***Sixerfan1976 Official Thread - Update Page 28***

KrazySixersD · Post #621 » by **KrazySixersD** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 12:25 am

are you really saing that if by some miracle martin and okafor were added to this team with jrue, iggy, and brand... that we wouldnt win 55 games after just winning 41 when we started 3-13 and iguodala played most the year hurt and our 20 year old PG will undoubtedly be better next year as well?

Im not sure how that team doesnt win 50 to 55 games easily

freshie2 · Post #622 » by **freshie2** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 12:41 am

Jrue/Martin/Iguodala/Brand/Okafor would be a very solid starting 5...but I think developing Jrue/ET/Iguodala/Brand/Hawes is better than a 41 win team next year as well...45-48 with the improved depth and hoping for a bit of contribution from Brackins. I don't think 50 wins is out of the picture with the right offseason moves.

agiaco · Post #623 » by **agiaco** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 1:57 am

I'd love to get Kevin Martin. Always been one of my favorite players and underrated too. Hill or Williams is kind of a toss-up. Both have potential, but TWill is kind of a troublemaker it seems. Hill has some potential to be a decent defender in the post.

76ciology · Post #624 » by **76ciology** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 2:54 am

freshie2 wrote:Jrue/Martin/Iguodala/Brand/Okafor would be a very solid starting 5...but I think developing Jrue/ET/Iguodala/Brand/Hawes is better than a 41 win team next year as well...45-48 with the improved depth and hoping for a bit of contribution from Brackins. I don't think 50 wins is out of the picture with the right offseason moves.

I don't know why the line-up of Jrue Martin Iguodala Brand Okafor is getting that much buzz. It's not that far off from the CP3-DWest-Okafor Hornets' squad in 2008-2009. And that squad, never won more than 50 games. And that 2008-2009 squad was better than this proposed team.

Yes, Martin and Iguodala are upgrades at the SG and SF position. But having a superstar PG in CP3 and an all-star PF in D.West are going to be a huge upgrade than EB42 and Jrue in PG-PF position.

P2K · Post #625 » by **P2K** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 11:45 am

KrazySixersD wrote:are you really saing that if by some miracle martin and okafor were added to this team with jrue, iggy, and brand... that we wouldnt win 55 games after just winning 41 when we started 3-13 and iguodala played most the year hurt and our 20 year old PG will undoubtedly be better next year as well?

Im not sure how that team doesnt win 50 to 55 games easily

What I'm saying is better teams than our Sixers have a hard time winning 45-50 games. There's no way of knowing if Martin and Okafor would completely fit in or conform to Collins' coaching. Neither are special players, either. And there's no guarantee Jrue gets better next year. We don't know his potential, not unless you have a crystal ball that tells the future. He may have topped out.

I refuse to believe a team of Jrue/Martin/Iguodala/Brand/Okafor is going to rival Boston, Miami, Chicago for damn near the best record in the East. And then, you add an easily on top of it. Wow. I think too many posters on here go too high with expectations and I have no idea where it comes from. 50-55 wins is a sick number. People's eyes get way too big for their stomach. Reality sets in and the big crash comes. Or as my late aunt would say "I had champage taste, but ripple money".

Gsraider · Post #626 » by **Gsraider** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 2:21 pm

P2K wrote:I refuse to believe a team of Jrue/Martin/Iguodala/Brand/Okafor is going to rival Boston, Miami, Chicago for damn near the best record in the East. And then, you add an easily on top of it. Wow. I think too many posters on here go too high with expectations and I have no idea where it comes from. 50-55 wins is a sick number. People's eyes get way too big for their stomach. Reality sets in and the big crash comes.

Generally, I would be in complete agreement with you on this one, except for a couple of things. One, this team as currently constituted, was 38-28 after a dreadful 3-13 start to the season. Since that is a much larger sample size, had they started the season playing like the did for most of it, that translates to about 47-48 wins. That was with Hawes at C, Turner having a poor year, and Iguodala battling injuries pretty much from Day 1. If no other changes were made whatsoever and Iguodala came in at close to 100%, it's at least reasonable to suspect a slight improvement over last year, since most of this team is pretty young and still possesses upside. For example, I think it's very reasonable to expect improvement next year from guys like Holiday, Young, Turner, and Meeks. On the flipside, it's possible to see Brand to take a step back at his age, but he is in his early 30's, not his late ones, so it's equally reasonable to expect a similar season to last year too.

Secondly, whether you like Martin or not, he has to be considered an upgrade over Meeks. Same goes with Okafor over Hawes. Granted, it could take some time to mesh, but it's not as though in Okafor's place he would be replacing much from the get go. With Martin, he would need to be come out of the gates hitting his share of three's to keep the floor spaced, but he is good enough from there to have that respect.

In the end, 50 wins is probably more likely, but I don't see the 55 number as outlandish as I normally would either. Actually doing it is probably easier said than done, but on paper, it seems doable to me and I'm someone who agrees with your premise in general.

Winejk · Post #627 » by **Winejk** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 6:44 pm

One, this team as currently constituted, was 38-28 after a dreadful 3-13 start to the season. Since that is a much larger sample size, had they started the season playing like the did for most of it, that translates to about 47-48 wins.

Yeah I've always been puzzled by fans that don't think 50 wins is a remote possibility given how this team struggled the first quarter of last season. Part of the 3-13 record were two losses each to Toronto, Cleveland and the two heartbreakers with Washington.

And like Gsraider, I think with some improvement hopefully by Holiday, Turner, Meeks, Williams and Young and a healthy Iguodala reaching 50 is not out of the realm of possibility. Is it guaranteed to happen? No, but it is plausible.

Post #628 » by **Sixerscan** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:07 pm

76ciology wrote:
freshie2 wrote:Jrue/Martin/Iguodala/Brand/Okafor would be a very solid starting 5...but I think developing Jrue/ET/Iguodala/Brand/Hawes is better than a 41 win team next year as well...45-48 with the improved depth and hoping for a bit of contribution from Brackins. I don't think 50 wins is out of the picture with the right offseason moves.

I don't know why the line-up of Jrue Martin Iguodala Brand Okafor is getting that much buzz. It's not that far off from the CP3-DWest-Okafor Hornets' squad in 2008-2009. And that squad, never won more than 50 games. And that 2008-2009 squad was better than this proposed team.

Okafor wasn't on the Hornets in 2009... Chandler was, but he got hurt and only played 45 games, with the immortal Hilton Armstrong filling in for him to the tune of 5/3 a night

FWIW the year before they won 56 games, in a conference much deeper than the East is right now...

But this is all a waste of time because there's no way in hell we're getting both Okafor and Martin (probably don't have a chance at either)

P2K · Post #629 » by **P2K** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:14 pm

I don't understand why there are those that just totally dismiss the 3-13 start like it never happened. It did happen and for a reason. Just like they went into a nosedive at the end of the season. When you're not that good, you can't mask all of your problems forever and eventually, they come out on the court. And once again, this team wouldn't have a superstar.

45 wins? Yeah, I could see that. But anything above...I just disagree, I guess.

Arsenal · Post #630 » by **Arsenal** » Thu Jun 30, 2011 5:16 am

Dump Evan Turner for Kevin Martin? Where do I sign?

I'd be surprised if we can get anything of value for Evan Turner at this point.

PhillyFan · Post #631 » by **PhillyFan** » Thu Jun 30, 2011 5:40 am

Why aren't we looking to trade Louis Williams? He has a reasonable contract for what he does and should have some value around the league for teams looking to add some sparks off the bench.

76ciology · Post #632 » by **76ciology** » Thu Jun 30, 2011 5:49 am

PhillyFan wrote:Why aren't we looking to trade Louis Williams? He has a reasonable contract for what he does and should have some value around the league for teams looking to add some sparks off the bench.

Because he is our team's best scorer.

PhillyFan · Post #633 » by **PhillyFan** » Thu Jun 30, 2011 5:52 am

76ciology wrote:
PhillyFan wrote:Why aren't we looking to trade Louis Williams? He has a reasonable contract for what he does and should have some value around the league for teams looking to add some sparks off the bench.

Because he is our team's best scorer.

And where has he lead us? He is expandable in my opinion.

76ciology · Post #634 » by **76ciology** » Thu Jun 30, 2011 6:44 am

PhillyFan wrote:
76ciology wrote:
PhillyFan wrote:Why aren't we looking to trade Louis Williams? He has a reasonable contract for what he does and should have some value around the league for teams looking to add some sparks off the bench.

Because he is our team's best scorer.

And where has he lead us? He is expandable in my opinion.

With our deficiency on offense, I honestly can see us not making the play-offs without Lou Williams. He is expendable if we are going for the 2012 FA sweepstakes or if we are getting a similar scorer back in return. (Pietrus?)

Winejk · Post #635 » by **Winejk** » Thu Jun 30, 2011 7:04 am

Doug Collins has mentioned that Lou Williams is a leader on the team. When Williams got injured at the end of the season, according to Collins it was hard to replace his leadership not to mention the other things he brings to the team.

I won't say never, but I doubt you see Williams moved as long as Collins is the coach.

PH1LLYSFINEST13 · Post #636 » by **PH1LLYSFINEST13** » Thu Jun 30, 2011 12:15 pm

Winejk wrote:Doug Collins has mentioned that Lou Williams is a leader on the team. When Williams got injured at the end of the season, according to Collins it was hard to replace his leadership not to mention the other things he brings to the team.

I won't say never, but I doubt you see Williams moved as long as Collins is the coach.

Lou Williams and leadership in the same sentence?? I dont know about all this crazy talk. Lou is a great scorer , maybe they couldnt replace that , but him being a leader? Where did Collins say this? I would like to see it.

Didnt Lou go to a lil Wayne rap concert before one of the playoff games and then stay for the after party and shoot like 2-13 the next game? Dont get me wrong , you wanna go to concerts and whatever fine , but dont stay out till 4 am when you know you got a playoff game against the Heat the next day and the show up and dont show out.

PH1LLYSFINEST13 · Post #637 » by **PH1LLYSFINEST13** » Thu Jun 30, 2011 12:18 pm

PhillyFan wrote:
76ciology wrote:
PhillyFan wrote:Why aren't we looking to trade Louis Williams? He has a reasonable contract for what he does and should have some value around the league for teams looking to add some sparks off the bench.

Because he is our team's best scorer.

And where has he lead us? He is expandable in my opinion.

Nobody has lead us anywhere. Doug Collins has lead us to the playoffs. Lou isnt expendable unless the Monta trade goes through or you bring in another instant offense guy. Blake Griffin hasnt lead his team anywhere either.

Tony Franciosa · Post #638 » by **Tony Franciosa** » Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:06 pm

Yeah, Lou isn't expendable just yet. If they make an Iggy trade for another high energy scorer, I'd expect Lou to be moved.

PhillyFan · Post #639 » by **PhillyFan** » Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:32 pm

PH1LLYSFINEST13 wrote:
Winejk wrote:Doug Collins has mentioned that Lou Williams is a leader on the team. When Williams got injured at the end of the season, according to Collins it was hard to replace his leadership not to mention the other things he brings to the team.

I won't say never, but I doubt you see Williams moved as long as Collins is the coach.

Lou Williams and leadership in the same sentence?? I dont know about all this crazy talk. Lou is a great scorer , maybe they couldnt replace that , but him being a leader? Where did Collins say this? I would like to see it.

Didnt Lou go to a lil Wayne rap concert before one of the playoff games and then stay for the after party and shoot like 2-13 the next game? Dont get me wrong , you wanna go to concerts and whatever fine , but dont stay out till 4 am when you know you got a playoff game against the Heat the next day and the show up and dont show out.

I do remember Collins saying Lou is one of the leaders in the team, along side with Iguodala and Brand. But I think that was referring them to being on this team for a while, doesn't make the 3 o them untouchable though :lol:

Gsraider · Post #640 » by **Gsraider** » Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:34 pm

PhillyFan wrote:Why aren't we looking to trade Louis Williams? He has a reasonable contract for what he does and should have some value around the league for teams looking to add some sparks off the bench.

This was lost on me the entire time Iguodala was being heavily shopped during the draft and Philly was said to want to move up a few slots. Philly doesn't have too many guys that can create their own shots, but Lou's shot selection is atrocious, as is his defense, and he could have some decent value around the league. Like Winejk pointed out however, Collins has stated on numerous occasions that Lou is one of the team leaders (I find that stunning myself) and I believe it was K. Fagen that said she doubted Philly would look to move him. Not sure I totally get that, but it is what it is.