2013-2014 College Basketball / '14 NBA Draft Thread

[Kobblehead]

K.J. McDaniels ranks 2nd to Embiid on that steals+blocks per 40 list.

[LloydFree]

I wrote an article about the same subject last week (stl/blk rates and Sixers) so I can quickly bring up some charts for you

Here is combined stl and blk per 40 minutes for 2013 lottery picks + Kazemi

Nerlens Noel – 8.1
Steven Adams – 4.6
Michael Carter-Williams – 3.7
Arsalan Kazemi - 3.7
Alex Len – 3.4
Otto Porter – 3.1
Cody Zeller – 3.1
Victor Oladipo – 3.0
Kentavious Caldwell-Pope – 2.8
Anthony Bennett – 2.7
Kelly Olynyk – 2.7
Trey Burke – 2.4
Ben McLemore – 2.0
C.J. McCollum – 1.7
Shabazz Muhammad – 1.1

Now here is the 2013 lottery players by combined Stl+Blk+Reb+Ast per 40

Nerlens Noel – 22.0
Arsalan Kazemi - 19.4
Michael Carter-Williams 17.5
Alex Len – 16.8
Steven Adams – 16.5
Kelly Olynyk – 16.2
Cody Zeller – 15.8
Anthony Bennett – 15.7
Otto Porter – 14.7
Trey Burke – 13.5
Kentavious Caldwell-Pope – 13.2
Victor Oladipo – 11.4
Ben McLemore – 10.9
C.J. McCollum – 9.6
Shabazz Muhammad – 9.0

Now here are 2014 NCAA lotto prospects by the same list, starting with Stl+Blk per 40. I also included Jordan Adams and Kyle Anderson on this list because they are getting ranked high on analytics lists:

Joel Embiid – 6.0
Marcus Smart – 4.2
Jordan Adams – 3.7
Noah Vonleh – 3.4
Jabari Parker – 3.0
Kyle Anderson – 3.0
Gary Harris – 2.7
Andrew Wiggins – 2.6
Tyler Ennis – 2.6
Aaron Gordon – 2.4
Julius Randle – 1.6
Nik Stauskas – 0.9
Doug McDermott – 0.5

Stl+Blk+Reb+Ast per 40:

Joel Embiid – 22.3
Kyle Anderson – 21.3
Noah Vonleh – 17.9
Marcus Smart – 17.2
Julius Randle – 16.9
Jabari Parker – 15.9
Aaron Gordon – 15.1
Jordan Adams – 13.9
Tyler Ennis – 12.6
Andrew Wiggins – 11.6
Gary Harris – 11.0
Doug McDermott – 10.7
Nik Stauskas – 7.9

To me it is likely all the Sixers love Wiggins leaks that have come out is trolling to get Embiid to fall

Very good post. Deserving of more And1's. Bad news for the McDermott fans.

It also strengthens my thought that the 76ers should do whatever is necessary, outside of trading Noel and MCW, to move up from #10 to #7 to get whoever falls between Vonleh or Smart.

[sixers hoops]

Reports on draft night had the holiday deal dependent on Noel, Oladipo, or Bennett being available. If that is believed, then Bennett and Oladipo could be considered as players Hinkie likes.

[sixers hoops]

I wrote an article about the same subject last week (stl/blk rates and Sixers) so I can quickly bring up some charts for you

Here is combined stl and blk per 40 minutes for 2013 lottery picks + Kazemi

Nerlens Noel – 8.1
Steven Adams – 4.6
Michael Carter-Williams – 3.7
Arsalan Kazemi - 3.7
Alex Len – 3.4
Otto Porter – 3.1
Cody Zeller – 3.1
Victor Oladipo – 3.0
Kentavious Caldwell-Pope – 2.8
Anthony Bennett – 2.7
Kelly Olynyk – 2.7
Trey Burke – 2.4
Ben McLemore – 2.0
C.J. McCollum – 1.7
Shabazz Muhammad – 1.1

Now here is the 2013 lottery players by combined Stl+Blk+Reb+Ast per 40

Nerlens Noel – 22.0
Arsalan Kazemi - 19.4
Michael Carter-Williams 17.5
Alex Len – 16.8
Steven Adams – 16.5
Kelly Olynyk – 16.2
Cody Zeller – 15.8
Anthony Bennett – 15.7
Otto Porter – 14.7
Trey Burke – 13.5
Kentavious Caldwell-Pope – 13.2
Victor Oladipo – 11.4
Ben McLemore – 10.9
C.J. McCollum – 9.6
Shabazz Muhammad – 9.0

Now here are 2014 NCAA lotto prospects by the same list, starting with Stl+Blk per 40. I also included Jordan Adams and Kyle Anderson on this list because they are getting ranked high on analytics lists:

Joel Embiid – 6.0
Marcus Smart – 4.2
Jordan Adams – 3.7
Noah Vonleh – 3.4
Jabari Parker – 3.0
Kyle Anderson – 3.0
Gary Harris – 2.7
Andrew Wiggins – 2.6
Tyler Ennis – 2.6
Aaron Gordon – 2.4
Julius Randle – 1.6
Nik Stauskas – 0.9
Doug McDermott – 0.5

Stl+Blk+Reb+Ast per 40:

Joel Embiid – 22.3
Kyle Anderson – 21.3
Noah Vonleh – 17.9
Marcus Smart – 17.2
Julius Randle – 16.9
Jabari Parker – 15.9
Aaron Gordon – 15.1
Jordan Adams – 13.9
Tyler Ennis – 12.6
Andrew Wiggins – 11.6
Gary Harris – 11.0
Doug McDermott – 10.7
Nik Stauskas – 7.9

To me it is likely all the Sixers love Wiggins leaks that have come out is trolling to get Embiid to fall

Very good post. Deserving of more And1's. Bad news for the McDermott fans.

It also strengthens my thought that the 76ers should do whatever is necessary, outside of trading Noel and MCW, to move up from #10 to #7 to get whoever falls between Vonleh or Smart.

1. I don't think Vonleh falls to 7, if so, then that would be a no-brainer. I thought the likely candidates to slip would be Randle and Smart. However, I'd trade up for any of the big 7, prob not Gordon though.

2. If we have to trade something, aside from 3 pick, MCW, and Noel, our resources are limited. We really can't move future firsts. That leaves this boards favorite package of #10, #32, and Thad. I don't think that gets it done. People on this board thought Hawes and Turner would each fetch a mid-first. I like Thad a lot, but I don't see the Lakers moving down a tier for a high-end bench player and a high 2nd. If so, great deal for us.

[LloydFree]

Very good post. Deserving of more And1's. Bad news for the McDermott fans.

It also strengthens my thought that the 76ers should do whatever is necessary, outside of trading Noel and MCW, to move up from #10 to #7 to get whoever falls between Vonleh or Smart.

1. I don't think Vonleh falls to 7, if so, then that would be a no-brainer. I thought the likely candidates to slip would be Randle and Smart. However, I'd trade up for any of the big 7, prob not Gordon though.

2. If we have to trade something, aside from 3 pick, MCW, and Noel, our resources are limited. We really can't move future firsts. That leaves this boards favorite package of #10, #32, and Thad. I don't think that gets it done. People on this board thought Hawes and Turner would each fetch a mid-first. I like Thad a lot, but I don't see the Lakers moving down a tier for a high-end bench player and a high 2nd. If so, great deal for us.

Regarding Thad Young, you are right. He doesn't get you anything from a team in the lottery.

Regarding the pick: Although the Lakers wouldn't need it, the 32nd pick is huge. That pick is more valuable than a pick in the 20's for a team that is up against the salary cap. You can get a 1st round talent that drops, without getting stuck with a CAP hold.

But the 76ers have more than that. They have over 30 million in cap space available. The 76ers can pick up another NON-lottery 1st round pick very easily. That #16 pick of Chicago, is just sitting out there like low hanging fruit for the 3 or 4 teams that have the cap space to get Chicago a 16.5 million dollar TPE for Boozer.

[sixers hoops]

Very good post. Deserving of more And1's. Bad news for the McDermott fans.

It also strengthens my thought that the 76ers should do whatever is necessary, outside of trading Noel and MCW, to move up from #10 to #7 to get whoever falls between Vonleh or Smart.

1. I don't think Vonleh falls to 7, if so, then that would be a no-brainer. I thought the likely candidates to slip would be Randle and Smart. However, I'd trade up for any of the big 7, prob not Gordon though.

2. If we have to trade something, aside from 3 pick, MCW, and Noel, our resources are limited. We really can't move future firsts. That leaves this boards favorite package of #10, #32, and Thad. I don't think that gets it done. People on this board thought Hawes and Turner would each fetch a mid-first. I like Thad a lot, but I don't see the Lakers moving down a tier for a high-end bench player and a high 2nd. If so, great deal for us.

Regarding Thad Young, you are right. He doesn't get you anything from a team in the lottery.

Regarding the pick: Although the Lakers wouldn't need it, the 32nd pick is huge. That pick is more valuable than a pick in the 20's for a team that is up against the salary cap. You can get a 1st round talent that drops, without getting stuck with a CAP hold.

But the 76ers have more than that. They have over 30 million in cap space available. The 76ers can pick up another NON-lottery 1st round pick very easily. That #16 pick of Chicago, is just sitting out there like low hanging fruit for the 3 or 4 teams that have the cap space to get Chicago a 16.5 million dollar TPE for Boozer.

I think 10,16, and 32 likely gets it done. That would be a nice opportunity for the Lakers to get 3 young, cheap players.

[76ciology]

Reports on draft night had the holiday deal dependent on Noel, Oladipo, or Bennett being available. If that is believed, then Bennett and Oladipo could be considered as players Hinkie likes.

So that contradicts with the stls+blks+assists theory?

[Kobblehead]

Reports on draft night had the holiday deal dependent on Noel, Oladipo, or Bennett being available. If that is believed, then Bennett and Oladipo could be considered as players Hinkie likes.

So that contradicts with the stls+blks+assists theory?

It doesn't contradict the defensive impact play % theory.

Hinkie's draft picks all had a 6+ DIP%.

Dipo had a 7.4 DIP%.
Bennett had a 6.1 DIP%.

[Bling76]

To me it is likely all the Sixers love Wiggins leaks that have come out is trolling to get Embiid to fall

100%

[Hardcore6erFan]

I absolutely dread hearing Wiggins name called at #3. I hope he proves me wrong but I doubt it. Iggy 2.0 here we come.

[PhilasFinest]

I absolutely dread hearing Wiggins name called at #3. I hope he proves me wrong but I doubt it. Iggy 2.0 here we come.

Outside of dunking well,defending well and being athletic, there games aren't really that similar.

Wiggins is probably a better shooter now than Iggy is.....one of Iguodala's strengths are that he can handle/pass like a point forward....wiggins' weakness is ball handling.

I think Wiggins' floor is like Trevor Ariza

[FreesFro]

Please stop the Andrew Wiggins and Andre Iguodala comparisons. Offensively there is no comparison. Honestly, the enormous amount of hype and expectations for Wiggins are hurting him because he only had a pretty good freshman season. They're not even the same player. Both athletically gifted, Andre was stronger coming out of college and Wiggins can jump out of the gym. Andre is a better distributor and rebounder and Wiggins is a better shooter and scorer. Here are the numbers. If Wiggins comes into the NBA and has a career high of 19.9 ppg I'd be very surprised. You'd have to hope with his shot (it's not that bad), his athletic ability and the coaching and work he will hopefully put in that he ends up being a 25+ ppg scorer at some point in his career. That's the goal if he's ours at #3.

Iguodala played two years at Arizona and wasn't much of a scorer there.
Season GP MPG PPG FG% 3FG% FT% APG RPG BPG SPG
2003-04 30 32.1 12.9 45.0 31.5 78.8 4.9 8.4 0.4 1.6
2002-03 32 19.2 6.4 38.1 20.5 67.0 2.1 4.9 0.6 1.5

Wiggins at Kansas.
Season GP MPG PPG FG% 3FG% FT% APG RPG BPG SPG
2013-14 35 32.8 17.1 44.8 34.1 77.5 1.5 5.9 1.0 1.2

[snoopdogg88]

it drives me nuts that people act like Wiggins game is just fancy dunks and defense.

He's 10x the offensive player Iggy could ever be

[MRxBLACK]

it drives me nuts that people act like Wiggins game is just fancy dunks and defense.

He's 10x the offensive player Iggy could ever be

I've seen ridiculous extremes with all the top prospects.

Embiid: will be in a wheel chair in 2 years.
Wiggins: he's some untalented run and jump track & field athlete.
Exum: there's more footage on the Sasquatch than him.
Parker: some morbidly obese slob.

[Hardcore6erFan]

it drives me nuts that people act like Wiggins game is just fancy dunks and defense.

He's 10x the offensive player Iggy could ever be

If anything, it's the other way around. Iggy in his prime is 10x the offensive player Wiggins is right now. Wiggins is not a good passer, is not a good ball handler, and is not very good at taking his man off the dribble. Iggy is/was very good in all 3 of those departments. More importantly, Wiggins doesn't have the alpha dog mentality that all superstars have. Wiggins has a beta dog mentality. And that mentality is genetic, it's in his DNA and no amount of work ethic/practice will change that.

And I believe intelligence is more of a factor than work ethic when it comes to a guy reaching his max potential. Listening to Wiggins talk he just doesn't sound very intelligent. He presents himself like a 14 year old. Where as someone like Exum or Parker are articulate and eloquent speakers and present themselves as grown men. It's not a coincidence that those 2 are far superior offensive players to Wiggins.

[Mik317]

it drives me nuts that people act like Wiggins game is just fancy dunks and defense.

He's 10x the offensive player Iggy could ever be

I've seen ridiculous extremes with all the top prospects.

Embiid: will be in a wheel chair in 2 years.
Wiggins: he's some untalented run and jump track & field athlete.
Exum: there's more footage on the Sasquatch than him.
Parker: some morbidly obese slob.

I like to think this is people simply getting themselves ready to hate on whoever we don't take...

[snoopdogg88]

it drives me nuts that people act like Wiggins game is just fancy dunks and defense.

He's 10x the offensive player Iggy could ever be

If anything, it's the other way around. Iggy in his prime is 10x the offensive player Wiggins is right now. Wiggins is not a good passer, is not a good ball handler, and is not very good at taking his man off the dribble. Iggy is/was very good in all 3 of those departments. More importantly, Wiggins doesn't have the alpha dog mentality that all superstars have. Wiggins has a beta dog mentality. And that mentality is genetic, it's in his DNA and no amount of work ethic/practice will change that.

And I believe intelligence is more of a factor than work ethic when it comes to a guy reaching his max potential. Listening to Wiggins talk he just doesn't sound very intelligent. He presents himself like a 14 year old. Where as someone like Exum or Parker are articulate and eloquent speakers and present themselves as grown men. It's not a coincidence that those 2 are far superior offensive players to Wiggins.

i will admit that every interview I watch with Wiggins, something just seems to be "off" he doesn't quite seem to "get it".

[snoopdogg88]

it drives me nuts that people act like Wiggins game is just fancy dunks and defense.

He's 10x the offensive player Iggy could ever be

I've seen ridiculous extremes with all the top prospects.

Embiid: will be in a wheel chair in 2 years.
Wiggins: he's some untalented run and jump track & field athlete.
Exum: there's more footage on the Sasquatch than him.
Parker: some morbidly obese slob.

haha so true

[Hardcore6erFan]

Exum: there's more footage on the Sasquatch than him.
Parker: some morbidly obese slob.

lmao

[Hardcore6erFan]

it drives me nuts that people act like Wiggins game is just fancy dunks and defense.

He's 10x the offensive player Iggy could ever be

If anything, it's the other way around. Iggy in his prime is 10x the offensive player Wiggins is right now. Wiggins is not a good passer, is not a good ball handler, and is not very good at taking his man off the dribble. Iggy is/was very good in all 3 of those departments. More importantly, Wiggins doesn't have the alpha dog mentality that all superstars have. Wiggins has a beta dog mentality. And that mentality is genetic, it's in his DNA and no amount of work ethic/practice will change that.

And I believe intelligence is more of a factor than work ethic when it comes to a guy reaching his max potential. Listening to Wiggins talk he just doesn't sound very intelligent. He presents himself like a 14 year old. Where as someone like Exum or Parker are articulate and eloquent speakers and present themselves as grown men. It's not a coincidence that those 2 are far superior offensive players to Wiggins.

i will admit that every interview I watch with Wiggins, something just seems to be "off" he doesn't quite seem to "get it".

Yup