New GM search [SPOILER: It's Elton Brand]

76ciology · Post #741 » by **76ciology** » Fri Sep 28, 2018 12:46 pm

Just finished listening to EB’s interview with Lowe. He sounds more like a player than a GM, this could be a good trait if you want to lure FAs. Lowe also made a good point that Brand is the type of GM who doesnt care about job security because he’s richer than most GMs so you can expect him not to play safe.

Post #742 » by **BullyKing** » Mon Oct 15, 2018 5:37 pm

Man, this hurts

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/251418/Daryl-Morey-Had-Serious-Talks-With-76ers-On-GM-Job

Eyeamok · Post #743 » by **Eyeamok** » Mon Oct 15, 2018 6:38 pm

BullyKing wrote:Man, this hurts

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/251418/Daryl-Morey-Had-Serious-Talks-With-76ers-On-GM-Job

If you screwed over the top student. What hopes did you really have of signing the teacher?

Sixersftw · Post #744 » by **Sixersftw** » Mon Oct 15, 2018 7:09 pm

I choose to believe that isn't true. God that puts a pit in my stomach.

cool93 · Post #745 » by **cool93** » Mon Oct 15, 2018 7:31 pm

Now I am depressed

Lou_23 · Post #746 » by **Lou_23** » Mon Oct 15, 2018 7:42 pm

The source is Harris. He also said that Lebron "considered us very strongly" :lol:

Kobblehead · Post #747 » by **Kobblehead** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 2:05 pm

jbent87 wrote:this is horrifying to read. But it can't be forgotten. One of the most forward thinking GMs in todays day and age with the longest view in the room got burned at the stake because the entire league knew the direction he was heading in, and there wasn't enough support in his own building to hold off the hounds and support him. This is unfortunately what this team (ownership group) deserves after showing 0 back bone in supporting their guy.

Hinkie had 5 lotto picks. 3 of them were busts and the 2 that he wound up hitting on never suited up for the team while he was GM. He had nothing concrete to present to his bosses that could have offset the pressure they were dealing with from the league. Hinkie needed something to materialize on the court to save his job.

jbent87 · Post #748 » by **jbent87** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 3:22 pm

Kobblehead wrote:
jbent87 wrote:this is horrifying to read. But it can't be forgotten. One of the most forward thinking GMs in todays day and age with the longest view in the room got burned at the stake because the entire league knew the direction he was heading in, and there wasn't enough support in his own building to hold off the hounds and support him. This is unfortunately what this team (ownership group) deserves after showing 0 back bone in supporting their guy.

Hinkie had 5 lotto picks. 3 of them were busts and the 2 that he wound up hitting on never suited up for the team while he was GM. He had nothing concrete to present to his bosses that could have offset the pressure they were dealing with from the league. Hinkie needed something to materialize on the court to save his job.

Hinkie is a GM trying to set his bosses up to make money longterm. He isn't God. He can't magically heal Embiid and force him out there. He was months away from seeing that happen. His bosses couldn't wait. It is what it is.

Kobblehead · Post #749 » by **Kobblehead** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 4:40 pm

jbent87 wrote:Hinkie is a GM trying to set his bosses up to make money longterm. He isn't God. He can't magically heal Embiid and force him out there. He was months away from seeing that happen. His bosses couldn't wait. It is what it is.

Faith in Embiid and Saric when they finally got on the court isn't enough to offset the pressure. 2013 was a complete whiff and 2015 was looking like a colossal mistake. Hell, even Stauskas was looking like another lotto bust that he traded for.

All ownership had to go on was Robert Covington and a fringe roster player like T.J. McConnell. It's just too much being asked and not enough justification being proven. Hinkie needed to have shown to be a better GM. All he had shown up to that point that he was a shrewd wheeler and dealer that could acquire a lot of assets. And his track record of making selections with the assets he did have was very poor.

Post #750 » by **Sixerscan** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 4:54 pm

Kobblehead wrote:
jbent87 wrote:Hinkie is a GM trying to set his bosses up to make money longterm. He isn't God. He can't magically heal Embiid and force him out there. He was months away from seeing that happen. His bosses couldn't wait. It is what it is.

Faith in Embiid and Saric when they finally got on the court isn't enough to offset the pressure. 2013 was a complete whiff and 2015 was looking like a colossal mistake. Hell, even Stauskas was looking like another lotto bust that he traded for.

All ownership had to go on was Robert Covington and a fringe roster player like T.J. McConnell. It's just too much being asked and not enough justification being proven. Hinkie needed to have shown to be a better GM. All he had shown up to that point that he was a shrewd wheeler and dealer that could acquire a lot of assets. And his track record of making selections with the assets he did have was very poor.

Noel and Okafor weren't considered busts at that point, people were just annoyed he kept drafting centers/didn't signs veteran point guard.

His lack of home runs at that point certainly hurt his leverage, but I think it's pretty clear there was more going on here (namely, that the league got pissed about tanking so they foisted jerry Colangelo on the team who wanted to get his kid another basketball team to run).

I think the owners also massively overestimated how unpopular he was in the city. Probably in part because most of them are not local.

Kobblehead · Post #751 » by **Kobblehead** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 5:05 pm

Ownership probably knew they were busts at that point. They had a direct line of communication with Brett Brown. I'm sure Brett was complaining to all hell about Hinkie's lack of personality vetting with some of the prospects being brought onto the team.

jbent87 · Post #752 » by **jbent87** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 5:08 pm

Kobblehead wrote:Ownership probably knew they were busts at that point. They had a direct line of communication with Brett Brown. I'm sure Brett was complaining to all hell about Hinkie's lack of personality vetting with some of the prospects being brought onto the team.

I'm sure Brett is complaining just as much now about Markelle Fultz busting and getting his ass handed to him by the Celtics and having no clear way of getting around them in the near future.

Kobblehead · Post #753 » by **Kobblehead** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 5:10 pm

jbent87 wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:Ownership probably knew they were busts at that point. They had a direct line of communication with Brett Brown. I'm sure Brett was complaining to all hell about Hinkie's lack of personality vetting with some of the prospects being brought onto the team.

I'm sure Brett is complaining just as much now about Markelle Fultz busting and getting his ass handed to him by the Celtics and having no clear way of getting around them in the near future.

Absolutely agreed. Fultz wasn't vetted before we traded up. Colangelo blindly traded up to #1 without even speaking with or working out Fultz.

Post #754 » by **Sixerscan** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 5:10 pm

Kobblehead wrote:Ownership probably knew they were busts at that point. They had a direct line of communication with Brett Brown. I'm sure Brett was complaining to all hell about Hinkie's lack of personality vetting with some of the prospects being brought onto the team.

Wasn't there a report that ownership stopped Okafor from being traded at the deadline? I think you are projecting here. People generally thought those guys were good prospects, just that they couldn't play together.

Kobblehead · Post #755 » by **Kobblehead** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 5:16 pm

Maybe, reports can be truthful or used to control a narrative. Who knows.

It would have been better if Hinkie just drafted good players instead of taking bad ones and relying on pumping their shallow counting stats and hoping to flip them to a sucker, down the line.

Kobblehead · Post #756 » by **Kobblehead** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 5:21 pm

People think ownership forced Okafor on Hinkie. I ain't buying it. I think Hinkie saw Embiid suffer another setback and wanted to select Jah to put up gaudy stats while filling in for him so he could flip him like he just did with Carter-Williams. That's the problem. He was day trading and not building something concrete he could present to his investors.

Post #757 » by **BullyKing** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 5:33 pm

Kobblehead wrote:People think ownership forced Okafor on Hinkie. I ain't buying it. I think Hinkie saw Embiid suffer another setback and wanted to select Jah to put up gaudy stats while filling in for him so he could flip him like he just did with Carter-Williams. That's the problem. He was day trading and not building something concrete he could present to his investors.

I think there's validity to the day trading analogy. But I do think Hinkie felt some pressure to not take Porzingis because of the reports he did not want to come here and inciting another he's never coming over Dario type coverage. But yes, Hinkie deserves blame for the Okafor pick without question.

Post #758 » by **Sixerscan** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 5:37 pm

Kobblehead wrote:People think ownership forced Okafor on Hinkie. I ain't buying it. I think Hinkie saw Embiid suffer another setback and wanted to select Jah to put up gaudy stats while filling in for him so he could flip him like he just did with Carter-Williams. That's the problem. He was day trading and not building something concrete he could present to his investors.

I think he thought he had more than 3 seasons to build something. Which he probably would have had the league not stepped in.

TTP · Post #759 » by **TTP** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 5:37 pm

Kobblehead wrote:
jbent87 wrote:Hinkie is a GM trying to set his bosses up to make money longterm. He isn't God. He can't magically heal Embiid and force him out there. He was months away from seeing that happen. His bosses couldn't wait. It is what it is.

Faith in Embiid and Saric when they finally got on the court isn't enough to offset the pressure. 2013 was a complete whiff and 2015 was looking like a colossal mistake. Hell, even Stauskas was looking like another lotto bust that he traded for.

All ownership had to go on was Robert Covington and a fringe roster player like T.J. McConnell. It's just too much being asked and not enough justification being proven. Hinkie needed to have shown to be a better GM. All he had shown up to that point that he was a shrewd wheeler and dealer that could acquire a lot of assets. And his track record of making selections with the assets he did have was very poor.

The bolded isn't true at all and is extremely revisionist. In April, 2016, these were how his picks looked (excluding the super late 2nds for obvious reasons):

Noel - definitely not considered a bust then - a team would offer him 4-70 a year later
MCW - looked brutal by this time despite the ROTY but Hinkie managed to move him at peak value
Embiid - near the end of his second year injured
Saric - expected to come over during the summer
KJ McDaniels - mediocre prospect, was finishing his first season of a 3-10 with the Rockets
Jerami Grant - mediocre prospect
Okafor - would be announced as All Rookie 1st team in a few months despite terrible advanced stats, wasn't considered a bust yet
Holmes - mediocre prospect that had a promising rookie season

At the time Hinkie resigned, Noel looked like a good pick and Okafor was still well-regarded. All of those second rounders were likely viewed as exceeding pick expectation. Saric was still on the same timeline as expected from when he was drafted. He ended up getting positive value from the MCW draft pick. The major issue with his draft record at that time was the Embiid pick - whether he'd ever play.

Kobblehead · Post #760 » by **Kobblehead** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 5:46 pm

He just needed SOMETHING to be in place. Even Ryan McDonough (a bad GM) had more to show to his investors. He had Devin Booker and T.J. Warren in place. You can continue to pitch your vision when you have something concrete to show. Hinkie had terrible players putting up empty counting stats and underperforming prospects that were looking like busts.

Who should be hired as the next GM?