The Tomjas Thread

[Sixerscan]

Just to throw an example out, like if the Sixers wanted Murray and McDermott from the Spurs, they money would work but they couldn't do that until 12/15 because McDermott was signed in the offseason.

[Negrodamus]

Awesome to see both Sixers and Spurs fans massively over valuing Dejounte Murray. See, you can get along. Also, I love fans that come here from other teams and think they can trade tehri fifth and sixth best players for Simmons, and the top players on the Spurs are barely as good as the fifth or sixth best players on those other teams. Spurs are a roster full of 'nice' players, if they had actual stars they wouldn't be after Simmons in the first place.

I think it's crazier how many Sixer fans think we can pull Ingram, Jaylen Brown, or even De'Aaron Fox (I, myself, have talked myself into this thinking) for Ben Simmons.

The only thing Ben provides on offense is fast break points, and assist creation when the team is built around him with shooters. Meanwhile Fox, Brown, and Ingram are able to create points with the ball in their hands; something that's extremely valuable in the playoffs.

Viewing Ben as anything other than an elite role player is, frankly, pretty silly. On top of that, he is either faking a mental illness or actually has a mental disorder which hurts his value.

I think our only move to maximize his value is to milk the T'Wolves for all they're worth in a three team trade.

[Skates]

On a team with plenty of creators already, Simmons is an incredible asset to have. He can shut down the opposing team's best player from 1-4 and even play the 5 at times, while still terrorizing with his off ball D at the same time. He has great handles for a 6'10" player, which is not to say great handles for a smaller player, but at his size he can guard and terrorize the other team's best scorer/creator, be an asset on the fast break and in the open floor on both ends, stuff the stat sheet and even with his shooting limitations his passing to others has created a ton of baskets. The league didn't make him an All Star several times, vote him second (when he really should have been first) for DPOY, put him on All Defense squads several times and even make one All-NBA team without reason. He is a hyper athletic version of Draymond Green, without the shot Green has developed (though we all have seen him shoot threes and he can shoot it, and maybe would on a team where the offensive glare points elsewhere and a new coach brings it out of him).

He is a lot like Draymond and Iggy had a more athletic 6'10" offspring that is definitely not suited to being in the limelight for a tough fan base, so either a small market or a guy where he wasn't the number one pick in the draft and has offensive stars to complement. Ingram is a good shooter, decent, but just showing it now creator, Fox is overrated in my opinion, and no, we aren't getting Jaylen Brown since the Celtic burned even more first round draft picks into ashes than we did, they can't afford to lose one of their only two creators.

Other than Keldon and his crappy three point shooting getting hoisted onto the Olympic team because his coach was their coach, San Antonio has no one to match Simmons, not even close. Vassal is a nice prospect, but not much more so than a lot of other might develop guys in the league and Murray is a poor man's Simmons, who does the same things, but not as well, not as athletic or big and is pretty inefficient as a shooter. SA is a system team that plays better than any of the sum of its parts and they have been as hot on Simmons almost as much as Minny has, both needing a third team in for a deal.

Everyone is trying to get a bargain on Simmons and Morey is waiting that out. He isn't worth Anthony Edwards or guys like that, but he is worth more than most team's fan bases are. Haliburton, Hield and Bagley is what I am hoping for, with Simmons and one of our cheap, but role players going the other way, maybe flipping Bagley and Green to someone with a FRP for a better starting SF. CJ, Little and two FRP's is fair, and requires a second deal or third team in for a big defensive wing, or whomever the Wolves can get for Russell and/or Beasley, Vanderbilt and McDaniels and picks in the three team deal. SA obviously has a number of good, far from great guys to package without emptying their shelves in a three team deal.

People point to Ingram in large part because the Pellies are a mess and they made a lot of odd moves this offseason that make you wonder if management is weak (Griffin without Lebron is just another guy as GM).

Some combo of Portland, Sacto, Minny, SA and different third teams can supply a lot of what the Sixers need. Morey really just has to be sure Dame is not available (and he looks bad so far, though I expect that to change), we know Beal isn't, and then he will move on to his preferred next tier targets. Simmons isn't everyone's taste, his character issues are far less concerning than plenty of less talented guys people have craved in trades, and Morey won't sell just to sell, plus Simmons is not a rental. I am not overrating him, but at times we forget how good and valuable the things he can do are, how rare as a package.

[zaz102]

Awesome to see both Sixers and Spurs fans massively over valuing Dejounte Murray. See, you can get along. Also, I love fans that come here from other teams and think they can trade tehri fifth and sixth best players for Simmons, and the top players on the Spurs are barely as good as the fifth or sixth best players on those other teams. Spurs are a roster full of 'nice' players, if they had actual stars they wouldn't be after Simmons in the first place.

I think it's crazier how many Sixer fans think we can pull Ingram, Jaylen Brown, or even De'Aaron Fox (I, myself, have talked myself into this thinking) for Ben Simmons.

The only thing Ben provides on offense is fast break points, and assist creation when the team is built around him with shooters. Meanwhile Fox, Brown, and Ingram are able to create points with the ball in their hands; something that's extremely valuable in the playoffs.

Viewing Ben as anything other than an elite role player is, frankly, pretty silly. On top of that, he is either faking a mental illness or actually has a mental disorder which hurts his value.

I think our only move to maximize his value is to milk the T'Wolves for all they're worth in a three team trade.

Simmons, Brown, and Ingram were drafted the same year. Simmons is a 3x All-Star selected by coaches including the last one. Brown and Ingram made 1 All-Star game. None of have great playoff success and have been second fiddles (when their teams were good). Pelicans are awful and Celtics are currently struggling. They might not want Simmons but it's not as far off as you are saying.

Kings are doing pretty good and Fox is younger, but he has less accolades and they also have Haliburton in the wings which may make Fox disposable.

Obviously, none of these offers are on the table or the Sixers would have taken them, but if these teams don't make the playoffs or if any of the players become disposable for whatever reason, then the situation could change.

[Negrodamus]

Awesome to see both Sixers and Spurs fans massively over valuing Dejounte Murray. See, you can get along. Also, I love fans that come here from other teams and think they can trade tehri fifth and sixth best players for Simmons, and the top players on the Spurs are barely as good as the fifth or sixth best players on those other teams. Spurs are a roster full of 'nice' players, if they had actual stars they wouldn't be after Simmons in the first place.

I think it's crazier how many Sixer fans think we can pull Ingram, Jaylen Brown, or even De'Aaron Fox (I, myself, have talked myself into this thinking) for Ben Simmons.

The only thing Ben provides on offense is fast break points, and assist creation when the team is built around him with shooters. Meanwhile Fox, Brown, and Ingram are able to create points with the ball in their hands; something that's extremely valuable in the playoffs.

Viewing Ben as anything other than an elite role player is, frankly, pretty silly. On top of that, he is either faking a mental illness or actually has a mental disorder which hurts his value.

I think our only move to maximize his value is to milk the T'Wolves for all they're worth in a three team trade.

Simmons, Brown, and Ingram were drafted the same year. Simmons is a 3x All-Star selected by coaches including the last one. Brown and Ingram made 1 All-Star game. None of have great playoff success and have been second fiddles (when their teams were good). Pelicans are awful and Celtics are currently struggling. They might not want Simmons but it's not as far off as you are saying.

Kings are doing pretty good and Fox is younger, but he has less accolades and they also have Haliburton in the wings which may make Fox disposable.

Obviously, none of these offers are on the table or the Sixers would have taken them, but if these teams don't make the playoffs or if any of the players become disposable for whatever reason, then the situation could change.

I'm sorry, but All-Star game appearances don't really resonate with me. Once you make one while on a winning team, you're pretty much a shoo in from there on out unless you miss large parts of the season or have come off the rails.

If Ben had the same career but on the Cavs or some other consistently bad team, we wouldn't be discussing his accolades.

For the most part, these teams are run by competent people. They will see Ben for what he is: a glue piece on a championship team if he's willing to buy in. Unless there is a Jimmy Butler/James Harden irreparable fallout situation presents itself, I don't see a team out there trading a self sufficient on ball scorer for a role player.

The most I can see right now is Minnesota's deal. I can see them overpaying STEEPLY for Ben to appease KAT. Similar situation as what the Thunder pulled off on Paul George when they knew the Clippers Kawhi offer was contingent on them getting George.

[zaz102]

I think it's crazier how many Sixer fans think we can pull Ingram, Jaylen Brown, or even De'Aaron Fox (I, myself, have talked myself into this thinking) for Ben Simmons.

The only thing Ben provides on offense is fast break points, and assist creation when the team is built around him with shooters. Meanwhile Fox, Brown, and Ingram are able to create points with the ball in their hands; something that's extremely valuable in the playoffs.

Viewing Ben as anything other than an elite role player is, frankly, pretty silly. On top of that, he is either faking a mental illness or actually has a mental disorder which hurts his value.

I think our only move to maximize his value is to milk the T'Wolves for all they're worth in a three team trade.

Simmons, Brown, and Ingram were drafted the same year. Simmons is a 3x All-Star selected by coaches including the last one. Brown and Ingram made 1 All-Star game. None of have great playoff success and have been second fiddles (when their teams were good). Pelicans are awful and Celtics are currently struggling. They might not want Simmons but it's not as far off as you are saying.

Kings are doing pretty good and Fox is younger, but he has less accolades and they also have Haliburton in the wings which may make Fox disposable.

Obviously, none of these offers are on the table or the Sixers would have taken them, but if these teams don't make the playoffs or if any of the players become disposable for whatever reason, then the situation could change.

I'm sorry, but All-Star game appearances don't really resonate with me. Once you make one while on a winning team, you're pretty much a shoo in from there on out unless you miss large parts of the season or have come off the rails.

If Ben had the same career but on the Cavs or some other consistently bad team, we wouldn't be discussing his accolades.

For the most part, these teams are run by competent people. They will see Ben for what he is: a glue piece on a championship team if he's willing to buy in. Unless there is a Jimmy Butler/James Harden irreparable fallout situation presents itself, I don't see a team out there trading a self sufficient on ball scorer for a role player.

The most I can see right now is Minnesota's deal. I can see them overpaying STEEPLY for Ben to appease KAT. Similar situation as what the Thunder pulled off on Paul George when they knew the Clippers Kawhi offer was contingent on them getting George.

I certainly get the argument about all star appearances, but why do you think coaches have been selecting him and have been passing over Ingram and Brown? Not sure I get it if teams truly think Brown and Ingram are truly a tier above Simmons.

[kuclas]

Awesome to see both Sixers and Spurs fans massively over valuing Dejounte Murray. See, you can get along. Also, I love fans that come here from other teams and think they can trade tehri fifth and sixth best players for Simmons, and the top players on the Spurs are barely as good as the fifth or sixth best players on those other teams. Spurs are a roster full of 'nice' players, if they had actual stars they wouldn't be after Simmons in the first place.

I think it's crazier how many Sixer fans think we can pull Ingram, Jaylen Brown, or even De'Aaron Fox (I, myself, have talked myself into this thinking) for Ben Simmons.

The only thing Ben provides on offense is fast break points, and assist creation when the team is built around him with shooters. Meanwhile Fox, Brown, and Ingram are able to create points with the ball in their hands; something that's extremely valuable in the playoffs.

Viewing Ben as anything other than an elite role player is, frankly, pretty silly. On top of that, he is either faking a mental illness or actually has a mental disorder which hurts his value.

I think our only move to maximize his value is to milk the T'Wolves for all they're worth in a three team trade.

We don’t know how good Ingram fox really are until they hit the playoffs. Their teams are losing games and they are inflating their stats. This doesn’t make them good players. Just stat stuffers.

Brown is Jacking up shots as well. But it comes at a cost. Less assists. Less team play. More losses for Boston. And his defense has taken a big hit.

I’m not sure i even want Anthony Edwards in Minnesota anymore. He’s playing like he’s the Second coming of Andre Wiggins. Taking 20’plus shots a game. And not a good shooter.

So you have this image of ben Simmons in the playoffs. But those others guys fox/Ingram could end up being exposed. Just like deangelo Russell was exposed when sixers (Simmons) locked Russell down in the playoffs and exposed him for what he was. A high volume low efficiency chucker who doesn’t play defense.

[Negrodamus]

Simmons, Brown, and Ingram were drafted the same year. Simmons is a 3x All-Star selected by coaches including the last one. Brown and Ingram made 1 All-Star game. None of have great playoff success and have been second fiddles (when their teams were good). Pelicans are awful and Celtics are currently struggling. They might not want Simmons but it's not as far off as you are saying.

Kings are doing pretty good and Fox is younger, but he has less accolades and they also have Haliburton in the wings which may make Fox disposable.

Obviously, none of these offers are on the table or the Sixers would have taken them, but if these teams don't make the playoffs or if any of the players become disposable for whatever reason, then the situation could change.

I'm sorry, but All-Star game appearances don't really resonate with me. Once you make one while on a winning team, you're pretty much a shoo in from there on out unless you miss large parts of the season or have come off the rails.

If Ben had the same career but on the Cavs or some other consistently bad team, we wouldn't be discussing his accolades.

For the most part, these teams are run by competent people. They will see Ben for what he is: a glue piece on a championship team if he's willing to buy in. Unless there is a Jimmy Butler/James Harden irreparable fallout situation presents itself, I don't see a team out there trading a self sufficient on ball scorer for a role player.

The most I can see right now is Minnesota's deal. I can see them overpaying STEEPLY for Ben to appease KAT. Similar situation as what the Thunder pulled off on Paul George when they knew the Clippers Kawhi offer was contingent on them getting George.

I certainly get the argument about all star appearances, but why do you think coaches have been selecting him and have been passing over Ingram and Brown? Not sure I get it if teams truly think Brown and Ingram are truly a tier above Simmons.

Because he became an allstar in his second year while playing with an incredible cast. Was probably his best all around season. He then followed it up with a slightly worse season once Jimmy and Redick left, but maintained similar stats and made it on reputation. Last year was purely on reputation. All of this is null anyway: what matters is your ability in the playoffs. The Warriors aren't going to Draymond Green to produce some offense when the team goes cold in a playoff game. The Celtics, Pelicans, and Kings will go to their suggested stars for points. That can't be measured in all star games.

[zaz102]

I'm sorry, but All-Star game appearances don't really resonate with me. Once you make one while on a winning team, you're pretty much a shoo in from there on out unless you miss large parts of the season or have come off the rails.

If Ben had the same career but on the Cavs or some other consistently bad team, we wouldn't be discussing his accolades.

For the most part, these teams are run by competent people. They will see Ben for what he is: a glue piece on a championship team if he's willing to buy in. Unless there is a Jimmy Butler/James Harden irreparable fallout situation presents itself, I don't see a team out there trading a self sufficient on ball scorer for a role player.

The most I can see right now is Minnesota's deal. I can see them overpaying STEEPLY for Ben to appease KAT. Similar situation as what the Thunder pulled off on Paul George when they knew the Clippers Kawhi offer was contingent on them getting George.

I certainly get the argument about all star appearances, but why do you think coaches have been selecting him and have been passing over Ingram and Brown? Not sure I get it if teams truly think Brown and Ingram are truly a tier above Simmons.

Because he became an allstar in his second year while playing with an incredible cast. Was probably his best all around season. He then followed it up with a slightly worse season once Jimmy and Redick left, but maintained similar stats and made it on reputation. Last year was purely on reputation. All of this is null anyway: what matters is your ability in the playoffs. The Warriors aren't going to Draymond Green to produce some offense when the team goes cold in a playoff game. The Celtics, Pelicans, and Kings will go to their suggested stars for points. That can't be measured in all star games.

So teams gave Simmons a free all star pass due to his reputation whereas Brown and Ingram did not make it because they do not have the reputation. Yet these same teams would have no interest for trading for the player that has a better reputation with them? Not sure I follow.

I get that Ingram and Brown can be more of go to players, but they haven't exactly led their teams to much success. Bostons had some stacked teams as well. Ingram played with LeBron. They haven't been playing on crappy teams either.

Again, I don't think they are trading them now, but if Pelicans decide they need a change or Bostons in fighting continues leading to a collapse, I would certainly monitor those situations. Maybe Sixers throw is some extra incentive as well. Doesn't need to be one for one.

[DCasey91]

Spurs has to take Ben for Murray.

After they trade for Ben, they just need a mid first and get them another Murray.

If Milton is in Murray’s place taking 18 shots a game, Milton would be a 20+ppg scorer with good %s, decent defense and assist numbers.

If Seth is taking 18 a game, UnderArmor will sign Seth.
Steph will have to settle for LiNing endorsement with Dwyane Wade.

Who the hell cares about your PG rebounding and making all those inflated assist numbers. If you want that, call the Cavs and ask for Ricky Rubio. Or the Celtics ask for Josh Richardson. If your PG can’t score efficiently and can’t shoot decently, he shouldn’t be valued in today’s NBA.

Look how toxic Westbrook is..

Think about it.. we’re one of the best PnR teams in the league. Best offensive team in the league. And what makes our offense run is because our guys can shoot and our guards are scorers.

Thank God we are done with this BS guard who cant shoot and is not a scorer running our offense gimmick.

..and now you want to go back to those days? Mistakes should make us better by learning from it. You’re a fool if you dont learn from your mistakes.

You don’t rate Murray? I agree Murray is not it for a second option but so isn’t Fox, CJ, Harris for that matter. Our offense is number one and it’s not like Maxey/Harris/Embiid is setting the world on fire on their efficiency. (Thank the sky with have Seth)

Murray/Curry backcourt is ideal imo. They compliment each other super well. Murray covers Curry shortcomings on defense and Curry is our nuke on offense.

Murray is a mini Ben that shoots. If you watch him his jumper is now defined there’s no hitch anymore.

If he can get his midrange game to 45% (hovers around 42+) it’s fine for us.

I’m buying, this teams needs a Holiday to Embiid and the team because:

We still need playmaking
We still perimeter defense

Murray comes with that + rebounding, better FT shooter then Ben could ever dream of and he is a better shooter than Fox basically from 10ft and beyond (both there average distance is 11/12 for respectively). On a bargain contract at this level of play

Fox makes Maxey negligible. Both are slashers with streaky jumpers

Move Harris for Barnes + and we should be good to go.

Something like this

Ben for Murray, White, Vassell
Harris for Barnes, Bagley
Move Korkmaz, Milton for assets/players (Simons!)

Murray
Curry
Green (Can be moved as well if he’s cooked)
Barnes
Embiid

Vassell, Thybulle as the wings
White, Simons, Maxey as the guards
Niang, Drummond as the bigs

This is a rocking list with flexibility in the future. Win win

This is all for nought if Brown is available though. But still that team above is well equipped to battle.

[Lou_23]

People comparing a player in his 6 season with a 21 years old kid in his 9 games as starter this year.lol

Murray is a mediocre player, and the Spurs are a losing team. Good numbers in a terrible team.

It is sad that Simmons and Zion are a bad fit, because I am sure then the Pelicans would do a trade Ingram-Simmons.

But who knows, maybe Griffin is desperate with the Pelicans bad season and have fear to be fired and he wants to make a crazy trade.

[LeonJordanJr24]

Gimmie Kyrie and call it a day

[Negrodamus]

I certainly get the argument about all star appearances, but why do you think coaches have been selecting him and have been passing over Ingram and Brown? Not sure I get it if teams truly think Brown and Ingram are truly a tier above Simmons.

Because he became an allstar in his second year while playing with an incredible cast. Was probably his best all around season. He then followed it up with a slightly worse season once Jimmy and Redick left, but maintained similar stats and made it on reputation. Last year was purely on reputation. All of this is null anyway: what matters is your ability in the playoffs. The Warriors aren't going to Draymond Green to produce some offense when the team goes cold in a playoff game. The Celtics, Pelicans, and Kings will go to their suggested stars for points. That can't be measured in all star games.

So teams gave Simmons a free all star pass due to his reputation whereas Brown and Ingram did not make it because they do not have the reputation. Yet these same teams would have no interest for trading for the player that has a better reputation with them? Not sure I follow.

I get that Ingram and Brown can be more of go to players, but they haven't exactly led their teams to much success. Bostons had some stacked teams as well. Ingram played with LeBron. They haven't been playing on crappy teams either.

Again, I don't think they are trading them now, but if Pelicans decide they need a change or Bostons in fighting continues leading to a collapse, I would certainly monitor those situations. Maybe Sixers throw is some extra incentive as well. Doesn't need to be one for one.

Well when you use a nebulous word like "teams", then it might be hard to get. The players, coaches, media members and fans, people who see "triple double" and get excited, vote for the player. The front office (ie the GM, analytics department, owners, etc) make personnel decisions.

[thenbaman]

Gimmie Kyrie and call it a day

Win win.

[stormi]

Hali + Barnes + 2022 1st (top 3 protected. Becomes unprotected in 2023 if it doesn't convey)

[stormi]

Wait, Brandon Twigram's shooting 45% from 3 on 5+ attempts while also averaging 5 assists per game???



Get him here NEOW

[stormi]

Point Ingram / Maxey
Curry / Thybulle
Green / Korkmaz
Niang / Harris
Embiid / Drummond

Playoff ready.

[DCasey91]

Kings might actually stay fat imo. 5-4 and in the playoff hunt. Holmes is destroying btw lol

I think from memory it’s about 20+ games in before the top 8 sorts itself historically a really high % of the time, the seedings will go up and down and 1-2 teams are fighting for the last couple of positions but every team just about knows where they stand. Add in the play ins it’s not that hard to make it if the FO is aiming for it.

East > West now

Hence when deadline comes there’s more trade activity and being the deadline and all opening up tradeable contracts, the timeline is pretty consistent.

I don’t think Ben is going to be traded not until December.

Wolves are desperate but that don’t have anything of worth to me. No to KAT (unless moved on for Brown) and no to Edwards (1 Cent head on him). KAT, Harris and Embiid is an awful Frankenstein setup again no thanks.

I still reckon it’s going to be a three way deal where all parties get what they want.

Our record is inflated with an easy schedule so far.

Cavs have been highly impressive to me (hardest schedule so far?) long road games and pretty difficult opponents back to back and one after the other and still keeping a positive record.

Wolves, Pels, Spurs, Blazers in that order of desperation.... well what do you know all suitors for Ben . It’s like we called it before it was going to happen.

Now only if we got Simons last year

[Skates]

KAT's twitter 'hacked' when he liked a "FreeKAT" tweet, Olshey under investigation in Portland, the more turmoil on other teams in the Simmons sweepstakes the better, not even getting into Barkley's fairly accurate comment that Zion of the broken foot is fat enough to be his and Shaq's love child.

[stormi]

Holmes is destroying btw lol

What a baller.

Bryan Colangelo and Amir Johnson will pay for their sins of blocking his shine.