Markelle Fultz Discussion

[cksdayoff]

there are a lot of players who have tore their acls before entering the nba, most went on to have long careers.

but i gotta be honest, i'm always leery about players who have a lot of explosion whether its straight line or laterally because they're more athletic than their bodies can handle.

[LloydFree]

Hey guys, just stopping by your forum to check out what the buzz was on mMarkelle. I I can't believe how down so many of you are on him. I think you looks amazing. Hopefully Philly will trade him to the Thunder for a bag of chips or something if you think he's that bad.

For me,
It's not that he's a bad player. He's a good player. It's that it was a stupid trade for a player that isn't better than a number of the guys taken after him. If they traded up​ to get an other-worldly talent like Simmons or Embiid that's understandable. But Fultz isn't that kind of talent.
Because of the trade-up, he'll be judged against the guys who​ went behind him and the top 5 pick next year, that they they gave away. It was dumb move, to get what... the next CJ McCollum?

That's fair and if he ends up being no more than CJ McCollum and Tatum becomes Carmelo people will always wonder. And I'm not here to be Brian Colangelo's press agent or anything but it does mean something just looking at this objectively that Fultz has been the consensus number 1 overall pick all year long. Guys moved up and down the more respected mock drafts in the 2-5 range but Fultz has been the constant. Can't be too mad at 'em for finding a way to take the consensus best player in what is perceived as a strong draft.

I don't agree. I don't expect my GM to go along with consensus. I expect him to be a better talent evaluator than some freelance writers for DraftExpress and NBAdraftnet. The consensus has been wrong too many times to give him a break. He'll be wrong for trading two top 5 picks for a player that isn't better than guys taken later. Period. If giving passes for taking the consensus player was accepted practice, then guys like Joe Dumars wouldn't still be wearing the stink of selecting the consensus #2 Darko Milicic. If Colangelo is wrong and Fultz isn't better than the guys selected after him, draftsite consensus or not, he should be held accountable for making a bad deal.

[SparksFly87]

This is a great draft it looks like so far but what this team needs Fultz is exactly what we need and very much worth the haul to get him.

[Old Man Game]

For me,
It's not that he's a bad player. He's a good player. It's that it was a stupid trade for a player that isn't better than a number of the guys taken after him. If they traded up​ to get an other-worldly talent like Simmons or Embiid that's understandable. But Fultz isn't that kind of talent.
Because of the trade-up, he'll be judged against the guys who​ went behind him and the top 5 pick next year, that they they gave away. It was dumb move, to get what... the next CJ McCollum?

That's fair and if he ends up being no more than CJ McCollum and Tatum becomes Carmelo people will always wonder. And I'm not here to be Brian Colangelo's press agent or anything but it does mean something just looking at this objectively that Fultz has been the consensus number 1 overall pick all year long. Guys moved up and down the more respected mock drafts in the 2-5 range but Fultz has been the constant. Can't be too mad at 'em for finding a way to take the consensus best player in what is perceived as a strong draft.

I don't agree. I don't expect my GM to go along with consensus. I expect him to be a better talent evaluator than some freelance writers for DraftExpress and NBAdraftnet. The consensus has been wrong too many times to give him a break, if he's wrong for trading two top 5 picks for a player that isn't better than guys taken later. If giving passes for taking the consensus player was accepted practice, then guys like Joe Dumars wouldn't still be wearing the stink of selecting the consensus #2 Darko Milicic. If Colangelo is wrong and Fultz isn't better than the guys selected after him, draftsite consensus or not, he should be held accountable for making a bad deal.

People certainly do have a bias towards judging the final results and forgetting the process that got us to that point.

[PhilasFinest]

Man, you'd think Fultz was scoring 4 ppg on 20% shooting after reading half this thread.

[SparksFly87]

This is a great draft it looks like so far but what this team needs Fultz is exactly what we need and very much worth the haul to get him.

[CoreyGallagher]

Man, you'd think Fultz was scoring 4 ppg on 20% shooting after reading half this thread.

In actual games.

[Unbreakable99]

I don't believe that anybody's a hater, just that fans tend to overreact and exaggerate, especially to SL.

Starters were negative again yesterday, so in every game they've been negative. The only starter that has had a positive plus/minus in any game the entire SL was TLC against the Celtics.

Fultz is going to be more scrutinized due to the price we paid to trade up for him, fair or not. There'd be less scrutiny if he was just a normal draft pick. He really needs to separate himself from the guys taken after him otherwise the trade will look really bad. Considering the price we paid to trade up, I would have just taken DSJ and called it a night. Obviously I hope Fultz proves me wrong.

I agree. Even before the draft I thought DSJ was the pick and was actually a bit disappointed when I heard BC traded up to get Fultz. I think he can be a very good player, but I've never been a fan of non-alpha type guards (especially if you plan on using them as PG)...and Fultz definitely isn't an alpha.

That said, if the Lakers pick or Sac pick end up being 2-5, I predict this trade will end up being really bad; primarily because I don't feel like Fultz will be an elite-level player. A good/very good player, but not elite.

I guess a good side to Fultz not being an alpha dog is that he will be the 3rd or maybe 4th option this year. Embiid and Simmons are our alphas. Too many alphas and then you let egos get in the way like Kobe and Shaq. But even with Fultz not having an alpha dog mentality he still tries to get his shots so he's not shy about trying to get his. He leads more by example and not yelling. Embiid is our yeller. Simmons is our calm presence. Fultz is just following this season.

[Embiid P]

Is anyone really expecting Fultz to be a superstar? I'm not but then again, he doesn't have to be considering who's around him. He could easily be a great third or even second banana on a championship-level team.

At first I was unhappy upon hearing that BC was trading up for him, but since he only ended up trading away one additional pick instead of two as initially reported, I've learned to live with it.

[Ericb5]

Hey guys, just stopping by your forum to check out what the buzz was on mMarkelle. I I can't believe how down so many of you are on him. I think you looks amazing. Hopefully Philly will trade him to the Thunder for a bag of chips or something if you think he's that bad.

For me,
It's not that he's a bad player. He's a good player. It's that it was a stupid trade for a player that isn't better than a number of the guys taken after him. If they traded up​ to get an other-worldly talent like Simmons or Embiid that's understandable. But Fultz isn't that kind of talent.
Because of the trade-up, he'll be judged against the guys who​ went behind him and the top 5 pick next year, that they they gave away. It was dumb move, to get what... the next CJ McCollum?

I agree, but as long as Fultz is a star, it's a good trade, even if Tatum/Jackson plus the player drafted with the pick we gave the Celtics also turn into stars. We would lose the trade on points, but win it in the sense that we maximized fit and got a guard that we needed that wasn't otherwise available.

We only need him to be a third banana after all.

Basically the math can work now that we are beyond the asset acquisition phase of the rebuild. Before we had our first star it would have been a bad trade.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Unbreakable99]

Hey guys, just stopping by your forum to check out what the buzz was on mMarkelle. I I can't believe how down so many of you are on him. I think you looks amazing. Hopefully Philly will trade him to the Thunder for a bag of chips or something if you think he's that bad.

For me,
It's not that he's a bad player. He's a good player. It's that it was a stupid trade for a player that isn't better than a number of the guys taken after him. If they traded up​ to get an other-worldly talent like Simmons or Embiid that's understandable. But Fultz isn't that kind of talent.
Because of the trade-up, he'll be judged against the guys who​ went behind him and the top 5 pick next year, that they they gave away. It was dumb move, to get what... the next CJ McCollum?

I agree, but as long as Fultz is a star, it's a good trade, even if Tatum/Jackson plus the player drafted with the pick we gave the Celtics also turn into stars. We would lose the trade on points, but win it in the sense that we maximized fit and got a guard that we needed that wasn't otherwise available.

We only need him to be a third banana after all.

Basically the math can work now that we are beyond the asset acquisition phase of the rebuild. Before we had our first star it would have been a bad trade.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I had Fultz ranked 3rd before the draft. I'm starting the think I may have ranked him too high. He is a good fit though. I don't expect him to become a superstar and doubt he's ever a top 20 player but if he can become an offensive player on the level of a CJ McCollum or Brandon Roy then that's pretty good for a 3rd option. You sure can do a lot worse than that. I just hope he can become at least as good as CJ. I'll start there as my baseline. If he surpasses him then that will be good. If he never becomes as good as him then we have a problem.

[LloydFree]

For me,
It's not that he's a bad player. He's a good player. It's that it was a stupid trade for a player that isn't better than a number of the guys taken after him. If they traded up​ to get an other-worldly talent like Simmons or Embiid that's understandable. But Fultz isn't that kind of talent.
Because of the trade-up, he'll be judged against the guys who​ went behind him and the top 5 pick next year, that they they gave away. It was dumb move, to get what... the next CJ McCollum?

I agree, but as long as Fultz is a star, it's a good trade, even if Tatum/Jackson plus the player drafted with the pick we gave the Celtics also turn into stars. We would lose the trade on points, but win it in the sense that we maximized fit and got a guard that we needed that wasn't otherwise available.

We only need him to be a third banana after all.

Basically the math can work now that we are beyond the asset acquisition phase of the rebuild. Before we had our first star it would have been a bad trade.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I had Fultz ranked 3rd before the draft. I'm starting the think I may have ranked him too high. He is a good fit though. I don't expect him to become a superstar and doubt he's ever a top 20 player but if he can become an offensive player on the level of a CJ McCollum or Brandon Roy then that's pretty good for a 3rd option. You sure can do a lot worse than that. I just hope he can become at least as good as CJ. I'll start there as my baseline. If he surpasses him then that will be good. If he never becomes as good as him then we have a problem.

Well, I don't believe Fultz has done anything in Summer League to get downgraded. He's showed the same things in SL that he did during the season. I had him 5th before Summer League and I still have him 5th. The only thing that has changed for me since the beginning of SL is that I'm more confident that Dennis Smith will be an impact player in this league.

[oddwolfhooligan]

For me,
It's not that he's a bad player. He's a good player. It's that it was a stupid trade for a player that isn't better than a number of the guys taken after him. If they traded up​ to get an other-worldly talent like Simmons or Embiid that's understandable. But Fultz isn't that kind of talent.
Because of the trade-up, he'll be judged against the guys who​ went behind him and the top 5 pick next year, that they they gave away. It was dumb move, to get what... the next CJ McCollum?

That's fair and if he ends up being no more than CJ McCollum and Tatum becomes Carmelo people will always wonder. And I'm not here to be Brian Colangelo's press agent or anything but it does mean something just looking at this objectively that Fultz has been the consensus number 1 overall pick all year long. Guys moved up and down the more respected mock drafts in the 2-5 range but Fultz has been the constant. Can't be too mad at 'em for finding a way to take the consensus best player in what is perceived as a strong draft.

I don't agree. I don't expect my GM to go along with consensus. I expect him to be a better talent evaluator than some freelance writers for DraftExpress and NBAdraftnet. The consensus has been wrong too many times to give him a break, if he's wrong for trading two top 5 picks for a player that isn't better than guys taken later. If giving passes for taking the consensus player was accepted practice, then guys like Joe Dumars wouldn't still be wearing the stink of selecting the consensus #2 Darko Milicic. If Colangelo is wrong and Fultz isn't better than the guys selected after him, draftsite consensus or not, he should be held accountable for making a bad deal.

Yeah, but if you want a true juggernaut, it's not only crucial that you have talent, but that your talent fits together seamlessly. Having three all-star level players who are a perfect fit compared to three all-star level players who are an okay fit can literally be the difference between being a really good team and an elite team. As a result, there may be a player that we could have had at 3 that ends up being as good as Fultz, but if they don't fit as perfectly with Simmons and Embiid as Fultz does, then we're still better off with Fultz.

Honestly, judging this trade based on whether or not another player becomes better than Fultz is akin to judging the tank by whether or not we win a championship. All a GM can do is work off probability, and BC was undoubtedly taking the safest bet for us to become a contender when he made this trade. With Simmons, Embiid and RoCo already in the fold, we were an all-star level combo guard who can shoot away from having the foundation to build a contender. As a result, BC made a deal to draft the player who has a very high probability of being able to fill that role. Now does that mean there's no way we might've ultimately done better had we stayed put? Of course not. Maybe we take Josh Jackson and he develops into a good shooter(coin flip at best) and then we use the LA pick to land the only high level combo guard who can sorta shoot in 2018 in Collin Sexton. If all that happens, then yeah, you might have a better foundation than Fultz, Simmons, Embiid, and RoCo. However, so much more has to go right in that situation for it to work out and the odds of it all coming to fruition are drastically lower. You could just as easily end up in 2017 with a Josh Jackson who never learns how to shoot and another **** Center in the big man heavy 2018 draft and if that happens you're kicking yourself for not taking the almost sure-thing in Fultz.

[eagereyez]

The odds are probably lower than 50/50 for Jackson becoming an above average shooter. If there's anyone who potentially fits the team's needs that we might regret passing on, it's DSJ.

[Unbreakable99]

Fultz does fit our team very well. We were front court heavy. We need players who can shoot. Fultz can shoot. I like the fit. I just want him to be great too.

[Unbreakable99]

Read on Twitter

[Negrodamus]

I'm sure he "asked" for a selfie and not completely imposed on his personal space to force a selfie with Fultz. Usually people go from gratitude to aggression in a split second.

[LongLiveHinkie]

Good for Fultz, that guy is a douche.

[cksdayoff]

Read on Twitter

it was a lakers fan, markelle fultz is the man

[Tony Franciosa]

No selfies with Laker fans. Good for Markelle.