-signing JJ.


Celtics guaranteed Salaries for 2019-20 season (amended from the Boston Sports Journal)

Gordon Hayward: $32.7 million
Marcus Smart: $12.6 million
Jayson Tatum: $7.8 million
Jaylen Brown: $6.5 million
Guerschon Yabusele: $3.1 million
Robert Williams: $1.9 million
Semi Ojeleye: $1.3 million
No. 14 pick: $3.45 million
No. 22 pick: $2.38 million
No. 33 pick: (no cap hold)
Cap Hold 1: $897,000
Cap Hold 2: $897,000
Cap Hold 3: $897,000

Guaranteed money committed: $72.2 million to seven players, two draft slots and three minimum cap holds.
Not counting Kemba Walker.

[ProcessDoctor]

as of right now i would put my money on Jimmy, unless he flat out refuses to return.

Thanks! Is your inkling on Tobi that he doesn't want to be on the team, or that he'll only stay if we give the max? Also will we give the max, publicly we keep saying we will.

Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk

Its gonna be about $$ and years. If both get max offers, both stay. If one can get a max on another team and be a 2nd option, one will leave.

Dont think both want to be a 2nd/3rd/4th option. Ben and his development is a major factor

If one of them leaves, do you think the team has any interest in someone like DLO or Brogdan?

[AirP.]

I dont want to burst your bubble but players like Donovan Mitchell are not in the loop as to what their front office is up to.

Players like Lebron have more of a say and are involved.

He really has no idea as to what is going on with other teams and is just makin g a guess.

I get there's a high probability he doesn't know, but to think a higher level NBA player has zero chance of hearing something here and there that the general public doesn't get to hear is ignorant. On Redick's recent podcast, he mentioned he had information(talking about free agency) he couldn't talk about.

[mhunt]

guys, help me out with the horford thing. if butler stays, wouldn't the sixers have to renounce everyone else to fit horford under the cap at $20m-25m per (before re-signing butler)? that's the way it's looking on the capulator. if so, we'd be looking at losing not only harris, but redick & scott as well in order to sign horford? is that correct?
i'm hoping i did something wrong on there.

[AirP.]

guys, help me out with the horford thing. if butler stays, wouldn't the sixers have to renounce everyone else to fit horford under the cap at $20m-25m per (before re-signing butler)? that's the way it's looking on the capulator. if so, we'd be looking at losing not only harris, but redick & scott as well in order to sign horford? is that correct?
i'm hoping i did something wrong on there.

I would hope there are multiple contingency plans just in case something doesn't go as they expect.

[Sixerscan]

The Lakers mouthpiece on ESPN, Ramona whatever-her-name-is, says that us and the Kings are "surprise bidders" for Al Horford.

Makes sense as a basketball and leadership fit.

In my opinion, If Horford is an option and a 4 year deal is in play, they can’t bring back Jimmy on 5 year max.

I don’t think he’s as good a fit for us. Like if guys leave and he wants to come at a swallowable number I’m not gonna turn him down but it makes more sense for the Kings.

[Arsenal]

guys, help me out with the horford thing. if butler stays, wouldn't the sixers have to renounce everyone else to fit horford under the cap at $20m-25m per (before re-signing butler)? that's the way it's looking on the capulator. if so, we'd be looking at losing not only harris, but redick & scott as well in order to sign horford? is that correct?
i'm hoping i did something wrong on there.

You're correct. But that doesn't matter. I'm not sure why people think Mike Scott is some kind of must have player. The guy was a -2 player last year. That means he's worth the vet min and totally replaceable.

Redick is a loss, but he's going to be 35 next year, so if we lose him its no big deal. And I think there could be a chance to keep him anyway with a vet min, because next summer we'll have full bird rights for him and can give him a large 1 year deal to make him whole. The Spurs did this exact thing w/Ginobili when they needed to use cap room elsewhere.

[Arsenal]

Makes sense as a basketball and leadership fit.

In my opinion, If Horford is an option and a 4 year deal is in play, they can’t bring back Jimmy on 5 year max.

I don’t think he’s as good a fit for us. Like if guys leave and he wants to come at a swallowable number I’m not gonna turn him down but it makes more sense for the Kings.

Al Horford is a better player than Tobias Harris. We'd be better for the next couple of years with Horford, although probably not after that as father time wins out.

[Arsenal]

Philly plays a switching defense, the guy with the ball can choose to get Butler or Simmons switched off him for a more favorable defensive player which makes a huge difference and gives Butler less time against the guy with the ball. I'm used to seeing Butler trying to stick to his man, fighting through picks and making his man work, with Philly, not much of that at all, just take your switch and like it.

Spoiler:

To me, it seemed like he had a number of defensive plays most players don't make.

Watch on YouTube

And there's so much people miss like Butler knowing where to be and blocking out the other team to allow teammates to get rebounds... which contribute to less possessions for the other team.

Watch on YouTube

Even in the playoffs, he made huge defensive plays, AI liked this one...

Watch on YouTube

I get Butler isn't a gifted player like some of the top tier guys, but there are VERY FEW players that seem to make big plays in crunch time, Butler is one of those few players who seem to make those crucial big plays on BOTH sides of the ball. If you want success in the playoffs, these are the type of players you acquire or keep.

Jimmy Butler is a gifted player. That's not the point. He doesn't help maximize Joel Embiid and/or especially Ben Simmons on offense. He actually competes against them for the ball and space on the court. Even if you're of the mind that Jimmy Butler is worth Max salary well into his thirties, there has to be some acknowledgement that those three players cause each other to provide diminished returns on court. The 76ers should be in the business of accentuating Simmons and Embiid, not paying premium prices to put players in that they can't coexist on court.

It is my view, assuming there is truth to the Butler S&T reports, that Ainge and the Celtics will be in the middle of the eventual outcome. If reports are accurate that Ainge has targeted Kemba Walker and that he will make announcement on shortly after free-agency opens on Sunday night, the Celtics will have, assuming they extend Kemba a $32 mil max deal, around $106 mil on their payroll not counting the 33 pick.

Assuming Horford leaves (seems likely) and in light of trading Baynes to Phoenix, the Celtics won't have a center, starting or backup. I'm not counting Williams, and Tatum is small as a 4.

Of course Ainge has options using one of the exceptions, but the max he can go (if I understand the MLE rules correctly) is around $9 mil.

So then the question is: What is Ainge willing to part with to bring Capella and his $15 mil contract to Boston? Does he even want Capella? And if not, what other options is he considering and at what price? There are a slew of free-agent centers out there, some like Vucevic are out of his price range.

https://hoopshype.com/2019/06/21/nba-free-agency-2019-centers/

And then with respect to the Sixers: Can Morey convince Ainge to send Smart or Jaylen Brown to Philly as part of a three-way deal. I would love Smart if we could get him. He would provide Jimmy-like toughness. He is 25 and under contract for another three years. I also like Jaylen Brown, who apparently wasn't happy last season with reduced minutes as Brad Stevens tried to reintegrate damaged-goods Hayward and is due for a payday soon as a restricted free agent, thus under team control for whoever tries to sign him.

I don't know what other third team options are available, but I would surely consider Brown or Smart, a Houston pick and perhaps something from the Celtics. Downside: Ainge tries to win every deal. But if Jimmy wants to walk, the ball's pretty much in Morey's court to make it happen.

I'm not in favor of bringing in Gordon if we're re-signing JJ.


Celtics guaranteed Salaries for 2019-20 season (amended from the Boston Sports Journal)

Gordon Hayward: $32.7 million
Marcus Smart: $12.6 million
Jayson Tatum: $7.8 million
Jaylen Brown: $6.5 million
Guerschon Yabusele: $3.1 million
Robert Williams: $1.9 million
Semi Ojeleye: $1.3 million
No. 14 pick: $3.45 million
No. 22 pick: $2.38 million
No. 33 pick: (no cap hold)
Cap Hold 1: $897,000
Cap Hold 2: $897,000
Cap Hold 3: $897,000

Guaranteed money committed: $72.2 million to seven players, two draft slots and three minimum cap holds.
Not counting Kemba Walker.

From Boston's perspective it is very simple. Once they sign Kemba Walker to the MAX they'll be capped out. They'll have the Room Ex to use. After that if they want in on the Jimmy deal to get Capela, they have to trade out either Marcus Smart, or Jaylen Brown + Yabusele + R. Williams.