Where is Nerlens?

[tk76]

I agree. I just refuse to follow the herd that he set out to have the worst record. I was advised many years ago to put together time lines before attempting to make judgments about intent.

Here's the timeline:

June 14. Embiid's doctors determined that his foot hadn't healed completely, thus wouldn't be available for the summer league, and reasonable people would have to be concerned if he'd ever step on the court at all.

June 25. Hinkie drafted Okafor, the second-best rated big man in the draft. Had we won the lottery, he would have surely drafted Anthony-Towns.

Late June/early July. He didn't come to terms with Ish Smith, leaving a void at point guard.

July 18. He re-signed Pierre Jackson.

Sept. 9, He signed Kendall Marshall, still rehabbing from his ACL injury. That was his biggest mistake. Marshall wouldn't play until the second week of December.

Late October/early November. Covington went down. Didn't return until Nov. 14. We lost our best shooter. Hinkie couldn't have planned for that.

So I just to buy the argument that he went into the season with the intention of having the worst record. I think he got too wrapped up in trying to accumulate assets (the Jason Thompson trade was stupid) while underestimating the importance of a veteran to run the offense. He clearly misfired with Canaan and Wroten, thinking there was any way possible either could run the offense, Wroten's injury notwithstanding.

Then things spiraled out of control including Okafor's run-ins with the law.

You left out Hinkie's main mistake. Midway through training camp it was clear the team has no viable options at PG for a while to come. Brett Brown spoke of needing a"bunker mentality" as the team was clearly not equipped to compete.

Then Ish was cut by Washington at the end of camp... and the Sixers chose not to claim him off waivers. Ish was available to the Sixers on a 1 year minimum contract the week before the season started.

Hinkie could have preserved his job right there. It would have been a simple, no brainer correction of the mistake of counting on Marshall, Butler and Pierre Jackson. To this day, I don't know why Hinkie didn't claim Ish off waivers. But that was the reason they stayed so epically bad... costing Hinkie his job.

[hookshot199]

I agree that he didn't intend to be that bad, and it was a misjudgment of the ability of our point guards.

Btw, you reminded me when you mentioned Canaan. A lot of people didn't like the KJ McDaniels trade when it seemed like Canaan was the main target. Now that Holmes has started coming on though, who would trade Holmes for McDaniels? Another Hinkie won trade...

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The KJ deal is one of the unfairest attacks against Hinkie. KJ's agent refused a 'Hinkie special'. I believe Glen Robinson Jr. was the only other second-round pick to refuse to sign. Everyone else signed including Jerami Grant. So KJ went from 25 mpg to around 6 mpg last season. He got $6 mil guaranteed on a three-year/$10 mil contract, but probably screwed himself out of a $30-$40 mil for his second contract. Unless he gets 20-25 mpg this year, his value has fallen.

Tbc the "hinkie special" is a 4 year with little to no guaranteed money like Hollis and TJ got.

KJ was offered more guaranteed money than any 2nd round pick in history. Now granted I assume part of this was that Sam stil wanted him to sign for 4 years, but kj got a lot more than the "hinkie special" offered to him.

I'm not disputing you. In fact, over a three-year period, KJ will make as much money as Elfrid Peyton, the 10th pick in the draft. So short term his agent represented him well. Long term, I can't see him getting as big a payday as Jeremy Grant, for instance. It has to do with playing time. He averaged only 6 mpg last season. Of course injury contributed to that. But if he doesn't get into the rotation his value won't go up, I don't think.

[hookshot199]

I agree. I just refuse to follow the herd that he set out to have the worst record. I was advised many years ago to put together time lines before attempting to make judgments about intent.

Here's the timeline:

June 14. Embiid's doctors determined that his foot hadn't healed completely, thus wouldn't be available for the summer league, and reasonable people would have to be concerned if he'd ever step on the court at all.

June 25. Hinkie drafted Okafor, the second-best rated big man in the draft. Had we won the lottery, he would have surely drafted Anthony-Towns.

Late June/early July. He didn't come to terms with Ish Smith, leaving a void at point guard.

July 18. He re-signed Pierre Jackson.

Sept. 9, He signed Kendall Marshall, still rehabbing from his ACL injury. That was his biggest mistake. Marshall wouldn't play until the second week of December.

Late October/early November. Covington went down. Didn't return until Nov. 14. We lost our best shooter. Hinkie couldn't have planned for that.

So I just to buy the argument that he went into the season with the intention of having the worst record. I think he got too wrapped up in trying to accumulate assets (the Jason Thompson trade was stupid) while underestimating the importance of a veteran to run the offense. He clearly misfired with Canaan and Wroten, thinking there was any way possible either could run the offense, Wroten's injury notwithstanding.

Then things spiraled out of control including Okafor's run-ins with the law.

You left out Hinkie's main mistake. Midway through training camp it was clear the team has no viable options at PG for a while to come. Brett Brown spoke of needing a"bunker mentality" as the team was clearly not equipped to compete.

Then Ish was cut by Washington at the end of camp... and the Sixers chose not to claim him off waivers. Ish was available to the Sixers on a 1 year minimum contract the week before the season started.

Hinkie could have preserved his job right there. It would have been a simple, no brainer correction of the mistake of counting on Marshall, Butler and Pierre Jackson. To this day, I don't know why Hinkie didn't claim Ish off waivers. But that was the reason they stayed so epically bad... costing Hinkie his job.

I agree. I had forgotten that Ish was available for several months. I believe that the point guard position was Hinkie's blind spot. He just didn't understand it. Remember, he did the same thing the year before, began the season with Carter-Williams injured, then used rental players off and on until Ish came along.

And the Jason Thompson trade - from the standpoint of a veteran on the roster - also made no sense. He got a net $5 or $10 million savings over two years and some sort of a pick swap possibility.

[Att]

Don't know where to put it but how about K.Oubre for Noel?
Maybe + a first.

[MatthewGeigerII]

Don't know where to put it but how about K.Oubre for Noel?

better chance at porter because of the contracts of both.

[NJ SixerFan]

Hopefully packing.

[Att]

Don't know where to put it but how about K.Oubre for Noel?

better chance at porter because of the contracts of both.

Porter is meh. I think Oubre is the better talent.

[phiphan]

I know it's been said before, but wasn't Colangelo supposed to be the master at player/agent management? It seems very unlikely that Noel is being held out in agreement with the GM, pending a potential trade, given that the Sixers don't seem to be providing any information regarding Noel and have already said Noel self-reported the injury. He's not with the team and we get no updates on him really... When will the lid be blown off this situation?

[rzzzzz]

and the Sixers chose not to claim him off waivers. Ish was available to the Sixers on a 1 year minimum contract the week before the season started.

i really hated having to give up those two 2nd round picks when we should have kept Ish all along. as it turns out, GSW drafted the pg prospect who we would probably be featuring right now, in the middle of the 2nd.

[Ericb5]

I know it's been said before, but wasn't Colangelo supposed to be the master at player/agent management? It seems very unlikely that Noel is being held out in agreement with the GM, pending a potential trade, given that the Sixers don't seem to be providing any information regarding Noel and have already said Noel self-reported the injury. He's not with the team and we get no updates on him really... When will the lid be blown off this situation?

Something is definitely going on here. The fact that he wasn't even mentioned in the injury report for last night's game is very telling to me.

In the second night of back to back games, when Embiid won't be in the lineup, Noel will get lots of minutes. That will be his golden opportunity to show his worth. I think Dec 15th is the date where new free agents that were signed in the summer can be traded. That might be a time when a deal might get done.

[Sixerscan]

I know it's been said before, but wasn't Colangelo supposed to be the master at player/agent management? It seems very unlikely that Noel is being held out in agreement with the GM, pending a potential trade, given that the Sixers don't seem to be providing any information regarding Noel and have already said Noel self-reported the injury. He's not with the team and we get no updates on him really... When will the lid be blown off this situation?

Something is definitely going on here. The fact that he wasn't even mentioned in the injury report for last night's game is very telling to me.

In the second night of back to back games, when Embiid won't be in the lineup, Noel will get lots of minutes. That will be his golden opportunity to show his worth. I think Dec 15th is the date where new free agents that were signed in the summer can be traded. That might be a time when a deal might get done.

he probably wasn't mentioned in the tweet (which isn't really an "injury report") because he didn't travel with the team. Same reason Bayless and Simmons probably weren't mentioned. It was a "shootaround update." Obviously if people aren't in DC they aren't playing in the game.

Of course you can draw your own conclusions as to if he didn't travel for injury reasons or because of trade talks.

[Ericb5]

I know it's been said before, but wasn't Colangelo supposed to be the master at player/agent management? It seems very unlikely that Noel is being held out in agreement with the GM, pending a potential trade, given that the Sixers don't seem to be providing any information regarding Noel and have already said Noel self-reported the injury. He's not with the team and we get no updates on him really... When will the lid be blown off this situation?

Something is definitely going on here. The fact that he wasn't even mentioned in the injury report for last night's game is very telling to me.

In the second night of back to back games, when Embiid won't be in the lineup, Noel will get lots of minutes. That will be his golden opportunity to show his worth. I think Dec 15th is the date where new free agents that were signed in the summer can be traded. That might be a time when a deal might get done.

he probably wasn't mentioned in the tweet (which isn't really an "injury report") because he didn't travel with the team. Same reason Bayless and Simmons probably weren't mentioned. It was a "shootaround update." Obviously if people aren't in DC they aren't playing in the game.

Of course you can draw your own conclusions as to if he didn't travel for injury reasons or because of trade talks.

Yeah, that makes sense.


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[kriss73]

Call me crazy, but I'd trade Noel to GSW for McCaw and a 2018 first.

[NatiboyB]

Call me crazy, but I'd trade Noel to GSW for McCaw and a 2018 first.

I'd hop you could find far more value than a 2nd rd pick and a 2018 (26-30th pick).

[kriss73]

Call me crazy, but I'd trade Noel to GSW for McCaw and a 2018 first.

I'd hop you could find far more value than a 2nd rd pick and a 2018 (26-30th pick).

On surface you are right.
But I always saw McCaw as a tremendous prospect, well above his draft spot. And he would fit perfectly with our core.

The pick is not exciting, I agree, but who knows how GS will be in the 2017-2018 season?
A great team probably, but they have a couple of key FAs this summer (including Noel if that trade happened) and they could not be super healthy forever.

[Foshan]

Call me crazy, but I'd trade Noel to GSW for McCaw and a 2018 first.

If they included looney too... i'd at least think about it as a bottom of the barrel deal for Noel, but it'd make me sad. Maybe if we could somehow send Looney and something to MIN for TJones, so it was Jones/McCaw i could not be super depressed over... maybe

[Ericb5]

Call me crazy, but I'd trade Noel to GSW for McCaw and a 2018 first.

I don't think that they can trade their 2018 pick because the still owe a pick to Utah.


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[kriss73]

Call me crazy, but I'd trade Noel to GSW for McCaw and a 2018 first.

I don't think that they can trade their 2018 pick because the still owe a pick to Utah.


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I think they owe to Utah the 2017 first round pick.
Oh well, but this means that they cannot trade the 2018 pick

Edit: sorry that's exactly what you meant

[freshie2]

That's not awful value, but the longer this drags out I'm thinking he's part of a bigger/package deal or simply not traded.

[Unbreakable99]

Call me crazy, but I'd trade Noel to GSW for McCaw and a 2018 first.

I actually don't hate that trade. And I actually think that would be a fair trade for both teams. Noel could start right away unlike McCaw. In 2-3 years McCaw could be better and be used a lot more for Golden St though. This year I'm not so sure how much he will be used but if he continues to play this well he will get 15-20 minutes per game and Golden St might say no. Noel would be foolproof for GS though. The downside is that Noel is in his last year so I don't know if GS has the money to match another team so it would be a one year rental. So with that said if we offered Noel for McCaw I actually think GS says no. Now call ME crazy. Lol