Official #1 pick thread: Simmons or Ingram? Merging topics and a Poll

freshie2 · Post #821 » by **freshie2** » Fri May 20, 2016 1:59 am

LSU was horrible.

PhilasFinest · Post #822 » by **PhilasFinest** » Fri May 20, 2016 2:01 am

Ericb5 wrote:
76ciology wrote:
snoopdogg88 wrote:i feel like I'm the only one who still thinks Ben Simmons going to LSU was a really gutsy and character choice on his part.

He went against the "go to Duke/Kansas/Kentucky" grain, and valued his family and what his heart told him over just being another part of college's New York Yankees and Boston Red Sox.

with that said, he clearly had no desire to really play college basketball. and it's hard to blame him. something tells me once he reaches the court for the Sixers, questions about his "heart" will go away

He went to LSU because they are close with the coach who built a team to make him look good. The goal of that team is not to win games but to make Simmons be number 1 pick.

Regardless of why he chose LSU I think that it was definitely a mistake. He should have gone to a top 5 program and played with better players, and better coaches.

Agreed.

If Brandon Ingram was on LSU and Simmons was on Duke, Does anyone think the W/L column changes drastically at all for either team?

Does LSU make the tournament with Ingram?

76ciology · Post #823 » by **76ciology** » Fri May 20, 2016 2:09 am

Ericb5 wrote:
76ciology wrote:
snoopdogg88 wrote:i feel like I'm the only one who still thinks Ben Simmons going to LSU was a really gutsy and character choice on his part.

He went against the "go to Duke/Kansas/Kentucky" grain, and valued his family and what his heart told him over just being another part of college's New York Yankees and Boston Red Sox.

with that said, he clearly had no desire to really play college basketball. and it's hard to blame him. something tells me once he reaches the court for the Sixers, questions about his "heart" will go away

He went to LSU because they are close with the coach who built a team to make him look good. The goal of that team is not to win games but to make Simmons be number 1 pick.

Regardless of why he chose LSU I think that it was definitely a mistake. He should have gone to a top 5 program and played with better players, and better coaches.

On one angle yes. There is also an angle where his raw stats wouldn't be that good. Such as playing with a good PG and a good center that can have negative effect with his assists and rebounding numbers.

FlightBrothers · Post #824 » by **FlightBrothers** » Fri May 20, 2016 2:18 am

Kobblehead wrote:I can't believe this is such a polarizing choice. It should be a landslide in favor of Simmons.

IF (a huge if) Brandon Ingram learns how to play defense and get some semblance of strength/mass, he can maybe be an Otto Porter / Harrison Barnes caliber of a player.

Ben Simmons can be a superstar.

6'10" 230+ pounder with plus athleticism that plays both ends of the floor and handles and distributes like a PG? Forget about it. This is the easiest choice in the world.

Welcome back buddy. I hope you are here to stay. I agree 100%

Negrodamus · Post #825 » by **Negrodamus** » Fri May 20, 2016 2:21 am

freshie2 wrote:LSU was horrible.

I found a video of Simmons when he was on Iowa State:

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdYRh5oEJ4U[/youtube]

PhilasFinest · Post #826 » by **PhilasFinest** » Fri May 20, 2016 2:26 am

Negrodamus wrote:
freshie2 wrote:LSU was horrible.

I found a video of Simmons when he was on Iowa State:

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdYRh5oEJ4U[/youtube]

STOP IT. lol.

Negrodamus · Post #827 » by **Negrodamus** » Fri May 20, 2016 2:33 am

PhilasFinest wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:
freshie2 wrote:LSU was horrible.

I found a video of Simmons when he was on Iowa State:

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdYRh5oEJ4U[/youtube]

STOP IT. lol.

Hey, it's not too bad of a comparison. Royce was damn good, but had mental issues with flying IIRC.

I will say he wasn't afraid to shoot though.

guitarpath · Post #828 » by **guitarpath** » Fri May 20, 2016 2:48 am

I also don't think it is as much of a debate as many make it out to be. The 76ers went through hell the past three years in order to be in the position to draft a franchise player. In this draft, the player with elite franchise player upside is Ben Simmons.

Perhaps Ingram has the higher floor. He will be a very good player in the NBA. But the Sixers should (and I believe will) go for greatness. And this year, that means Ben Simmons.

LongLiveHinkie · Post #829 » by **LongLiveHinkie** » Fri May 20, 2016 3:55 am

Jonathan Givony, who I respect a good deal, says a big concern about Ben Simmons isn't just that he can't shoot, but it has gotten worse over the last 4 years and he rarely works on it. He said when you see him live at shootaround and practices, the guy never shoots. It's all layup drills. He said it's almost like he's embarrassed or ashamed of his shot, and he just thinks it's worrisome that the guy has regressed since getting into college instead of getting better, when a guy like Ingram on the other hand has been getting better.

Kirk Van Houten · Post #830 » by **Kirk Van Houten** » Fri May 20, 2016 3:59 am

The thread should be Thon Maker or Ben.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

PhilasFinest · Post #831 » by **PhilasFinest** » Fri May 20, 2016 4:08 am

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnvmmBEvbPI[/youtube]

Maybe I'm oblivious to it, but I still don't see a broken jump shot. This isn't MKG/Evan Turner like broken mechanics.

If Okafor can go from a 50% FT shooter to a near 70% FT shooter and also add in game range to his arsenal in less than a year....I think Simmons can evolve into an improve shooter.

USWAY · Post #832 » by **USWAY** » Fri May 20, 2016 4:15 am

LongLiveHinkie wrote:Jonathan Givony, who I respect a good deal, says a big concern about Ben Simmons isn't just that he can't shoot, but it has gotten worse over the last 4 years and he rarely works on it. He said when you see him live at shootaround and practices, the guy never shoots. It's all layup drills. He said it's almost like he's embarrassed or ashamed of his shot, and he just thinks it's worrisome that the guy has regressed since getting into college instead of getting better, when a guy like Ingram on the other hand has been getting better.

THIS is why I have been leaning towards Ingram. Not because of Simmons supposed unwillingness to work on his shot, but because Ingram just kept on getting better. He's been doing it since his senior year. Shot up the rankings then and did it again this year in college. Just always imrpoving. I will tell anyone who will listen that I was all team Simmons when the year started, but the more I watched Ingram I just thought "how can this guy not be the pick?". Same **** I went through with Jah and KAT last year.

USWAY · Post #833 » by **USWAY** » Fri May 20, 2016 4:22 am

PhilasFinest wrote:[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnvmmBEvbPI[/youtube]

Maybe I'm oblivious to it, but I still don't see a broken jump shot. This isn't MKG/Evan Turner like broken mechanics.

If Okafor can go from a 50% FT shooter to a near 70% FT shooter and also add in game range to his arsenal in less than a year....I think Simmons can evolve into an improve shooter.

For as much shtick as he gets for the way he started of his career, Jah really is all about improving as a player, especially offensively. Comes natural to him. Now if he can just apply that work ethic to defense and rebounding lol.

Post #834 » by **CoreyGallagher** » Fri May 20, 2016 4:23 am

Ingram isn't KAT and feel like the comparison of the drafts and how they unfolded is being made to make him seem more enticing by association.

LongLiveHinkie · Post #835 » by **LongLiveHinkie** » Fri May 20, 2016 4:27 am

Another thing Givony said was that the only reason Ben Simmons was as hyped as he was coming into this college season is because a bunch of people who had no clue what they were talking about were hyping him up and it just got way out of control. He basically said "But who were the ones hyping him though? Any Joe Schmoe can hype a guy, but for the people who actually watched him play a great deal since he was 16, you knew those people were going way over the top."

He also said he thinks you'll have to completely retool your entire roster to fit in Ben Simmons because the guy is bad off the ball and needs the ball in his hands constantly, and it just may not be worth it to retool your entire roster just for one guy who is overhyped to begin with. He's been one of the most critical of Simmons, and basically called out anyone who referred to him as that elite generational talent, and inferred they don't know what they are talking about.

Post #836 » by **CoreyGallagher** » Fri May 20, 2016 4:29 am

Respect Givony, but he's been among the more vocal Simmons detractors - as you mentioned. Which is fine, but his is own opinion, plenty of people that also know what they're talking about advocate for the Simmons' hype.

FreakMaster · Post #837 » by **FreakMaster** » Fri May 20, 2016 4:29 am

I don't get the Ben Simmons love. If I were the Sixers I'd take Kris Dunn and enjoy the next D. Wade vs drafting Simmons and end up booing him out of town.

It's not like LSU doesn't have a basketball reputation. They've had plenty of NBAr's come from there. Simmons doesn't dominate in any fashion of the game. Keep him from driving to the paint, and force him to take shots and his scoring avg will be mediocre at best. His ole defense doesn't help either. He's too timid to be a #1, and if the Sixers are banking on his upside, they'll be waiting a few yrs before they actually see it.

What the Sixers need is some shooters to space the floor. Dunn, Jamal Murray or Buddy Hield would be better fits, and they come to the NBA as proven leaders... well Hield and Dunn does.

LongLiveHinkie · Post #838 » by **LongLiveHinkie** » Fri May 20, 2016 4:35 am

CoreyGallagher wrote:Ingram isn't KAT and feel like the comparison of the drafts and how they unfolded is being made to make him seem more enticing by association.

I prefer Ingram, but if they take Simmons, I will support him. However, if Simmons is the pick and he turns out to not live up to the selection(and to make matters worse, Ingram tears it up in LA) then I pretty much can never trust anything this current brain trust does ever again. Literally, like ever.

Post #839 » by **CoreyGallagher** » Fri May 20, 2016 4:39 am

LongLiveHinkie wrote:I prefer Ingram, but if they take Simmons, I will support him. However, if Simmons is the pick and he turns out to not live up to the selection(and to make matters worse, Ingram tears it up in LA) then I pretty much can never trust anything this current brain trust does ever again. Literally, like ever.

Same could be said if we draft Ingram and Simmons tears it up in LA. In fact I'd likely be more upset because we'd have passed on the more hyped prospect for what I'd assume was for fit (even if that wasn't necessarily the case).

Idk, I'll support whatever we do because I like them both as prospects, but I already don't trust the current brain trust so we'll see.

phantom84 · Post #840 » by **phantom84** » Fri May 20, 2016 4:39 am

FreakMaster wrote:I don't get the Ben Simmons love. If I were the Sixers I'd take Kris Dunn and enjoy the next D. Wade vs drafting Simmons and end up booing him out of town.

It's not like LSU doesn't have a basketball reputation. They've had plenty of NBAr's come from there. Simmons doesn't dominate in any fashion of the game. Keep him from driving to the paint, and force him to take shots and his scoring avg will be mediocre at best. His ole defense doesn't help either. He's too timid to be a #1, and if the Sixers are banking on his upside, they'll be waiting a few yrs before they actually see it.

What the Sixers need is some shooters to space the floor. Dunn, Jamal Murray or Buddy Hield would be better fits, and they come to the NBA as proven leaders... well Hield and Dunn does.

Thankfully you aren't a Sixers FO. Taking Dunn, Murray, or Hield at 1 is a damn reach. Also, you draft BPA and forget about this fit nonsense.