The Coaching Thread/SF76 Update: Page 54

LongLiveHinkie · Post #681 » by **LongLiveHinkie** » Mon May 17, 2010 4:01 am

Eskin said he suspects we name Collins coach by the end of the week.

Stiff, please go away. I hope he fails miserably.

Post #682 » by **The Guilty Party** » Mon May 17, 2010 4:05 am

Sixerboy3 wrote:Howard Eskin said tonight on Sports Final that 3 sources have told him that Philly is Doug Collins top choice and that the Sixers top candidate is Collins. Eskin thinks a deal will be done this week.

I'd obviously prefer Stefanski to be canned but I've at least warmed up to the idea of Doug Collins as the coach. The real issue regardless of coach is the roster. I don't care if it's Collins or Brown or Laimbeer on the sidelines, if this team next season is essentially the same as last year + our pick... then we'll continue to suck.

We need a good pick and trades need to happen.

HotSauce77 · Post #683 » by **HotSauce77** » Mon May 17, 2010 4:08 am

He's a good coach. Should have hired him last season instead of Eddie Jordan. Still don't understand what was going through Stefanski's mind when he hired Jordan, who has no defensive ideology and whose offensive philosophy was an atrocious fit with this roster.

Mojo7 · Post #684 » by **Mojo7** » Mon May 17, 2010 4:47 am

Collins is fine. At this stage, I'm not overjoyed, nor am I underwhelmed. You figured Stefanski would go for the safe choice with the Winning record and the local pedigree. If Stefanski was going to gamble, he would've done it last year. Once they kept Stefanski, barring one of the assistants having a fantastic interview, this was the way it was going to be.

I've been thinking of the example of Hubie Brown. Hubie Brown was once such a demanding hard-ass that one of his players hid all the basketballs to force the end of practice. Yet, in his elder days, he did a fantastic job with Memphis. Collins, by all accounts, is a very smart coach, a good teacher with a defensive focus. In many ways, he could be considered the Economy-sized version of LB. So, the likely scenario is that the team will improve a ton under his tutelage and he will eventually move on to retirement, possibly taking an executive spot with the team once he wears out his welcome.

Post #685 » by **Foshan** » Mon May 17, 2010 8:30 am

I agree with an earlier poster that if Collins is the choice, then hire him. He needs to start working on our guys and figuring out this roster, we can't waist any more time.

That said, I'm still not a huge Collins fan. Last year I would have been over EJ. But a Collins hire, imo, means that we think this roster, or this roster with a small trade is ready to compete. I just don't think that is the case. I think we have serious personel issues that to be correctly addressed are going to leave us in a place where we need such significant moves that I doubt the new roster is ready to compete right away.

The only way I like this move, is if we land a great pick, and move some guys (Iggy/Dally/etc) in an attempt to rebuild with Collins teaching the guys the 'right way' to play bball. And I just don't think that happens.

corwin · Post #686 » by **corwin** » Mon May 17, 2010 9:32 am

HotSauce77 wrote:He's a good coach. Should have hired him last season instead of Eddie Jordan. Still don't understand what was going through Stefanski's mind when he hired Jordan, who has no defensive ideology and whose offensive philosophy was an atrocious fit with this roster.

We've never gotten the full answer to that one. IMO other than the money (which is a real issue), I think that the Stiff must have thought that EFJ could make AI2 into a star offensive player like he did for Arenas & to a lesser extent Caron Butler. I wish Tom or one of the other beat writers would ask him that simple question, i.e. what is the main reason that you hired EFJ?

corwin · Post #687 » by **corwin** » Mon May 17, 2010 9:36 am

Foshan wrote:That said, I'm still not a huge Collins fan. Last year I would have been over EJ. But a Collins hire, imo, means that we think this roster, or this roster with a small trade is ready to compete. I just don't think that is the case. I think we have serious personel issues that to be correctly addressed are going to leave us in a place where we need such significant moves that I doubt the new roster is ready to compete right away.

Not disagreeing that you might be right about this. However, how did you draw this conclusion? I've been trying to get a read on Collins' view of the team (as well as the other candidates) & other than Avery Johnson last year saying that AI2 was not a SG, I can't remember having seen much about anyone's opinions.

sixerfan1976 · Post #688 » by **sixerfan1976** » Mon May 17, 2010 11:33 am

i dont think collins is a done deal....but he is the favorite as has been widely reported.

2nd interviews and scheduling them should take most of this week to do. Maybe late week hiring but it could drag into next week.

The brass isnt convinced Avery wants to coach here...which makes Collins and Mitchell the favorites but they will still attempt to 2nd interview Avery.

Still unclear if Dwayne Casey will be brought in for an interview.

I would say 60/40 Collins if I was an odds maker(over Mitchell)

bballin76 · Post #689 » by **bballin76** » Mon May 17, 2010 12:32 pm

Collins is a good pick. You know what he brings to the table and he's going to demand effort from the players. This team isn't ready for a Gregg Poppovich level coach to get them over the hump. They need a coach that will develop them and their identity first. Collins can do that. More importantly, he'll fix the defense. My only concern with Collins is his offensive pace not matching this rosters talent of run and gun.

Post #690 » by **Foshan** » Mon May 17, 2010 12:43 pm

corwin wrote:
Foshan wrote:That said, I'm still not a huge Collins fan. Last year I would have been over EJ. But a Collins hire, imo, means that we think this roster, or this roster with a small trade is ready to compete. I just don't think that is the case. I think we have serious personel issues that to be correctly addressed are going to leave us in a place where we need such significant moves that I doubt the new roster is ready to compete right away.

Not disagreeing that you might be right about this. However, how did you draw this conclusion? I've been trying to get a read on Collins' view of the team (as well as the other candidates) & other than Avery Johnson last year saying that AI2 was not a SG, I can't remember having seen much about anyone's opinions.

eh, sorry no link or any 'source.' Just as i look at the available field, and consider how much they are probably going to have to pay a guy like Collins to come in here and right the ship, it just leads me away from the idea of making major moves and anything to do with rebuilding. It seems like a 'we have the talent just make it work' (maybe with a minor move). I could be/probably am totally wrong. But I remember reading some one say that Iggy was in favor of Collins. Which, if Iggy had anything to do with it, he doesn't get traded, and I think that trading him would be a BIG part of rebuilding/righting the ship.
But I could be totally wrong. We could still blow it all up and hope Collins is a guy that can teach young guys the game correctly. *shrug*

Gsraider · Post #691 » by **Gsraider** » Mon May 17, 2010 12:56 pm

Foshan wrote:a Collins hire, imo, means that we think this roster, or this roster with a small trade is ready to compete. I just don't think that is the case. I think we have serious personel issues that to be correctly addressed are going to leave us in a place where we need such significant moves that I doubt the new roster is ready to compete right away.

I understand your point, but I'm not sure I think this is entirely true. I have never been a proponent of fire-saling players. Right now, I think Philly has several needs that have to be addressed, but they also have a few assets on their roster that are at an all time low right now in terms of value. Jordan was so bad last year that several of these guys look far worse than they actually are and if you traded them now, you would get pennies on the dollar. Even a mediocre coach with solid systems in place should see a reasonable turnaround with more or less the same group of guys, assuming their confidence is not shaken after last year. If that happens, perhaps the plan is not to see if this same group can compete for anything substantial, but to try and trade some of the players at that point and not now. Many of these same guys looked far more intriguing to other squads when Philly was around a .500 club. I'm guessing that would be the case again.

bebopdeluxe · Post #692 » by **bebopdeluxe** » Mon May 17, 2010 1:12 pm

corwin wrote:
Foshan wrote:That said, I'm still not a huge Collins fan. Last year I would have been over EJ. But a Collins hire, imo, means that we think this roster, or this roster with a small trade is ready to compete. I just don't think that is the case. I think we have serious personel issues that to be correctly addressed are going to leave us in a place where we need such significant moves that I doubt the new roster is ready to compete right away.

Not disagreeing that you might be right about this. However, how did you draw this conclusion? I've been trying to get a read on Collins' view of the team (as well as the other candidates) & other than Avery Johnson last year saying that AI2 was not a SG, I can't remember having seen much about anyone's opinions.

+1, corwin. I don't think that ANYBODY is saying this team is ready to compete for ANYTHING. However, it is time to start answering questions...Iggy/Thad at the 2/3? Can Speights' defense be improved enough so that he can play 30+ minutes without being a defensive sieve? Can the remainder of EB's contract be salvaged at all?

After the joke of a year that EFJ was, I am ready to have a grown-up coach this team. Bring in ESnow as coach-in-training...and pray to the ping-pong-ball gods tomorrow ight.

sixerfan1976 · Post #693 » by **sixerfan1976** » Mon May 17, 2010 2:22 pm

Doug Collins did say in his interview that changes to the personnel should be made because there are some pieces that arent great fits here. If we hire him...maybe Stefanski is basically agreeing and gonna be active this offseason?

Gsraider · Post #694 » by **Gsraider** » Mon May 17, 2010 3:20 pm

sixerfan1976 wrote:Doug Collins did say in his interview that changes to the personnel should be made because there are some pieces that arent great fits here. If we hire him...maybe Stefanski is basically agreeing and gonna be active this offseason?

Or maybe (and perhaps hopefully), they agree that changes need to be made when the opportunity presents itself, not just to make them this off-season to seem like they are actively trying to right the ship. Rebuild their values and then trade them. It's not as though they can get any lower, can they?

Gsraider · Post #695 » by **Gsraider** » Mon May 17, 2010 3:21 pm

sixerfan1976 wrote:Doug Collins did say in his interview that changes to the personnel should be made because there are some pieces that arent great fits here. If we hire him...maybe Stefanski is basically agreeing and gonna be active this offseason?

Or maybe (and perhaps hopefully), they agree that changes need to be made when the opportunity presents itself, not just to make them this off-season to seem like they are actively trying to right the ship. Rebuild their values and then trade them. It's not as though they can get any lower, can they?

Post #696 » by **The Guilty Party** » Mon May 17, 2010 3:23 pm

sixerfan1976 wrote:Doug Collins did say in his interview that changes to the personnel should be made because there are some pieces that arent great fits here. If we hire him...maybe Stefanski is basically agreeing and gonna be active this offseason?

This is one of the reasons why I actually like the idea of hiring Collins. I think he has a strong belief on how to win and given his strong analysis for TNT, I would be shocked if he came in here and thought he could just take this team as it exists and make it a contender for anything other than the 8th seed each year.

BringBackKorver · Post #697 » by **BringBackKorver** » Mon May 17, 2010 4:01 pm

The Guilty Party wrote:
sixerfan1976 wrote:Doug Collins did say in his interview that changes to the personnel should be made because there are some pieces that arent great fits here. If we hire him...maybe Stefanski is basically agreeing and gonna be active this offseason?

This is one of the reasons why I actually like the idea of hiring Collins. I think he has a strong belief on how to win and given his strong analysis for TNT, I would be shocked if he came in here and thought he could just take this team as it exists and make it a contender for anything other than the 8th seed each year.

Agreed. I love how when Collins announces the games he breaks down the offense and defense and calls out plays the coaches are using / should be running. He doesn't just yell "Hand down, man down!" every time Kobe makes a jumper.

Although Collins' history doesn't match the style this team fits (slow vs fast), I'm glad that he is bold enough to say "I'm not going to work with what we have, I want to bring in my guys that will fit the core pieces as well as my core philosophy." It's something I've never understood about NBA vs NFL. I know the NBA is a player driven league, but I'd love to see more coaches come in and say what Collins did.

I've always been a big Avery Johnson fan, but I'd really like to see Collins come in and toughen up this team.

93 Phillies · Post #698 » by **93 Phillies** » Mon May 17, 2010 7:06 pm

On the one hand, I really wanted to see a first time coach with the Sixers this year after the failed attempts with recycling other team's failures. Given, the only guy I wouldn't be okay with out of these three is Mitchell.

Mojo7 · Post #699 » by **Mojo7** » Mon May 17, 2010 7:21 pm

BringBackKorver wrote:
The Guilty Party wrote:
sixerfan1976 wrote:Doug Collins did say in his interview that changes to the personnel should be made because there are some pieces that arent great fits here. If we hire him...maybe Stefanski is basically agreeing and gonna be active this offseason?

This is one of the reasons why I actually like the idea of hiring Collins. I think he has a strong belief on how to win and given his strong analysis for TNT, I would be shocked if he came in here and thought he could just take this team as it exists and make it a contender for anything other than the 8th seed each year.

Agreed. I love how when Collins announces the games he breaks down the offense and defense and calls out plays the coaches are using / should be running. He doesn't just yell "Hand down, man down!" every time Kobe makes a jumper.

Although Collins' history doesn't match the style this team fits (slow vs fast), I'm glad that he is bold enough to say "I'm not going to work with what we have, I want to bring in my guys that will fit the core pieces as well as my core philosophy." It's something I've never understood about NBA vs NFL. I know the NBA is a player driven league, but I'd love to see more coaches come in and say what Collins did.

I've always been a big Avery Johnson fan, but I'd really like to see Collins come in and toughen up this team.

I'm not as concerned about the Pace factor as some of you, I guess. If the team has an emphasis on grinding defense that looks to push off stops, then the pace won't be as "frenetic" as Phoenix or GS, but that would suit the personnel just fine. We are not necessarily a quick-shooting team, but we should be a fastbreaking team. I don't think Collins, as smart as he is, will look to stop the running game and control every possession. Especially since this team(pre-Lottery) lacks a great breakdown guy who might be able to consistently create a good look at the end of the shot clock(a la Jordan or Grant Hill or Jordan in his previous stops). Of course, if they land Turner, that last statement flies out the window.

Mojo7 · Post #700 » by **Mojo7** » Mon May 17, 2010 7:26 pm

The Guilty Party wrote:
sixerfan1976 wrote:Doug Collins did say in his interview that changes to the personnel should be made because there are some pieces that arent great fits here. If we hire him...maybe Stefanski is basically agreeing and gonna be active this offseason?

This is one of the reasons why I actually like the idea of hiring Collins. I think he has a strong belief on how to win and given his strong analysis for TNT, I would be shocked if he came in here and thought he could just take this team as it exists and make it a contender for anything other than the 8th seed each year.

Does anybody think there is a possibility that if Collins comes here eventually he ends up retiring from the sideline and taking Stefanski's job? Somehow, I could see Ed Snider pulling that, especially if McKie/Snow is here as a designated successor