The Tomjas Thread

[Kobblehead]

Murray is taking 4+ 3pa per 36. He's evolving from a nonshooter to a reluctant shooter. Maybe he continues his forward trajectory from a reluctant shooter into a legit spacer.

Also, if there's a way to get Vassell included, you can't pass that up IMO.

[Kobblehead]

Im guessing Doc is very happy with how the team’s offense is running right now. Doc loves the pick and roll, the shooting, the spacing the scoring.. then suddenly Morey surprises him with..

Oh btw Doc, we’d like to have Dejounte Murray run our offense.

Even if you look at the numbers and see what kind of players Morey wants from his guard, you can clearly see Murray is NOT that guy.

Tyrese Maxey is playing 33.6 mpg entirely at PG for us right now and is shooting a pathetic 2.7 3pa per 36 and has a horrible 18.8% assist percentage.

Murray would a be a monumental upgrade from the PG play we're getting right now.

[Kobblehead]

Tyrese Maxey:
- 15.7 ppg per 36, 2.7 3pa per 36, 18.8% assist, 1% steal, 1.1% block

Dejounte Murray:
- 19.3 ppg per 36, 4.2 3pa per 36, 35.4% assist, 2.9% steal, 1.2% block

Colossal upgrade on scoring and shooting on a per minute basis. Colossal upgrade in ball movement. Colossal upgrade on the defensive end.

[Negrodamus]

You can get further with Ben and random combo guards than Murray and random PF.

These are two different things. You can get farther if Ben has an entire team curtailed to cover his flaws? Meanwhile we're comparing that to Murray with a random PF? I think if Murray stepped into Maxey's spot on this team, he'd be better than any team build around Simmons.

In terms of supply, a guy like Ben is a lotto to mid first talent while you can get a 18ppg on 17FGA guard in the 20-30th range of the draft.

Yes, if you completely shelf the other side of the ball, where Murray is among the elites in the game, then Murray is an end of the first round talent. But, of course, we can't do that. Ben's entire perceived value exists on the side you're ignoring.

Like I said, Milton, Kork and Maxey can all be better than Murray on offense.

Perhaps they can, but so far this season, it is demonstrably false that they are better than Murray on offense (and far, far worse on defense). If TS% is your only indicator, then I suppose your mind is already made up.

Murray is actually shooting a better 3FG% on a higher rate than our current starting point guard, which is actually where it matters. Murray could step into the Maxey role and do it much, much better.

[76ciology]

Im guessing Doc is very happy with how the team’s offense is running right now. Doc loves the pick and roll, the shooting, the spacing the scoring.. then suddenly Morey surprises him with..

Oh btw Doc, we’d like to have Dejounte Murray run our offense.

Even if you look at the numbers and see what kind of players Morey wants from his guard, you can clearly see Murray is NOT that guy.

Tyrese Maxey is playing 33.6 mpg entirely at PG for us right now and is shooting a pathetic 2.7 3pa per 36 and has a horrible 18.8% assist percentage.

Murray would a be a monumental upgrade from the PG play we're getting right now.

That’s not the metric we care about though.
We dont really look at 3pa or assists.

You can easily pad assists or run an elite offense with collectively sharing the assists responsibility and there are ways to make up for lack of 3pt makes

[Bornstellar]

There's no way the Spurs would trade Murray or Vassell for Simmons. If anything it'd be White and KJ or Lonnie plus Young and a pick or two. If Murray keeps his play up the Spurs basically have a shorter Simmons with slightly worse defense and passing but much better shooting.

Vassell looks like he's about to breakout, kid gives me young Kawhi vibes. Plus with Ben's attitude issues and mental health thing I just don't see the Spurs making that trade.

[76ciology]

There's no way the Spurs would trade Murray or Vassell for Simmons. If anything it'd be White and KJ or Lonnie plus Young and a pick or two. If Murray keeps his play up the Spurs basically have a shorter Simmons with slightly worse defense and passing but much better shooting.

Vassell looks like he's about to breakout, kid gives me young Kawhi vibes. Plus with Ben's attitude issues and mental health thing I just don't see the Spurs making that trade.

Good.

Give us Keldon Johnson, Primo, 2 picks and a pick swap.

[Bornstellar]

There's no way the Spurs would trade Murray or Vassell for Simmons. If anything it'd be White and KJ or Lonnie plus Young and a pick or two. If Murray keeps his play up the Spurs basically have a shorter Simmons with slightly worse defense and passing but much better shooting.

Vassell looks like he's about to breakout, kid gives me young Kawhi vibes. Plus with Ben's attitude issues and mental health thing I just don't see the Spurs making that trade.

Good.

Give us Keldon Johnson, Primo, 2 picks and a pick swap.

Not a terrible trade honestly but I think the Spurs view Primo super highly long term. I might make that deal but I don't think the FO is interested in trading Primo unless it's an offer that can't be refused

[76ciology]

We’re 1st in offense but only 11th in assists. We need more assists from Maxey?

What we need is a shot maker where when our collective dribble drive offense gets stalled by elite defense and Embiid is struggling, we can go to that guy.

We need an efficient scorer who can shoot.

No, not Tobi

[Kobblehead]

Maxey is along for the ride, not a catalyst for our success. He doesn't shoot, pass or defend. Murray does it all. While scoring off the dribble and creating his own shot.

[Negrodamus]

We’re 1st in offense but only 11th in assists. We need more assists from Maxey?

What we need is a shot maker where when our collective dribble drive offense gets stalled by elite defense and Embiid is struggling, we can go to that guy.

We need an efficient scorer who can shoot.

No, not Tobi

And we need it in a trade for a guy who does none of those things. Any takers?!

[76ciology]

There's no way the Spurs would trade Murray or Vassell for Simmons. If anything it'd be White and KJ or Lonnie plus Young and a pick or two. If Murray keeps his play up the Spurs basically have a shorter Simmons with slightly worse defense and passing but much better shooting.

Vassell looks like he's about to breakout, kid gives me young Kawhi vibes. Plus with Ben's attitude issues and mental health thing I just don't see the Spurs making that trade.

Good.

Give us Keldon Johnson, Primo, 2 picks and a pick swap.

Not a terrible trade honestly but I think the Spurs view Primo super highly long term. I might make that deal but I don't think the FO is interested in trading Primo unless it's an offer that can't be refused

Those picks and Primo could get me a guy who can LIKELY be better than Ben and Murray.

It would also be easier for me to win a bid war of picks with Primo, 2 Spurs picks, 3 Sixers picks for Dame or top tier talents in the future.

Short term, Keldon and likely Thad, can provide me the size at the wing positions I need to match up against guys like Giannis in the playoffs.

[76ciology]

Maxey is along for the ride, not a catalyst for our success. He doesn't shoot, pass or defend. Murray does it all. While scoring off the dribble and creating his own shot.

I dont think Murray is that guy tho.

Let’s say Murray is an upgrade over Maxey. We then become slightly better than we are right now. But do you think after doing the Murray for Ben trade, you put yourself in a better place to win a bid war for a top tier shot maker talent in the future

And i’d rather kick the can with Primo, Keldon and picks. Then be more confident to win bid wars for top tier talents in the future.

[theo42]

Maxey is along for the ride, not a catalyst for our success. He doesn't shoot, pass or defend. Murray does it all. While scoring off the dribble and creating his own shot.

Wrong.

While his steal numbers need to get better, his on-ball defense is outstanding. Also, it isn't his fault that he has been relegated to a 4th or 5th option on the court. When they do turn to him, he gets to the rim at will. This is a trait this team desperately needs.

Murry, when he was 21, was hot garbage. 8 PPG. Maxey, by age 24, will be a beast.

[Skates]

Awesome to see both Sixers and Spurs fans massively over valuing Dejounte Murray. See, you can get along. Also, I love fans that come here from other teams and think they can trade tehri fifth and sixth best players for Simmons, and the top players on the Spurs are barely as good as the fifth or sixth best players on those other teams. Spurs are a roster full of 'nice' players, if they had actual stars they wouldn't be after Simmons in the first place.

[sixers hoops]

Who would we realistically want 12/15 that is not available now ? Doesn’t seem like a lot of guys.

I don’t see any all-stars or game changers suddenly becoming available to us on 12/15. I think a lot of players will become eligible to be traded, but I don’t know that it equates to a difference maker getting offered to us for Ben.

[Sixerscan]

Tyrese Maxey:
- 15.7 ppg per 36, 2.7 3pa per 36, 18.8% assist, 1% steal, 1.1% block

Dejounte Murray:
- 19.3 ppg per 36, 4.2 3pa per 36, 35.4% assist, 2.9% steal, 1.2% block

Colossal upgrade on scoring and shooting on a per minute basis. Colossal upgrade in ball movement. Colossal upgrade on the defensive end.

Would be pretty funny to go through all this and end up with an all-Klutch backcourt

[Sixerscan]

Who would we realistically want 12/15 that is not available now ? Doesn’t seem like a lot of guys.

I don’t see any all-stars or game changers suddenly becoming available to us on 12/15. I think a lot of players will become eligible to be traded, but I don’t know that it equates to a difference maker getting offered to us for Ben.

The 12/15 date is always overrated by teams looking for trades and fans of those teams. That said I assume that date would be more about salary coming available for filler to make the numbers work as opposed to the "difference maker" himself

[sixers hoops]

December 15th. It's a long time from now, I know. But just focus on December 15th.

Who are the targets that become available on 12/15? I’m sure having a wave of players become eligible to be traded helps, but I don’t see how those players will bridge the gap between what Morey is digging his heels in for, and what other teams will realistically offer.

If you’re suggesting Morey will lower his demands on 12/15, that is one thing; however, I don’t know that there is an amazing deal out there that hinges on a player becoming available on 12/15.

[LeonJordanJr24]

Eww stop with this Murray crap...

We should look to move Simmons for a wing upgrade over Danny Green who is our weak link .


Jalen Brown or Ingram are what we should be looking to get.


Also, with the mandate Irving ...


Of course Beal, Lilliard or Lavine.