Simmons Trade Thread - The Ocho

[Negrodamus]

Scotto (from 10:50): "When I talk to other executives around the league about the situation with the Sixers, point-blank, nobody feels sorry for Daryl Morey around the league. They think his asking price is way too high, given the situation, coming off the playoffs. Teams know Ben Simmons doesn’t want to be there.... I’ve heard this from some executives, too, that when Joel Embiid was healthy and before their recent losing streak, this team was performing well without him. Some executives said to me it further in their eyes lowered the trade value for Ben Simmons."

https://www.reddit.com/r/sixers/comments/qw3ikh/scotto_when_i_talk_to_other_executives_around_the/

Feels pretty expected. Ben's career is based off riding on Embiid's cape. Getting Dejounte Murray would be a steal for Ben.

BREAKING: Certain executives enjoy negotiating from an advantageous position

I probably should have edited out the expected parts like the execs not feeling bad for Morey. I'm posting this more about how the early success with Embiid implies that Ben's effect is overinflated.

[GutUNC]

https://www.reddit.com/r/sixers/comments/qw3ikh/scotto_when_i_talk_to_other_executives_around_the/

Feels pretty expected. Ben's career is based off riding on Embiid's cape. Getting Dejounte Murray would be a steal for Ben.

BREAKING: Certain executives enjoy negotiating from an advantageous position

I probably should have edited out the expected parts like the execs not feeling bad for Morey. I'm posting this more about how the early success with Embiid implies that Ben's effect is overinflated.

And if the Sixers struggle, then Morey is under pressure to deal Ben because the season is floundering. "Heads, I win. Tails, you lose"

We know what Ben Simmons is as a player. His value is what it is. It hasn't changed since he decided to no-show and it won't change moving forward as it pertains to the Sixers. Other teams may become more or less interested as their seasons unfold, but his value is static in and of himself.

[Negrodamus]

BREAKING: Certain executives enjoy negotiating from an advantageous position

I probably should have edited out the expected parts like the execs not feeling bad for Morey. I'm posting this more about how the early success with Embiid implies that Ben's effect is overinflated.

And if the Sixers struggle, then Morey is under pressure to deal Ben because the season is floundering. "Heads, I win. Tails, you lose"

We know what Ben Simmons is as a player. His value is what it is. It hasn't changed since he decided to no-show and it won't change moving forward as it pertains to the Sixers. Other teams may become more or less interested as their seasons unfold, but his value is static in and of himself.

I actually disagree. I think his value is all over the spectrum around the league depending on who is running the show. So having the drama unfold how it has on top of the early success with Embiid might have more teams down on him.

His value on our team is not letting the bottom fall out when Embiid is sidelined, like we're experiencing right now. But his impact on our team when all systems are go is very capped due to his limitations.

[NBA Moses]

I'm posting this more about how the early success with Embiid implies that Ben's effect is overinflated.

Maybe the superfresh Sixers played over their heads first 10 games fueled by motivation that they can win without Ben Simmons.

Its long season,Sixers players are already getting exposed left + right.

Any opposing GM who questions Ben Simmons overall positive impact on a team is a fool. There should be zero doubt about his on-court talent, now the whole off-the-court nightmare Ben Simmons is a different story.

If I were an opposing GM thats what Im worried about. Im worried about him quitting on my team.

[Tomjas]

A few early season games were nothing more than a tiny sample from which very little can be determined

[Skates]

1. If I have a GM/Basketball ops guy that other execs feel bad for, I have the wrong guy. No one feels bad for the guy they are afraid will fleece them down the road.

2. We all know Morey was asking for that crazy price to start because he wanted to talk to everyone, but try to wait out Dame, Beal or another team to crumble, we are likely in that third phase now. He will never get his initial asking price, but no one ever does unless EB or Billy King is on the receiving end of offer.

3. The Sixers record without Simmons has never been good until this year before Embiid was injured and especially not in a long stretch of games. It points more to the development of Maxey, Milton and some nice new bench pieces that fit Joel really well, but are getting overexposed in his absence. We have also seen the value of Tisse with him being out of the lineup lately, which exacerbates not having Simmons as a switchable all NBA defender and athlete.

[GutUNC]

I probably should have edited out the expected parts like the execs not feeling bad for Morey. I'm posting this more about how the early success with Embiid implies that Ben's effect is overinflated.

And if the Sixers struggle, then Morey is under pressure to deal Ben because the season is floundering. "Heads, I win. Tails, you lose"

We know what Ben Simmons is as a player. His value is what it is. It hasn't changed since he decided to no-show and it won't change moving forward as it pertains to the Sixers. Other teams may become more or less interested as their seasons unfold, but his value is static in and of himself.

I actually disagree. I think his value is all over the spectrum around the league depending on who is running the show. So having the drama unfold how it has on top of the early success with Embiid might have more teams down on him.

His value on our team is not letting the bottom fall out when Embiid is sidelined, like we're experiencing right now. But his impact on our team when all systems are go is very capped due to his limitations.

And you have every right to that opinion but my point is that regardless of how the first quarter of the season played out, "rival executives" were going to be quoted as saying that Simmons' value is dropping. The only blank to be filled in was the reason why.

[Negrodamus]

I'm posting this more about how the early success with Embiid implies that Ben's effect is overinflated.

Maybe the superfresh Sixers played over their heads first 10 games fueled by motivation that they can win without Ben Simmons.

Its long season,Sixers players are already getting exposed left + right.

Any opposing GM who questions Ben Simmons overall positive impact on a team is a fool. There should be zero doubt about his on-court talent, now the whole off-the-court nightmare Ben Simmons is a different story.

If I were an opposing GM thats what Im worried about. Im worried about him quitting on my team.

They're being exposed because we aren't playing our MVP candidate who drives the ship.

I don't think anyone questions if Ben has a positive impact on the team. I think the question is how big of an impact he has as a max player.

[Eyeamok]

Scotto (from 10:50): "When I talk to other executives around the league about the situation with the Sixers, point-blank, nobody feels sorry for Daryl Morey around the league. They think his asking price is way too high, given the situation, coming off the playoffs. Teams know Ben Simmons doesn’t want to be there.... I’ve heard this from some executives, too, that when Joel Embiid was healthy and before their recent losing streak, this team was performing well without him. Some executives said to me it further in their eyes lowered the trade value for Ben Simmons."

https://www.reddit.com/r/sixers/comments/qw3ikh/scotto_when_i_talk_to_other_executives_around_the/

Feels pretty expected. Ben's career is based off riding on Embiid's cape. Getting Dejounte Murray would be a steal for Ben.

In Simmon's defense. The sixers have been able to perform .500 or better without Embiid and only Simmons playing. Though they played some pretty bad teams during the 10 games Embiid missed with the knee injury this last season. Simmons was still able to lead them to a 7-3 record (with all 3 losses coming against playoff teams (bucks, clippers, denver).

So this current 5 game losing streak. I think We would be at worst 3-2 had Simmons played.

But executives are right in that it's really Embiid that makes the sixers a good team. If Simmons played the entire season with no Embiid. Sixers probably still make the playoffs but maybe 6/7 seed 43-39 type of record.

With a healthy Embiid Sixers win 50 games even without Simmons assuming Embiid plays 65 games (which is a big if already since he's missed 6 games so far).

With Simmons leading this team in the playoffs does this team get swept or win at least one game in first round ?

[CoolPapaMo]

Philly rolled over Chicago in Chi and were 8-2 - covid took over the team and it’s been bad. It has nothing to do with Ben Simmons being out - simply a bad break with Covid.

[Bum Adebayo]

Bum Simmons is a loser, this has been known for quite some time, execs know this well.

[rzzzzz]

So Simmons basic deal, outside of getting his feelings hurt, is that he wants a team built around him. It’s not a bad strategy for some outright struggling clubs. He now might even be willing to soften his stubborn reflex-panic around letting it fly a little more, if the right coach blows smoke up his ***. (There’s at least one struggling club I know, with young assets, and whose coach is halfway out the door.)

[sixers4real]

So Pelicans, Wolves and Kings right now are all being bottom 5 in the West and out of play-in picture.

I remember talking to the fans of these teams in September, most of all told me their goal is playoffs, and it’s doable, I told them that’s almost impossible and that I believe that in December January management of these teams will put this on the table for Simmons.
Fox (Sacramento)
2FRPs, maybe even 3FRPs and swaps along with salary (Timberwolves)
Ingram (Pelicans)

These Wolves picks can be valuable for Pelicans, and Ingram will be valuable for us.

I also think we’ll be able to get Fox for Simmons straight in 2-3 weeks, considering tough Kings schedule, I just don’t believe Fox is atop of Morey’s wishlist.

[76ciology]

https://www.reddit.com/r/sixers/comments/qw3ikh/scotto_when_i_talk_to_other_executives_around_the/

Feels pretty expected. Ben's career is based off riding on Embiid's cape. Getting Dejounte Murray would be a steal for Ben.

BREAKING: Certain executives enjoy negotiating from an advantageous position

I probably should have edited out the expected parts like the execs not feeling bad for Morey. I'm posting this more about how the early success with Embiid implies that Ben's effect is overinflated.

I have a feeling that Dame wants to play for the Sixers. This also explains why he is playing poorly. Morey knows this. But they can’t disclose it because its as bad as Ben faking all the illnesses just to not get fined.

Either that or you have to look at Morey as a delusional guy, which Im not buying given how pro he has been

[Tomjas]

BREAKING: Certain executives enjoy negotiating from an advantageous position

I probably should have edited out the expected parts like the execs not feeling bad for Morey. I'm posting this more about how the early success with Embiid implies that Ben's effect is overinflated.

I have a feeling that Dame wants to play for the Sixers. This also explains why he is playing poorly. Morey knows this. But they can’t disclose it because its as bad as Ben faking all the illnesses just to not get fined.

Either that or you have to look at Morey as a delusional guy, which Im not buying given how pro he has been

Lillard isn’t 100% fit and there’s never been any indication that he wants to leave

[76ciology]

I probably should have edited out the expected parts like the execs not feeling bad for Morey. I'm posting this more about how the early success with Embiid implies that Ben's effect is overinflated.

I have a feeling that Dame wants to play for the Sixers. This also explains why he is playing poorly. Morey knows this. But they can’t disclose it because its as bad as Ben faking all the illnesses just to not get fined.

Either that or you have to look at Morey as a delusional guy, which Im not buying given how pro he has been

Lillard isn’t 100% fit and there’s never been any indication that he wants to leave

Agree. There’s never been any indication except his play and how his team is playing.

[sixers4real]

I probably should have edited out the expected parts like the execs not feeling bad for Morey. I'm posting this more about how the early success with Embiid implies that Ben's effect is overinflated.

I have a feeling that Dame wants to play for the Sixers. This also explains why he is playing poorly. Morey knows this. But they can’t disclose it because its as bad as Ben faking all the illnesses just to not get fined.

Either that or you have to look at Morey as a delusional guy, which Im not buying given how pro he has been

Lillard isn’t 100% fit and there’s never been any indication that he wants to leave

Yeah, I don’t think Portland will put Dame on the table this season or Dame will ask out.
The earliest it will happen is next off-season. And I don’t really think I want Lillard for Simmons because Lillard is small and will be old soon with a need to pay him $50M.

But I guess you all know who I want on this Sixers for Simmons lol. Ingram

[Tomjas]

I have a feeling that Dame wants to play for the Sixers. This also explains why he is playing poorly. Morey knows this. But they can’t disclose it because its as bad as Ben faking all the illnesses just to not get fined.

Either that or you have to look at Morey as a delusional guy, which Im not buying given how pro he has been

Lillard isn’t 100% fit and there’s never been any indication that he wants to leave

Agree. There’s never been any indication except his play and how his team is playing.

He got injured at the Olympics and hasn’t recovered

In today’s game, he was getting treatment for something near pelvis

He’s missing shots due to limited elevation

[stormi]

I'm posting this more about how the early success with Embiid implies that Ben's effect is overinflated.

Maybe the superfresh Sixers played over their heads first 10 games fueled by motivation that they can win without Ben Simmons.

Its long season,Sixers players are already getting exposed left + right.

Any opposing GM who questions Ben Simmons overall positive impact on a team is a fool. There should be zero doubt about his on-court talent, now the whole off-the-court nightmare Ben Simmons is a different story.

If I were an opposing GM thats what Im worried about. Im worried about him quitting on my team.

They're being exposed because we aren't playing our MVP candidate who drives the ship.

I don't think anyone questions if Ben has a positive impact on the team. I think the question is how big of an impact he has as a max player.

Historically, the 76ers are 34-34 in games when Ben Simmons plays and Joel Embiid doesn't.

The Sixers are now 0-5 since Embiid's gone down, and they're getting embarrassed with supposedly the best group of surrounding players the we've had in his time here.

This is with Ben's replacement, Tyrese Maxey being the moral-victory MVP averaging 24/5/5 and shooting five 3's per game at ~39% during this L streak.

Embiid's historical regular season record without Ben Simmons is also .500.

It's going to pain points-per-game merchants in their soul, but Ben Simmons is an unreal basketball even in spite of his very obvious flaws. I kind of hope we keep getting pummelled to emphasize this. I never understood how this team winning in his absence would be any good for his value. This team is LOUSY, with two marquee superstars.

[Kobblehead]

The positive impact Ben Simmons has on this team is that he improves the team's defensive efficiency. Which doesn't matter until the later rounds of the playoffs. At which point, Ben's overwhelming offensive incompetency negates any value he brings on the defensive end, anyway.