The Sixerfan1976 Off-Season Thread (Update: Page 61)

[ExplosionsInDaSky]

I would explode with rage if we traded Thaddeus Young for Verajao.

[Arsenal]

Varejao is the quintessential example of a mediocre role player who looks better than he is when he plays on a good team. No one will want this guy after they see him play next year on a horrible team.

[Skates]

I hate Varejao too on the Cavs. much like I hated Lenny Dykstra on the Mets, but I would trade an over rated role player like Young for him in a blink. Offensively Varejao is a garbage point/hustle player, but defensively and on the boards he is very good and under rated by most here, and if the flopping works, more power to him. Does he get pushed around by the likes of Dwight Howard, sure, but so do 99% of the players in the league. The injury concerns are an issue, but defensively he would be great on a Collins coached team and he is a cost-certain role player.

What does Hollinger say about Varejao and his often panned contract?

Scouting report: Varejao's flopping gets everyone talking, but the rest of his defense is the real story. He's an elite defender who deserved All-Defense honors, as he can guard 4s on the perimeter or defend the post with equal effectiveness. He defends pick-and-rolls, he gets back quickly in transition, and he hustles like crazy to get loose balls. He's not a leaper, but at 6-foot-11 and 260 pounds he possesses unusual mobility for a player of his size.

Offensively, Varejao can handle the ball fairly well for his size but is a poor shooter, with a line-drive, below-the-chin, elbow-out release that will never appear in a textbook. He runs the floor well and scraps his way to a lot of second shots, plus he's great at moving without the ball, particularly as the roll man in screen-and-rolls. For him to score on his own is quite difficult, however, and opponents routinely dare him to fire away from the perimeter. Too often, he takes the bait.

2009-10 outlook: Varejao signed a six-year, $50 million deal to stay in Cleveland that drew howls of laughter until the fine print came out. Much of it is incentive-based and the last year isn't guaranteed, making the Cavs' obligation more on the order of five years, $38.5 million, with a $4 million golden parachute to make him go away if he's washed up by Year 6. That's expensive for a role player, but it's not outrageous given Varejao's immense defensive contributions. More importantly, it makes sense considering he was as an unrestricted free agent, making it likely a team such as Portland or Oklahoma City would have pounced if the Cavs hadn't made a strong offer.

He'll be Cleveland's starting power forward, but he'll likely see generous dollops of time at center too as the Cavs look to carefully manage the load on Shaquille O'Neal and Zydrunas Ilgauskas. Look for Varejao to average about 30 minutes a game but don't expect much in the way of individual numbers. A better bet, however, is that he'll finally get recognition for his defensive exploits and make the All-Defense team, provided he doesn't take too many dives that go unrewarded by the zebras.

[ExplosionsInDaSky]

I think we can sign Lou Amundsun and he would have the same impact as an Anderson Verajao for us.

[KrazySixersD]

why is turners deal so short? and is the 3rd year a team option im assuming? still dont understand why its so short

[phiphan]

I actually think that Varejao would be a good fit at C for us, but his contract runs a year too long for my tastes -- if he expired in 2012/2013, I'd probably bite.

[Gsraider]

I understand his value in certain respects, but I cannot stand watching Varaejo play, nor do I think this this team is close enough that it makes sense to bring on his contract. He seems like the type of player that would help a contending team as the backup PF/C, provide instant energy, and be a nice situational player to have out there from time to time. For a team like Philly that is currently miles away and unwilling to spend, this isn't the guy I want to use it on, let alone trade away a guy who I think is currently undervalued for.

[Slacktard]

why is turners deal so short? and is the 3rd year a team option im assuming? still dont understand why its so short

It's the standard 1st round pick contract.

1st year: Guaranteed
2nd year: Guaranteed
3rd year: Team Option
4th year: Team Option
5th year: Restricted Free Agent with Qualifying Offer.

[Skates]

why is turners deal so short? and is the 3rd year a team option im assuming? still dont understand why its so short

It looks like a standard rookie contract under the current CBA. It is essentially a four year deal if we keep making the qualifying offers, etc that are required. There isn't a whole lot of wiggle room in the contracts of first rounders under the current CBA.

[radrmd216]

I wouldn't trade for Varejao.

ChuckS, how do you think the Sixers can compete for a title?

I think Kobe was an outlier, the Gasol trade was crazy, and good vets will sign in LA.

A team like Portland had the lottery pick(s) to trade for Roy.

I like the way the Blazers and Thunder built their teams. I'm not going to overate their respective GM's like it seems many people do, but I still think they have done good so far.

[KrazySixersD]

o i didnt realize we had a 4th year with an option as well, and a 5th year where we can match.. that sounds better

[ChuckS]

A team like Portland had the lottery pick(s) to trade for Roy

Really?

http://www.nba.com/blazers/news/Trail_B ... -1177.html

How we got Brandon Roy:
Trade #1:
Portland Trail Blazers trade Sebastian Telfair, Theo Ratliff, 2008 2nd round pick to the Boston Celtics
for Randy Foye (the 7th pick in the 2006 draft), PG (and former Trail Blazer) Dan Dickau, and Center Raef LaFrentz.

Trade: #2
Portland Trail Blazers trade Randy Foye (acquired through Celtics trade) to Minnesota Timberwolves for University of Washington guard Brandon Roy.

Portland gains: Brandon Roy, Dan Dickau, Raef LaFrentz
Portland trades away: Sebastian Telfair, Theo Ratliff, 2008 2nd Round Pick.

I think Kobe was an outlier, the Gasol trade was crazy, and good vets will sign in LA.

Whatever! There are enough good vets, however, who will sign anywhere for money and playing time. Certainly LA, Miami, and New York have advantages, but they cannot get them all. But I thought you did not want any good vets to louse up a team of teenyboppers.

PS I take Varejao. We have too many threes, and I still prefer Nocioni off of the bench backing up Andre. I also like Carney as a low cost emergency reserve.

[radrmd216]

Yes, the Blazers traded a lottery pick for Roy.

ChuckS, you a few other people want to just add pieces and hope the Sixers become a title contending team, while they realistically top out as a 55 win team at the most.

Also, why would I want to add a vet player to a team that isn't competing and needs to play their young guys. I want to follow the Blazer thunder mold. From your comments I assume you don't assuem those are the types of teams the Sixers should emulate.

I'm saying one really bad year. That is all. The team can have a bad year and still build for the playoffs. I think impatience and not wanting to take a step back will limit options and prevent the team from contending for a title.

[Guerilla713]

Where is this coming from that Ariza controls the ball less than Andre does? Last year (AKA the only year he averaged over 9 points a game) him and Iguodala had almost identical usage rates and shots per game.

Moreover, for their careers

Ariza averages 11.1 shots per 36 minutes
Iguodala averages 11.2 shots per 36 minutes

In fact, I would argue Ariza is even more of a chucker than Iguodala because he doesn't have anywhere near the handles Andre does to create looks for himself and teammates.

Hill and Ariza is not enough. Hill's value derives from the Knicks thinking he was worth the 8th overall pick last year. Otherwise he's just like every other big man that doesn't get it. We need Hayes or picks.

Exactly. Somehow, because Ariza provides nothing that Iguodala doesn't provide but much less, he's a better fit here? And because of that we're supposed to trade Iguodala for him with only a semi-good prospect like Hill? It's ridiculous...

No, it's because Ariza handled the ball a lot before Kevin Martin was in Houston. Once Martin came, his shots per game went down by about two, yet his points remained the same (so, he shot at a higher percentage). The guy almost got a triple-double during many games, and on the last game of the season, finally got it. I hope the trade rumor is true: Ariza + Jeffries + Hill for Iguodala + Smith. I doubt the Knicks picks would be involved. The 2011 NY pick is top 1 protected and the 2012 NY pick is top 5 protected. If we were to give up one of those, I'd say we keep Hill, or the Sixers give us a young player.

[ExplosionsInDaSky]

I would do the trade if Jordan Hill is involved. We need size in the frontcourt and i'm not ready to label Jordan Hill a bust. I don't think he's David Robinson or anything of that nature but I do think he can be a better version of Ronny Turiaf. Much like Turiaf, Hill wont have to have plays run for him but he will score a lot on putbacks and just being active out there.
I don't consider the trade horrible like some of you because I don't overrate Iguodala. Yes he is a great defender but so is Trevor Ariza. If we are getting Ariza and a defensive minded/rebounding big who has the potential to be pretty good I don't see where the trade is lopsided or bad at all.
I would trade any player on this team not named Holiday or Turner for the right kind of deal.
In conclusion I don't see the trade happening but I wouldn't lose sleep over it if it did happen. Ariza is still an improving player, and I think his shooting will be even better next year.

[radrmd216]

To anybody that likes the rumored Sixers-Rockets trade, would you include Speights for the Knicks 2011 pick?

[Skates]

I'd say the Rockets are pretty ready to label Hill a bust given that they drafted a PF and re-signed Scola to a big deal, paying a lot of money for a guy who is heading towrds his decline years. I either want draft picks or Patterson, not Hill.

[Numb3rs]

I think the key to an Ariza trade is how many minutes he plays. He can be an effective as role player in 25MPG which would also free up minute in the rotation for Thad and Nocioni. I think you'd have to strongly consider Iggy and Smith or Speights for Ariza, Jeffries, Hill and the pick.

[BringBackKorver]

Iguodala, Green
for
Ariza, Hill, Jeffries, 2010 Houston pick, one of their 2011 picks

That's the best I'd do. Otherwise we're just trading for the sake of trading. Ariza isn't better at anything than Iguodala, Hill doesn't fit with the team, and their picks aren't worth much anyway.

Still think we'd be better off trying a deal with the Bulls if we really wanted to move Iguodala.

Iguodala, Green, 2nd
for
Deng, Gibson, Charlotte first, Chicago first

It's just hard to justify a trade where we dilute our biggest asset when that is the complete opposite of what we need. We have a good bench and a team filled with role players. What we need is another starter on Iguodala's level who is a good fit with the rest of the team. I think the Hawes / Brand pairing will work wonders for this team though, and I'm really not in a hurry to see any more trades when we had such a solid off-season.

If you had asked everyone here what their biggest wishes for this team in the off-season were before the lotto, they would have been:

Pull out all the stops to get Turner to be our franchise player
Dump Dalembert
Get out of the tax
Get a young center to develop / be the future.

Got Turner, traded Sammy, got out of the tax, brought in Hawes. That's a mighty successful off-season in my mind, but I think a lot of people are knee-jerking when it comes to seeing Turner not have a productive summer league, and they're scared he won't be the "franchise player" everyone here tagged him to be.

I still wish we had traded back, but Turner should be very solid, and like it or not this team's going to be in the playoffs this year barring some catastrophic injury.

[Numb3rs]

Really not sure about the Chicago trade. Deng is injury prone and misses too many games and I didn't realise this but Gibson 25 years old about to come into his second season. Chicago's first rounder probably won't be worth much either.